Islamophobia in Canada

[WestCoastRunner]

I know because i've already seen the interviews with the politicians and police trying to worm out of it. At best they'll say it was just some every day robberies (because, y'know they're just poor people that need money for food) and steer as far away from the sexual assault and rape allegations.

By saying it's ridiculous, are you saying that you expect charges or that you simply don't believe the women?

It's ridiculous how you are providing legal commentary from an armchair here in Canada and you expect individuals to assume you know all the facts.

[Hal 9000]

^^^ I have said that they probably won't get charged...that I doubt they'll get charged. That's an opinion!

What is your opinion, do you expect charges? If not, then why?

[Hal 9000]

^^ How about this WCR, If there are no sexual assault charges, what would be the reason why?

Here I thought you and I would be on the same page with this on - how awkward!

[WestCoastRunner]

^^ How about this WCR, If there are no sexual assault charges, what would be the reason why?

Here I thought you and I would be on the same page with this on - how awkward!

We don't yet know of the charges.

Come on Hal. Don't make this so easy for me.

Edited January 7, 2016 by WestCoastRunner

[Hal 9000]

We don't yet know of the charges.

No we don't. I gave an opinion and asked yours - thats all.

[WestCoastRunner]

No we don't. I gave an opinion and asked yours - thats all.

I refuse to give an opinion without the facts.

[Hal 9000]

I refuse to give an opinion without the facts.

The facts so far are thus; More than 150 young girls (in numerous cities) have reported being chased through the streets, dragged to the ground, clothes tore off and sexually molested - then robbed by several gangs of 25-30 arab looking men.

[WestCoastRunner]

The facts so far are thus; More than 150 young girls (in numerous cities) have reported being chased through the streets, dragged to the ground, clothes tore off and sexually molested - then robbed by several gangs of 25-30 arab looking men.

I'm not interested in your facts.

[Hal 9000]

I'm not interested in your facts.

They're not my facts, they're everybody's facts. That's what a fact is. The nice thing about a "fact" is that they are the same for everybody.

[Bob Macadoo]

They're not my facts, they're everybody's facts. That's what a fact is. The nice thing about a "fact" is that they are the same for everybody.

It's a statement really......fact would need some supporting evidence....video, semen, 3rd party impartial observants.

[dialamah]

The facts so far are thus; More than 150 young girls (in numerous cities) have reported being chased through the streets, dragged to the ground, clothes tore off and sexually molested - then robbed by several gangs of 25-30 arab looking men.

Did I miss the cite on these 'facts'? And is an "Arab-looking man" anything like a "bushy-haired stranger"?

It's a statement really......fact would need some supporting evidence....video, semen, 3rd party impartial observants.

Impartial observers - scarcer than Hen's teeth, I'm guessing.

Edited January 8, 2016 by dialamah

[Hudson Jones]

They're not my facts, they're everybody's facts. That's what a fact is. The nice thing about a "fact" is that they are the same for everybody.

When was the last time you went on a child sex tour? This question goes to all of us white men out there.

And I ask, simply because:

The white male gaze that drives child sex tourism

[Hal 9000]

It's a statement really......fact would need some supporting evidence....video, semen, 3rd party impartial observants.

I gave a fact. What about my statement is not factual?

[dialamah]

Yes, a white person can do something bad, so can a black, a jew, an asian...or any other person.

And, I would agree with you if what happened was simply one muslim man assaulting one woman. What we saw here was a systemic mind set by literally hundreds of men who clearly all think the same way. When has a group of 25 white guys (or blacks, asians, jews etc) chased down and sexually assaulted a girl...Let alone several groups chasing down several girls in multiple cities. Sorry, this is their "normal".

You can call them the 1%, but they're not the radicals, they are the "moderates". They are the "good" ones - the ones we want to bring in.

By definition, men who think it's ok to form a gang to attack anyone is not a 'moderate'.

Men who clearly think the same way create child pornography rings; fathers/uncles/brothers/mothers/sisters in that group sell pictures of their children. Men/women who think the same way form groups to traffic women/girls around the world. Many of these people are white, and Western.

What happened in Germany was a crime, the men responsible should be held in the utmost contempt and face severe penalties if found (honestly, I hope they are). But again, that says nothing about the majority of "Arab-looking" people who don't think the same way.

If you are going to hold all Muslims (or "Arab looking people") responsible for the actions of the criminally-minded among them, then you must also hold all white people responsible for the actions of the criminally-minded among them. Otherwise, it's hypocrisy.

[Hal 9000]

@ WCR, I don't think I have ever seen you side with the male side or male perspective over the female perspective ever. If there is a college couple on date that ends with a "he said/she said", you wind us up about rape culture, but on this...you've got nothing?

When you ask why I think these guys will go uncharged (or minimal charges), I just look at your reactions here and know.

With the lack of respect that most muslim men have for women, it seems inevitable that sooner or later, you would be forced to one side - I'm a little surprised at you really.

[Hal 9000]

By definition, men who think it's ok to form a gang to attack anyone is not a 'moderate'.

So, if these guys are not "moderate", then they are "radical" muslims and the UN and Germany have allowed them in, then what we have is a whole lot of radical islamists roaming around western europe and integrating into the refugee numbers - Is that what your saying?

[Bob Macadoo]

I gave a fact. What about my statement is not factual?

Facts are proven statements found, either by agreement between parties or adjudication by 3rd party impartials, to be true. Therefore that would make your whole statement not factual at this point.

[Hal 9000]

Facts are proven statements found, either by agreement between parties or adjudication by 3rd party impartials, to be true. Therefore that would make your whole statement not factual at this point.

More than 150 young girls (in numerous cities) have reported being chased through the streets, dragged to the ground, clothes tore off and sexually molested - then robbed by several gangs of 25-30 arab looking men.

What here is not a fact?

[Guest]

Fellow from ZDF being interviewed on NPR today regretted the slow reporting of these incidents and went on to discuss them with the interviewer.

Are there still people on here who believe it was all made up? He seemed to think it was genuine.

[dialamah]

So, if these guys are not "moderate", then they are "radical" muslims and the UN and Germany have allowed them in, then what we have is a whole lot of radical islamists roaming around western europe and integrating into the refugee numbers - Is that what your saying?

When you have thousands or millions of people any where. even several hundred behaving badly shouldn't be a shock; I wonder how many women are attacked during Mardi Gras, for instance? I've no idea what percentage of migrants entering Europe might hold radical views or who might be dangerous. I don't even have the information for my neighborhood. What I'm not going to do is blame everyone within 100 miles because there are gunshots fired, and people killed in my city all too regularly.

Europe as a whole faces different problems than Canada. Given that people can essentially *walk* over there, they have much less ability to ensure any individual's background or level of risk. This is worrying to me, because no country wants to have people who'll cause problems.

In Canada, our ability to properly screen people is much better. That's not to say that there aren't risks, of course there are. But the risk isn't great enough to refuse aid to the vast majority of people who look for nothing more than relief from the nightmare of their life.

Incidentally, you haven't said whether you will hold all white guys blameworthy because some white guys support pedophilia, as a sex tourist and/or through organized rings.

[eyeball]

Are there still people on here who believe it was all made up? He seemed to think it was genuine.

Not all of it just most of it.

[Guest]

Not all of it just most of it.

How do you quantify it though? The ZDF employee said they were initially careful because they thought it was a regional issue. Then when they heard it was happening on a national level, (his words) they were reluctant to act because they thought it was a hoax, given the reporting of the nationalities involved. He said they regretted that. They should have reported it fully.

From the interview I understand that Cologne has cctv footage, but Hamburg and another city, (I forget which) had turned off the cctv cameras due to privacy concerns.

Edited January 8, 2016 by bcsapper

[dialamah]

Fellow from ZDF being interviewed on NPR today regretted the slow reporting of these incidents and went on to discuss them with the interviewer.

Are there still people on here who believe it was all made up? He seemed to think it was genuine.

I don't believe its made up, just a little skeptical of the details. For instance, initially I heard of multiple rapes; later, one confirmed rape. Would the level of violence and assaults be a lot more than usual? Would it be more than, for instance, assaults during a New York New Years? Was it really 'arab-looking men', or was it dark and confusing and assumptions led descriptions? Details like that are important for perspective, in my opinion.

I will say that I am very concerned about terrorism everywhere, whether it's a guy working alone, or a well-organized well-planned attack. My support for refugees and refusal to paint all Muslims with a terrorist brush doesn't mean I think terrorism is acceptable in any way.

[Guest]

I don't believe its made up, just a little skeptical of the details. For instance, initially I heard of multiple rapes; later, one confirmed rape. Would the level of violence and assaults be a lot more than usual? Would it be more than, for instance, assaults during a New York New Years? Was it really 'arab-looking men', or was it dark and confusing and assumptions led descriptions? Details like that are important for perspective, in my opinion.

I will say that I am very concerned about terrorism everywhere, whether it's a guy working alone, or a well-organized well-planned attack. My support for refugees and refusal to paint all Muslims with a terrorist brush doesn't mean I think terrorism is acceptable in any way.

I don't think this had anything to do with terrorism, myself. I think this was a clash of cultures. This is what I do at home so I'll be damned if I'm going to refrain from doing it here. (During the crowded protests of the Arab Spring there were numerous reports of this kind of behaviour, with jaded participants describing it as normal behavior for many of the young men around at the time)

Another disturbing aspect, on top of the assaults, is the notion that it was somehow organized. I haven't seen that refuted yet. I expected to.

[WestCoastRunner]

@ WCR, I don't think I have ever seen you side with the male side or male perspective over the female perspective ever. If there is a college couple on date that ends with a "he said/she said", you wind us up about rape culture, but on this...you've got nothing?

When you ask why I think these guys will go uncharged (or minimal charges), I just look at your reactions here and know.

With the lack of respect that most muslim men have for women, it seems inevitable that sooner or later, you would be forced to one side - I'm a little surprised at you really.

You don't know anything about me so how could you be surprised.