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War In Ukraine


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41 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I disagree. People that live in those areas understand what the KGB (now FSB) system means for the next 100 years if it gets terrain there.

Is not only about food and basic needs now, the apparatus is like cancer, intellectuals will be targeted to be replaced by loyalists, private sector will be asked to be loyal to Moscow and the justice system will also be run remotely from the Kremlin.

Hmm...sounds quite a bit like Zelinsky's government. 

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1 hour ago, OftenWrong said:

You people are looking at this from a geo-political perspective, which is at the top level and most obvious. Yes, we all know about those things. What I'm suggesting is from a very personal individual perspective, especially for people who are raising families, they of course just want the war to end. It may not matter what flag is flying over their parliament, to them it's an abstract concept. They need safety and food, basic necessities. I bet many of them are willing to even learn Russian...   ;)

But not die for some ideal, that is largely important to whom? I told you whom. More than the Ukraine. More than their own interests, force-feeding them on war because it benefits the great powers.

Is it right for other nations to involve themselves in such as way as to keep elevating the conflict, or should they be only involved in doing the opposite? That is, f*ckin de-escalation.

It isn't abstract at all. Ukrainians know very well what it is like to live under Russian then Soviet oppression. Why do you think they are fighting so hard for their freedom?

 

Holodomor

It's only abstract to pampered, entitled people who have no idea what it is like.

Edited by Aristides
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11 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Is it really? I already explained why I think it's different this time.

You can come up with whatever explanations you like, but none of that means much when we see a nation 1/4 the size of its invader successfully fight them off.  That speaks to their motivation, compared to the conscripts who can barely move forward without a general coming to the front line to yell at and threaten his subordinates.

11 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Kinda like the US taking a back seat during WWII, but happy to provide enough resources to keep the fighting going.

When Russia leaves Ukraine, the fighting will be over.  That's how long the fighting will keep going.  

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10 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I can guarantee you if Canada would be invaded, you would not care one bit if Trudeau starts arresting Russian sympathisers or even closing Russian churches for having political connections with Patriarch Kirill, codename Mikhailov, former KGB officer, now leader of Orthodox Russian Church. Should I remind what allies did in WW2 during wartime here at home? 

but because is Ukraine, and the Redacted source, which is also being circulated by FSB sympathisers on this board and on Australian boards, has reached into your head, whatever you want to believe. 

I have issues with Zelenskyy's foreign policy, power got to his head, and he started messing around the world politics, but internally, he is doing what a wartime president needs to do. I think if he did not have the backing of his people, he would not be President now. 

and France, Turkey are helping in deescalation. 

as for the US to allow Putin to win the war, as long as the Ukrainians want to fight, the US can not allow this war to be won by Russia. It will send a dangerous message to Beijing is my estimation. 

Who says I sympathise with Russian spies? Or any spies as far as that's concerned? You? The Libbie "pose"? That's some wild accusation. But as is the norm...it's just smoke and mirrors.

I can guarantee you, that if Canada had an ethnic province that was not the majority of ethnicity in Canada, but demanded to be allowed to be their ethnicity, Canada would not bomb the he'll out of them. Instead we would make Quebec...what it is.

I get your hatred for Russia. But letting your hatred cloud your judgements and dictate your ideals, is not terribly "Canadian"...is it.

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3 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I don't hate Russian or Chinese people, just their systems. I ridicule them really (the system), and people that try to defend them.

What is Canadian? To write that you want Russia to win the war in Ukraine? So you want one of the biggest adversaries of the West to win the war in Ukraine?

or to support insurrectionists in the USA, not even your own country?

how about spreading russian disinformation? Is that Canadian?

Again, we are going in circles.

You can't lecture me about being a "Canadian" when you have such resume.

Huh...perhaps this is why Poland is such a mess?

Have I said I want Russia to win? Or have I said it's always been inevitable without direct NATO involvement and that this "proxy war" is disgusting and NATO should stay out of it?

Here's an interesting question. Is Russia an adversary of The West...or is The West an adversary of Russia?

What insurrectionists? Give the Libbie fear-porn a rest. The only real serious crime perpetrated that day, was a cop shooting an unarmed protester for...trespassing.

So this is YOUR resume son. A resume full of biased assumptions and biased conclusions. 

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8 hours ago, Contrarian said:

Excellent so I am pro-NATO, pro-law as under the law, the FBI is still looking for some of the traitors:

https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/capitol-violence

and also your quote is famous on this thread when you said you want Russia to win against the Ukrainians.

Logic says I have the solid resume.

Go back and listen to some more from Redacted, it will make it for sure, true, "diplomat." ?

And If Russia and Ukraine make a peace treaty how will you treat that?

Edited by Nationalist
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1 hour ago, Contrarian said:

as Macron said: France will support any peaceful resolution as long as the Ukrainians agree.

Is their house that got invaded.

If your house got invaded, would you want other people to tell you, in your own house, when to stop fighting an intruder?

now that has to be realistic.

If Zelenskyy will want Crimea too, I have an intuition that NATO will cut the weapons, as then Nuclear War needs to be avoided.

@athostovarisch, came out in force this evening. You belong in a different era my friend, the era when 10 men ran around a fire and chanted for the strongest of the tribe or the most criminal of the tribe I might say.

Come to reality. Is not looking good for Putin and the neo-nazi coats robber from Wagner with the latest Western weaponery coming in.

Did you watch the clip I posted? Looks like the Ukrainians are questioning what's happening.

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Why are we asking this question now?  I don't see what handing over some tanks changes.  There's no question that thee West is directly supporting Ukraine, and wants to help defeat Russia.  The distinguishing factor is that NATO isn't attacking Russia directly, nor are NATO troops firing on Russia's dicrepit army from NATO territory.  

There's not much logic to the idea that MBTs push the envelope if HIMARS didn't.  The West can continue to call Russia's bluff on "escalation", because Russia can't afford to escalate anything.    

 

Edited by Moonbox
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I don't even know how someone can seriously try to post a Redacted clip as credible news and not burst out laughing at themselves.  No wonder people get so screwed up over this stuff.  Literally anything gets past their filter, as long as it's anti-establishment.  

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41 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

So the German defence minister is out, for someone that follows German politics, maybe you are aware of Christine Lambrecht.  

Her last stunt, talking about the Ukrainian war while there are New Years fireworks in the background:

https://youtu.be/9fDuL7zpE5Y?t=31

Many welcome the change. In one Bild interview, Ms. Lambrecht had been unable to name the German military ranks. 

I feel bad for her more than anything.  Making her the defense minister would have been like making my mom defense minister.  She didn't know anything about it, she wasn't interested in it, and she didn't want the job.  No wonder she sucked at it.  

41 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Also, I was reading the opinion of one journalist that Belarus will join the war. I don't think this aspect is set in stone, Lukashenko is hesitating, part of it it might be that fear of war crimes charges. 

I am not sure what to think of this.  Belarus' army is even trashier than Russia's, but Lukashenko's fate is inextrictably linked to Putin's.  On one hand, his own country tried to revolt against him not long ago and Putin is the only reason he's still in power.  On the other hand, Belarussians still hate him and could revolt again if they thro them into the war. My guess is nothing happens, but I'm not making any bets on it.  

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1 hour ago, Aristides said:

R is a Putin mouthpiece, just look at their website.

Don't like the message...attack the messenger.

Tell me...without NATO military involvement, what is it you expect to happen here? A perpetual military stalemate? That would be a nice long term dumping ground for old armaments but, what real other purpose does it serve?

WHO...does such a thing serve?

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The Ukrainians who don't want to become part of Russia, and Russia's geopolitical enemies.  You're not saying anything novel here.  That NATO is eager to see Russia weakened and humbled is no mystery.  That this interest aligns with Ukrainian desire for independence and to avoid hopeless alignment with Russia isn't either.  The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

WHO does the invasion serve?  Not the Ukrainians, obviously.  Not the Russian people, equally obvious, since they're not even motivated to fight.  WHO does this serve, aside from Putin and his delusions of grandeur?  

 

Edited by Moonbox
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1 hour ago, Nationalist said:

Don't like the message...attack the messenger.

Tell me...without NATO military involvement, what is it you expect to happen here? A perpetual military stalemate? That would be a nice long term dumping ground for old armaments but, what real other purpose does it serve?

WHO...does such a thing serve?

Ukraine stays independent and a stopper is put on Russian aggression.

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8 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Locked in a long term war...oh goodie.

So...the Russians can leave the country they invaded. 

"Oh we want peace.  Just put your weapons down, stop fighting us, and let us do what we please.  Shh..Shh...it won't hurt so bad."

patrickdumb.thumb.png.4426e5bbf6429adbd9b4311c737d710c.png

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5 hours ago, Moonbox said:

So...the Russians can leave the country they invaded. 

"Oh we want peace.  Just put your weapons down, stop fighting us, and let us do what we please.  Shh..Shh...it won't hurt so bad."

patrickdumb.thumb.png.4426e5bbf6429adbd9b4311c737d710c.png

Lol...'AHHH! THE RUSSIANS ARE COMING, THE RUSSIANS ARE COMING!'

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