Trudeau pledges Canadian tax dollars to Argentina.

[taxme]

Our PM is in Argentina and has pledged millions of our tax dollars to go help Syrian refugees in Argentina. What the heck? Are we not doing enough of our so-called fair share of taking in Syrian refuges into Canada that we now are going to have to fork over some of our Canadian tax dollars to help Syrian refugees in Argentina? It makes me want to ask the question as to whether this is just going to be the one case or will this be one of many more handouts being given to other countries who take in refugees? Is this PM for Canada or for the of the world? 

Diversity and multiculturalism seems to be what Canada is all about these days. The PM says that this is a part of Canadian values. Well maybe they are his values but they certainly are not mine. Canada has truly become the rest of the world now. 

Source: CTV news channel. 

[?Impact]

The government in Argentina is changing to something that is more in line with Canadian values, something many here seem to cherish. As I understand it, Argentina is asking for our help in resettling Syrian refugees because that is something we supposedly have experience with. It is more about experience than money.

[Moonlight Graham]

" In 2016, the United Nations (UN) identified 13.5 million Syrians requiring humanitarian assistance, of which more than 6 million are internally displaced within Syria, and over 4.8 million are refugees outside of Syria. "  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War

Over 400,000 people have died in Syria.  Can any of us even begin to comprehend that number?  It's a civil war. This is an international crisis.  If you flee a war-torn country, you have no job, no income, no home. What kind of human being would be so terribly inconvenienced to not even be willing throw a bit of tax money to save some lives (or at least help it not be a living hell)?  Canadian values shouldn't be sitting idly doing nothing while hundreds of thousands of people die.

On 9/11, 3 or 4 buildings were destroyed and 3000 people died. Remember how we all felt from that video footage and everything after?  Remember how it completely changed our society?  Now literally multiply that by 100 (100 x 3000 = 400,000), and put yourself in the war-zone.  If you can't feel any compassion for people going through a hundred 9/11's I don't know what to say.

[jacee]

I agree from a humanitarian perspective, but whoever is over there fighting against the rebels to keep Assad in power, to safeguard corporate oil rights, should be paying for resettling the refugees. 

Obviously they're just not killing enough of them. :/

[bush_cheney2004]

25 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

 

On 9/11, 3 or 4 buildings were destroyed and 3000 people died. Remember how we all felt from that video footage and everything after?  Remember how it completely changed our society?  Now literally multiply that by 100 (100 x 3000 = 400,000), and put yourself in the war-zone.  If you can't feel any compassion for people going through a hundred 9/11's I don't know what to say.

 

That's not the sentiment I recall from a few MLW members....it was more like the U.S. "deserved it" and/or "had it coming to them".

If that was the case, then ditto Syria.  

[Moonlight Graham]

33 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

That's not the sentiment I recall from a few MLW members....it was more like the U.S. "deserved it" and/or "had it coming to them".

If that was the case, then ditto Syria.  

Alas, one of the great debates of MLW lore! All these years later, I still believe that America, as a country, had an attack coming to them, as in they provoked it.  But that in no way whatsoever means that they or anyone ever deserved to be murdered, especially indiscriminate civilians, including on 9/11.  Maybe you still just don't get what I'm trying to say.  Maybe we'll chat about it again in another 5 years!

[bush_cheney2004]

Just setting the record straight, as it is laughable to invoke 911 victims for this OP after what was actually posted back then.

 

[Army Guy]

1 hour ago, Moonlight Graham said:

" In 2016, the United Nations (UN) identified 13.5 million Syrians requiring humanitarian assistance, of which more than 6 million are internally displaced within Syria, and over 4.8 million are refugees outside of Syria. "  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War

Over 400,000 people have died in Syria.  Can any of us even begin to comprehend that number?  It's a civil war. This is an international crisis.  If you flee a war-torn country, you have no job, no income, no home. What kind of human being would be so terribly inconvenienced to not even be willing throw a bit of tax money to save some lives (or at least help it not be a living hell)?  Canadian values shouldn't be sitting idly doing nothing while hundreds of thousands of people die.

On 9/11, 3 or 4 buildings were destroyed and 3000 people died. Remember how we all felt from that video footage and everything after?  Remember how it completely changed our society?  Now literally multiply that by 100 (100 x 3000 = 400,000), and put yourself in the war-zone.  If you can't feel any compassion for people going through a hundred 9/11's I don't know what to say.

The Syrian conflict is one of just 86 conflicts ongoing right now.....And yes I have been in a conflict zone and I do feel compassion for them all, and yet I also am a realist and can't help them all.....It is time for the muslim communities around the world to stand up and start taking them in....other than those countries directly effect by the crisis....Jordan, turkey, etc.....what of Saudis, or other gulf countries...how many has Iran taken in....

[herples]

4 hours ago, taxme said:

Our PM is in Argentina and has pledged millions of our tax dollars to go help Syrian refugees in Argentina. What the heck? Are we not doing enough of our so-called fair share of taking in Syrian refuges into Canada that we now are going to have to fork over some of our Canadian tax dollars to help Syrian refugees in Argentina? It makes me want to ask the question as to whether this is just going to be the one case or will this be one of many more handouts being given to other countries who take in refugees? Is this PM for Canada or for the of the world? 

Diversity and multiculturalism seems to be what Canada is all about these days. The PM says that this is a part of Canadian values. Well maybe they are his values but they certainly are not mine. Canada has truly become the rest of the world now. 

Source: CTV news channel. 

From CTV news

" The duo declared that Argentina would open its doors to Canadian pork products for the first time since 2002, collaborate on resettling 3,000 Syrian refugees into Argentina -- including through an Argentine version of Canada's private sponsorship program -- and work through the World Trade Organization to further open borders to goods and services. "

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/trudeau-looks-to-gain-foothold-in-argentina-as-doors-open-to-foreign-investors-1.3164696

 

Why focus only on refugees?

[Moonlight Graham]

1 hour ago, Army Guy said:

The Syrian conflict is one of just 86 conflicts ongoing right now.....And yes I have been in a conflict zone and I do feel compassion for them all, and yet I also am a realist and can't help them all.....It is time for the muslim communities around the world to stand up and start taking them in....other than those countries directly effect by the crisis....Jordan, turkey, etc.....what of Saudis, or other gulf countries...how many has Iran taken in....

Nobody's saying Canada should help all 5 million refugees.  But if all countries with the means can help some of them then together we can help a good number of them that really need it.

There's a crap-ton of conflicts, yes.  My point above stands too.  If countries with the means can do a bit to help some of the people in some the conflicts in a humanitarian fashion, then humanity will be better off for it.

And yes you're right, some middle-eastern neighbours have done nothing and we should pressure them too.  But I'm not waiting around for horrible governments to grow some decency while people are dying.

[Wilber]

20 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

And yes you're right, some middle-eastern neighbours have done nothing and we should pressure them too.  But I'm not waiting around for horrible governments to grow some decency while people are dying.

It seems the divisions between Muslims are often greater than those between Muslims and non Muslims. 

[eyeball]

It stands to reason Muslims have their lefties and righties too.

[eyeball]

What's really funny is how our righties lump themselves in with Islam's progressives while insisting our lefties are with their conservatives.

[Moonlight Graham]

49 minutes ago, Wilber said:

It seems the divisions between Muslims are often greater than those between Muslims and non Muslims. 

It's yet another story of one group disliking another group. I wish we could all solve our difference like adults, instead violence and hatred and resentment.  I think one of the biggest problems with humans is when they're unable or unwilling to try to put themselves in another person's shoes and understand where they're coming from, even if they disagree that's 100% fine but, like, people need to at least dialogue and try to talk things out.

If I met a Muslim terrorist you know what I'd do?  I'd talk to him.  I'd get him to make me understand his thinking, even if I 100% reject it his conclusions at least he won't be subhuman to me.

[Wilber]

18 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

It's yet another story of one group disliking another group. I wish we could all solve our difference like adults, instead violence and hatred and resentment.  I think one of the biggest problems with humans is when they're unable or unwilling to try to put themselves in another person's shoes and understand where they're coming from, even if they disagree that's 100% fine but, like, people need to at least dialogue and try to talk things out.

 

No reason to think all Muslims will see eye to eye any more than all Christians.

Quote

If I met a Muslim terrorist you know what I'd do?  I'd talk to him.  I'd get him to make me understand his thinking, even if I 100% reject it his conclusions at least he won't be subhuman to me.

If he didn't kill you first. He is  a terrorist after all and a good chance he doesn't want to talk to you.

[Moonlight Graham]

24 minutes ago, Wilber said:

No reason to think all Muslims will see eye to eye any more than all Christians.

You're right, people are people.

Quote

If he didn't kill you first. He is  a terrorist after all and a good chance he doesn't want to talk to you.

True, but I'm a westerner.  We kill a lot more of them then they kill of us.  He'd probably think the same of me haha.  Doesn't mean I'm an idiot and would walk into a terrorist camp to try to make small talk lol.

[eyeball]

22 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

We kill a lot more of them then they kill of us.

And yet look at how many are still willing to risk living amongst us.

Pretty courageous people compared to most of us.

[Army Guy]

3 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

It's yet another story of one group disliking another group. I wish we could all solve our difference like adults, instead violence and hatred and resentment.  I think one of the biggest problems with humans is when they're unable or unwilling to try to put themselves in another person's shoes and understand where they're coming from, even if they disagree that's 100% fine but, like, people need to at least dialogue and try to talk things out.

If I met a Muslim terrorist you know what I'd do?  I'd talk to him.  I'd get him to make me understand his thinking, even if I 100% reject it his conclusions at least he won't be subhuman to me.

I wonder if you would have the same opinion if you seen these adults in action, cutting off little girls hands for going to school, killing their fathers for letting them, and raping their mother as if the first two life lessons were not enough....or how about taking the time to skin an old man then stake him to the ground so he could cook in the hot morning sun, his crime was to talk to NATO troops who stopped him for directions.........the examples are endless.....you begin to map their acts, their compassion for their cause and their total disrespect for the lives of others.....They are ruthless, they do acts, do not make sense, except to cause pain to their enemies  in fact you begin to see them as they are animals....rabid animals that need to be put down.....that's when dislike turns to hate.....Not for an entire race, but for that small group that we classify as terrorists.....Because they do not want to talk to you, they HATE you and EVERYTHING YOU stand for...... there is no changing their mind.....they have already made that promise to die for their cause if asked.....they are fanatical....Now you may be de program them over a long period of time....but not in a few discussions.....ask the Capt you took an axe to the head, by a teenager.....that was what he was doing at the time....talking....and for it he has paid a very steep price..... 

[Army Guy]

On ‎11‎/‎18‎/‎2016 at 1:02 AM, Moonlight Graham said:

Nobody's saying Canada should help all 5 million refugees.  But if all countries with the means can help some of them then together we can help a good number of them that really need it.

There's a crap-ton of conflicts, yes.  My point above stands too.  If countries with the means can do a bit to help some of the people in some the conflicts in a humanitarian fashion, then humanity will be better off for it.

And yes you're right, some middle-eastern neighbours have done nothing and we should pressure them too.  But I'm not waiting around for horrible governments to grow some decency while people are dying.

My point is that not all Syrian refugees are as hard off as you think they are.....when hundreds in Europe are complaining about the food, intra net quality, and accommodations....with some returning or threating to return back to Syria.....

Yes there is a lot of conflicts, Can you name 5 of them.....honestly.....and yet we as a nation stand up for a nation we truly know nothing about , let alone it's people or they're wants and needs....or if their culture will clash with western cultures.....Has our refuges been handled properly, have we corrected everything that went wrong....how are our refugees doing today.....how are they being treated.....

 

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

And yet look at how many are still willing to risk living amongst us.

Pretty courageous people compared to most of us.

Probably because they would be killed by them too. They want to live amongst us because we're better. 

[Moonlight Graham]

3 hours ago, eyeball said:

And yet look at how many are still willing to risk living amongst us.

Pretty courageous people compared to most of us.

Snakes in the grass... lol just kidding

[Moonlight Graham]

58 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

My point is that not all Syrian refugees are as hard off as you think they are.....when hundreds in Europe are complaining about the food, intra net quality, and accommodations....with some returning or threating to return back to Syria.....

Yes there is a lot of conflicts, Can you name 5 of them.....honestly.....and yet we as a nation stand up for a nation we truly know nothing about , let alone it's people or they're wants and needs....or if their culture will clash with western cultures.....Has our refuges been handled properly, have we corrected everything that went wrong....how are our refugees doing today.....how are they being treated.....

Yemen, Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan, Libya, DRC, every damn country surrounding the DRC, Somalia basically always, Sudan probably still, Egypt and Turkey probably next month, Israel/Palestine always, North/South Korea still in defacto war. 

Some Syrians have taken advantage of the crisis to immigrate to the West or elsewhere.  Some are also in dire need.  That's a true shame.  I'll tell you what, the Syrians who are sponsored by relatives, why are they in dire need?  They have a relative in Canada, a super rich country compared to theirs, who can wire them money, 1 Canadian dollar can probably buy a new car in those countries.  The needy fall through the cracks.  The politics and the expediency of Trudeau's promise ENSURES that numbers are the priority, not the quality of the vetting and selection, nor even helping them when they get here, unless it might appear in the media or a talking point.

Trudeau, not a bad guy, I don't mind him, but I know that he's surrounded in sh*t, and it will bring him down too most likely, just like the last few PM's. 

[betsy]

On 11/17/2016 at 7:50 PM, taxme said:

Our PM is in Argentina and has pledged millions of our tax dollars to go help Syrian refugees in Argentina. What the heck? Are we not doing enough of our so-called fair share of taking in Syrian refuges into Canada that we now are going to have to fork over some of our Canadian tax dollars to help Syrian refugees in Argentina? It makes me want to ask the question as to whether this is just going to be the one case or will this be one of many more handouts being given to other countries who take in refugees? Is this PM for Canada or for the of the world? 

Diversity and multiculturalism seems to be what Canada is all about these days. The PM says that this is a part of Canadian values. Well maybe they are his values but they certainly are not mine. Canada has truly become the rest of the world now. 

Source: CTV news channel. 

As if that's not enough......

 

 

Quote

 

Trudeau Liberals give $25M to UN agency with links to banned terrorist group Hamas

International Development Minister Marie-Claude Bibeau issued a news release announcing that Canada will be giving $25M to UNRWA, the United Nations Relief and Works Agency, an organization with well documented ties to Hamas, a banned terror organization in Canada, the US and many other countries.

The ties are so close that the Harper Conservatives removed UNRWA from their list of development partners.

While the Conservatives demanded answers about this move in the House of Commons Wednesday, what was the Liberal response?

It wasn’t to deal with the substance of the problem, it was to give glib answers

Watch as I run through the many good reasons the Harper government made the decision to cut UNRWA off and show that nothing has changed to warrant the restored funding. 

We have been petitioning the Trudeau government on this for months. We don’t think Canadian tax dollars should be going to a group with terrorist ties.

More.....

 

http://www.therebel.media/trudeau_liberals_give_25m_to_un_agency_with_links_to_banned_terrorist_group_hamas

 

Dealing with people or groups linked to terrorist groups......hmmmmm.  It seems the Liberals are going by the same Hillary Clinton playbook. 

This is politics.  If they're bending over to do this....you bet, there's something in it for the Liberals. 

 

Edited November 19, 2016 by betsy

[Army Guy]

9 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Yemen, Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan, Libya, DRC, every damn country surrounding the DRC, Somalia basically always, Sudan probably still, Egypt and Turkey probably next month, Israel/Palestine always, North/South Korea still in defacto war. 

Some Syrians have taken advantage of the crisis to immigrate to the West or elsewhere.  Some are also in dire need.  That's a true shame.  I'll tell you what, the Syrians who are sponsored by relatives, why are they in dire need?  They have a relative in Canada, a super rich country compared to theirs, who can wire them money, 1 Canadian dollar can probably buy a new car in those countries.  The needy fall through the cracks.  The politics and the expediency of Trudeau's promise ENSURES that numbers are the priority, not the quality of the vetting and selection, nor even helping them when they get here, unless it might appear in the media or a talking point.

Trudeau, not a bad guy, I don't mind him, but I know that he's surrounded in sh*t, and it will bring him down too most likely, just like the last few PM's. 

So with all this conflict in world Why has Canada chosen the Syrian people to help, why not another nation such as Columbia, Mexico, or from some African state....You say some have taken advantage of this situation and moved , all those people arriving by those boats have paid thousands of dollars, just to get to the coast, thousands more to get on those so called boats.....and then thousands of more just to live and travel within Europe...Those that can not help themselves are in the camps, the ones we were suppose to get our refugees from....But that's not where we concentrated all our numbers from....And your right the needy do slip through the cracks, like the millions of other conflict affected people around the world....people like those in Sudan who can not afford thousands of dollars to flee....The forgotten people....

I Canadian dollar might get you a coke and a smile....in Syria....

That is a pretty big gamble on Trudeau's side of the house to put numbers in front of security, quality...just one problem, and it heard around the world in the media....and yet if we where taking people from the Camps , they are already in a safe environment, why the need or rush to get them over to Canada, could it have been political damn right it was political.....So Justin could stand up and make a political point in front of the world.....Had nothing to do with Syrian refugees, they were just the tools used to make that point....So there were no heart strings attached to this decision....sure it was sold to you that way....but to the Liberals it was an opportunity...and like any Political party they jumped all over it...

[Argus]

On 11/17/2016 at 8:43 PM, Moonlight Graham said:

On 9/11, 3 or 4 buildings were destroyed and 3000 people died. Remember how we all felt from that video footage and everything after?  Remember how it completely changed our society?  Now literally multiply that by 100 (100 x 3000 = 400,000), and put yourself in the war-zone.  If you can't feel any compassion for people going through a hundred 9/11's I don't know what to say.

People die in great numbers all across the third world every year. Half a million people die of malaria every year. Now I'm all for helping to take care of the refugees in the most effective and efficient manner, which is to keep them in areas near the border of their own countries so they can go back when the fighting ends. This can be done far, far cheaper than flying them to western countries and building them subsidized housing. 

As for completely changing society, that's what I don't want to see happening over here.