Army Guy Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 27 minutes ago, eyeball said: The problem is that conservatives want to rig the questions and dominate the rejection process. You guys make me laugh...we don't want to control anything we want the existing system fixed, Guys like you throw their heads in the sand and keep repeating everything is fine, relax...roll a joint....everything will fix itself , So what your saying is this and correct me if i'm wrong.....we don't want any questions, on morals and values because we have none period...or There is no value on these questions they scare me .....the current system is working fine, nothing wrong with it......we should assume everyone is a good person until they prove other wise, and let them all in.....and current immigration levels are ok, not high enough or to high.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 So far I haven't heard anything from Trudeau about this which I thought would a no no for Trudeau. Maybe if Doug Ford proposed the same thing for Ontario there would be a reaction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, egghead said: I believe it did. We don't need value test, but we need language test (a real one). 75% of Canadians disagree with you. They see no sense in importing people filled with religious hate and values which strongly support that hatred. We have more than enough already. Edited June 17, 2019 by Argus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 3 hours ago, HeadLines said: I was responding to this: The political, academic and media elites in their tight, incestuous bubble are all fully supportive of mass immigration. Even the idea that Canada has a culture or values that we ought to protect is anathema to them. None will dare express a contrary view to the prevailing narrative that mass immigration is an unparalleled benefit - though none will produce any evidence of that, nor need any. As for what ordinary Canadians think or want? They couldn't care less. They don't hear it. They live in a self-contained bubble where they reassure themselves that everyone believes as they do. I am not elite, I don't live in a bubble. Immigrants/refugees will learn the language they need to learn. The values test is a really big problem. Just in this conversation people obviously have different values. Will the values test begin to apply to people born in Canada? I'm talking about values which say gays should be killed or imprisoned, that women who show their shoulders are whores, and thus free to be raped, or that in any case should be beaten whenever they get out of line. I'm talking about religiously inspired values out of the sixteenth century which do not believe in democracy or a secular society, and which do believe anyone who blasphemes or goes against their religion should be killed. Nobody is talking about shades of gray here, but of black and white. And yes, I recognize the irony in using that and how gleeful the lower IQ folks on the left would be to pick it up and brandish it aloft, but their opinions are so poorly stated, so poorly supported that only the ignorant pay them any heed. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 2 hours ago, dialamah said: 4 decades of research demonstrate that immigration is linked to lower crime rates. But the conservative, anti-immigrant lobby continues to push the myth that immigrants mean more crime. This is politics of fear, and you are buying right in. Why? Why are the majority of criminals wanted by the RCMP minorities? According to stats canada 70% of visible minorities are immigrants, and almost all the rest are their children. By population, only one out of 5 wanted men should be a visible minority. So why so many? RCMP most wanted list Same in Toronto Toronto most wanted Same in Ottawa Wanted by Ottawa police Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 1 hour ago, egghead said: It is because we don't have a REAL Canadian values. They will learn it when they are here (that is the language test for). OK, may be ask them to take consumer education 12 or social studies 11, then take the test They will 'learn' that they shouldn't beat women or kill gays or Jews when they're here? But their religion says otherwise. You expect them to abandon their religions when they arrive because we tell them it's bad? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Army Guy said: Thats bullshit, we have Values, and morals , and yes a lot of them we share with most civilized western nations....is moral right to give your sister of 12 away in marriage....How about how we value life we have no death penalty, nor do we allow stoning to death as a form of punishment. the list is endless. What is the problem with asking questions, and using those questions as part of the whole acceptance or rejection process.. The problem is that English Canadian opinion makers have long spoken disparagingly about this country and everything in its past. To their minds there is absolutely nothing good about Canada other than its acceptance of immigration and multiculturalism. And in their minds, doing a values test suggest that we have values superior to theirs. This is anathema to them. We are not, to their minds, superior in any way to any country in the world. Take the most miserable shithole like Afghanistan and they'll ooze respect for their culture. Pretend ours is in any way superior and they'll be outraged. Trudeau is a good example of that. He's never had a good thing to say about Canada that isn't related to multiculturalism or immigration. He travels around the country and around the world bursting into tears whenever he talks about the horrible things we've done in our history to everyone in existence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 (edited) del Edited June 17, 2019 by Argus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 Canadians are rejecting the Trudeau regime's immigration policies according to a recent Leger survey, but although it's concerning, it won't stop the Liberals from pushing their global agenda. IMO most people are okay with a reasonable level of immigration as long as it is tied to the economy and is based on merit and qualifications; that and sharing our common values. Values which do not include killing gays, beating women, FGM among other things. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canadians-favour-limiting-immigration-1.5177814 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Army Guy said: So what your saying is this and correct me if i'm wrong.....we don't want any questions, on morals and values because we have none period... We have plenty of morals and values and some are definitely worth questioning. Quote or There is no value on these questions they scare me .... I suspect your questions would just amuse me. I don't think there's any point to asking them because its merely a right-wing feel-good exercise - a pathetic sop that lowers Canada's reputation. Quote ....the current system is working fine, nothing wrong with it......we should assume everyone is a good person until they prove other wise, and let them all in..... Pretty much. Quote ...and current immigration levels are ok, not high enough or to high.... Not high enough. Edited June 17, 2019 by eyeball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egghead Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 15 minutes ago, Argus said: They will 'learn' that they shouldn't beat women or kill gays or Jews when they're here? But their religion says otherwise. You expect them to abandon their religions when they arrive because we tell them it's bad? I understand where you're coming from, and I believe we need to have that too (just look at England). Having said that, what is Canadian value? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egghead Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Army Guy said: Thats bullshit, we have Values, and morals , and yes a lot of them we share with most civilized western nations....is moral right to give your sister of 12 away in marriage....How about how we value life we have no death penalty, nor do we allow stoning to death as a form of punishment. the list is endless. What is the problem with asking questions, and using those questions as part of the whole acceptance or rejection process.. haha, we don't. We just have a muddy view. What kind of questions do you want to ask? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Army Guy said: You guys make me laugh...we don't want to control anything we want the existing system fixed, Guys like you throw their heads in the sand and keep repeating everything is fine, relax...roll a joint....everything will fix itself , Our immigration system is based on merit and is well-respected around the world. The people who think it needs to be "fixed" by asking "value questions" simply do not understand the problems they think "fixing immigration" will fix. Immigrants do not cause crime; they reduce it in the neighborhoods into which they initially move. Asking value questions of them will not change the behavior of their children and grandchildren who will eventually "integrate" into the same crime rates as all Canadians. Misogynistic practices are alive and well in many groups of Canadians, immigrant and non-immigrant. Asking "value questions" will do nothing to change that. Education and help for women looking to escape abuse will help. Radicalization is not limited to young men and women of the Muslim faith. Addressing root causes of extremism would be much more effective than asking "value questions" of immigrants. This idea is just pandering to white nationalism and xenophobes. Politics of fear. Pretty sad to see in Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 I'm sure if you gave it a minute one or two would come to mind... I don't have an answer for that, I would hope there was some professional within the immigration board could come up with a series of questions to be asked, ones that would be thoughtfully worded to further give immigration officials some more insight into who they are talking to in the screening process. You think Israel has problems sniffing out unwanted immigrants, and while we might not have to go that far, I'm sure we can make some fact based decisions. Nobody ever been harmed from answering questions in Canada, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 9 hours ago, cannuck said: You seem to be blind to the fact that we are in debt far, far beyond anything sustainable with an economy that is crumbling in its fragile value added sectors. On top of that, we are already taxed to death and you think it is just fine to get on some kind of idiot virtue signalling campaign an piss away billions more to do WHAT?????? You must have quoted the wrong guy here. Let me be clear- I'm agin it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 3 minutes ago, dialamah said: Our immigration system is based on merit and is well-respected around the world. The people who think it needs to be "fixed" by asking "value questions" simply do not understand the problems they think "fixing immigration" will fix. Immigrants do not cause crime; they reduce it in the neighborhoods into which they initially move. Asking value questions of them will not change the behavior of their children and grandchildren who will eventually "integrate" into the same crime rates as all Canadians. Misogynistic practices are alive and well in many groups of Canadians, immigrant and non-immigrant. Asking "value questions" will do nothing to change that. Education and help for women looking to escape abuse will help. Radicalization is not limited to young men and women of the Muslim faith. Addressing root causes of extremism would be much more effective than asking "value questions" of immigrants. This idea is just pandering to white nationalism and xenophobes. Politics of fear. Pretty sad to see in Canada. Your right I do not fully understand our immigration policies and practices, neither does anyone else on this board, regardless if they are a new immigrant or not....what I can comment on is what I have read in the media....and no not the rebel media....What I do not understand is why your so scared or against asking a few questions during the interview....Unless your afraid these questions or more to the point the answers will target certain groups.... That is a board remark is it not.....are you saying that this ethic gangs do not seek or pressure new immigrants to join and these gangs do not commit crimes...I call bullshit.... First of all we are not talking about questions that would mislead or trap them into a false statement, because there are laws against that sort of thing....so my question is Why would we want to change that,...and why would we have to find that acceptable and why can't can't we block it at the source. again they are just questions, why are you so afraid ? Yes education would help, but what education class are immigration offering ? such as classes on rights and laws, etc Your right, but today the rate is a lot higher in Muslim population than any other...enough to cause concern, we already have more than 80 home grown terrorist that we know about....and most if not all come from Muslim families...and I agree more could be done to address extremists, but then again even if value questioning uncovered only one person with extremist believes would it not be worth it ? they are after all just questions , there is no medical team giving truth serum or some Canadian version of a torturer where we kill them slowly with kindness, and maple syrup, and watch hours ,upon hours of leaf play off footage... Just for a minute lets just say screw white nationalist or racist rednecks , whats with a few more questions, and so what that not everyone is going to be accepted, we already have limitations and policies where the elimination of an individual may depend on questions or extreme ideals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 45 minutes ago, egghead said: I understand where you're coming from, and I believe we need to have that too (just look at England). Having said that, what is Canadian value? Defining our values is a bit like defining art, in that its absence is more easily noted than its presence. If you can't interact socially with a member of the opposite sex, can't talk to them comfortably, can't touch them even to shake hands, I would say that's not our values. If you believe those who are not members of your religion are inferior, and offensive to God, and that this gives you considerable leeway to commit acts of violence on them, well, that's not our values either. Ditto if you think our laws or society should be amended to avoid offending your religious beliefs. If you think the women in your family belong to you and you can do whatever you want to them because your religion tells you to, well, that's not our values. Likewise if you think women are inferior to men and must always act and be modest around them. And I would say also that if you're not open to the values and culture here, but insist that yours are given by God, and thus cannot be changed, then you're not going to ever really integrate into our society, so should probably stay home. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 35 minutes ago, dialamah said: Immigrants do not cause crime; Yeah? What do you think the odds are that the shootings at the raptors thing today was done by a couple of white guys? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannuck Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 23 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: You must have quoted the wrong guy here. Let me be clear- I'm agin it! Yeah, I think I did. Or, it is just pick on OW day for the hell of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 1 hour ago, eyeball said: We have plenty of morals and values and some are definitely worth questioning. Name some. I suspect your questions would just amuse me. I don't think there's any point to asking them because its merely a right-wing feel-good exercise - a pathetic sop that lowers Canada's reputation. We've had to listen to Liberal feel good exercises for the last 4 years, your turn Pretty much. says a man who lives in a tree Not high enough. Well the majority of Canadians think your wrong, but then again your always swimming up stream Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 37 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Name some. Tim Horton's Maple Syrup Hockey Night in Canada You figured out how effing easy it will be to pass your stupid test yet? Quote We've had to listen to Liberal feel good exercises for the last 4 years, your turn I certainly haven't seen anything worth listening to there. What do you mean my turn? Quote says a man who lives in a tree You imagine I'm a Liberal too. Quote Well the majority of Canadians think your wrong, but then again your always swimming up stream Prove it. Maybe you can find another bullshit poll like Argus is trying to flog in his 63% of Canadians want immigration cut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 58 minutes ago, cannuck said: Yeah, I think I did. Or, it is just pick on OW day for the hell of it. Nice... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 4 hours ago, eyeball said: Affordable housing is definitely tight in the small town I call home but there's a help wanted sign in virtually every window and I'm often called in on day's off to cover the shortage where I work. Affordable housing would definitely help alleviate the shortage. We have new affordable housing built here. All bums moved in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 7 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: We have new affordable housing built here. All bums moved in. Now all you have to do is find a place with a help wanted sign. Do that and soon you'll be able to keep up with all the new Canadians too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted June 18, 2019 Report Share Posted June 18, 2019 10 minutes ago, eyeball said: Now all you have to do is find a place with a help wanted sign. Do that and soon you'll be able to keep up with all the new Canadians too. I'm sure you will. And I'm sure the government will do a good job handling it too. Just as I'm sure whatever jobs they create will thrive, long after the government cheese runs out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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