The Coronavirus

[Shady]

I'd expect all businesses to conduct themselves the way that the LBCO, and grocery stores and drug stores are currently doing.  Standing 6 feet away in lines, using masks, sanitizer etc.  Bars and restaurants would probably have new capacity limits until the summer.

[Boges]

Just now, Shady said:

Who's enforcing quarantines now?  I'd expect anyone that's high risk, would want to self-quarantine.  If they won't, than they're risking their life.  I'd also expect there to be some kind of government policy directed towards nursing homes and retirement homes though.

I think anyone is potentially risking their lives. 

What I'm saying is, that if we do this it's going to be tough to isolate "high-risk" people. 

Unless they live alone and can isolate themselves. I suspect that's a small percentage of the "high risk" population.

[bush_cheney2004]

5 minutes ago, Shady said:

Who's enforcing quarantines now?  I'd expect anyone that's high risk, would want to self-quarantine.  If they won't, than they're risking their life.  I'd also expect there to be some kind of government policy directed towards nursing homes and retirement homes though.

 

Exactly...there should have been segregation and infection control at the nursing homes much earlier.    Letting underpaid employees travel between facilities was a disaster waiting to happen...and it did.   If it takes military resources (e.g. Quebec), then make it so.

[Argus]

5 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Exactly...there should have been segregation and infection control at the nursing homes much earlier.    Letting underpaid employees travel between facilities was a disaster waiting to happen...and it did.   If it takes military resources (e.g. Quebec), then make it so.

How do you control for infected but asymptomatic employees coming in to work?

[Shady]

9 minutes ago, Argus said:

How do you control for infected but asymptomatic employees coming in to work?

There would need to be testing in place.

[Boges]

4 minutes ago, Shady said:

There would need to be testing in place.

Which we are a long way off from. 

[bush_cheney2004]

55 minutes ago, Argus said:

How do you control for infected but asymptomatic employees coming in to work?

 

Testing, segregation, rolling 14 day pools, dirty & clean I/O, washdowns, PPE, airflow, etc.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Heads of government should be ultra-cautious about publicly discussing controversial new treatments during a pandemic. Once the name has left the leader’s lips, it doesn’t matter what qualifying language accompanied it. You can’t brainstorm in front of the nation and expect nobody to get the wrong idea.

 

 

 

 

[New World Disorder]

4 hours ago, Shady said:

But casualties are almost as high.  Regardless, that's why mitigation and social distancing are still important when re-opening the economy.  High risk people can still remain in quarantine.

Where is the mitigation on the roads?

[SpankyMcFarland]

Ideally, before opening up we would have widely available tests for the virus and a reliable antibody test as well. At the very least, all high-risk people like those in care homes (and their carers) need intensive, repeated testing. At some point we’re going to be asked to take our chances with physical distancing etc. It’s going to be a rough ride. 

[New World Disorder]

1 minute ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Ideally, before opening up we would have widely available tests for the virus and a reliable antibody test as well. At the very least, all high-risk people like those in care homes (and their carers) need intensive, repeated testing. At some point we’re going to be asked to take our chances with physical distancing etc. It’s going to be a rough ride. 

We'd need a reliable test first. Nations are producing their own tests which have garnered varying results. Nothing really consistent. I would not count on those tests to show us anything definitive.

[Shady]

15 minutes ago, New World Disorder said:

Where is the mitigation on the roads?

It's part of the law.  The general rule is for every 10 km/hour leave one car length of distance in front of you.  Following speed limits.  Also, using signals when changing lanes.  That's all part of mitigation.

[Shady]

Just now, New World Disorder said:

We'd need a reliable test first. Nations are producing their own tests which have garnered varying results. Nothing really consistent. I would not count on those tests to show us anything definitive.

That's not true.  The accuracy of tests isn't an issue, other than tests made in China.  It's the speed of the test.

[New World Disorder]

Just now, Shady said:

It's part of the law.  The general rule is for every 10 km/hour leave one car length of distance in front of you.  Following speed limits.  Also, using signals when changing lanes.  That's all part of mitigation.

That's all fine, but we know there are idiots on the road that don't obey the rules of the road. How do you mitigate against stupidity?

[New World Disorder]

Just now, Shady said:

That's not true.  The accuracy of tests isn't an issue, other than tests made in China.  It's the speed of the test.

But the tests have not been developed yet in Canada.

[Shady]

3 minutes ago, New World Disorder said:

But the tests have not been developed yet in Canada.

Some have, some are from other countries, so what?  Here's the complete list.  Some of the newer/faster tests aren't on the list yet.   But they're from American companies.

https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/drugs-health-products/medical-devices/covid-19/diagnostic-devices-authorized.html

[eyeball]

14 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Heads of government should be ultra-cautious about publicly discussing controversial new treatments during a pandemic. Once the name has left the leader’s lips, it doesn’t matter what qualifying language accompanied it. You can’t brainstorm in front of the nation and expect nobody to get the wrong idea.

I fail to see why I should waste my concern on anyone stupid enough to continue following the stupidest politician on the planet into oblivion.  There should be a Darwin Award the size of the Statue of Liberty built in Trump's honour.  Being an ordinarily intelligent person in the midst of so much stupidity must be as terrifying as being normal in a Zombie Apocalypse.

Aim for the head is really all you can say.

[Shady]

5 minutes ago, New World Disorder said:

That's all fine, but we know there are idiots on the road that don't obey the rules of the road. How do you mitigate against stupidity?

You can't.  That's true of life in general.  

[eyeball]

Just now, Shady said:

You can't.  That's true of life in general.  

Sure you can. The technology to make driving safer by circumventing human stupidity has been on the shelf for years. 

Trouble is the "not until they pry my steering wheel from my dead cold fingers" crowd wouldn't stand for any infringement of their right to be as pigheaded as they choose.  The same yahoos that fear public health officials using their cellphones and bank cards to trace, track and contain outbreaks. People for whom the words social engineering are as galvanizing and terrifying as the words Allahu Akbar.  The sort of people who think everyone and everything occurring outside their tribe's comfort zone is the result of a communist plot.

Brain dead fucking idiots in other words.

[Zeitgeist]

22 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Sure you can. The technology to make driving safer by circumventing human stupidity has been on the shelf for years. 

Trouble is the "not until they pry my steering wheel from my dead cold fingers" crowd wouldn't stand for any infringement of their right to be as pigheaded as they choose.  The same yahoos that fear public health officials using their cellphones and bank cards to trace, track and contain outbreaks. People for whom the words social engineering are as galvanizing and terrifying as the words Allahu Akbar.  The sort of people who think everyone and everything occurring outside their tribe's comfort zone is the result of a communist plot.

Brain dead fucking idiots in other words.

Take it easy.  There are good reasons to be very concerned about heavy surveillance.  Whatever new mob form of Puritanism emerges will have ample data to seize upon immediately.  For example, maybe we decide all elderly should stay home.  Maybe solitary men should stay home outside of work and essential movements because some perceive them as threats. Maybe we should crack down on smokers, or what about any kind of gathering because we don’t know what might be being planned?  It sounds absurd, but such restrictions aren’t unusual in theocracies and North Korea.  What happens if one day you’re feeling a bit run down because you put in long hours and the diagnostic wristband alerts the authorities to force you into two-week quarantine?  Any such surveillance and diagnostics have to be extremely conditional.  

Edited April 24, 2020 by Zeitgeist

[New World Disorder]

1 hour ago, Shady said:

You can't.  That's true of life in general.  

How much faith are you willing to put into these tests that are being developed? The results have been quite varied.

Maybe we should wait for the WHO to tell us which test will be the most accurate. That would be the right thing to do.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Take it easy.  There are good reasons to be very concerned about heavy surveillance.  

Well sure there is but I've told you a 1000 times how to nip that in the bud, souveillance - turn the Telrscreens around. George Orwell was asked,  "George, how do we prevent what you wrote about?" "Just don't let it happen" he said.

How hard can it be? All the technology we need to do so has been on the shelf for years.

[OftenWrong]

Copper is an important metal for controlling viruses. This was already known long ago, by the ancient ones, the old ones.

Copper Could Help Prevent The Spread Of Flu Infections
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/02/060214080834.htm

And there is evidence the same is true for SARS-2:
New England Journal of Medicine:
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2004973
On copper, no viable SARS-CoV-2 was measured after 4 hours and no viable SARS-CoV-1 was measured after 8 hours.

So injecting molten copper into your veins might help to fight the virus iternally. Problem is that copper doesn't melt until a thousand degrees. But, it's just another technical problem that can be solved.

=====

Certain diets that focus on nuts, fruits and delicious salads are notably higher in these essential nutrients. People who frequently eat these foods tend to have less disease, when measured in broad population studies. Physically less disease, and also mentally as well. To maintain good immune health you need to consume the minerals that come from the soil. From the life-giving dirt of the good Earth itself. It is life, I tell you. It's concentrated in the plant's skin. Like in yer potato skins, and stuff.

Hence a dinner of oven baked potato skins, with sour cream and chives should be beneficial, but only if eaten regularily of course... you have to build up the level in your blod stream. Even potato chips would be beneficial, maybe? The green potato chips you never liked to eat, since they are poisonous.
Antiviral properties of potato glycoalkaloids

That is why we lowly people who have to always eat further down the food chain, closer to the soil and more plain food without fancy sauces will survive, while all you who dine on gourmet meals, like your vichy-sousse and stuff, with some shrimps added even, you are the ones likely to go first. We have to eat the rotten and green potatoes.

So go outside now and eat some dirt you stupid chowderheads, as Grandma would say. And go drink some poison. But remember just a little, stupid idiots. Too much is bad for you again. Then she'd roll her eyes.

[SpankyMcFarland]

5 hours ago, Shady said:

Some have, some are from other countries, so what?  Here's the complete list.  Some of the newer/faster tests aren't on the list yet.   But they're from American companies.

https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/drugs-health-products/medical-devices/covid-19/diagnostic-devices-authorized.html

They’re all viral detection tests with PCR? There have been concerns about false negatives with them given problems with sampling etc. The bigger problem is antibody testing. We need that to determine how many people have been exposed and may be immune for some time thereafter. So far, given the rush to market, these tests appear to have highly varied sensitivity and specificity:

https://www.evaluate.com/vantage/articles/analysis/spotlight/covid-19-antibody-tests-face-very-specific-problem

 

[-TSS-]

It must be painful for young people whose lives consist very much of things like festivals and concerts or other things where large crowds of people gather together. As for the rest of us, it is quite astonishing how quickly one adapts to these otherwise very unnatural circumstances and learns to deal with them accordingly.