dialamah Posted March 19, 2016 Report Share Posted March 19, 2016 Most of the posts in the comments below were on point. Do you mean, the posts calling conservative leaning commentators morons and whiners? Or, the ones calling left-leaning commentators libtards and hypocrites? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted March 19, 2016 Report Share Posted March 19, 2016 I always thought that name calling was such a childish process. The only intent is to tease or anger someone who has an investment in the target. Why would a poster want to do that? Does name calling improve your view of the name caller? I think not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 When has there ever been an issue on this forum that wasn't an issue of trivial importance? Making sure stupid conversations stay on-topic to a poorly written OP is of actual importance? I understand what you're saying. I'm sure that none of us here are under the illusion that we're changing the course of human history with our assorted ramblings here. Most of us are here for fun, not because we think this little forum is the place where the battle for the hearts and minds of Canadian voters can be won or lost. To borrow a sports analogy, this is rec-league, not the big-leagues. And I think that like the toolbag who brings a hyper-competitive attitude to a rec-league game, some people need to lighten up and dial it back a little. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Either there's a policy of decorum or there isn't. If you guys aren't moderating decorum, I'm quite alright with that. I look forward to this place being littered with pejoratives like CBC's comments section. If you are going to moderate decorum, which I think has been an expectation here given the Forum Rules and Guidelines, then everyone knows the game here. Junior is not endearing. It's meant to diminish the Prime Minister. Nobody's offended and it's not the end of the world, but it will lead to more disrespectful posts and petty bickering. Like I said, I don't care either way, but it's not clear at this point if there's a decorum policy or not. I agree that we would like to avoid this turning into a poop-flinging monkey brawl like the comments section at any major media website. And any egregious offenses will continue to be dealt with with that goal in mind. But this "Trudeau Jr" thing is really not that big a deal. I understand the complaint, but the moderating team has considered the complaint and made their decision, and it's time to move on. I don't believe that decorum can be created simply by enforcing a minimal set of rules. Banning terms like "LIEberals" and "Conservitards" and so-on might help the forum avoid looking like it's been overrun by junior high-school students, but it doesn't get us to decorum on its own. For example, a post like this... I'm sure there's plenty of "natives" who are fed up with people like you too. ...isn't really violating any rule that I know of, but it's not exactly the kind of discussion we're hoping to build here either. (The above post is hardly the most flagrant example.) One of the complaints I've seen a few times is that some posters have mastered the art of being insulting without breaking any forum rules. What's the answer to that? More rules? More judgment calls from the moderators? Personally my vote would be that members be friendlier to each other, and that they develop thicker skins. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Macadoo Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 I don't believe that decorum can be created simply by enforcing a minimal set of rules. Banning terms like "LIEberals" and "Conservitards" and so-on might help the forum avoid looking like it's been overrun by junior high-school students, but it doesn't get us to decorum on its own.No but you can't get even get a ticket to decorum if you don't. We understand you drink from the C.-A. Kool-aid on this one......patronizing nicknames aren't a big deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 No but you can't get even get a ticket to decorum if you don't. We understand you drink from the C.-A. Kool-aid on this one......patronizing nicknames aren't a big deal. Gotta agree. Name-calling such as "Lieberal" and "Conservitard" should be just as unacceptable as 'troll' or 'stupid'. If the moderators here truly want civil discourse, they could try enforcing a more respectful tone, rather than accepting junior-high-school behavior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Gotta agree. Name-calling such as "Lieberal" and "Conservitard" should be just as unacceptable as 'troll' or 'stupid'. If the moderators here truly want civil discourse, they could try enforcing a more respectful tone, rather than accepting junior-high-school behavior. Rest assured that "Lieberal" and "Conservatard" are and will always be banned. That's cut and dried. Charles and Michael have decided that "Trudeau Jr" isn't intended maliciously, so they have decided not to take action. I personally disagree, but I don't think it is worth getting upset about. The moderators will not always agree with you about everything. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 I think that the general feeling of the moderating team is that this is an issue of trivial importance. People are making a mountain of a molehill, clamoring for moderator action for the sake of it. If the moderating team gets involved in this, it will just encourage more people to make more mountains of molehills in the future. The better solution would be if August agree to stop using Trudeau Jr and everyone agree to stop making mountains of molehills. watching you twist, turn and gyrate over this is gold, real gold! Over a half-dozen or so posts you manage to come down against this moderator sanctioned improper use of generational suffixes... while at the same time trivializing the concerns of those who quite vociferously and adamantly maintain it's a purposeful intent to demean the Canadian Prime Minister. How is this any different from the formal defined MLW rule against '3rd party insults'... the rule that relates an offending example in the use of 'Steve/Stevie' for Steven Harper? Notwithstanding, of course, there is no basis or foundation to warrant this improper decision that goes against the very definition of how generational suffixes are to be used. . Charles and Michael have decided that "Trudeau Jr" isn't intended maliciously, so they have decided not to take action. I personally disagree, but I don't think it is worth getting upset about. The moderators will not always agree with you about everything. nonsense! There has been purposeful 'malicious' intent by some in improperly using the generational suffix 'Jr, Jnr'... or the full word 'Junior'... if only now being used because some have chosen to raise objection to its use. Even if one might choose to accept this purely subjective view on malicious intent... when it doesn't even fit within the definition of generational suffix use, how can it be "moderator sanctioned"? . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 For example, a post like this... ...isn't really violating any rule that I know of, but it's not exactly the kind of discussion we're hoping to build here either. (The above post is hardly the most flagrant example.) -k And that post was in response to the other posters' thinly veiled excuse for throwing around as many racist stereotypes as he could. So that's my point. Sometimes you police decorum, sometimes you don't. Then the mods insult people when they say they don't understand the decisions made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Moderation should pretty much be based on George Carlin's seven words. Other than that, who cares? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Rest assured that "Lieberal" and "Conservatard" are and will always be banned. That's cut and dried. Charles and Michael have decided that "Trudeau Jr" isn't intended maliciously, so they have decided not to take action. I personally disagree, but I don't think it is worth getting upset about. The moderators will not always agree with you about everything. -k My mistake, then, I misunderstood this statement "Banning terms like "LIEberals" and "Conservitards" and so-on might help the forum avoid looking like it's been overrun by junior high-school students, but it doesn't get us to decorum on its own." to mean they weren't banned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 If Charles, Charles Junior, and Baby Charlie are at all at peace with the decision, I certainly am too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 If you knew for a fact that the person speaking to you didn't care for you, your fashion, your lifestyle or your beliefs and they said "Hey, Junior", would you consider that an endearment? Charles Jr, can I get an answer to this question, please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 And that post was in response to the other posters' thinly veiled excuse for throwing around as many racist stereotypes as he could. So that's my point. Sometimes you police decorum, sometimes you don't. Then the mods insult people when they say they don't understand the decisions made. Policing flagrant violations is easy. Images and embedded video get policed efficiently because they don't take any discussion or judgment in most cases. Where as with Argus's thread, I get that the content of his OP might have made people angry or uncomfortable, but we aren't going to get into the business of attempting to regulate discomfort. As with the Nancy Reagan threads. The content made some members pretty angry, but the discussion was not against the rules. People have taken Argus's post in constructive directions, which was the whole point. If your idea of decorum is that we should take stop threads that might make people feel angry or uncomfortable, it's not going to happen. We aren't going to attempt to create decorum by squashing everything that might turn ugly. What we ask instead that you fine folks, the valued members of the forum, create decorum by responding to ideas in a reasoned, mature way. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 What we ask instead that you fine folks, the valued members of the forum, create decorum by responding to ideas in a reasoned, mature way. I'll try a second time: what distinction will you make in regards the formal MLW rule against declared 3rd-party insults. You know, the MLW rule that specifically highlights an insult infraction in using "Steve/Stevie" in referring to Stephen Harper. How is that any different from using "Trudeau Jr." to identify/label Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau... more pointedly in the face of that use not aligning with the formal identified definition of the use of generational suffixes, most pointedly in that neither Justin or Pierre Trudeau used or self-identified themselves as, respectively, "Jr and Sr"? . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 (edited) ....Charles and Michael have decided that "Trudeau Jr" isn't intended maliciously, so they have decided not to take action. I personally disagree, but I don't think it is worth getting upset about. The moderators will not always agree with you about everything. This decision is also consistent with allowing various forms of "junior" for George W. Bush over the years, even though it is/was incorrect. If Bush survived it, then so can Justin Trudeau. Edited March 20, 2016 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 I have already given my view on "Trudeau Jr". I will leave Charles and Charles Jr to discuss their ruling on that. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 This decision is also consistent with allowing various forms of "junior" for George W. Bush over the years, even though it is/was incorrect. If Bush survived it, then so can Justin Trudeau. Yes, however at least that is an easy mistake to make given how similar their names are. But Pierre and Justin? Not even close. What's strange is the doubling down on this issue by the mods. Now that we are all aware of the use of the terms why can't we agree, on a going forward basis, to adhere to proper usage? If someone comes across a post of mine where I have incorrectly used the terms then point it out to me and I will edit it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Yes, however at least that is an easy mistake to make given how similar their names are. But Pierre and Justin? Not even close. Doesn't matter....usage was incorrect. And Justin Trudeau has no problem leveraging the PM lineage back to his father during interviews. It's not like he has asked people to stop doing it either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Hey, I've had enough of of the constant insults, trolling and disrespect on this forum and am moving on. Would like to find a place where this doesn't happen, or at least not so much, if anyone can advise me - I'll hope for response in the next day or two before I deactivate. Thanks to smallc, OGFT, Army Guy, Kimmy, BC_Chick, Hal 9000, BCSapper, waldo, Big-Guy, cybercoma, msj, Westcoastrunner for good discussion, even when I disagreed with you. Probably a couple of names I've missed there, hope you know who you are. Michael Hardner, thanks for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Doesn't matter....usage was incorrect. And Justin Trudeau has no problem leveraging the PM lineage back to his father during interviews. It's not like he has asked people to stop doing it either. So since that usage was incorrect we need to balance it out with incorrect usage for Trudeau? Is this the standard we are aiming for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Hey, I've had enough of of the constant insults, trolling and disrespect on this forum and am moving on. Would like to find a place where this doesn't happen, or at least not so much, if anyone can advise me - I'll hope for response in the next day or two before I deactivate. Thanks to smallc, OGFT, Army Guy, Kimmy, BC_Chick, Hal 9000, BCSapper, waldo, Big-Guy, cybercoma, msj, Westcoastrunner for good discussion, even when I disagreed with you. Probably a couple of names I've missed there, hope you know who you are. Michael Hardner, thanks for your help. I just don't see it. I've been on some sites that would make your hair curl. This site seems fairly benign in terms of insults and disrespect. Trolling I agree with you on, but then, I don't mind it. The only sites I think would suit your requirements are those I've only heard of, like Babble, where almost everyone agrees with you and the moderation deletes dissenting opinions before you read them. Where's the fun in that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 So since that usage was incorrect we need to balance it out with incorrect usage for Trudeau? Is this the standard we are aiming for? It's not my call...or yours. The mods have spoken, and I can understand why they let this "junior" stand. Common usage and precedent prevail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 (edited) ....The only sites I think would suit your requirements are those I've only heard of, like Babble, where almost everyone agrees with you and the moderation deletes dissenting opinions before you read them. Where's the fun in that? Agreed...no fun or interest in reading the same, controlled opinion. Edited March 20, 2016 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted March 20, 2016 Report Share Posted March 20, 2016 Hey, I've had enough of of the constant insults, trolling and disrespect on this forum and am moving on. Would like to find a place where this doesn't happen, or at least not so much, if anyone can advise me - I'll hope for response in the next day or two before I deactivate. Thanks to smallc, OGFT, Army Guy, Kimmy, BC_Chick, Hal 9000, BCSapper, waldo, Big-Guy, cybercoma, msj, Westcoastrunner for good discussion, even when I disagreed with you. Probably a couple of names I've missed there, hope you know who you are. Michael Hardner, thanks for your help. That would be a shame given the few female members. I would miss your well thought out posts. I think MH should return to posting here. It would raise the caliber. And stop suspending thoughtful and intelligent posters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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