OftenWrong Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 10 hours ago, Aristides said: FFS, that article was from 2019. Glad you're following along. Trump's comments are about his conservation with another leader when he was president. Even Treebeard references it in his next post. 8 hours ago, TreeBeard said: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68266447 At a rally on Saturday, he said he had once told a leader he would not protect a nation behind on its payments, and would "encourage" the aggressors to "do whatever the hell they want". You guys, and myata, are alarmingly clueless on what this topic is about. Here, allow me to clarify it for you. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68266447 Addressing crowds during the rally in South Carolina, Mr Trump said he had made his comments about Russia during a meeting of leaders of Nato countries. He recalled that the leader of a "big country" had presented a hypothetical situation in which he was not meeting his financial obligations within Nato and had come under attack from Moscow. Mr Trump said the leader had asked if the US would come to his country's aid in that scenario, which prompted him to issue a rebuke. "I said: 'You didn't pay? You're delinquent?'... 'No I would not protect you, in fact I would encourage them to do whatever they want. You gotta pay.'" Dr Patrick Bury, a defence and security expert and former Nato analyst, told the BBC that Mr Trump was reflecting anger in the US that some European Nato countries were not spending 2% of their budget on the military, as Nato wants. "Playing hardball with Nato allies is correct, but it all depends on how far you go. These comments are too far, really," he said. But he said such statements had an impact at a time when Russia had put its economy onto a war footing and its military spending was outstripping that of European countries. Russia launched its full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022, after Mr Trump left office. .... Get it now? Thanks for keeping up. "FFS" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationalist Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 20 hours ago, I am Groot said: The cash injection didn't really happen until Russia launched its all-out invasion of Ukraine. That woke people up and even Germany doubled its military spending while Sweden brought the draft back. You probably don't know this because the only news you ever get is from FOX and One America. The rest of your time is spent sitting in a corner crying because you're not an American. This is amusing...if not typical of American ingenuity. Edumacated at Harvard I might venture to guess? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted February 12 Author Report Share Posted February 12 (edited) When someone is asking a brutal bully to attack innocent victims and a mob cheers and applauds, there's only one kind of cluelessness here: by those who turned off their brains, integrity everything for a direct feed to the cult Idol. Yes people do that. They do it again and again. You're boring useless shells filled by smoke and lies and you chose it: nobody else, there wasn't a reason, cause or necessity, this time around. No regrets and no sympathy, this was a dumb, brainless choice. We have to show and tell it for what it is now, clearly, painstakingly because giving in to group insanity is never an intelligent choice and will always have dire consequences. Including the converts of course but they wouldn't see it because all sense and the brain that processes them are switched off. Four billion years of evolution for nothing: wasted. Edited February 12 by myata 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 1 hour ago, OftenWrong said: Glad you're following along. Trump's comments are about his conservation with another leader when he was president. Even Treebeard references it in his next post. You guys, and myata, are alarmingly clueless on what this topic is about. Here, allow me to clarify it for you. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68266447 Addressing crowds during the rally in South Carolina, Mr Trump said he had made his comments about Russia during a meeting of leaders of Nato countries. He recalled that the leader of a "big country" had presented a hypothetical situation in which he was not meeting his financial obligations within Nato and had come under attack from Moscow. Mr Trump said the leader had asked if the US would come to his country's aid in that scenario, which prompted him to issue a rebuke. "I said: 'You didn't pay? You're delinquent?'... 'No I would not protect you, in fact I would encourage them to do whatever they want. You gotta pay.'" Dr Patrick Bury, a defence and security expert and former Nato analyst, told the BBC that Mr Trump was reflecting anger in the US that some European Nato countries were not spending 2% of their budget on the military, as Nato wants. "Playing hardball with Nato allies is correct, but it all depends on how far you go. These comments are too far, really," he said. But he said such statements had an impact at a time when Russia had put its economy onto a war footing and its military spending was outstripping that of European countries. Russia launched its full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022, after Mr Trump left office. .... Get it now? Thanks for keeping up. "FFS" He would give Putin an open invitation to attack any NATO member who he didn’t feel was paying enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 (edited) President Trump was confusing a conversation he had with the head of the EU which is not a NATO member. His memory is failing him. As a former President, he should know that, of 31 NATO members, the US contributes almost the least as a percentage of GDP. It is #26. Only Spain, Belgium and Luxembourg contribute less. Even Canada contributes more to NATO as a pecentage of GDP than the USA. Greece contributes more tham all the rest of us. Edited February 12 by Queenmandy85 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Aristides said: He would give Putin an open invitation to attack any NATO member who he didn’t feel was paying enough. I guess that would include his buddy Orban, who the other day he seemed to think was the president of Turkey. But Biden is supposed to be the senile one. Edited February 12 by Aristides Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: President Trump was confusing a conversation he had with the head of the EU which is not a NATO member. His memory is failing him. As a former President, he should know that, of 31 NATO members, the US contributes almost the least as a perscentage of GDP. It is #26. Only Spain, Belgium and Luxembourg contribute less. Even Canada contributes more to NATO as a pecentage of GDP than the USA. Greece contributes more tham all the rest of us. Poland defence spending to hit 4% GDP this year. Germany more than doubled its defence spending in 2023, from 47 billion Euros to 100 billion. This was a result of Putin's invasion more than anything else, although Europe is increasing looking at the US as an unreliable ally if Trump becomes president again. Edited February 12 by Aristides 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted February 12 Author Report Share Posted February 12 6 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said: He's probably just saying that to get them to move. There are grown up, responsible ways to discuss essential problems in the alliance, and the budget is not the only one; for example, commitment to the shared principles is no less important. But he isn't doing that; he is weakening the alliance in the face of the rising threat for no other reason than to orchestrate his cult and prop his ego. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 On 2/11/2024 at 10:20 AM, Fluffypants said: Trump told him that so maybe he starts ponying up the money and troops they are supposed to. Imagine if you signed a lease stating that you would pay 2000 a month and you just decide, I am just going to pay 1k a month how long do you think you get to stay in that home? NATO is supposed to be COLLECTIVE defense meaning that everyone has to chip in and maintain a certain level of military might along with paying their share. It doesn't mean America jumps in and protects anyone in NATO while everyone else gets to do very little. Look at Ukraine we have given them more than any other country has combined and we have the least to lose by Russia taking over. We give and give and give and other countries crap on us every chance they get. The UN is a joke, they have some of the worst despotic countries on the Human Rights council for god's sake. Your excuses for Trump can never undo the damage he's doing to NATO and favors he's doing for Putin and Xi. 🤮 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 On 2/11/2024 at 12:07 PM, OftenWrong said: The link I provided is from NATO, not FOX. As for your personal comments, go stuff yourself, douchebag. Resorting to insults only proves your intellectual BANKRUPTCY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 21 hours ago, Nationalist said: Your panic and fear is noted. Your complacency and defense of lDIOCY and FRAUD is noted. 21 hours ago, OftenWrong said: Please, do not disturb those who are sleeping. Providing facts is being unkind. You may end up being ignored because of it, like me. If you are ignored, it's because you are often wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 19 hours ago, herbie said: The buffoon is putting his ignorance on display again. The so-called businessman can only count monetary values, showing his total inability to understand govt is not a 'business' and neither is the military. He's a toady to what Eisenhower warned everyone about - the Military Industrial Complex. Where Raytheon and General Dynamics tell the govt what to do instead of you and Airbus and Embrauer get penalized for being "govt subsidized" where as Boeing's military contracts "are not" govt subsidies. He's also demonstrating the dangers of electing this oaf to office, He will - something neither his party came up with, nor it's supporters in their platform, just him. He will tell his Party what it's platform is, not the membership. And of course he needs complete immunity for any decision he makes as well.... The imbecile's latest statement that he would sell his own allies down the river makes the fate of Ukraine pretty obvious if he's elected. They'll no longer be a country but another Russian Oblast and Trump will dance about in glee claiming how he solved the problem, too thick and oblivious to even bear any shame like Neville Chamberlain. But it's yet another reason in the long, long list of why he won't be. Trump's "solution" to the Ukraine problem will ONLY unleash another, much bigger, problem in Taiwan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 2 hours ago, Aristides said: He would give Putin an open invitation to attack any NATO member who he didn’t feel was paying enough. Sure, that's apparent if you are a one-dimensional thinker. Another interpretation is, these are the threats he made to direlect Nato members who haven't lived up to their committments. It came at a time when Russia was clearly mobilizing their resources to prepare for the full-scale attack, and was a crucial time for Nato members to step up. As a result of these threats, Trump forced them to pony up, boosting Nato support by, as Stoltenberg himself said at the time, $100 Billion, and more to come. Get it now? Of course, the bought media seeks to turn everything he says around into an attack on him, and it works especially to those who don't know the history of what actually took place in 2019. Always happy to help you people get caught up to the issue. "ffs..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 18 hours ago, OftenWrong said: Stick to the topic, not about me. The info provided shows Trump took action and it produced results. NATO is far stronger today because of it. If you have any proof that it's untrue and that they were simply sating that to flatter him, go ahead and provide it. NATO is far stronger today because Putin INVADED Ukraine and Biden help stand them up. Duh 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 9 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said: He's probably just saying that to get them to move. There you go, chappy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: President Trump was confusing a conversation he had with the head of the EU which is not a NATO member. His memory is failing him. As a former President, he should know that, of 31 NATO members, the US contributes almost the least as a percentage of GDP. It is #26. Only Spain, Belgium and Luxembourg contribute less. Even Canada contributes more to NATO as a pecentage of GDP than the USA. Greece contributes more tham all the rest of us. Trump made up the convo out of whole cloth. You can tell because he mentioned NO NAMES. AKA complete LIE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 6 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: Sure, that's apparent if you are a one-dimensional thinker. Another interpretation is, these are the threats he made to direlect Nato members who haven't lived up to their committments. It came at a time when Russia was clearly mobilizing their resources to prepare for the full-scale attack, and was a crucial time for Nato members to step up. As a result of these threats, Trump forced them to pony up, boosting Nato support by, as Stoltenberg himself said at the time, $100 Billion, and more to come. Get it now? Of course, the bought media seeks to turn everything he says around into an attack on him, and it works especially to those who don't know the history of what actually took place in 2019. Always happy to help you people get caught up to the issue. "ffs..." Nothing is helped by sending a message to Putin and Xi that NATO is considered to be expendable. Nothing but illegal foreign aid to Trump's campaign, that is.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 3 hours ago, Nationalist said: This is amusing...if not typical of American ingenuity. Edumacated at Harvard I might venture to guess? The poster proved themselves a tard by attacking me, without understanding the issue. Was just a useless ad-hominem, nothing more. Once I put him in his place and asked him to back up his claim, that Stoltenberg was LYING, nothing more to say. Oh well, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 Just now, robosmith said: Nothing is helped by sending a message to Putin and Xi that NATO is considered to be expendable. Nothing but illegal foreign aid to Trump's campaign, that is.... Highly debatable and a matter of leadership style, but Trump is rude, abrasive and to the point. I suppose he has no patience or time for lying leftists who want to get a free ride on US' back. But this was, literally, an emergency. Did it work? See my links. Results speak for themselves. 16 minutes ago, robosmith said: Your complacency and defense of lDIOCY and FRAUD is noted. If you are ignored, it's because you are often wrong. Once people go after my forum name, I know I have won. Your surrender has been accepted... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted February 12 Author Report Share Posted February 12 This is so characteristic of the brain-dead "thinking": he said it but media are at fault for making known what was said. Putin invaded a peaceful neighbor country that never threatened him, but he must have had his reasons. A murderous psycho goes on a shooting rampage but in his mind he thought he was saving (or "liberating") them, shouldn't he be understood? So when a burglar attacks him, it's not all as it looks, right? Brain-dead people, brain-dead muzak f@ck the future. Refrain. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationalist Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 33 minutes ago, robosmith said: Your complacency and defense of lDIOCY and FRAUD is noted. If you are ignored, it's because you are often wrong. Idiocy like...opening the border to millions? Like surrendering to a terrorist group? Like spending the USA into a deep hole and inflation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted February 12 Author Report Share Posted February 12 (edited) 5 hours ago, OftenWrong said: "I said: 'You didn't pay? You're delinquent?'... 'No I would not protect you, in fact I would encourage them to do whatever they want. You gotta pay.'" So effectively, it means that any jerk in the government of an allied state could use any pretext they like to not participate in the collective defense. That would be, effectively, the end of the alliance. Right in the sight of the rising new Axis of tyrant thugs. Or, he was blowing bubbles from his imagination bullshitting his brainless herd while undermining the alliance at the same time. Which is a better one? Only a brain-dead would know. Edited February 12 by myata 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 10 minutes ago, myata said: This is so characteristic of the brain-dead "thinking": he said it but media are at fault for making known what was said No, the media are at fault for lying, by omitting the context and the whole truth of what was said. So-called "lies of omission". It works on people like you. Calling me brain-dead? You started the thread but obviously didn't understand the issue either. Evidenced by giving approval in your reaction to aristumped when he said "ffs... the link is from 2019." Brain dead, look in the mirror. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 On 2/11/2024 at 7:20 AM, Fluffypants said: Trump told him that so maybe he starts ponying up the money and troops they are supposed to. The person that you're talking to is incapable of acknowledging facts that he doesn't like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted February 12 Report Share Posted February 12 6 minutes ago, myata said: So effectively, it means that any jerk in the government of an allied state could use any pretext they like to not participate in the collective defense. That would be, effectively, the end of the alliance. Right in the sight of the rising new Axis of tyrant thugs. Or, he was blowing bubbles from his imagination bullshitting his brainless herd while undermining the alliance at the same time. Which is a better one? Only a brain-dead would know. I suggest you are out of your depth again (nothing new there, who knew?). Do not ever play poker. Stick to the lottery instead. As per usual, am sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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