Native complaints about Canada's 150th

[taxme]

14 minutes ago, Argus said:

We have land rights on account of we are here and we hugely outnumber them and  we won the fights.

You sound like a racist to me. 

[jacee]

8 minutes ago, taxme said:

Too late now. The Europeans are here and we ain't leaving, pardner. The Indians of today now have to deal with the European Canadians of today who had nothing to do with what happened to them in the past. I/they had nothing to do with their problems of today. European Canadians have land rights too now, so what the hell are you going to do about that? It's a bloody mess, and I for one do not what to do about it all except to maybe suggest that we all just try to get along and move on. The Indians have their land, and the Europeans have their land. Everybody is happy. 

We all have to deal with the laws of our land, and that includes treaties and Aboriginal rights.

The law is always complex, but it's the best way we have to "try to get along".

Edited July 1, 2017 by jacee

[jacee]

23 minutes ago, Argus said:

We have land rights on account of we are here and we hugely outnumber them and  we won the fights.

We didn't make war.

We made treaties of peace, friendship and respect that we are legally bound to uphold.

 

[capricorn]

9 minutes ago, jacee said:

Aboriginal rights.

 

That should be Indigenous Peoples rights. Get with the program will you.

[taxme]

7 minutes ago, capricorn said:

That should be Indigenous Peoples rights. Get with the program will you.

We have a politically correct person speaking here. Some call them Indigenous people or Aboriginal people or First Nations people or just plain Native Indian people. It is getting to the point where it is hard to know as to what to hell to call Indians anymore. I just call them Native Indians just like I call myself a European Native. We are all natives here. 

So, you get with the program, will you. Call them what you want to call them, and so will I. 

[jacee]

25 minutes ago, capricorn said:

That should be Indigenous Peoples rights. Get with the program will you.

True, that's the internationally recognized term.

However, our Constitution Act still refers to "Aboriginal rights".

[eyeball]

4 hours ago, Hal 9000 said:

There are plenty of things that were laws or treaties written over 150 years ago that don't apply in 2017.  Should were revisit all the laws of the 1800's? 

In light of all the references to the 4th century when it comes to denigrating Islam to justify our policies all I can say is....

/facepalm

[-1=e^ipi]

Jacee, who gave the unelected foreign monarchs and hereditary chiefs the right to impose racist laws that should apply hundreds of years long after they are dead?

Answer: No one.
 

Abolish the indian act, reserve system & monarchy and create a republic instead.

[jbg]

On 6/30/2017 at 0:24 PM, Argus said:

Canada's 150th birthday approaches, and it has been accompanied by a growing whinging from natives, a whinging which is frankly offensive and derogatory, and more than a little racist. Yesterday they demanded to be allowed to put up a tipi on parliament hill, and of course, the Trudeau government caved. Calling us 'settlers' and 'colonists' they continue to insist that no one has any rights to the land here but them. And of course, the hand-wringing, spineless progressives all bow down before them, wracked by guilt and self-loathing.

Which is all total garbage.

Let's start with what the natives and their moronic progressive allies continually look back on as the garden of eden prior to Columbus. Well, it was no garden of eden. Most of the natives in our part of the Americans were hunter/gatherers, while others had basic agrarian lives. They were hard, grasping, hand-to-mouth lives which ended quickly (and in 20% of the case by violence). The average lifespan was no more than 35. During those short lifespans they spent virtually all their time and efforts trying to feed themselves. There had been no scientific progress or advances in 1000 years. In fact, scientists say the natives were less healthy just prior to the arrival of Europeans, than their distant ancestors had been. And there were no trainable animals in all the Americans which could be used to help with farming or transportation. As you can imagine, trying to farm with horses and oxen is back breaking work. But trying to farm without them is far worse. 

And if the Europeans had never arrived, life here would still be the same way. So natives should be thanking the Europeans for arriving and pulling them out of endless eons of short, miserable lives of hardship and starvation. 

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/teepee-erected-on-parliament-hill-was-for-ceremony-not-protest-says-grassroots-group

http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=5991

 

People should read a bit, perhaps Lawrence H.Keeley, 's War Before Civilization: The Myth of the Peaceful Savage before deciding "whitey bad FN good." There was plenty of internecine war before we arrived. And Canada receives high grades, perhaps too high, for their handling of FN compared to the U.S.'s handling of Native Americans.

[dre]

Nationalism is stupid. Canada is chunk of realestate with some animals living on it. The only thing I celebrate on Canada day is that I get paid without working. I dont really care if Natives want to protest Canada day, but Its too bad for them if they don't want to be part of Canada. I care about their feelings about as much as I care about yours. To me "Canada" is the ~400 people, and about 3000 square kilometers that I care about. The rest of you (and it) might as well be France.

[dre]

56 minutes ago, jbg said:

People should read a bit, perhaps Lawrence H.Keeley, 's War Before Civilization: The Myth of the Peaceful Savage before deciding "whitey bad FN good." There was plenty of internecine war before we arrived. And Canada receives high grades, perhaps too high, for their handling of FN compared to the U.S.'s handling of Native Americans.

I dont disagree. But what we did was negotiate treaties and we should honor them. 

[dre]

3 hours ago, taxme said:

We have a politically correct person speaking here. Some call them Indigenous people or Aboriginal people or First Nations people or just plain Native Indian people. It is getting to the point where it is hard to know as to what to hell to call Indians anymore. I just call them Native Indians just like I call myself a European Native. We are all natives here. 

So, you get with the program, will you. Call them what you want to call them, and so will I. 

Louis CK had some good standup comedy about this...  Europeans showed up here thinking it was India. They were like "Is this India? Are you Indians?" The native were like "No no, this is a different place, its not India". The Europeans were like "Meh..... fuck it. Your'e Indians anyways!", and kept using that term for 200 hundred years. ROFLMAO.  I think its more about garden variety retardation more than its about racism.

 

 

[Moonlight Graham]

9 hours ago, Hal 9000 said:

Treaties are all outdated and shouldn't be recognized as anything except museum pieces.  The world has moved on - sorry.

You can't ignore the law because you think it's "outdated".

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

You can't ignore the law because you think it's "outdated".

I don't know about that.  I think we all probably do that everyday. 

http://www.fun-interesting-facts.com/stupid_canadian_laws.html

Of course, I always do my dead horse dragging on Tuesdays...

[dre]

19 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

You can't ignore the law because you think it's "outdated".

Not just that, but our treaties are voluntary contracts signed by two parties. If the government of Canada refused to honor its contracts, then it would have a hard time negotiating new contracts with the rest of the world. A lot of the nations we do business with think that honoring these types of deals with aboriginal people is pretty important... It would be a signal to the world that the government of Canada cannot be trusted.

[Hal 9000]

54 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

You can't ignore the law because you think it's "outdated".

Fine, but the fishing treaties say nothing about using a 100" seine boat (and top notch electronics) or half mile gill net...or 40' lobster boats with 200 traps, and if they want land, fair enough, but not land developed by whitey.  It seems strange that they care more about land claims in Vancouver than they do in NWT, coincidence maybe. 

[Hal 9000]

33 minutes ago, dre said:

Not just that, but our treaties are voluntary contracts signed by two parties. If the government of Canada refused to honor its contracts, then it would have a hard time negotiating new contracts with the rest of the world. A lot of the nations we do business with think that honoring these types of deals with aboriginal people is pretty important... It would be a signal to the world that the government of Canada cannot be trusted.

I hardly think the international world cares about whether we end a 150 YO treaty over land claims with the FN's. 

[Ash74]

6 minutes ago, Hal 9000 said:

I hardly think the international world cares about whether we end a 150 YO treaty over land claims with the FN's. 

More likely other countries use it as a negotiation tactic when necessary.

Our crimes the government of Canada did to the FN are disgusting but we can't change the past. We are not going to move cities or abandon them or pay untold billions. It is just not going to happen. Be realistic. What we can do is make sure it does not happen again and help the reserves prosper. Many are making an excellent trade with tobacco, I imagine pot will open even more markets

[jacee]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

 

3 hours ago, -1=e^ipi said:

Jacee, who gave the unelected foreign monarchs and hereditary chiefs the right to impose racist laws that should apply hundreds of years long after they are dead?

Answer: No one.
 

Abolish the indian act, reserve system & monarchy and create a republic instead.

Answer: At Confederation Canada took responsibility for upholding treaties and existing laws (eg, BNA Act) on behalf of the Crown. 

Republic?

Maybe ... 

 

Edited July 2, 2017 by jacee
Remove quote in error

[jacee]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

I don't know about that.  I think we all probably do that everyday. 

http://www.fun-interesting-facts.com/stupid_canadian_laws.html

Of course, I always do my dead horse dragging on Tuesdays...

Omg ... I gotta do that ... not a real horse, maybe a hobby horse, drag it down Yonge St just before midnight Saturday night ... when it's still legal.

[Hal 9000]

We had an agreement that women shouldn't vote - lets go back to that too.

[Argus]

17 hours ago, jacee said:

comes just stupid to keep arguing with the laws of Canada.

Love it or leave it.

I see. So your position is that the law is settled and natives should shut up and accept that this is the way things are, and they own nothing, including their own reserves?

[Argus]

16 hours ago, jacee said:

We didn't make war.

We made treaties of peace, friendship and respect that we are legally bound to uphold.

They wouldn't have signed those treaties if they'd had the strength to get their way. And in any event, the treaties are actually hurting them now. They should all be declared null and void and the natives should be brought into the cities and assimilated.

[Argus]

11 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

You can't ignore the law because you think it's "outdated".

Did any of the treaties call for us to supply electricity and phone service to the natives? I rather doubt it. Do you know that we provide free transportation to natives if they have a medical appointment, by road, rail or air, as necessary? Do we do that for Canadians in small towns? Nope. The natives, btw, have come to understand of late, that they can simply make a medical appointment, then get the free travel to visit relatives or go shopping or whatever, and get free travel home. And then do it again whenever they want. The agency that pays for this has already shot its year's budget and has had to request more money.

[Moonlight Graham]

26 minutes ago, Argus said:

Did any of the treaties call for us to supply electricity and phone service to the natives? I rather doubt it. Do you know that we provide free transportation to natives if they have a medical appointment, by road, rail or air, as necessary? Do we do that for Canadians in small towns? Nope. The natives, btw, have come to understand of late, that they can simply make a medical appointment, then get the free travel to visit relatives or go shopping or whatever, and get free travel home. And then do it again whenever they want. The agency that pays for this has already shot its year's budget and has had to request more money.

What does that have to do with ignoring land treaties?