Another Mass Shooting

[ExFlyer]

11 hours ago, ironstone said:

No, the point I was trying to make was about people not obeying all laws, in particular criminals. A lot of states have all kinds of differences in law. The criminals simply do not care too much and they take full advantage of states that are soft on crime, like California where it is now pretty much legal to steal up to a $950 limit. Insanity.

Criminal, by very definition is someone that breaks the laws of the land, whatever land they are in.

[Aristides]

13 hours ago, ironstone said:

But it is against the law in Chicago so in theory there should be drastically fewer gun crimes. Why isn't everyone just obeying the law there?

Some states have different speed limits and when visitors from out of state drive there, they are expected to obey the laws in other states. That goes for all laws.?

You are correct that guarded borders work well. Think of the Biden inspired chaos at the southern border(where there isn't actually a border now apparently). But that's another topic.

Tell us genius, how does a city keep guns outside its city limits when the rest of the country is saturated in guns?

[Aristides]

13 hours ago, ironstone said:

No, the point I was trying to make was about people not obeying all laws, in particular criminals. A lot of states have all kinds of differences in law. The criminals simply do not care too much and they take full advantage of states that are soft on crime, like California where it is now pretty much legal to steal up to a $950 limit. Insanity.

Only 4 states have lower firearms homicide rates than California. None of them are red. But if stealing $950 equals one dead kid in your world, that's on you.

Edited June 1, 2022 by Aristides

[Robert Salyers]

On 5/14/2022 at 6:31 PM, ExFlyer said:

I understand the American constitutional "right to bear arms".

I also understand the controversy around that right.

My topic is not the right to bear arms, it is why are there so many mass shootings and why Americans are not more outraged about it.

As I type, there was another mass shooting in a Buffalo grocery store where 10 were killed and yet to announce how many injured.

Not sure if more people are killed by Mexican cartel wars or by American urban wars?

Oh and laugh at the post all you want but it should be of great concern to all Americans that you cannot even go to the grocery store without you and your kids getting shot.

 

lack of mental health care , lack of ethics and morals break up of the core family . Hollywood , teachers not doing their jobs and police and court system not doing their jobs.

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, Robert Salyers said:

lack of mental health care , lack of ethics and morals break up of the core family . Hollywood , teachers not doing their jobs and police and court system not doing their jobs.

How are you going to determine who needs mental health care until the do something?? There is no crazy person thermometer.

So, if I kill someone, I get life in prison but if I kill 3, 4, 10, I have a mental problem.

Hollywood?? Huh??

Teachers not doing their jobs?   Police not doing their jobs? Exactly what jobs are not being done?

 

[Infidel Dog]

4 hours ago, Aristides said:

Only 4 states have lower firearms homicide rates than California. None of them are red. But if stealing $950 equals one dead kid in your world, that's on you.

Has that changed since 2015? Show me. I count 29 lower gun murder rates that California and 30 or 4 ties in 2015.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state

And if you go by total number of murders involving firearms in 2020 California sits comfortably on top of Texas and blows the other states away.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/301603/murder-involving-firearms-us/

[Infidel Dog]

32 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

How are you going to determine who needs mental health care until the do something?? There is no crazy person thermometer.

So, if I kill someone, I get life in prison but if I kill 3, 4, 10, I have a mental problem.

Hollywood?? Huh??

Teachers not doing their jobs?   Police not doing their jobs? Exactly what jobs are not being done?

 

Those are some very complex issues you want to reduce to abc simplicity.

Basically though, when everything is considered, everything you just said is wrong. You like simplicity, right? It's that simple.

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, Infidel Dog said:

Those are some very complex issues you want to reduce to abc simplicity.

Basically though, when everything is considered, everything you just said is wrong. You like simplicity, right? It's that simple.

On the contrary. When someone does the mass killings clearly (?) he/she has mental illness. Or do they?

The pro gun people are quick to say we should not let people with mental illness have guns, but it is OK for normal people. How can you tell the difference before they commit the sections??

Nothing simple about it but it is simple to say mentally ill should not have guns.

[ironstone]

6 hours ago, Aristides said:

Tell us genius, how does a city keep guns outside its city limits when the rest of the country is saturated in guns?

So are you suggesting that all states should have identical laws?

Why a city like Chicago has such a high murder rate likely has a lot to do with the culture. Single moms are the norm and the traditional family has gone by the wayside.

Illinois gun laws aren't working are they? And it still does not dawn on you that criminals don't give a rat's ass about all those Democratic style gun laws. Commit a crime with a gun? Move on to that George Soros funded DA!

[Infidel Dog]

1 minute ago, ExFlyer said:

On the contrary. When someone does the mass killings clearly (?) he/she has mental illness. Or do they?

The pro gun people are quick to say we should not let people with mental illness have guns, but it is OK for normal people. How can you tell the difference before they commit the sections??

Nothing simple about it but it is simple to say mentally ill should not have guns.

Well let's look at one case and see what could have been done.

How about the most recent case of the Uvalde shooter.

He  hinted on social media that an attack could be coming.

On the morning of the attack, Ramos sent a direct message to an individual on a Facebook platform reading: “I’m going to shoot an elementary school.”

 

A young woman who worked with him until March admitted she noticed an aggressive streak.

“He would be very rude towards the girls sometimes, and one of the cooks, threatening them by asking, ‘Do you know who I am?’ And he would also send inappropriate texts to the ladies,” the former co-worker told The Daily Beast on condition of anonymity.

“At the park, there’d be videos of him trying to fight people with boxing gloves. He’d take them around with him,” she said.

The shooter's grandfather was a convicted felon. Ramos lived with him. It's illegal for a gunowner to live with a convicted felon.

Quote

Ramos’ friend Santos Valdez Jr., 18, said the two had been close, playing video games and basketball regularly, until his friend’s behavior began to “deteriorate,” The Washington Post reported.

At one point, he recounted, Ramos showed up at a park with scratch marks across his face and said he had been attacked by a cat.

“Then he told me the truth, that he’d cut up his face with knives over and over and over,” Valdez told the newspaper.

So there were red flags. Republicans are not against red flag laws properly administered.

Then there's this:

"The school was unlocked and no officer was present to stop him."

Republicans would not have been opposed to that rear door being locked and a well trained armed guard at the door that would have been unlocked in the front.

So that's how Republicans would react. Well thought out Red Flag flaws with mental care as reaction and precautions to deal with anybody that slipped through the cracks.

Tell me specifically what you would recommend that would have been better.

[traveler52]

On 5/15/2022 at 6:33 AM, ExFlyer said:

But your greatness lost to the small nation of Canada. We even burnt down your original white house LOL

He has very distorted understanding U.S. History.  The only real reason Britain ended the war was good old Napoleon was raising hell on the Continent.  Britain could fight two wars thousand of miles apart and win both wars. 

The War with the U.S. more of a nuisance war than anything else.  Also, when the enemy burns your capitol, you've lost the war anyway. 

Britain wanted to prove to the U.S. how strong their navy was by stopping U.S. Ships and taking crew members they believed were British Sailors.  Basically British version of the "Press" (forced recruitment) on the high seas.

Our one major victory New Orleans, was mute.  Britain quit the war before the battle started and word was NOT received until after the bigot Jackson had won his hollow victory.

 

 

 

Edited June 1, 2022 by traveler52

[ExFlyer]

20 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

Well let's look at one case and see what could have been done.

How about the most recent case of the Uvalde shooter.

He  hinted on social media that an attack could be coming.

On the morning of the attack, Ramos sent a direct message to an individual on a Facebook platform reading: “I’m going to shoot an elementary school.”

 

A young woman who worked with him until March admitted she noticed an aggressive streak.

“He would be very rude towards the girls sometimes, and one of the cooks, threatening them by asking, ‘Do you know who I am?’ And he would also send inappropriate texts to the ladies,” the former co-worker told The Daily Beast on condition of anonymity.

“At the park, there’d be videos of him trying to fight people with boxing gloves. He’d take them around with him,” she said.

The shooter's grandfather was a convicted felon. Ramos lived with him. It's illegal for a gunowner to live with a convicted felon.

So there were red flags. Republicans are not against red flag laws properly administered.

Then there's this:

"The school was unlocked and no officer was present to stop him."

Republicans would not have been opposed to that rear door being locked and a well trained armed guard at the door that would have been unlocked in the front.

So that's how Republicans would react. Well thought out Red Flag flaws with mental care as reaction and precautions to deal with anybody that slipped through the cracks.

Tell me specifically what you would recommend that would have been better.
 

who would have said he was mentally ill? Who would have stopped him from buying guns?

All great in retrospect but the point I am making is that he was free to do what he wished without restrictions. 

How would you enforce red flag laws? You would have to have clear evidence and present it in court and by then, he could have done the damage. The US is so litigious that there is no way you can stop anyone form buying guns.

As they say, hindsight has 20/20 vision. In the US,foresight has to be proven in court

Edited June 1, 2022 by ExFlyer

[traveler52]

The member who requested the definition of a semi-automatic rifle.

A Semi-Automatic Rife is a the type of rifle that fires a single round every time the trigger is pulled.  This type of rifle is also known as a self-loading or auto-matic loading rifle.  When the selector switch is moved to full automatic ("Rock and Roll") weapon will continue to fire until the magazine is empty or  the person shooting wants to fire a shorter burst, usually 3-5 rounds.  

Edited June 1, 2022 by traveler52

[Infidel Dog]

30 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

who would have said he was mentally ill? Who would have stopped him from buying guns?

All great in retrospect but the point I am making is that he was free to do what he wished without restrictions. 

How would you enforce red flag laws? You would have to have clear evidence and present it in court and by then, he could have done the damage. The US is so litigious that there is no way you can stop anyone form buying guns.

As they say, hindsight has 20/20 vision. In the US,foresight has to be proven in court

I forgot some stuff:

"

Disturbing new video obtained by The Post shows demented Robb Elementary School shooter Salvador Ramos grinning as he holds up a bag of blood-soaked dead cats.

The deranged 18-year-old gunman is seen smiling in the undated footage while sitting in the passenger seat of a pal’s car — holding up a clear plastic bag with at least two bloodied cats visible inside.

The sicko was previously rumored to have had a fascination with dead cats and had threatened to kidnap, kill and rape girls who shunned him online.

“The shooter was known for hurting cats,” said David Trevino Jr., who is related to the shooter’s grandmother by marriage, to The Post. 

“He liked hurting animals,” Trevino said. “I’m told he killed the cats and carried around the bag of bodies for s–ts and giggles.

“The video shows he was not right in the head,” he added. “He’s not all there. The video raises all sorts of red flags.”

One classmate said Ramos had a tendency to be “violent towards women” and was described by an ex-girlfriend as “scary.”

https://nypost.com/2022/05/30/new-video-shows-texas-school-shooter-salvador-ramos-holding-bag-of-dead-cats/

So, in a different world would any of that or what's been mentioned already have been enough to open a red flag file on this guy who liked to cut his face up with knives, kill animals and boasted of buying a gun and said some people “deserved to be raped” on the teen app Yubo, where users nicknamed him “school shooter”– even before Tuesday’s massacre in Uvalde, Texas.

If not, Republicans think it would have been a good idea to have had the rear school door locked and an armed guard at the front.

Again, what's you're better idea? Why are you afraid to tell us?

Edited June 1, 2022 by Infidel Dog

[ExFlyer]

1 minute ago, Infidel Dog said:

I forgot some stuff:

"

Disturbing new video obtained by The Post shows demented Robb Elementary School shooter Salvador Ramos grinning as he holds up a bag of blood-soaked dead cats.

The deranged 18-year-old gunman is seen smiling in the undated footage while sitting in the passenger seat of a pal’s car — holding up a clear plastic bag with at least two bloodied cats visible inside.

The sicko was previously rumored to have had a fascination with dead cats and had threatened to kidnap, kill and rape girls who shunned him online.

“The shooter was known for hurting cats,” said David Trevino Jr., who is related to the shooter’s grandmother by marriage, to The Post. 

“He liked hurting animals,” Trevino said. “I’m told he killed the cats and carried around the bag of bodies for s–ts and giggles.

“The video shows he was not right in the head,” he added. “He’s not all there. The video raises all sorts of red flags.”

One classmate said Ramos had a tendency to be “violent towards women” and was described by an ex-girlfriend as “scary.”

https://nypost.com/2022/05/30/new-video-shows-texas-school-shooter-salvador-ramos-holding-bag-of-dead-cats/

So, in a different world would any of that or what's been mentioned already have been enough to open a red flag file on this guy who liked to cut his cut his face up with knives, kill animals and boasted of buying a gun and said some people “deserved to be raped” on the teen app Yubo, where users nicknamed him “school shooter”– even before Tuesday’s massacre in Uvalde, Texas.

If not, Republicans think it would have been a could idea to have had the rear school door locked and an armed guard at the front.

Again, what's you're better idea? Why are you afraid to tell us?

Does not change my point. I am not afraid to tell you anything. I am telling you that whatever you think, you cannot call a person crazy and take away their freedoms or rights without a long trial.

As I said,hindsight has 20/20 vision. This happens all the time. Check the person out after they do some outrageous thing.

Trying to accuse or identify them as mentally ill before they do something will never (or extremely rare) happen. What are they going to say...that the person may do something bad?? Anyone can be accused then.

[taxme]

On 5/30/2022 at 6:24 PM, Aristides said:

Ja, Mein Fuhrer

Ja, comradsky. LOL.

[taxme]

On 5/31/2022 at 4:23 AM, ExFlyer said:

Didn't he also shoot and kill his Grandmother?

I heard that he shot his grandmother. But I am not sure if he just injured her or shot her dead. I will call up the county sheriff and find out for you. Hang on. ?

[ExFlyer]

28 minutes ago, taxme said:

I heard that he shot his grandmother. But I am not sure if he just injured her or shot her dead. I will call up the county sheriff and find out for you. Hang on. ?

Duhh?

[Robert Salyers]

4 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

How are you going to determine who needs mental health care until the do something?? There is no crazy person thermometer.

So, if I kill someone, I get life in prison but if I kill 3, 4, 10, I have a mental problem.

Hollywood?? Huh??

Teachers not doing their jobs?   Police not doing their jobs? Exactly what jobs are not being done?

 

Really when he and another kid threatened to attack a school 4 years ago maybe if he had help then . The school was involved as was the police and his family . Then he has taked about doing it in 2022 when he turned 18 I . I think thats a pretty good crazy person thermometer  dont you think ? I mean seriously what more evidence do you need he had mental issues ?

[OftenWrong]

On 5/14/2022 at 6:31 PM, ExFlyer said:

My topic is not the right to bear arms, it is why are there so many mass shootings

There can be many reasons. Why is it worse in the so-called land of the free? Maybe that’s why. With freedom comes the freedom to fail. 

Many mass-shooters want to send a message. They love the notoriety. They seek to create as much shock and anguish as possible, to get full media attention. Live-streaming your murderous act and suicide is highly in demand.

Note there’s already a high level of tolerance to mass-shootings, as they occur now almost daily. Yet only the most heinous and grievous acts are now reported. In order to get attention you have to jack it up a notch.

That’s entertainment.

[Robert Salyers]

12 hours ago, Aristides said:

Tell us genius, how does a city keep guns outside its city limits when the rest of the country is saturated in guns?

Criminals dont care about the law 

[Scott Mayers]

If gun owners are themselves rightous to assert absolute autonomy for defining themselves as 'law abiding', then let us 'law abiding' citizens also have a right to wear explosive vests too! We should also let us 'law abiding' citizens have our own nuclear bombs too! If deterency is presumed to make for 'peace', then given we are all born 'innocent', if we all had guns and explosive vests an nuclear bombs provided to each of us, we'd BE "law abiding" and thus have a very peaceful world! 

[ExFlyer]

13 hours ago, Robert Salyers said:

Really when he and another kid threatened to attack a school 4 years ago maybe if he had help then . The school was involved as was the police and his family . Then he has taked about doing it in 2022 when he turned 18 I . I think thats a pretty good crazy person thermometer  dont you think ? I mean seriously what more evidence do you need he had mental issues ?

Like I said before, hindsight has 20/20 vision.

What a person did or said 4 years prior is meaningless. Anyone and everyone has said things in the past.

Like I also said, you cannot just accuse and take arbitrary action. In the US especially, there would be a lot of legal hoops and ladders before being declared mentally incompetent.

If you just took action against everyone that said something stupid or made threats the facilities would be overflowing .  What is an empty threat because someone is pissed and what is a real threat? Are all those folks that are anti government or anti establishments and making threats mentally ill and be institutionalized?

It is easy to say things like you say but you cannot jail someone for speaking their mind.

Edited June 2, 2022 by ExFlyer

[Robert Salyers]

10 hours ago, Robert Salyers said:

Criminals dont care about the law 

you can not keep guns out of any place on earth

[Robert Salyers]

On 6/1/2022 at 10:38 AM, Aristides said:

Tell us genius, how does a city keep guns outside its city limits when the rest of the country is saturated in guns?

look at the segment of Chicago where the shooting happen there and it explains it all thugs and gang banger