On Guard for Thee Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I suppose it doesn't really matter what type of gun you pick up at a gun show, purchase from a dealer out of his car trunk as BC does, or simply borrow it from your mother, whatever you need for the killing spree you are heading off on, its at your fingertips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada_First Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I suppose it doesn't really matter what type of gun you pick up at a gun show, purchase from a dealer out of his car trunk as BC does, or simply borrow it from your mother, whatever you need for the killing spree you are heading off on, its at your fingertips. I think our gun laws are ok as is. I'd like to have CCW permits but other than that we have a good system and doesn't need to be changed. The US seems to be a little lax in some states but that's not for me to decide since I don't live there. That's for those states to decide. If somepone wants to kill someone they will do so whether they use a gun or a bat or a knife. Legal gun or illegal gun. Irrelevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) Exactly, namely when more Americans are killed annually by baseball bats and hammers......... You hear about a lot of baseball bat massacres, eh? Lone batters walking into black churches killing a bunch of people? Walking into schools and murdering several children with them? Walking into movie theatres and bashing in a dozen skulls? Baseball bats. Just like guns. No difference whatsoever there. Edited June 23, 2015 by cybercoma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada_First Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 They are also talking about removing the Confederate Flag from the Capital(Capitol?)building. They wanting to do this because of this killing. What are your thoughts on this? Seems like a lot of people think it as a racist flag and a symbol of slavery. The civil war wasn't fought over slavery like so many think so I'm confused as to why remove it and why now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted June 23, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 They are also talking about removing the Confederate Flag from the Capital(Capitol?)building. They wanting to do this because of this killing. What are your thoughts on this? Seems like a lot of people think it as a racist flag and a symbol of slavery. The civil war wasn't fought over slavery like so many think so I'm confused as to why remove it and why now? It wasn't? That claim would need a solid citation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada_First Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 It wasn't? That claim would need a solid citation. I'm on my mobile atm. Once I get home I'll post one for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted June 23, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 Even if the Slavery wasn't the primary reason for the Civil War, the Stars and Bars are still a strong symbol of the Antebellum South. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 You hear about a lot of baseball bat massacres, eh? Lone batters walking into black churches killing a bunch of people? Walking into schools and murdering several children with them? Walking into movie theatres and bashing in a dozen skulls? Baseball bats. Just like guns. No difference whatsoever there. Now you're making a distinction that I think we should talk more about. Nine black people murdered would be, what, a pretty typical weekend in Detroit? But nine black people murdered in a single act of hatred is shocking to us (and rightfully so.) But an impartial look at the numbers indicates that these massacre type shootings represent a drop in the bucket of overall murders. To me, that suggests that the political aftermath that results from these incidents is less about saving lives, and more about our emotional reaction to the events. I understand and share the emotional reaction, but is that the best basis for shaping public policy? This is hardly the only example of this kind of thinking. The money being wasted on shoddy security measures to prevent terrorism on airplanes could save more lives if it was spent putting warning lights at railway crossings. Here in BC a group of doctors set out to ban mixed martial arts competition, citing public safety. If public safety was really the issue, they would turn their attention to ski hills, skateboarding, and swimming pools, not fighting sports. I've made mention on numerous occasions of the annual Carnival Of Carnage known as snowmobile season here in back-country BC. They claim far more lives than hunting accidents. Every summer we have numerous deaths involving recreational watercraft. These claim far more lives than hunting accidents, but hunting accidents receive far more news coverage. Why? People shrug their shoulders and say "buncha dummies" when mooks kill themselves with snowmobiles and powerboats, but when there's a gun involved people react differently. Is that rational? I think that media sensationalism has played a role in giving people a distorted view of what actually constitutes a threat to the public safety. I don't think the emotional response to these incidents is the best basis for public policy. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted June 23, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) Now you're making a distinction that I think we should talk more about. Nine black people murdered would be, what, a pretty typical weekend in Detroit? But nine black people murdered in a single act of hatred is shocking to us (and rightfully so.) But an impartial look at the numbers indicates that these massacre type shootings represent a drop in the bucket of overall murders. To me, that suggests that the political aftermath that results from these incidents is less about saving lives, and more about our emotional reaction to the events. I understand and share the emotional reaction, but is that the best basis for shaping public policy? This is hardly the only example of this kind of thinking. The money being wasted on shoddy security measures to prevent terrorism on airplanes could save more lives if it was spent putting warning lights at railway crossings. Here in BC a group of doctors set out to ban mixed martial arts competition, citing public safety. If public safety was really the issue, they would turn their attention to ski hills, skateboarding, and swimming pools, not fighting sports. I've made mention on numerous occasions of the annual Carnival Of Carnage known as snowmobile season here in back-country BC. They claim far more lives than hunting accidents. Every summer we have numerous deaths involving recreational watercraft. These claim far more lives than hunting accidents, but hunting accidents receive far more news coverage. Why? People shrug their shoulders and say "buncha dummies" when mooks kill themselves with snowmobiles and powerboats, but when there's a gun involved people react differently. Is that rational? I think that media sensationalism has played a role in giving people a distorted view of what actually constitutes a threat to the public safety. I don't think the emotional response to these incidents is the best basis for public policy. -k Excellent Post. How about sports like Football, Rugby and Hockey. One wonders how deaths doing those activities stack up to gun deaths. Humans react irrationally to things quite often. A plane crashes, people don't want to fly anymore. There are daily car crashes in every city. No one thinks twice about getting in a car. What Roof did is horrific, but do the numbers bare out that people that feel the way he did are emblematic of a great population. And before anyone brings up terrorism. I would hope security agencies are looking just as closely at white supremacist groups as they are at muslim terrorist groups. Edited June 23, 2015 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimG Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 but hunting accidents receive far more news coverage. Why? People shrug their shoulders and say "buncha dummies" when mooks kill themselves with snowmobiles and powerboats, but when there's a gun involved people react differently. Is that rational?Incidents that result in 3rd parties dying that did not make a choice to participate in a risky activity tend to cause widespread public dread even if the statistics show that the choices people make are much more deadly. It is irrational but human nature to fear what cannot be controlled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeNumber Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 Excellent Post. How about sports like Football, Rugby and Hockey. One wonders how deaths doing those activities stack up to gun deaths. Humans react irrationally to things quite often. A plane crashes, people don't want to fly anymore. There are daily car crashes in every city. No one thinks twice about getting in a car. What Roof did is horrific, but do the numbers bare out that people that feel the way he did are emblematic of a great population. And before anyone brings up terrorism. I would hope security agencies are looking just as closely at white supremacist groups as they are at muslim terrorist groups. Actually death's during and because of hockey have recieved a huge amount of attention and have completely changed the way the game is being played including added safety measures to mitigate the chances of another death happening and will probably incur more changes in the coming years. So if we want to compare that to gun murders in the US, the first response would be more to add more safety. If that can't be done or doesn't change anything, then the next response is to remove the thing that causes harm. Though that illicits a response from the old school crowd that thinks its part of the culture... I mean game! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeNumber Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 They are also talking about removing the Confederate Flag from the Capital(Capitol?)building. They wanting to do this because of this killing. What are your thoughts on this? Seems like a lot of people think it as a racist flag and a symbol of slavery. The civil war wasn't fought over slavery like so many think so I'm confused as to why remove it and why now? The Civil War was fought for a variety of reasons, much like any war, one of them being slavery. To say it wasn't fought over slavery is to say the Iraq war wasn't fought over oil. It may not be the primary reason, or it may be. But nevertheless it was a reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty AC Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 Humans react irrationally to things quite often. A plane crashes, people don't want to fly anymore. There are daily car crashes in every city. No one thinks twice about getting in a car. What Roof did is horrific, but do the numbers bare out that people that feel the way he did are emblematic of a great population. And before anyone brings up terrorism. I would hope security agencies are looking just as closely at white supremacist groups as they are at muslim terrorist groups. As Tim G mentioned, control plays a role. I am not affected by other people participating in risky sports and activities, but I am at risk when others own guns. People are statistically more likely to be killed in a car than a plane crash, but the lack of control scares some away from flying. If that plane is going down, you have no options. In over a dozen states gun deaths have now outnumbered car deaths, despite way more time being spent in cars than with guns. Fear is a powerful thing. There is no evidence that owing a firearm reduces your risk of being injured in a crime and significant evidence that owing a gun increases the risk of death to you, your spouse or your children. Yet...people still buy guns for protection, despite the irrationality. Groups like the NRA have done a good job convincing many to deny logic and go against their best interests when it comes to safety. Our government has used the fear of an almost non-existent Islamic terrorism threat to strip away privacy rights. Is it rational? no...but fearful people make irrational decisions like buying guns for protection or giving unchecked, secretive powers to secret police. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 They are also talking about removing the Confederate Flag from the Capital(Capitol?)building. They wanting to do this because of this killing. What are your thoughts on this? Seems like a lot of people think it as a racist flag and a symbol of slavery. The civil war wasn't fought over slavery like so many think so I'm confused as to why remove it and why now? It 100% was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 Dylann Roof is yesterday's news....the next "mass shooting" will be along any day now. It's really not about guns at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeNumber Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) Dylann Roof is yesterday's news....the next "mass shooting" will be along any day now. It's really not about guns at all. That's right BC. You can always count on a mass shooting every other month in the good ol' US of A! GUNS GUNS GUNS! Edited June 23, 2015 by PrimeNumber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty AC Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 Dylann Roof is yesterday's news....the next "mass shooting" will be along any day now. It's really not about guns at all. Some stories manage to hold the ADHD media longer than others, but both individual and mass shootings, really are about guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 That's right BC. You can always count on a mass shooting every other month in the good ol' US of A! GUNS GUNS GUNS! So why do some Canadians worry so much about it ? Vacation property in the land of GUNS GUNS GUNS ! ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 Some stories manage to hold the ADHD media longer than others, but both individual and mass shootings, really are about guns. Nope...take away the gun and I can find plenty of other "mass" killings. Are more plentiful suicides about the guns too ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeNumber Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 So why do some Canadians worry so much about it ? Vacation property in the land of GUNS GUNS GUNS ! ? I'm not worried, my country has gun controls and our gun crime is relative to those controls. We don't have infants shooting themselves in grocery stores with their mothers handguns. We just don't have anything else to talk about, so we talk about your problems. it's a longstanding Canadian tradition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 All one need do is look at the statistics of various countries with strict gun laws (Canada, The UK, Japan, Australia for instance) and the ratio of gun homicides to see the difference vis a vis the US. We have ten million legal firearms in this country, and criminals have ready access to the guns smuggled up from the US. The countries you're talking about above are all also wealthy western nations and none of them has massive slums with a multi-generational underclass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I believe that Kim City must be among the most firearms-crazy communities in Canada. It seems like every third car on the road is a mud-covered off-road capable vehicle with a Browning buck-mark sticker on the back window. If you took every "Support the Troops" ribbons and breast cancer ribbons and every other awareness sticker on cars and added them all up, you wouldn't have 1/10th as many of those as you have of the Browning buck-mark stickers. We've got more major gun stores than major electronics stores. I bet we have more guns per capita than any other city of notable size in Canada. Meanwhile, in Argus city, otherwise known as Ottawa, there are, more or less, ZERO gun shops or shops that sell firearms. Does that mean there aren't any shootings? Nope! The local gangs manage to find guns without much problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 We have ten million legal firearms in this country, and criminals have ready access to the guns smuggled up from the US. The countries you're talking about above are all also wealthy western nations and none of them has massive slums with a multi-generational underclass. And what do you suppose the reason might be that this ready access as you like to call it, is to guns from the US...maybe if they tightened up their laws, we would all sleep a little easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted June 23, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 And what do you suppose the reason might be that this ready access as you like to call it, is to guns from the US...maybe if they tightened up their laws, we would all sleep a little easier. You sleep uneasy in Canada? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 You sleep uneasy in Canada? Seriously....most Americans still sleep easy too. Why the hell would somebody in another country lose sleep over shootings in the U.S. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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