Covid Is Turning Us Into a Socialist/Fascist Country

[BeaverFever]

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

FYI

Are you saying that the Nazis weren't fascists, or that they weren't socialists?

I'm just trying to get a clearer sense of how wrong you are. 

North Koreas official name is the People’s Democratic Republic of Korea.   Don’t be fooled by names
 

The fascist in Germany and Italy were PRO Bourgeoisie, PRO big business. They jailed and murdered socialists by the thousands in concentration camps. Karl Marx and socialism were denounced loudly and often.  NAZI supporters came primarily from other right wing parties they absorbed and their leaders and backers were from the countries” aristocratic class.   Western aristocrats were often pro-Nazi, like Charles Lindbergh and George Bush’s grandfather Prescott Bush who was a Nazi financier for a time. Meanwhile working classes around the world were typically anti-Nazi especially organized labour and socialist groups   

When Nazi-allied Fascist Francisco Franco staged a coup and civil war in 1936 against the mildly socialist Spanish government, complete with Nazi air support, capitalist countries turned a blind eye. But Socialists and organized labour groups from around the world including from USA and Canada travelled to Spain to fight in multinational volunteer brigades alongside the Spanish army. The fascist dictator Franco won the war but he was welcomed by the capitalist countries anyway as he stayed neutral in WW2 and his regime lasted into the 1970s 

Famous Nazi war criminal Klaus Barbie was a fearsome hunter of communists and socialists during the Nazi regime and then worked for the US after the war hunting and torturing socialists in South America for various right wing dictators backed by the US

 

The examples go on and on. Get a history book would ya?

Edited October 20, 2020 by BeaverFever

[Army Guy]

8 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

A lot has changed in Canada since we first landed, and started settlements way back in the 1700's, Like Taxes, more social programs, world politics and globalization to compare them is like apples and oranges. Nobody is saying we need to cut off immigration off totally..it needs to be scaled back to allow infra structure to grow along with it.

Initial immigration into Germany was a nightmare, even Merkel will say so, they were over whelmed,  finding shelter for everyone was a problem, make shift camps were set up, over crowding was an issue, along with many cultural differences like diet, religion, bored young men with no work...  to say everything went fine, is a lie, crime rates went up, cultural clashes made head lines every where. Same issues were had in Sweden, Denmark, France, Britain. So to say we have nothing to learn from Europe is not true.

Most of these immigrants will not stay in small urban centers, first chance they get they will move to the large cities, some of which are already struggling with not enough or aging infra structure to handle large numbers.  

Quote

 

Hallak, an exceptionally motivated student with high social aptitude, is not representative of all the 1.7 million people who applied for asylum in Germany between 2015 and 2019, making it the country with the fifth highest population of refugees in the world. Some of those with whom he trekked through Turkey and across the Mediterranean, he says, haven’t picked up more than a few words and “just chill”.

But Hallak is not a complete outlier either. More than 10,000 people who arrived in Germany as refugees since 2015 have mastered the language sufficiently to enrol at a German university. More than half of those who came are in work and pay taxes. Among refugee children and teenagers, more than 80% say they have a strong sense of belonging to their German schools and feel liked by their peers.

 

from your source document, it lays out some of the difficulties German experienced, like some have just decided to chill live off government funding, more than 10,000 out of hundreds of thousands...more than 50 % work and contribute taxes...again our of hundreds of thousands, 

 

In 2015, Germany received 900 000 asylum seekers and spent €16 billion (0.5% of GDP) on its migrants that year.^[3

 

In 2017 the Federal Office for Migration and Refugees in Germany reported that of the 340,000 migrants who participated in German language courses during 2016, less than half at 113,050 received a passing grade. The authority had no idea why.^[3

 

n April 2018 more than half, at 55%, of the recipients of unemployment benefits had a migration background.^[35] According to the Federal Employment Agency (German: Bundesagentur für Arbeit) this was due to the migrants lacking either employable skills or knowledge of the language

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_Germany

 

Not all of it was a win as your source seems to paint another picture.

 

[cannuck]

29 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

North Koreas official name is the People’s Democratic Republic of Korea.   Don’t be fooled by names
 

The fascist in Germany and Italy were PRO Bourgeoisie, PRO big business. They jailed and murdered socialists by the thousands in concentration camps. Karl Marx and socialism were denounced loudly and often.  NAZI supporters came primarily from other right wing parties they absorbed and their leaders and backers were from the countries” aristocratic class.   Western aristocrats were often pro-Nazi, like Charles Lindbergh and George Bush’s grandfather Prescott Bush who was a Nazi financier for a time. Meanwhile working classes around the world were typically anti-Nazi especially organized labour and socialist groups   

When Nazi-allied Fascist Francisco Franco staged a coup and civil war in 1936 against the mildly socialist Spanish government, complete with Nazi air support, capitalist countries turned a blind eye. But Socialists and organized labour groups from around the world including from USA and Canada travelled to Spain to fight in multinational volunteer brigades alongside the Spanish army. The fascist dictator Franco won the war but he was welcomed by the capitalist countries anyway as he stayed neutral in WW2 and his regime lasted into the 1970s 

Famous Nazi war criminal Klaus Barbie was a fearsome hunter of communists and socialists during the Nazi regime and then worked for the US after the war hunting and torturing socialists in South America for various right wing dictators backed by the US

 

The examples go on and on. Get a history book would ya?

It seems you read a history book and take away what you like or can spin and ignore the rest.   The Workers National Socialist Party (however it translates) featured at its core things such as the nationalization of all companies - the basics of Marxist socialism (state owning the means of production, as was also written in the Regina Manifesto of your beloved NDP).  It was exactly what it's name suggested - a socialist party.  It was also run by a total fruitcake - much like pretty much EVERY socialist party - and when you take a whole range of freedoms (you know, those things the RIGHT WING supports) you get what you got.  Courtesy of socialism.

[BeaverFever]

2 hours ago, cannuck said:

It seems you read a history book and take away what you like or can spin and ignore the rest.   The Workers National Socialist Party (however it translates) featured at its core things such as the nationalization of all companies - the basics of Marxist socialism (state owning the means of production, as was also written in the Regina Manifesto of your beloved NDP).  It was exactly what it's name suggested - a socialist party.  It was also run by a total fruitcake - much like pretty much EVERY socialist party - and when you take a whole range of freedoms (you know, those things the RIGHT WING supports) you get what you got.  Courtesy of socialism.

It seem you didn’t read a history book at all. Sorry you don’t know what you’re talking about and your argument is really weak.  

And Right wing doesn’t mean “freedom “. There have always been right wing dictators. Putin is right wing. Pinochet was right wing.  It just means promoting  “traditional” values, social order and/or way of life, whatever that might be in a particular society.  In fact the very first use of the term “right wing” referred to to those in the time of the French Revolution who sat together n the righ-hand side of parliament and wanted to preserve the French monarchy and rigid class structure in opposition to the revolutionaries on the Left-hand side. 

BTW, The Nazis privatized lots of public industries.  Read the section of the Economy of Nazi Germany called “Privatization and businesses ties”:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Nazi_Germany

[Cannucklehead]

Generally speaking, right wing politics are not very "pro freedom"

 

Within the left–right political spectrum, Left and Right were coined during the French Revolution, referring to the seating arrangement in the French Estates General. Those who sat on the left generally opposed the Ancien Régime and the Bourbon monarchy and supported the French Revolution, the creation of a democratic republic and the secularization of society.  

[WestCanMan]

3 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

North Koreas official name is the People’s Democratic Republic of Korea.   Don’t be fooled by names
 

The fascist in Germany and Italy were PRO Bourgeoisie, PRO big business. They jailed and murdered socialists by the thousands in concentration camps. Karl Marx and socialism were denounced loudly and often.  NAZI supporters came primarily from other right wing parties they absorbed and their leaders and backers were from the countries” aristocratic class.   Western aristocrats were often pro-Nazi, like Charles Lindbergh and George Bush’s grandfather Prescott Bush who was a Nazi financier for a time. Meanwhile working classes around the world were typically anti-Nazi especially organized labour and socialist groups   

When Nazi-allied Fascist Francisco Franco staged a coup and civil war in 1936 against the mildly socialist Spanish government, complete with Nazi air support, capitalist countries turned a blind eye. But Socialists and organized labour groups from around the world including from USA and Canada travelled to Spain to fight in multinational volunteer brigades alongside the Spanish army. The fascist dictator Franco won the war but he was welcomed by the capitalist countries anyway as he stayed neutral in WW2 and his regime lasted into the 1970s 

Famous Nazi war criminal Klaus Barbie was a fearsome hunter of communists and socialists during the Nazi regime and then worked for the US after the war hunting and torturing socialists in South America for various right wing dictators backed by the US

 

The examples go on and on. Get a history book would ya?

The German gov't provided medicare, a combination of free and subsidized housing, unemployment and disability benefits, their markets didn't operate on supply and demand because the government regulated supply and prices themselves, the government strictly controlled business/production and media, in what way would you say that wasn't a socialist country?

They called themselves socialists, they had extensive socialist programs covering every aspect of life from the cradle to the grave, and they strictly controlled every single aspect of the economy, they basically regulated everything. 

You can use whatever words you want to describe the Nazis, but Germany under the Nazis was not a capitalist, free market economy at all. 

If it waddles like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a duck. 

So what if some of them claimed to hate socialists? Members of Antifa say that they hate fascism, but they are the closest thing we have in this country to actual fascists, and the media that supports them acts strictly as a propaganda wing for socialist parties.

[BeaverFever]

6 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

The German gov't provided medicare, a combination of free and subsidized housing, unemployment and disability benefits,

Most governments do, including your beloved conservative and Republican governments today.  Having social programs doesn’t make a country socialist. 

 

11 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

their markets didn't operate on supply and demand because the government regulated supply and prices themselves

 Their markets still operated on supply and demand and not everything was regulated. Also during the war and the Great Depression you could say that about just about any industrialized country. 

 

13 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

the government strictly controlled business/production and media,

Again not exclusive to socialism. Thats just dictatorship. 

 

15 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

They called themselves socialists

No they didn’t. They openly denounced and persecuted socialists. They called themselves NATIONAL SOCIALISTS which they viewed as entirely different. 

 

16 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

You can use whatever words you want to describe the Nazis, but Germany under the Nazis was not a capitalist, free market economy at all. 

I never said it was capitalist and free market.  I said it’s Right-wing, which  is not the same as capitalist or free market. Although the capitalists of the day preferred fascists to socialists. 

 

21 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Members of Antifa say that they hate fascism, but they are the closest thing we have in this country to actual fascists,

Uh no the closest thing to actual fascists are the ACTUAL fascists marching in Nazi uniforms and actually waiving swastikas at Unite the Right rallies.  Like it’s literally called “unite the right” and they’re literally wearing swastikas for Christs sake. How much more of a hint so you need?

[WestCanMan]

9 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

Most governments do,.... fascists to socialists. 

All governments do all the same things to some extent. The extent to which they do them determines how socialist they are. Germany circa 1937 ---------------> socialist. 

Quote

Uh no the closest thing to actual fascists are the ACTUAL fascists marching in Nazi uniforms and actually waiving swastikas at Unite the Right rallies.  Like it’s literally called “unite the right” and they’re literally wearing swastikas for Christs sake. How much more of a hint so you need?

The most notable trait of fascists is their violent control over free speech. THE group in NA that's famous for attacking people for exercising free speech is Antifa. 

They're not attacking people for saying outrageous or damaging things, just from supporting a President whose actions have greatly benefitted all Americans.

[cannuck]

10 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

And Right wing doesn’t mean “freedom “. There have always been right wing dictators. Putin is right wing. Pinochet was right wing.  It just means promoting  “traditional” values, social order and/or way of life, whatever that might be in a particular society.  In fact the very first use of the term “right wing” referred to to those in the time of the French Revolution who sat together n the righ-hand side of parliament and wanted to preserve the French monarchy and rigid class structure in opposition to the revolutionaries on the Left-hand side. 

BTW, The Nazis privatized lots of public industries.  Read the section of the Economy of Nazi Germany called “Privatization and businesses ties”:

Ah...I agree the "right wing" de facto is somewhat as you say.   My argument is that the right side of the French Parliament - as well as Conservative/conservative parties in democracies around the world are anything but Pinochets or Putins.  The track record of the Castros, Maduros, Putins, Lenins, Stalins, Mao, etc. is to use socialism as the platform to establish authoritarian socialism - all at the cost or freedom to the people.  What the Western political looney left calls "right wing" believes in individual rights and freedoms in a more libertarian sense, not authoritarianism.

The reason the Nazis had to privative is no different from why Saskatchewan and Manitoba did:  socialism as a business model simply doesn't work.  That does not change the FACT that the Nazi movement began with (and you will note Hitler INSISTED the programme was never to change) being a socialist worker's party.

From the perspective of freedom and individual rights, it is not a "left / right" issue, but very much an authoritarian vs. democratic forms of government. You will note as well that it is our current Prime Mistake that is leading Canada away from democratic rule and towards authoritarianism granting special privilege to "Liberal friendly" companies and racially identified groups within to have many advantages and even live outside of the law that applies to the rest of us.   It just so happens that such a dividing line fits the "left vs. right" narrative quite well.

[CampMassad]

15 hours ago, Army Guy said:

A lot has changed in Canada since we first landed, and started settlements way back in the 1700's, Like Taxes, more social programs, world politics and globalization to compare them is like apples and oranges. Nobody is saying we need to cut off immigration off totally..it needs to be scaled back to allow infra structure to grow along with it.  

Wrong. 

Canada is allowing just the right amount of immigrants. 350,000 is ideal, due to the changing demographics, and the strain on the health care system, and old age pension.

[taxme]

On 10/18/2020 at 6:39 PM, BeaverFever said:

So you have no proof.   The internet is also full of websites that claim the world is flat.  Just because some crackpot posts wild claims online doesn’t mean they’re true.  The guy at immigration watch is exactly that, just some random kook. 

Maybe you are the kook here, eh? the website is full of sites that will give followers like you the other side of the story. 

 

On 10/18/2020 at 11:09 PM, CampMassad said:

I actually read that Immigration Watch Canada site. Nothing but xenophobia and bullshit. Never let the facts get in the way of a good narrative, for scared old White men.

Racist. 

[Army Guy]

4 hours ago, CampMassad said:

Wrong. 

Canada is allowing just the right amount of immigrants. 350,000 is ideal, due to the changing demographics, and the strain on the health care system, and old age pension.

I'm sure i can provide credible sources that disagree, and what they are saying is most large Canadian cities are now or close to maxing out current infra structure, like road networks, bridging, sewage, clean water distribution, not to mention Housing, both in single homes and major housing buildings. All of it either outdated, or maxed out...

Currently that is where most immigrants are going to migrate to, they will move to centers where there is a large concentration of their own kind. 

And until the infra structure is brought up to speed to handle large numbers of immigrants the whole system will fail under it's own weight. we can see this in cities like Montreal, having to pump billions of liters of untreated sewage into the St Lawrence, or large chunks of concrete falling from over passes onto cars, some cities still have lead pipes in their networks  there are lots of cases from most of our major cities already in the media.

 

[taxme]

On 10/18/2020 at 6:39 PM, BeaverFever said:

So you have no proof.   The internet is also full of websites that claim the world is flat.  Just because some crackpot posts wild claims online doesn’t mean they’re true.  The guy at immigration watch is exactly that, just some random kook. 

So, what proof do you have to offer to dismiss what Immigration Watch Canada has to say? Where have they gone wrong in their reporting of what appears to be true facts? Point something out for me that I can go on, will you? Don't just talk the talk, walk the walk. Over. 

Maybe it is those leftist liberal/socialist websites that you enjoy visiting and reading are the real crackpots? Hey, we never know, eh?  

[taxme]

On 10/18/2020 at 11:09 PM, CampMassad said:

I actually read that Immigration Watch Canada site. Nothing but xenophobia and bullshit. Never let the facts get in the way of a good narrative, for scared old White men.

Old "white" men. Are you a racist?  

[taxme]

20 hours ago, Army Guy said:

A lot has changed in Canada since we first landed, and started settlements way back in the 1700's, Like Taxes, more social programs, world politics and globalization to compare them is like apples and oranges. Nobody is saying we need to cut off immigration off totally..it needs to be scaled back to allow infra structure to grow along with it.

Initial immigration into Germany was a nightmare, even Merkel will say so, they were over whelmed,  finding shelter for everyone was a problem, make shift camps were set up, over crowding was an issue, along with many cultural differences like diet, religion, bored young men with no work...  to say everything went fine, is a lie, crime rates went up, cultural clashes made head lines every where. Same issues were had in Sweden, Denmark, France, Britain. So to say we have nothing to learn from Europe is not true.

Most of these immigrants will not stay in small urban centers, first chance they get they will move to the large cities, some of which are already struggling with not enough or aging infra structure to handle large numbers.  

Trying to put some common sense and logic into a leftist liberal or socialist head is truly an exercise in futility. I think that beaverfever has a real high temperature leftist liberal snowflake fever. A suggestion. Stay in bed and off the computer for a few months BF. Dr. Taxme's orders. 

[taxme]

1 minute ago, taxme said:

 

 

4 hours ago, CampMassad said:

Wrong. 

Canada is allowing just the right amount of immigrants. 350,000 is ideal, due to the changing demographics, and the strain on the health care system, and old age pension.

The change to the demographics and health care is due to massive third world immigration. Canada does not need 350,000 new legal and illegal refugees or immigrants any longer. Canada needs a moratorium on immigration for for at least five years. With more new immigrants means overloading the system and which means more new services. Anyone with an ounce of brains can figure that one out easily enough. Sadly, there are way too many Canadians very short on brain cells. Canada will never see it's potential as long as those brain dead sheeple followers are still around. Just my opinion of course. 

[BeaverFever]

20 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

The most notable trait of fascists is their violent control over free speech. THE group in NA that's famous for attacking people for exercising free speech is Antifa. 

They're not attacking people for saying outrageous or damaging things, just from supporting a President whose actions have greatly benefitted all Americans.

Tell that to Colin Kaepernick. Conservatives have their own censorship and try to force their own brand of political correctness down other people’s throats. Starbucks coffee cups not Christian enough?  Gillette commercials not macho enough?  Every US politician has to pose in front of a church with their families as props and swear to how religious they are because it’s political suicide in the US to say you’re an atheist or even that you’re just not interested in religion.   Even though most people aren’t that into religion everybody expects leaders to pretend Gimme a break. 
 

Trump has not benefited most Americans he’s an unstable moron his administration is incompetent he’s like a reverse King Midas everything he touches turns to shit. He’s alienated and weakened Americas alies while emboldening its enemies.  His toxic politics and conspiracy theories have left the country more divided than any time since the civil war and his attacks on the free press and the Democratic process are  biggest threat to democracy that America has faced since the 1960s

Edited October 21, 2020 by BeaverFever

[BeaverFever]

5 hours ago, taxme said:

So, what proof do you have to offer to dismiss what Immigration Watch Canada has to say? Where have they gone wrong in their reporting of what appears to be true facts? Point something out for me that I can go on, will you? Don't just talk the talk, walk the walk. Over. 

Maybe it is those leftist liberal/socialist websites that you enjoy visiting and reading are the real crackpots? Hey, we never know, eh?  

This is not a duel between my crackpots and your crackpots. It’s your crackpots vs the actual real world. I don’t have any crackpots that’s the difference. 

I don’t rely on on some unknown unrecognized self-proclaimed “expert” internet kook for my information, it’s that simple. And when said kooks come out of the woodwork to challenge mainstream opinion and eatablished expert opinions with their wild conspiracy theories, they don’t need deep analysis to be dismissed.   They haven’t earned my time 

[bush_cheney2004]

46 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

Trump has not benefited most Americans he’s an unstable moron his administration is incompetent he’s like a reverse King Midas everything he touches turns to shit. He’s alienated and weakened Americas alies while emboldening its enemies.

 

Actually, Trump benefited millions of Americans across all demographics with the lowest post WW2 unemployment rate.   Even with COVID, the U.S. unemployment rate is better than Canada's, which is below the G7 average.

America's weak ass allies like Canada needed to be "alienated", just as Bush and Obama called them out for being defence spending deadbeats.

[BeaverFever]

8 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Actually, Trump benefited millions of Americans across all demographics with the lowest post WW2 unemployment rate. 

The rooster who takes credit for the sun rising. The economy was growing steadily for years before Trump took office.

One of the funniest things I read was Trumps tweet taking credit for  11 years of uninterrupted growth.  But then it doesn’t seem like he’d be one who’s good at math. 
 

Do you give Trudeau credit for when he had one of the lowest unemployment rates also?  No? Tell me more!  Let me guess:  “That’s different ...uh ...um ...ack...gulp”. 

14 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

America's weak ass allies like Canada needed to be "alienated", just as Bush and Obama called them out for being defence spending deadbeats.

 He didn’t just call them out for weak defence spending he actively attacks their domestic policies and tries to undermine their political and economic influence while encouraging Russian political aggression in Europe 

[bush_cheney2004]

10 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

The rooster who takes credit for the sun rising. The economy was growing steadily for years before Trump took office.

 

U.S. presidents get credit or blame for what happens on their watch....whether it be Bush...Obama...or Trump.   Trump increased U.S. manufacturing jobs that stubbornly evaded Obama.   African American unemployment rates reach all time lows.

 

Quote

He didn’t just call them out for weak defence spending he actively attacks their domestic policies and tries to undermine their political and economic influence while encouraging Russian political aggression in Europe 

 

So ?    If they weren't in such weak positions to begin with, they wouldn't be so vulnerable to Trump's policies.   Canada is one of the worst offenders (NATO), not even attempting to meet defence spending goals promised before Trump ever became president.

Trump did exactly what he said he would do, challenging the globalists and protectionists with some of their own medicine.   Canada often confuses economic competition with alliance as an excuse for lower worker productivity, lack of domestic capital, lopsided dependence on the U.S. export market, and insistence that the USA defend the "post WW2 order while being a NATO deadbeat.

Edited October 21, 2020 by bush_cheney2004

[BeaverFever]

19 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

U.S. presidents get credit or blame for what happens on their watch....whether it be Bush...Obama...or Trump.   Trump increased U.S. manufacturing jobs that stubbornly evaded Obama.   African American unemployment rates reach all time lows.

Manufacturing is in permanent decline, even pre-COVID and Trumps tariffs trade wars have only made raw materials more expensive   Manufacturing job gains have actually been limited to specific niches  

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/02/08/economy/manufacturing-jobs/index.html

 

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/09/05/trump-said-hed-rebuild-manufacturing-now-its-decline-what-happened/%3foutputType=amp

23 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

So ?    If they weren't in such weak positions to begin with, they wouldn't be so vulnerable to Trump's policies.   Canada is one of the worst offenders (NATO), not even attempting to meet defence spending goals promised before Trump ever became president.

Trump did exactly what he said he would do, challenging the globalists and protectionists with some of their own medicine.   Canada often confuses economic competition with alliance as an excuse for lower worker productivity, lack of domestic capital, lopsided dependence on the U.S. export market, and insistence that the USA defend the "post WW2 order while being a NATO deadbeat.

What a bunch of nonsense. These are not trade or defence spending grievances and the US is as protectionist as anyone else out there.   Theyae are overtly hostile actiona meant to politically and economically damage the EU and member states solely foe the purpose of damaging them. Not to recrify some perceived policy disagreements.  Trump and his camp are overtly anti EU and pro Russia,  its that simple

[bush_cheney2004]

25 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

Manufacturing is in permanent decline, even pre-COVID and Trumps tariffs trade wars have only made raw materials more expensive   Manufacturing job gains have actually been limited to specific niches 

 

Nevertheless, there have been gains in U.S. manufacturing jobs, far better than in Canada.   Ontario begs multinationals for automotive product and jobs that Canada cannot provide.   85% of Canada's automotive production is exported to the United States.

 

Quote

What a bunch of nonsense. These are not trade or defence spending grievances and the US is as protectionist as anyone else out there.   Theyae are overtly hostile actiona meant to politically and economically damage the EU and member states solely foe the purpose of damaging them. Not to recrify some perceived policy disagreements.  Trump and his camp are overtly anti EU and pro Russia,  its that simple

 

If Russia was such a threat, then Canada and the other NATO deadbeats would be in much better defence positions, and less dependent on the United States.   President Obama did little about Russia's moves and yet he is loved by the Canadian deadbeats.

America is broke and can no longer afford to carry these EU and Canadian deadbeats on its back, while being criticized for a lack of universal healthcare and more social spending.  

The EU and Canada are economic competitors while insisting that the Americans also continue to carry the bulk of the defence burden.   (The EU's population is larger than America's.)   Trump has engaged China while Canada remains impotent.

Anti-American rhetoric was rampant in Canada and the EU long before Trump.

 

Edited October 21, 2020 by bush_cheney2004

[cannuck]

8 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

1.  If Russia was such a threat, then Canada and the other NATO deadbeats would be in much better defence positions, and less dependent on the United States.   President Obama did little about Russia's moves and yet he is loved by the Canadian deadbeats.

2.  America is broke and can no longer afford to carry these EU and Canadian deadbeats on its back, while being criticized for a lack of universal healthcare and more social spending.  

3.  The EU and Canada are economic competitors while insisting that the Americans also continue to carry the bulk of the defence burden.   (The EU's population is larger than America's.)   Trump has engaged China while Canada remains impotent.

4.  Anti-American rhetoric was rampant in Canada and the EU long before Trump.

1.  Russia IS such a threat.  Putin needs to perfect his Joe Stalin profile by "making Russia great again".   That inevitably means more of a military presence.  Also, he uses same to keep export markets for Russian energy (pretty much what runs the economy) and foreign policy in the former buffer states.  NATO is stunningly blind to this threat (or stunningly complicit out of pure ignorance).

2.  The US could be a lot less broke if it stopped handing 1/2 of all sick care costs to lawyers, insurers and "prophylactic" medicine needed to establish LLL checkpoints (i.e. Legal Liability Lottery - one of the top problems of the US economy).  Medicine is a social service, not a business.

3.  Canada remains so due to a string of leaders with no balls, capped off the the current one who adds no brains to the list.

4.  It has the rallying cry of the looney left and our stumbling attempt at nationalism for decades.  Few countries now or in the past have had such close economic, defense and cultural relationships.   Canada being the obvious minor partner should get a bit of a pass for whining a bit to try to preserve our identity.  That and trying to keep from being screwed over in trade agreements.

[bush_cheney2004]

1 hour ago, cannuck said:

1.  Russia IS such a threat. 

 

Then act like it and spend money on defence instead of whining about the United States.

 

Quote

 

2.   Medicine is a social service, not a business.

 

 

Even Canada has a 70/30 govt/private health care insurance and delivery model

 

Quote

3.  Canada remains so due to a string of leaders with no balls, capped off the the current one who adds no brains to the list.

 

Then fix it.

 

Quote

4.   Canada being the obvious minor partner should get a bit of a pass for whining a bit to try to preserve our identity.  That and trying to keep from being screwed over in trade agreements.

 

Too bad....only Mongolia is more dependent on another nation's market and capital.   Diversify, invest in R&D, and stop watching so much America television programming !

Edited October 21, 2020 by bush_cheney2004