CPC 2017: Bernier vs Alexander

[Argus]

2 hours ago, PIK said:

By paying attention?

To what?

[Newfoundlander]

20 hours ago, Argus said:

To what?

+1

[drummindiver]

Wtf was my Bernier post deleted? Totally on topic....Let me guess, just opposed mods opinions....again....

[Michael Hardner]

10 hours ago, drummindiver said:

Wtf was my Bernier post deleted? Totally on topic....Let me guess, just opposed mods opinions....again....

I went back to late March and no hidden posts on this thread.  You may have posted it elsewhere.  Please PM us with such questions, no need to post on the thread thanks.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Economic policy positions are easier to modify than social ones. Bernier would have to trim his libertarian sails to have any chance against JT. Harper knew exactly how far he could push Canada to the right and it wasn't that far. 

[Newfoundlander]

41 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Economic policy positions are easier to modify than social ones. Bernier would have to trim his libertarian sails to have any chance against JT. Harper knew exactly how far he could push Canada to the right and it wasn't that far. 

 

 

 

I don't think his libertarian stances are too out of line - though they're are usually positions I hold anyway - I just think he wants to do too much too fast. I think there's a lack of pragmatism with regard to how much he would be able to implement in a four year period. His position regarding health transfers is something I don't think he should have been advocating at this time, especially seeing we just had federal/provincial negotiations. As well, by running on so many policies - especially fairly bold policies - your message regarding them kind of gets lost. I've heard people say he plans to privatize CBC, when he actually plans to change their mandate and reduce their spending. I've followed this race very closely and I don't necessarily understand his positions that well because he has put out so many policies and hasn't explained them that clearly. 

Edited April 30, 2017 by Newfoundlander

[SpankyMcFarland]

42 minutes ago, Newfoundlander said:

I've followed this race very closely and I don't necessarily understand his positions that well because he has put out so many policies and hasn't explained them that clearly. 

I haven't followed it closely TBH. I rely mainly on news clips for my info about him. 

[August1991]

On 1/18/2017 at 0:41 PM, Argus said:

On the CBC panel yesterday evening they said that their contacts in the party said O'Leary would be the man to beat...

CBC? There's your signal that it's "fake news".

======

With O'Leary's departure, Max will win - and the only remaining questions are whether 1) he wins on the first ballot (I predict he won't - but I Wonder) and 2) who will face him in the final ballot (I predict it won't be Alexander).

==

Question 3) In 2019, can Maxime, son of Gilles, defeat Justin, son of Pierre. 

 

Edited May 16, 2017 by August1991

[Newfoundlander]

Bernier looks well positioned but it's quite possible for O'Toole or Scheer to overtake him. 

If Chong, Raitt and Lemieux supporters largely choose O'Toole and Scheer as their second and third choice it could be enough for one of them to overtake Bernier.

[OftenWrong]

I say it should be Chris Alexander, but it won't be. It'll probably be Maxime Bernier, whom I see as Stephen Harper reincarnated. Even the picture on his website looks like a Harper publicity shot, complete with family and casual looking "working class hero" shirt.

The poll shows a majority of votes for Kevin O'Leary. Polls...

[Newfoundlander]

13 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

I say it should be Chris Alexander, but it won't be. It'll probably be Maxime Bernier, whom I see as Stephen Harper reincarnated. Even the picture on his website looks like a Harper publicity shot, complete with family and casual looking "working class hero" shirt.

The poll shows a majority of votes for Kevin O'Leary. Polls...

 

While do you think it should be Alexander? 

And how do you see Maxime Bernier as Stephen Harper reincarnated? In my opinion, they represent two different brands of conservativism, have different personalities, and while Harper opted for incremental changes with regard to policy Bernier has shown he'd like to be more bold. 

Maxime Bernier and Michael Chong -  and more so Bernier - are the two candidates I see as representing the biggest change in direction for the party.

[August1991]

On 5/18/2017 at 8:44 AM, Newfoundlander said:

Bernier looks well positioned but it's quite possible for O'Toole or Scheer to overtake him. 

If Chong, Raitt and Lemieux supporters largely choose O'Toole and Scheer as their second and third choice it could be enough for one of them to overtake Bernier.

Newfoundlander, I had the chance to meet some of these candidates in person in Montreal.

======

Scheer is tall (6'2) but fat, lazy: he'll never defeat Trudeau Jnr.

O'Toole is short (5'10) but genuine, good: he'll never defeat Trudeau Jnr.

Chong: A misguided leftist, loser but a decent human being: must be included in any 2019 Conservative cabinet, campaign.

Raitt: She impressed me.

Alexander: Tall but boring, misses the point.

Leitch: Short, hyperactive, pointless.

Edited May 24, 2017 by August1991

[PIK]

9 hours ago, August1991 said:

Newfoundlander, I had the chance to meet some of these candidates in person in Montreal.

======

Scheer is tall (6'2) but fat, lazy: he'll never defeat Trudeau Jnr.

O'Toole is short (5'10) but genuine, good: he'll never defeat Trudeau Jnr.

Chong: A misguided leftist, loser but a decent human being: must be included in any 2019 Conservative cabinet, campaign.

Raitt: She impressed me.

Alexander: Tall but boring, misses the point.

Leitch: Short, hyperactive, pointless.

They don't have to beat trudeau, trudeau is beating himself. Trudeau is doing so much damage to his own brand a decent leader that does not step in it will beat trudeau.

[SpankyMcFarland]

1 hour ago, PIK said:

They don't have to beat trudeau, trudeau is beating himself. Trudeau is doing so much damage to his own brand a decent leader that does not step in it will beat trudeau.

If the Conservatives go for a right winger like Bernier, Trudeau should have an excellent chance of winning. 

[Argus]

12 hours ago, August1991 said:

Newfoundlander, I had the chance to meet some of these candidates in person in Montreal.

======

Scheer is tall (6'2) but fat, lazy: he'll never defeat Trudeau Jnr.

O'Toole is short (5'10) but genuine, good: he'll never defeat Trudeau Jnr.

Chong: A misguided leftist, loser but a decent human being: must be included in any 2019 Conservative cabinet, campaign.

Raitt: She impressed me.

Alexander: Tall but boring, misses the point.

Leitch: Short, hyperactive, pointless.

How do you judge someone lazy upon a brief meeting? Why would you say someone who is of average height is short? Why would you describe him as genuine and good but say he'd never beat Trudeau?

[dialamah]

14 minutes ago, Argus said:

How do you judge someone lazy upon a brief meeting?

Probably the same way some people judge liberals they've never met as lazy, non-tax-paying freeloaders.

[Argus]

5 hours ago, dialamah said:

Probably the same way some people judge liberals they've never met as lazy, non-tax-paying freeloaders.

I"m assuming he didn't spend months discussing things with these people, so it would be kind of hard to make it clear the way you have made clear what you're made of.

[dialamah]

51 minutes ago, Argus said:

so it would be kind of hard to make it clear the way you have made clear what you're made of.

Not talking about me, talking about statements that generalize the voting motivations, employment status and tax-contributions of leftists.   Not like the people who make these statements ever bother to think beyond their simplistic and intolerant beliefs about Canadians who don't vote conservative.  How do such people so readily and completely insult and dismiss millions of people they've never met? 

 

[Newfoundlander]

11 hours ago, PIK said:

They don't have to beat trudeau, trudeau is beating himself. Trudeau is doing so much damage to his own brand a decent leader that does not step in it will beat trudeau.

How is Trudeau damaging his brand?

[SpankyMcFarland]

Scheer has a smug permasmirk going on. I still think Raitt or O'Toole would pose the biggest problems for JT. 

[PIK]

12 hours ago, Newfoundlander said:

How is Trudeau damaging his brand?

People are getting tired of his antics. People in ONT see that he is going to follow Wynne's lead. He deferred a lot of the ship building for yrs, the east coast will ,love that. Planes anyone? And his stunts, like jumping out of a cave just when some tourists are walking by. Or just happened to show up a wedding for pics and then lately the set up photo of him running pass a prom party. And the deficit and all the lies. The natives are pissed the vets are pissed. He is done.

Edited May 25, 2017 by PIK

[Argus]

15 hours ago, dialamah said:

Not talking about me, talking about statements that generalize the voting motivations, employment status and tax-contributions of leftists.   Not like the people who make these statements ever bother to think beyond their simplistic and intolerant beliefs about Canadians who don't vote conservative.  How do such people so readily and completely insult and dismiss millions of people they've never met? 

 

I have never had a problem calling out stupid people for their stupid beliefs and stupid activities. 

[Newfoundlander]

10 hours ago, PIK said:

People are getting tired of his antics. People in ONT see that he is going to follow Wynne's lead. He deferred a lot of the ship building for yrs, the east coast will ,love that. Planes anyone? And his stunts, like jumping out of a cave just when some tourists are walking by. Or just happened to show up a wedding for pics and then lately the set up photo of him running pass a prom party. And the deficit and all the lies. The natives are pissed the vets are pissed. He is done.

 

 

Amazing how he manages to poll higher now than when he was elected then.

Edited May 26, 2017 by Newfoundlander

[PIK]

12 hours ago, Newfoundlander said:

Amazing how he manages to poll higher now than when he was elected then.

No he is not and once leaders are in position ,it is going to be harder. Trudeau is a nice guy and all ,but he is way out of his league .And he had another 2 yrs of screw ups to go. Even women that I know that vote fro him and now find him insulting. They seem to take offence to the thought that women can go know where unless justin helps them.And of course setting two of them up to fail and then throw them under the bus. This has to be one of the weakest cabinets we ever had. But I do agree with them trying to get out of peacekeeping in Mali, that will be disastrous for our country and military.

Edited May 26, 2017 by PIK

[Newfoundlander]

3 hours ago, PIK said:

No he is not and once leaders are in position ,it is going to be harder. Trudeau is a nice guy and all ,but he is way out of his league .And he had another 2 yrs of screw ups to go. Even women that I know that vote fro him and now find him insulting. They seem to take offence to the thought that women can go know where unless justin helps them.And of course setting two of them up to fail and then throw them under the bus. This has to be one of the weakest cabinets we ever had. But I do agree with them trying to get out of peacekeeping in Mali, that will be disastrous for our country and military.

 

How is he not. Polling shows the Liberals over 40%.

I'm not a fan of Trudeau and I think there are many people who supported him who have been somewhat disappointed. I disagree that he's out of his league. Maybe I just had low expectations but I think he has performed okay. Although many of his policy decisions -  which don't seem unpopular - I disagree with. 

I think his cabinet is one of the reasons he's done well. I think he has many competent people there. Wilson-Raybould, Freeland and Philpott have all been strong, especially considering their lack of experience in politics. McKenna has also been a competent minister. Carr is considered to be doing very well as is Goodale. 

Morneau has been a real disappointment as has Chaggar, and Monsef. LeBlanc was awful as House Leader. Nobody else stands out as glaringly bad.

Harper's cabinet definitely wasn't very strong. Although that's partly due to his leadership style, those who stayed did as he wanted.