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Ontario needs to invest in EVs as a realistic Option.


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13 hours ago, ironstone said:

I'm pretty certain that there will have to be a massive hike in the cost of electricity to replace gas tax revenue.

The 11% figure comes from a clip on Motoring TV.

I'm not against anyone wanting and buying an electric car but I don't like the subsidies.

That's a pretty ignorant view. It's from 2019 so I imagine his views on EVs have changed. 

If you have an EV you probably charge it at home. And many of these charging stations he's talking about are Stage 2 chargers where you leave it to charge and do something else. 

I'm also certain that, since 2019 a lot of the other elements of emissions has decreased as Canada's grid gets cleaner. 

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The province needs more electrical utility infrastructure before it can support a large number of electric vehicles. All of that energy expended during the day driving needs to be replenished at night.

One way is to add small nuclear reactors. There’s one coming soon to a neighbourhood near you.

These devices are not yet approved in Canada, so it could be a while before driving a vehicle that does not produce CO2, but produces toxic substances instead. Like lead, cadmium, germanium, arsenic and of course the good old spent nuclear fuel rods which no one knows what to do with, besides bury in a deep, deep hole ina ground...

Probably like in about 20-30 years.

But at least does not produce CO2.

It’s like fighting covid-19.

No, my brothers, there is no technological solution that gets us out of this. There is only one  solution that’s become obvious.

aaauuugaaahhh...

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8 hours ago, Boges said:

That's a pretty ignorant view. It's from 2019 so I imagine his views on EVs have changed. 

If you have an EV you probably charge it at home. And many of these charging stations he's talking about are Stage 2 chargers where you leave it to charge and do something else. 

I'm also certain that, since 2019 a lot of the other elements of emissions has decreased as Canada's grid gets cleaner. 

I'm not certain but it seems Canada's emissions are continuing to rise under Justin Trudeau.

Oil and SUVs: Why Canada's emissions have risen since Trudeau took office (climatechangenews.com)

I don't know what the future holds and have nothing against anyone pushing for electric cars but they are not for everyone.

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19 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

The province needs more electrical utility infrastructure before it can support a large number of electric vehicles. All of that energy expended during the day driving needs to be replenished at night.

One way is to add small nuclear reactors. There’s one coming soon to a neighbourhood near you.

These devices are not yet approved in Canada, so it could be a while before driving a vehicle that does not produce CO2, but produces toxic substances instead. Like lead, cadmium, germanium, arsenic and of course the good old spent nuclear fuel rods which no one knows what to do with, besides bury in a deep, deep hole ina ground...

Probably like in about 20-30 years.

But at least does not produce CO2.

It’s like fighting covid-19.

No, my brothers, there is no technological solution that gets us out of this. There is only one  solution that’s become obvious.

aaauuugaaahhh...

I have an EV and it uses about as much Electricity as my Air Conditioning does. 

We will need to adopt Nuclear in the future. Much of Ontario's energy is already generated from Nuclear. 

Nuclear is actually quite safe. People are just spoked by isolated incidents. over the past 40 years. 

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15 hours ago, ironstone said:

I don't know what the future holds and have nothing against anyone pushing for electric cars but they are not for everyone.

Not yet, for sure. If you live in a building or drive more than 200 km a day, it's definitely not a solution. But for a vast majority of driving it's a great solution. 

I'll still keep an ICU car (in my case, a hybrid) as a backup and an option for long road trips. 

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On 8/9/2021 at 10:40 AM, Shady said:

I agree, at some point soon technology will be where we need it to be.  But there are other issues when it comes to lithium that need to be taken into consideration.

 

81A9FC54-E67A-428E-B796-AEA3FEE1DE5F.webp

Greta is a victim of abuse and one day will feel resentment for the way her fanatical parents used her.

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On 8/15/2021 at 3:25 PM, ironstone said:

Electric cars will change the way we live and how we use our time. I can get almost 800km of range in a couple of minutes with my compact car while I see that an expensive Tesla will get only 200 miles of range after 15 minutes of supercharging. The bottom line is that people will be spending an awful lot more time waiting around to recharge. I have to wonder where all the electricity will come from as well. Wind turbines and solar panels?

The dirty secret of electric vehicles | World Economic Forum (weforum.org)

David Booth: What happens when there's just too many Teslas? | Driving

It is really hard to gaze into the future and see where we end up.  There will be a perverse logic to the adoption of electric vehicles in the short and medium term.  For instance, in the medium term, the demand decline in fossil fuels will lead to lower prices for gas.  That will lead to a slower adoption of electric vehicles as people hesitate looking at those lower fuel prices.  If you rarely drive the incentive for electric vehicles is not really there.  It needs to have a real economic benefit to end users and those will be those that commute to work.  

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18 hours ago, Faramir said:

It is really hard to gaze into the future and see where we end up.  There will be a perverse logic to the adoption of electric vehicles in the short and medium term.  For instance, in the medium term, the demand decline in fossil fuels will lead to lower prices for gas.  That will lead to a slower adoption of electric vehicles as people hesitate looking at those lower fuel prices. 

Which is where Carbon taxes come in. 

OPEC has been artificially keeping gas prices low for a long time. Western Governments are working against this. Gasoline in Europe has been this high for a long. 

 

Quote

If you rarely drive the incentive for electric vehicles is not really there.  It needs to have a real economic benefit to end users and those will be those that commute to work.  

No there isn't. But if you're driving over 100kms a day, you're insane not to look into EVs. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

DoFo is listening. 

https://news.ontario.ca/en/release/1001255/ontario-boosting-electric-vehicle-charging-availability

Quote

 

KING CITY – Ontario is bringing electric vehicle (EV) fast chargers directly to the province’s busiest highways with the deployment of Ivy Charging Network chargers at all ONroute locations. Chargers at 17 ONroute locations will be open in time for next summer, with another three ONroute locations opening before the end of 2022.

“Ontario is putting shovels in the ground to build critical infrastructure including highways,” said Todd Smith, Minister of Energy. “Our agreement with Ivy, ONroute and Canadian Tire to construct EV chargers at all of the province’s 23 ONroute stations is an important step forward, allowing EV owners to travel our great province with more freedom and confidence. This deployment will reduce barriers to EV ownership, supporting Ontario’s growing EV manufacturing market and critical minerals sector, and help achieve Ontario’s goal of building at least 400,000 electric and hybrid vehicles by 2030.”

 

 

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On 11/11/2021 at 7:14 AM, Boges said:

Which is where Carbon taxes come in. 

OPEC has been artificially keeping gas prices low for a long time. Western Governments are working against this. Gasoline in Europe has been this high for a long. 

 

No there isn't. But if you're driving over 100kms a day, you're insane not to look into EVs. 

LOL.  I work from home and the wife drives 7 km to work.  Yes of course, worth looking for long commuters into especially because of the low entry price which I believe is $55,000.  I mean I think a Honda Accord starts at $34,000 but is probably more like $40,000 with all options.  

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25 minutes ago, Faramir said:

LOL.  I work from home and the wife drives 7 km to work.  Yes of course, worth looking for long commuters into especially because of the low entry price which I believe is $55,000.  I mean I think a Honda Accord starts at $34,000 but is probably more like $40,000 with all options.  

And the Honda requires regular oil changes and Gasoline. 

People have no problem paying $40k for a new SUV but balk at a $50k EV? It's astonishing. 

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Electric cars may indeed be the future but will anybody openly admit that the cost of electricity is most certainly going to go through the roof since governments will have to replace all that revenue from gasoline taxes?

It's still very unclear what will generate all that electricity either( should be nuclear) but as we already know environmentalists are going to be impeding common sense solutions.

Fast charging may also be a big hurdle to overcome as it may increase the risk of fires and shorten battery life($$$).

 

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On 12/4/2021 at 9:33 AM, ironstone said:

Electric cars may indeed be the future but will anybody openly admit that the cost of electricity is most certainly going to go through the roof since governments will have to replace all that revenue from gasoline taxes?

It's still very unclear what will generate all that electricity either( should be nuclear) but as we already know environmentalists are going to be impeding common sense solutions.

Fast charging may also be a big hurdle to overcome as it may increase the risk of fires and shorten battery life($$$).

 

How can you not watch that video and not see some doddering old man that has no idea what he's talking about? 

I don't have a high-end EV, by any means, and it has a cooling pump for DC charging. EVs meter the amount of current they can safely accept. EVs are only workable for people with a garage they can daily charge the car. 

Those that live in Condos or don't have their own hydro can opt for Hybrid cars to reduce their Fossil fuel consumption. 

EVs are certainly not practical for everyone. But they're practical for many people. You have to ask yourself, if you can't get by on 300 kms of range per day, then WTF are you doing with your life? 

As for the cost of hydro, I haven't seen a huge spike in my electric usage. It's obviously more, but it's not going to break the bank. ACs running all day use about as much. 

I suspect when Gas Tax revenue dry up there'll be a registration charge of somekind. But that shouldn't be done until the EV adoption rate is higher. We're looking to incentivize EV adoption. 

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On 12/3/2021 at 11:36 AM, Boges said:

And the Honda requires regular oil changes and Gasoline. 

People have no problem paying $40k for a new SUV but balk at a $50k EV? It's astonishing. 

Hmmm.... I don't see the trend that they are balking at the EVs.  They are all over the place where I live.  There are those like me who will always buy in the used market.  New vehicles are grossly overpriced.  While incomes tripled from the 1970s, car prices has risen 10 times!!!  IF, in the future, I will considering a EV, it would be from the used market.  

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Just now, Faramir said:

Hmmm.... I don't see the trend that they are balking at the EVs.  They are all over the place where I live.  There are those like me who will always buy in the used market.  New vehicles are grossly overpriced.  While incomes tripled from the 1970s, car prices has risen 10 times!!!  IF, in the future, I will considering a EV, it would be from the used market.  

I will concede, you won't get good options from EVs in the used car market. The technology is advancing too fast. 

The benefit of buying a new car is the lower Interest Rate on a loan and starting mileage and warranties from the start. 

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4 hours ago, Boges said:

How can you not watch that video and not see some doddering old man that has no idea what he's talking about? 

I don't have a high-end EV, by any means, and it has a cooling pump for DC charging. EVs meter the amount of current they can safely accept. EVs are only workable for people with a garage they can daily charge the car. 

Those that live in Condos or don't have their own hydro can opt for Hybrid cars to reduce their Fossil fuel consumption. 

EVs are certainly not practical for everyone. But they're practical for many people. You have to ask yourself, if you can't get by on 300 kms of range per day, then WTF are you doing with your life? 

As for the cost of hydro, I haven't seen a huge spike in my electric usage. It's obviously more, but it's not going to break the bank. ACs running all day use about as much. 

I suspect when Gas Tax revenue dry up there'll be a registration charge of somekind. But that shouldn't be done until the EV adoption rate is higher. We're looking to incentivize EV adoption. 

After some analysis I figured in the US market, due to EV efficiency, that running your car on gas is about TWICE as expensive as running on electricity.  The benefit would be even more in California who have the highest gas prices in the USA.  

In Canada as we have lots of taxes on fuel consumption, the benefit is about 3 times.  Which begs the question, if everyone has an EV, how will they make up the tax loss?

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3 minutes ago, Faramir said:

After some analysis I figured in the US market, due to EV efficiency, that running your car on gas is about TWICE as expensive as running on electricity.  The benefit would be even more in California who have the highest gas prices in the USA.  

In Canada as we have lots of taxes on fuel consumption, the benefit is about 3 times.  Which begs the question, if everyone has an EV, how will they make up the tax loss?

Probably a Registration Tax of some kind. Governments can also mandate charges per kilometre or some sort of usage rate. All new cars have GPS technology so it would be easy to track.

Those measures can't be too expensive though. Carbon taxes will have to be spent bolstering infrastructure. 

Edited by Boges
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Governments at all levels are always crying that they need more revenue streams and ever increasing amounts of tax dollars. So it's a pretty safe assumption that the price of electricity will keep rising and rising like they did under Kathleen Wynne. It probably will involve governments tracking us in our cars as the cell phone companies track our phones.

As for Scotty Kilmer videos, I wouldn't call him a doddering old fool. He does have strange mannerisms but I think he really knows his stuff. Licensed mechanic for decades and he actually has a masters degree in anthropology of all things. For a lot of automotive stuff his videos are pretty good.

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24 minutes ago, ironstone said:

Governments at all levels are always crying that they need more revenue streams and ever increasing amounts of tax dollars. So it's a pretty safe assumption that the price of electricity will keep rising and rising like they did under Kathleen Wynne. It probably will involve governments tracking us in our cars as the cell phone companies track our phones.

As for Scotty Kilmer videos, I wouldn't call him a doddering old fool. He does have strange mannerisms but I think he really knows his stuff. Licensed mechanic for decades and he actually has a masters degree in anthropology of all things. For a lot of automotive stuff his videos are pretty good.

EXCEPT that goes contrary to what governments want.  They WANT cheap electricity to get us into the EVs.  Now that is what they say now.  The BC government way way back gave rebates on natural gas installations.  Only to see natural gas explode in price.  But then we had 20 years of cheap as water natural gas prices around $2.00.  It is difficult is not completely impossible to guess what the future holds.  China will be the number one player on the globe.  THAT is a certainty.

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17 hours ago, ironstone said:

Governments at all levels are always crying that they need more revenue streams and ever increasing amounts of tax dollars. So it's a pretty safe assumption that the price of electricity will keep rising and rising like they did under Kathleen Wynne. It probably will involve governments tracking us in our cars as the cell phone companies track our phones.

Funny thing about that. Because many people are working from home, hydro rates have actually dropped. For awhile they removed Time-of-Use pricing. They've put that back (which is fine for EV drivers, as you can charge overnight) but the off-peak rate is under 10¢/kwh. 

The DoFo regime has offered remarkable stability in the Hydro file. There was always controversy under McWynnty.

Quote

As for Scotty Kilmer videos, I wouldn't call him a doddering old fool. He does have strange mannerisms but I think he really knows his stuff. Licensed mechanic for decades and he actually has a masters degree in anthropology of all things. For a lot of automotive stuff his videos are pretty good.

What bugs me most is the titles of his video. It's titled "Why EVs are a Scam" or something like that. Then you start watching the video and he's not taking about anything remotely related. It's click-bait. 

Edited by Boges
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