SpankyMcFarland Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 11 hours ago, blackbird said: Of course the earth is warming. It would warm anyway because that is what climate change does. It is normal. Learn to adapt to it, not tax Canadians. You discuss a serious problem for our planet, the only known home of life in the universe, in the same breath as increased taxes. In the greater scheme of things they are hardly comparable. Adaptation is a different issue and we are all going to have to do a whole lot more of that. It will be forced upon us. Our country is on fire and that fire generates country-sized plumes of smoke in the summer. Lord knows what awaits us in the next decade. You better start praying to the lad upstairs because we’re not getting much done down here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted April 8 Author Report Share Posted April 8 2 hours ago, Aristides said: You say it is a complex thing and at the same time try to reduce it to fit your own simplistic views. You do exactly that yourself. Yet you think I am wrong and you are right. That hypocrisy. How the atmosphere works and how it is heated is extremely complex and I don't claim to know a lot about it. Neither should you be claiming to know all the answers. Let God control how the world turns and how the earth is heated. Don't pretend that man knows all about it and can control the earth's climate. That is like building the tower of babel to heaven. You think you can build a tower to heaven? Maybe you think you can. You think man can control the climate in any way? If so you have a erroneous idea of the power of man which is just a speck in the universe. Better get down on your knees and pray for some humility. We all need more humility and learn to respect things that are beyond man to know about and control. Man cannot do everything as some people seem to think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 1 hour ago, blackbird said: You do exactly that yourself. Yet you think I am wrong and you are right. That hypocrisy. How the atmosphere works and how it is heated is extremely complex and I don't claim to know a lot about it. Neither should you be claiming to know all the answers. Let God control how the world turns and how the earth is heated. Don't pretend that man knows all about it and can control the earth's climate. That is like building the tower of babel to heaven. You think you can build a tower to heaven? Maybe you think you can. You think man can control the climate in any way? If so you have a erroneous idea of the power of man which is just a speck in the universe. Better get down on your knees and pray for some humility. We all need more humility and learn to respect things that are beyond man to know about and control. Man cannot do everything as some people seem to think. I know basic science which should be obvious to anyone. The problem isn't God, it's humans. You are the one who is denying basic science and pretending humans bear no responsibility. Stop blaming everything on God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted April 8 Author Report Share Posted April 8 (edited) 39 minutes ago, Aristides said: You are the one who is denying basic science and pretending humans bear no responsibility. Stop blaming everything on God. Never blamed anything on God. Just telling you some things are in God's hands, not man's. Man cannot control the climate. It is narcissism to believe man had the power to control the climate. You hide behind the claim it is science when there is no proof that man is causing climate change or global warming. By the same token, man is not causing climate change. You believe the big lie, not me. Edited April 8 by blackbird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted April 8 Author Report Share Posted April 8 (edited) 3 hours ago, Aristides said: You are the one who is denying basic science and pretending humans bear no responsibility. Stop blaming everything on God. The problem is you think man is responsible for everything that happens in nature, which is false. Man is not responsible for climate change and man cannot control the climate. You have to trust God for some things like what is happening in nature and things you cannot control. People that don't believe in God and trust Him are in a panic and think they can do God's job. It is ridiculous. Read the Bible and believe what God says. Then you can stop worrying about such things as the climate and CO2 emissions. Edited April 8 by blackbird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 2 hours ago, Aristides said: I know basic science which should be obvious to anyone. The problem isn't God, it's humans. You are the one who is denying basic science and pretending humans bear no responsibility. Stop blaming everything on God. "Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired." Arguing with a Bible thumper about science is a mug's game, but even mug's games can be fun sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 On 3/22/2024 at 12:45 PM, blackbird said: The climate has always changed. Do you know what you are talking about? And CO2 and Greenhouse gasses caused that too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted April 8 Author Report Share Posted April 8 4 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: And CO2 and Greenhouse gasses caused that too. Almost all the CO2, water vapour, and other greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere are normal and nothing to do with man. As I said many times, man contributes a miniscule amount of CO2 which is not going to make any difference to anything except our wallets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 3 hours ago, blackbird said: Never blamed anything on God. Just telling you some things are in God's hands, not man's. Man cannot control the climate. It is narcissism to believe man had the power to control the climate. You hide behind the claim it is science when there is no proof that man is causing climate change or global warming. By the same token, man is not causing climate change. You believe the big lie, not me. No, we can't control the climate but we can sure as hell screw it up. The evidence is quite clear. You believe in ignorance and use God as an excuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 20 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: Is water vapour increase? If the experts aren't looking at it, it's probably not a factor. It is a HUGE factor, and many atmospheric and oceanic surface things contribute to changes in water vapour. The other biggie is of course methane - an extremely large natural emission that is massively contributing to climate change. Please note your sig line is extremely dishonest. Anthroprogenic CO2 emissions are not the "cause" of climate change, they are a very minor contributor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 4 minutes ago, cannuck said: It is a HUGE factor, and many atmospheric and oceanic surface things contribute to changes in water vapour. The other biggie is of course methane - an extremely large natural emission that is massively contributing to climate change. Please note your sig line is extremely dishonest. Anthroprogenic CO2 emissions are not the "cause" of climate change, they are a very minor contributor. Temperature is the biggest thing that limits the amount of water the atmosphere can hold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 8 Report Share Posted April 8 5 hours ago, blackbird said: ate in any way? If so you have a erroneous idea of the power of man which is just a speck in the universe. sorry, cut the "think man can control climate" Yes, we can and we have. Did it by poisoning the ocean and we can only avoid a genuinely man made catastrophe by STOPPING IMMEDIATELY discharging our "forever chemicals" into that ocean. No "god", santa clause, mohammed or anything else but human intervention is going to fix this. Instead we have let the Euroweenies and who knows who else demonize the oil industry to place blame for what other parts of the chemical industries and totally irresponsible waste management have done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted April 9 Author Report Share Posted April 9 35 minutes ago, cannuck said: sorry, cut the "think man can control climate" Yes, we can and we have. Did it by poisoning the ocean and we can only avoid a genuinely man made catastrophe by STOPPING IMMEDIATELY discharging our "forever chemicals" into that ocean. No "god", santa clause, mohammed or anything else but human intervention is going to fix this. Instead we have let the Euroweenies and who knows who else demonize the oil industry to place blame for what other parts of the chemical industries and totally irresponsible waste management have done. I can agree partially with you that we should not be dumping chemicals or plastics into the ocean. I see on television sometimes people trying to clean up huge messages of garbage on the beaches. All that garbage should not be there in the first place. But I don't see the environmentalists making much of a fuss over that. They are busy trying to stop the oil and gas industry and forest industry. You are mistaken about God. Islam does not believe in the true God of the Bible. You would have to study the Bible to learn about that. It is not something which I can comment on that you would believe. Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God (the Bible, in English the King James Version). There is lots of proof in the Bible. The fact that eye witnesses saw Jesus Christ after he rose from the dead is real proof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 1 hour ago, cannuck said: It is a HUGE factor, and many atmospheric and oceanic surface things contribute to changes in water vapour. The other biggie is of course methane - an extremely large natural emission that is massively contributing to climate change. Please note your sig line is extremely dishonest. Anthroprogenic CO2 emissions are not the "cause" of climate change, they are a very minor contributor. Read the link. You didn't answer my question either, although you seem to think that you did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 (edited) 14 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: Read the link. You didn't answer my question either, although you seem to think that you did. Sorry, kind of busy around here and I can easily drop a ball while putting out fires. Yes, water vapour is increasing - but the simplistic "activists" have the cart before the horse and tend to blame ocean temp rise on CO2 and thus increased water vapour - which is not at all correct. Oceans present about 80% of all evaporation into the troposphere and much of that is controlled by the SML (Surface micro layer) composed of phytoplankton - and it is the kill off of phytoplankton that is primary driver of surface evap rate increase that CONSEQUENTIALLY ocean temperature increases from greater water vapour in troposphere is most likely dangerous to lean on pseudo science from those who profit from demonizing carbon.. I have not read your link because of how you entitled it....but promise I will do so over next couple days. Edited April 9 by cannuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 (edited) 3 minutes ago, cannuck said: oops, wrong button Edited April 9 by cannuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 2 minutes ago, cannuck said: 1. Yes, water vapour is increasing - but the simplistic "activists" have the cart before the horse and tend to blame ocean temp rise on CO2 and thus increased water vapour - which is not at all correct. 1. If not, then what is causing the increased water vapour to trigger temperature rise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: 1. If not, then what is causing the increased water vapour to trigger temperature rise. I did explain that, but if you go to the goesfoundation link there is a much better explanation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 https://science.nasa.gov/earth/climate-change/steamy-relationships-how-atmospheric-water-vapor-amplifies-earths-greenhouse-effect/ Quote As greenhouse gases like carbon dioxide and methane increase, Earth’s temperature rises in response. This increases evaporation from both water and land areas. Because warmer air holds more moisture, its concentration of water vapor increases. Specifically, this happens because water vapor does not condense and precipitate out of the atmosphere as easily at higher temperatures. The water vapor then absorbs heat radiated from Earth and prevents it from escaping out to space. This further warms the atmosphere, resulting in even more water vapor in the atmosphere. This is what scientists call a "positive feedback loop." Scientists estimate this effect more than doubles the warming that would happen due to increasing carbon dioxide alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 2 minutes ago, Aristides said: https://science.nasa.gov/earth/climate-change/steamy-relationships-how-atmospheric-water-vapor-amplifies-earths-greenhouse-effect/ Once more, simplistically claims the effect and completely ignores (or is ignorant of) the actual cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 17 hours ago, blackbird said: Almost all the CO2, water vapour, and other greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere are normal and nothing to do with man. As I said many times, man contributes a miniscule amount of CO2 which is not going to make any difference to anything except our wallets. A belief you have admitted isn't based on any science or data, just a worthless and ill-informed opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 (edited) 5 minutes ago, cannuck said: Once more, simplistically claims the effect and completely ignores (or is ignorant of) the actual cause. NASA ignorant. Right, and you are an expert. https://www.britannica.com/science/ocean-acidification https://oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/acidification.html Edited April 9 by Aristides Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 19 minutes ago, cannuck said: Sorry, kind of busy around here and I can easily drop a ball while putting out fires. Yes, water vapour is increasing - but the simplistic "activists" have the cart before the horse and tend to blame ocean temp rise on CO2 and thus increased water vapour - which is not at all correct. Oceans present about 80% of all evaporation into the troposphere and much of that is controlled by the SML (Surface micro layer) composed of phytoplankton - and it is the kill off of phytoplankton that is primary driver of surface evap rate increase that CONSEQUENTIALLY ocean temperature increases from greater water vapour in troposphere is most likely dangerous to lean on pseudo science from those who profit from demonizing carbon.. I have not read your link because of how you entitled it....but promise I will do so over next couple days. And what's killing phytoplankton? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 20 minutes ago, cannuck said: I did explain that, but if you go to the goesfoundation link there is a much better explanation. I see.... Is there a paper I can look at ? I googled and found lots of examples of climate change affecting phytoplankton but not the other way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbird Posted April 9 Author Report Share Posted April 9 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Black Dog said: A belief you have admitted isn't based on any science or data, just a worthless and ill-informed opinion. Since you are so well-informed, what is the underlying scientific proof that man is causing climate change? Or where is the proof the minute amount of man-made CO2 is causing global warming? I have not seen it. Speculation is not proof. Neither are the rantings of Greta Thunberg, Trudeau, or any politician. Edited April 9 by blackbird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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