NAFTA negotiations.

[OftenWrong]

2 hours ago, Wilber said:

It's not irresponsible or cavalier, it's strategic.

It works both ways. No doubt Canada has presented a perfectly reasonable compromise. If Trump wants to meet his own deadline, all he has to do is accept it.

Do you think the US administration believes the Canadian government's sanctimonious moral BS? If you do, then you must believe it yourself. I, or anyone can pick out a number of articles showing how the Liberals are lying when it comes to upholding their moral standards. If it worked both ways, the government of Canada would live up to its own hype. Yet they do not. It's not likely that Trump's administration will fall for this. Even Canadian Liberals are not buying the Sunny Ways crap any more.

[Wilber]

28 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Do you think the US administration believes the Canadian government's sanctimonious moral BS? If you do, then you must believe it yourself. I, or anyone can pick out a number of articles showing how the Liberals are lying when it comes to upholding their moral standards. If it worked both ways, the government of Canada would live up to its own hype. Yet they do not. It's not likely that Trump's administration will fall for this. Even Canadian Liberals are not buying the Sunny Ways crap any more.

We have no idea what stage the negotiations are in. I would be very surprised if those positions weren't abandoned a long time ago and can't believe they would still be sticking points. None of them are being mentioned by the Americans, it's only some Canadians who still have their knickers in a knot. 

[Machjo]

6 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Freeland sure spends a lot of time in the United States...says the Americans should keep bearing the majority of the "post WW2" burden.

She brings all of that baggage plus Trudeau's "feminist agenda" to NAFTA negotiations.

If Liberal Canada wants all that so bad....then Canada should pay for it.

Trump should play the same game. The separate-school provisions of the Constitution Act 1982 violate a few articles of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights. If Trump said he'd consider Trudeau's feminist ideas on the condition that Canada scrap the separate-school system on human-rights grounds, given Canada's Catholic voting base that supports it, Trudeau would have fit.

[Machjo]

6 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

NAFTA is not the place for Trudeau/Freeland's "feminist agenda"...it was rejected by Asian nations and should be rejected by Mexico and the United States.

Take that crap back to Canada.

 

Why? We should launch it out of the solar system.

[OftenWrong]

2 hours ago, Wilber said:

We have no idea what stage the negotiations are in. I would be very surprised if those positions weren't abandoned a long time ago and can't believe they would still be sticking points. None of them are being mentioned by the Americans, it's only some Canadians who still have their knickers in a knot. 

"Freeland pulled a 180 and argued our negotiation planks would focus on feminism and environmentalism."
Liberals’ seriousness at NAFTA in doubt
Published:September 12, 2018

It is their clearly stated intention to use NAFTA to promote their brand of feminism. This stance, and the fact they dropped the ball and gave it to Mexico, believing that Mexico would likewise "stand in solidarity" with Canada shows how utterly naive they are. On top of this, it doesn't help that Freeland attends and speaks at anti-Trump events.
Their amateur antics have put Canada's negotiating position in jeopardy.

[Zeitgeist]

Domestic political matters need to stay out of these trade negotiations.

[Machjo]

6 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

"Freeland pulled a 180 and argued our negotiation planks would focus on feminism and environmentalism."
Liberals’ seriousness at NAFTA in doubt
Published:September 12, 2018

It is their clearly stated intention to use NAFTA to promote their brand of feminism. This stance, and the fact they dropped the ball and gave it to Mexico, believing that Mexico would likewise "stand in solidarity" with Canada shows how utterly naive they are. On top of this, it doesn't help that Freeland attends and speaks at anti-Trump events.
Their amateur antics have put Canada's negotiating position in jeopardy.

I don't entirely blame Mexico. Yes, a united front could have given better results, but only if Canada's demands were reasonable. Canada broke its pact with Mexico by playing these games. Mexico probably wanted to stick with Canada but once it saw Canadians playing these games, realized it needed to focus on itself until Canada smartens up.

[Queenmandy85]

It is shocking to read so many comments that denigrate women's rights. Can you honestly say the persuit of equal rights for women is wrong? The same goes for the environment. What kind of an idiot would oppose the protection of the environment?

[bush_cheney2004]

5 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

It is shocking to read so many comments that denigrate women's rights. Can you honestly say the persuit of equal rights for women is wrong? The same goes for the environment. What kind of an idiot would oppose the protection of the environment?

 

Lots of "idiots" in Asia, Africa, and South America who would rather be "emerging markets" first....rights later.

Politics and economics don't always mix well.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

It is shocking to read so many comments that denigrate women's rights. Can you honestly say the persuit of equal rights for women is wrong? The same goes for the environment. What kind of an idiot would oppose the protection of the environment?

You would.  If I suggested exterminating our species to protect the environment I'm sure you would oppose such a course of action.

[Zeitgeist]

4 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

You would.  If I suggested exterminating our species to protect the environment I'm sure you would oppose such a course of action.

The environment is priority for human survival.  Humanity must be the main purpose of environmental protection.  Other forms of life are far more resilient that homo sapiens.  Cockroaches can survive thermonuclear detonation.  Gaia will likely endure with or without humanity.  Environmentalism isn't primarily about the environment.  It's about us.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

The environment is priority for human survival.  Humanity must be the main purpose of environmental protection.  Other forms of life are far more resilient that homo sapiens.  Cockroaches can survive thermonuclear detonation.  Gaia will likely endure with or without humanity.  Environmentalism isn't primarily about the environment.  It's about us.

I'm sure cockroaches can't survive thermonuclear detonation, and pretty much every other species can't survive humanity.  Still, I don't see your point.  Mine was simply that QM's statement was far too broad to be valid.

[Zeitgeist]

40 minutes ago, Machjo said:

I don't entirely blame Mexico. Yes, a united front could have given better results, but only if Canada's demands were reasonable. Canada broke its pact with Mexico by playing these games. Mexico probably wanted to stick with Canada but once it saw Canadians playing these games, realized it needed to focus on itself until Canada smartens up.

Many of these positions represent genuine Canadian values, not just Liberal ones, though some of them may go outside the purview of a trade agreement.  Canada pushed these positions knowing that the U.S. would whittle them down.  Mexico seemed to be manipulated by the U.S., being told they'd get a special deal if they bargained without Canada.  What they got was fleeced.  The $16.00 minimum wage on a percentage of Mexican auto production is good, but not having a dispute resolution mechanism is a mistake, as is the short sunset clause, which prevents businesses and countries from doing any long-term planning around trade.

[Wilber]

2 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

"Freeland pulled a 180 and argued our negotiation planks would focus on feminism and environmentalism."
Liberals’ seriousness at NAFTA in doubt
Published:September 12, 2018

It is their clearly stated intention to use NAFTA to promote their brand of feminism. This stance, and the fact they dropped the ball and gave it to Mexico, believing that Mexico would likewise "stand in solidarity" with Canada shows how utterly naive they are. On top of this, it doesn't help that Freeland attends and speaks at anti-Trump events.
Their amateur antics have put Canada's negotiating position in jeopardy.

They said that  a year ago.  Show me where she said that recently.

 

Again, why aren't we hearing any of this from American sources?

Edited September 24, 2018 by Wilber

[OftenWrong]

9 hours ago, Wilber said:

They said that  a year ago.  Show me where she said that recently.

Those are their stated priorities going in to the discussion. We are not hearing anything now.

Quote

Again, why aren't we hearing any of this from American sources?

Why aren't we hearing anything from Canadian sources?

[Wilber]

2 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Those are their stated priorities going in to the discussion. We are not hearing anything now.

Why aren't we hearing anything from Canadian sources?

We are only hearing about Freelands alleged sticking to a feminist negotiating agenda from some Canadians. Not a peep about it from Americans. Why is that?

[Centerpiece]

I had heard about Freeland's participation in a panel called "Taking on the Tyrant" but had not seen any footage. Talk about bad, bad judgement. She may not have personally said anything that slurred Trump - but the context of this event was clear - evidenced by the ominous prelude that's included in the attached video. As mentioned before, both Freeland and Trudeau have managed to alienate themselves with the most important trading partner that we have. Incompetence, insanity.

Link: 

 

[Zeitgeist]

Be thankful for pushback against attempted fascism. 

[bush_cheney2004]

8 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Be thankful for pushback against attempted fascism. 

 

Fascism is very popular in Canada (e.g. "crown corporations")

[Queenmandy85]

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Fascism is very popular in Canada (e.g. "crown corporations")

That's an incredible stretch. You cheapen the impact of the word. It is tantamount to calling President Trump a nazi. It diminishes the struggle against real fascists, communists and nazis. 

Is the TVA fascist?

[bush_cheney2004]

12 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said:

That's an incredible stretch. You cheapen the impact of the word. It is tantamount to calling President Trump a nazi. It diminishes the struggle against real fascists, communists and nazis.

 

Lots of people call President Trump a fascist/Nazi.    Marxists are getting popular too.

Quote

Is the TVA fascist?

 

Of course....FDR admired "fascism".

...and now Trudeau/Canada owns an oil pipeline.

[bush_cheney2004]

Another Canadian automotive manufacturer voting with its feet and pesos:

 

Location, location, Michigan: Canadian auto-parts maker develops tech near Detroit

 

 

[Queenmandy85]

2 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Of course....FDR admired "fascism".

...and now Trudeau/Canada owns an oil pipeline.

You do not understand what Fascism is. 

[bush_cheney2004]

Just now, Queenmandy85 said:

You do not understand what Fascism is. 

 

THat's what they always say when I point out explicit examples of state owned means of production, especially in Canada.

[bush_cheney2004]

Canada's tech sector is falling farther behind...little wonder that Trudeau and Freeland are resisting Trump's demands for IP theft protection under NAFTA.

Quote

Canada’s ICT sector is the smallest in the G7 and is continuing to fall behind other developed nations, according to a government report obtained by The Logic.

The report was prepared in advance of the Digital Industries Economic Strategy Table’s first meeting last Fall. That group, which includes Shopify CEO Tobias Lütke as the chair, was convened by the government to boost Canada’s tech sector.

In the source documents obtained by The Logic, some worrisome industry trends are identified:

• Since 2011, Canada’s ICT sector has posted slightly weaker annual growth than the total economy;
• The ICT sector is dominated by small firms (98.6 per cent);
• Average R&D spending fell slightly in the ICT sector between 2008 to 2013 (-0.4 per cent) and 2014 to 2016 (-0.7 per cent);
• Canada’s share of the global ICT market is shrinking as exports drop off (Canada ranked 16th out of OECD countries in 2016, down from 11th in 2014).

https://www.itworldcanada.com/article/canadas-ict-sector-falling-behind-government-report/407250