This week in Islam

[Argus]

Test for public school students in Malaysia includes a question on how to beat your wife properly.

https://clarionproject.org/high-school-exam-question-how-to-beat-your-wife/

[eyeball]

On 9/22/2018 at 8:11 AM, DogOnPorch said:

 

So what's your verdict? Are you saying that since Christianity burned witched before...Islam should be allowed its violence now?

Because that's what it seems like...

No, it's more like; Christians can be forgiven their past no matter how henious it might have been but Muslims can't.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, eyeball said:

No, it's more like; Christians can be forgiven their past no matter how henious it might have been but Muslims can't.

No it's not.  Muslims can be forgiven their past too. Unless it was last week.  That's asking a bit much.

[Argus]

6 hours ago, bcsapper said:

No it's not.  Muslims can be forgiven their past too. Unless it was last week.  That's asking a bit much.

What the left wants is for us to forgive them their present, not past.
64% of the Koran is devoted to talking about Kafirs (that's us), 81% of the Sira and 37% of the Hadith are about dealing with Kafirs. For a 'religion' this religion seems to focus most of its time on discussing what to do about unbelievers - and little of what it says is very kind or tolerant. And what little it DOES say which is kind or tolerant is from Muhammad's Medina period, and overruled by his later statements in Mecca. So we have the past influencing the present. And both are violent and hateful.

Edited September 30, 2018 by Argus

[Goddess]

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/4490892/cra-suspends-fines-major-islamic-charity-over-concerns-it-may-have-provided-resources-to-armed-militants/

 

 

Quote

 

While the Charities Directorate did not revoke ISNA-Canada’s charity status, the group was required to enter into a compliance agreement under which it must “cease its overseas operations.”

“We are saddened by this outcome,” ISNA-Canada said in a written statement.

It denied any links to terrorism and said it had “made progressive and important changes” to its governance and “how we operate as one of the largest Muslim organizations in Canada.”

The CRA audit documents obtained by Global News were heavily redacted but alleged that during the audited period, ISNA-Canada “gifted” $90,000 to the Relief Organization for Kashmiri Muslims.

The CRA has previously described the ROKM as the “charitable arm” of Jamaat-e-Islami, a Pakistani group whose armed wing, Hizbul Mujahideen, is listed as a terrorist group in Europe and the United States.

The audit documents also showed that ISNA-Canada gave an additional $46,000 to the Kashmiri Relief Fund of Canada, which the CRA has previously alleged had fundraised for the ROKM.

“Providing resources to organizations operating in support of a political purpose, including the achievement of nationhood or political autonomy, are not recognized at law as charitable,” the CRA wrote.

The auditors identified a number of other concerns, including “inadequate internal controls,” a “third-party receipting scheme,” close links to for-profit Muslim housing co-ops and a halal certification program that the CRA said was essentially a business.

The CRA also found ISNA-Canada’s mission statement — “To advance the cause of Islam and serve Muslims in North America so as to enable them to adopt Islam as a complete way of life” — was too broad and vague to be considered exclusively charitable.

 

 

[scribblet]

Oh Oh, where they praying towards Israel.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/turkey-mosque-muslim-pray-wrong-direction-imam-sugoren-years-mihrab-qibla-mecca-a8589896.html?fbclid=IwAR1ywdMNSwRFBO_E4XDW1tLbfgb5uZTxVbNR6smk5ZbjJaJfvNH6U2uAOXw

 

[DogOnPorch]

1 hour ago, scribblet said:

Oh Oh, where they praying towards Israel.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/turkey-mosque-muslim-pray-wrong-direction-imam-sugoren-years-mihrab-qibla-mecca-a8589896.html?fbclid=IwAR1ywdMNSwRFBO_E4XDW1tLbfgb5uZTxVbNR6smk5ZbjJaJfvNH6U2uAOXw

 

 

Originally, Big Mo had everybody pray towards Jerusalem; but when wooing the Jews failed...he had an epiphany (one of many)...and prayers were then directed towards Mecca...his new home base of military ops.

Edited October 19, 2018 by DogOnPorch

[Goddess]

From some links on another thread, I just realized that what I witnessed a few years ago was probably this:

https://www.bnaibrith.ca/sheikh_calls_for_eradication_of_israelis_at_toronto_al_quds_day_rally

https://www.bnaibrith.ca/iran_issues

The one I witnessed was absolutely a hatefest and I was stunned that nobody - nobody - said anything about it.

Where are all the "moderate Muslims"?

https://dianebederman.com/pm-trudeau-is-al-quds-day-compatible-with-the-west/

Quote

 

In 2017 the Police were called int to investigate the antisemitic lyrics of a song that was played at the Al Quds day rally.

The translated lyrics to the song, Declare It A Popular Revolution, in part say:

“With a Palestinian woman (armed with a knife) we defeated them”… “fill (the bottle) to the top with gasoline, and snatch from him the M-16”…“stab whoever you see, five, six, ten, twelve.”

“Declare a popular revolution,” the lyrics continue… “Make us happy with bombing the bus” and then “cut off (their heads), stab (them), run over (them), launch an attack on them.”

 

Quote

Is this parade supposed to promote tolerance, inclusion, accommodation and diversity in Canada?

 

[dialamah]

Al quds day seems to be more about supporting Palestine and objecting to Isreal's occupation of East Jerusalem, not condemning Jews.   Anti-Semitic sentiment is not it's goal, though I have no doubt it's held by some of the more extreme people who attend these events, and agree it should be condemned.   However, please note that it's not just Muslims who support Palestine and object to Isreal's incursion into Palestinian lands; why don't you ask where all the moderate anti-Zionists are?  

30 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Where are all the "moderate Muslims"?

But since you didn't, and assume that only Muslims support al quds and that means they all must hate and want to kill Jews, here are some "Moderate Muslims".  

http://time.com/5437229/muslim-organizations-benefit-pittsburgh-synagogue-shooting-victims/

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/europe/british-muslim-group-denounces-anti-semitism-in-full-page-newspaper-ad-1.6099535

https://ing.org/new-ing-editorial-by-maha-elgenaidi-why-muslims-must-continue-to-stand-up-to-anti-semitism/

And, to be fair, are you in Pittsburgh today, standing on the street outside the courthouse to condemn the White guy who committed the massacre?  Did you go to Charlottesville last year to condemn the White Supremacists who chanted anti-Semitic slogans as they passed a Synagogue?  Did you loudly and decisively declare that not all Whites hated Jews, organize protests against White Nationalists, contribute money to the victims, confront your friends and family to do the same? Are you out there "proving" that there are "moderate" White people who don't hate Jews, even as White nationalist sentiment grows and attacks against Jews increase?   

Or are you here, assuming that the extremists in the Muslim group are the norm for that group and so all Muslims must "prove" they don't agree with those extremists?

Quote

The one I witnessed was absolutely a hatefest and I was stunned that nobody - nobody - said anything about it.

Kind of how I feel about the constant anti-Muslim comments made on this forum by DoP, Argus, you and a few others.  But I'm saying something about it.

Edited October 30, 2018 by dialamah

[Goddess]

28 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Anti-Semitic sentiment is not it's goal, though I have no doubt it's held by some of the more extreme people who attend these events, and agree it should be condemned. 

It may not be its "stated" goal but that  is exactly what it is.

I wasn't making a comment on the Palestine/Gaza thing - I'm well aware that there are other people besides Muslims that support Palestine.  There's a difference between supporting Palestine and calling for the death of all Jews.  If you can read those articles (and others) about the Al Quds in Canada, and conclude that everything is fine, that says a lot about you - as I notice once again, when I bring up a problem you "pooh-pooh" my views as being racist and Islamophobic and only condemn me, not what is going on at these Al Qud celebrations.  If Jews were having a celebration every year saying all Muslims must die and are not entitled to live on the planet, you'd be screaming with outrage.

The Bnai Brith have been calling for an end to this annual hatefest in Canada for quite a while now.  Are they also racist and Islamophobic?  Or is it just everyone who dares to talk about the negative things done in Islam that is racist and Islamophobic to you?  Maybe you better get on the phone with them and tell them how wrong they are for protesting this.  Condemn them for condemning this, as you are now condemning me.  As Rue says - go ahead and finish it.  Write your representatives and let them know how completely out of line Bnai Brith is for spotlighting this problem.

36 minutes ago, dialamah said:

here are some "Moderate Muslims".  

Yes, Dia, I'm well aware that there are moderate Muslims out there.  My question is:  Why is it not the moderate Muslims who are handling this issue?  Why when that Sheihk calls for the death of Jews does the crowd of 400 people cheer?  In Canada.  Why it is the Bnai Brith leading the charge here and not moderate Muslims?  Why is it rarely moderate Muslims that turn in imams that speak like this?  You're the one who is always berating and censoring others here because the words we use are soooooo important and must be the exact "Dia Approved" words , yet when Muslims are doing this, suddenly the words they use are not as important to you......very hypocrite, much double standard.

 

40 minutes ago, dialamah said:

And, to be fair, are you in Pittsburgh today, standing on the street outside the courthouse to condemn the White guy who committed the massacre?  Did you go to Charlottesville last year to condemn the White Supremacists who chanted anti-Semitic slogans as they passed a Synagogue? 

Are you going to pay for my travel and time to do that?  Unless you can point out to me where I have continually made excuses for white supremacists, as you do for Islamists.......

 

Quote

and agree it should be condemned.

I'm condemning it now and you're here telling me I'm wrong for condemning it.

[dialamah]

59 minutes ago, Goddess said:

I'm condemning it now and you're here telling me I'm wrong for condemning it.

Not condemning you condemning anti-semitism.  I'm condemning your demand that "moderate Muslims" are somehow failing in their duty because you aren't satisfied that they are doing enough, even while you ignore everything they do.   

Perhaps if you hadn't also, recently, condemned a drunk Saudi guy and a murderous Syrian refugee as 'representative' of all Muslims, while ignoring the Muslims who also condemn their actions, I wouldn't have the notion that you expect a lot more from "Moderate Muslims" than you do from moderate Whites.   I also recall how blind and silent you were when two posters here opined that Muslims deserved to die.

Quote

Why is it not the moderate Muslims who are handling this issue? 

Perhaps because moderate Muslims expect the authorities in the country in which they live to handle extremists.   That's what I expect when a racist shouts insults at non-white people on public transit, or a White Nationalist shoots them in a grocery store or the parking lot.  I don't expect or ask you, as a 'moderate white person'  who disapproves of such behavior to come along and 'handle it' in some way.  If directly asked, then I would expect you to condemn it but beyond that is entirely up to your own conscience how much effort you want to put into denouncing White Supremacy.   I give the same courtesy to Muslims.  

And if by "moderate Muslims" you mean those Muslim leaders should publicly denounce anti-semitism - I provided you THREE cites clearly doing that; it took a single 30 second google search.  Just think if I'd spent longer on the search, hmm?  But I suspect it wouldn't matter how many examples I could show you of Muslims, leaders or not, denouncing anti-Semitism, it would not be enough for you.   It really seems that if it's not every single Muslim in the area or world, it's just not going to be enough.

Quote

Unless you can point out to me where I have continually made excuses for white supremacists, as you do for Islamists.......

I do not make excuses for violence or oppression of women/minorities.   What I do is fail to condemn Muslims for the sins of their more extreme members (aka "Islamists"), or even of the excesses of their governments.   

59 minutes ago, Goddess said:

yet when Muslims are doing this, suddenly the words they use are not as important to you......very hypocrite, much double standard.

I am not debating with these intolerant and hateful Muslims, am I?  I'm debating with intolerant Canadians.  Therein lies the difference.   Of course,  some of those intolerant and hateful Muslims have banned me when I've pointed out their intolerance and hatred, as they have Muslims who've done the same.  That's the thing with intolerance; it can't bear to hear anything but it's own hate.  That intolerance on this board is reflected in people informing me I'm lying or that I'm not Canadian, or repeating endlessly that I'm "making excuses" for violence/intolerance, or that I support misogyny, or hate Canada.  Etc. 

In my opinion, you are a remarkably good and caring person, more so than me in ways that matter.  Unfortunately, you fail to see how your attitudes toward Muslims are informed by an extreme right-wing agenda that has filtered into the mainstream, they sound logical and reasonable and you believe them.  And, it seems to me your "side" is winning, and just like Jews have been vilified for decades, if not centuries, I expect Muslims will be facing the same fate.   But I won't be on the side of that, even if I'm also and equally vilified by accusations that I am a race-traitor, a traitor to Canada, women and the LGBTQ community.

Edited October 30, 2018 by dialamah

[DogOnPorch]

4 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Not condemning you condemning anti-semitism.  I'm condemning your demand that "moderate Muslims" are somehow failing in their duty because you aren't satisfied that they are doing enough, even while you ignore everything they do.   

 

 

Same Quran as all other Muslims. 

So either Muslims are all ticking time bombs...who knows which ones...or the "moderates" don't really follow Islam and are thus apostates or worse.

[Goddess]

16 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I'm condemning your demand that "moderate Muslims" are somehow failing in their duty because you aren't satisfied that they are doing enough, even while you ignore everything they do.   

Yes, I do think moderates should be doing much more to combat extremism, as it is coming from within their own ranks.  That doesn't mean that I "ignore everything they do".  It just means that in this age of Islamic terrorism, I feel they should be the ones who are turning in imams and condemning these kinds of celebrations.  Frankly, you are the one who is going against what a lot of moderates and progressive Muslims are saying - that other moderates need to speak up more. 

 

20 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Perhaps because moderate Muslims expect the authorities in the country in which they live to handle extremists. 

That's an unfortunate and unhelpful view and I really hope you are not speaking for all Muslims when you say this.  I believe everyone - even Muslims - have a duty to speak up and not just sit back and say, "Meh....let other people handle it."   The government can only deal with the effects of extremism. It is moderate Muslims and mostly their imams themselves who should be reasoning from the Koran with their mosque attenders to show the wrongness of such extreme views.  Good grief, every influential moderate Muslim says the same thing - although I notice you frequently demand the direct opposite of what reformers say should happen.  

 

26 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I am not debating with these intolerant and hateful Muslims, am I? 

Maybe you should.  Instead of ignoring them, making excuses for them and castigating everyone who sees that there are intolerant and hateful Muslims.  

 

28 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Perhaps if you hadn't also, recently, condemned a drunk Saudi guy and a murderous Syrian refugee as 'representative' of all Muslims,

I have never once said "All bad Muslims are representative of all other Muslims".  Not once.  But you continue to sling mud at anyone who sees that there are problems in Islam right now.

Anti-semitism is growing in every country of the world.  And many are connecting it to the migration of Muslim people - not that they are causing it, but that they are "awakening" the sleeping anti-semitism already present and emboldening others to the same.  You can deny it all you want, refuse to read anything about what's going on in Europe.  But you are wrong.  Anti-semitism is growing and these Al Qud celebrations of hate fuel it further.  I find it very odd that you continually have to make sure that no one here discusses these things, and if they dare to, you make sure you're here to sling the racist and Islamophobe mudballs until something sticks.

Amazing how you see racism and prejudice against Muslim people in everything  (who at 1.3 or 1.6 billion people are NOT a minority) but have  excuse after excuse after excuse for Muslim intolerance and racism and hatred.

In this case, your excuse is you don't like the way I presented the problem. 

Too bad for you, I don't care - you perceive anti-Muslim in pretty much everything anyone says.  Unless it's praising Muslims.  

Nice distraction, though.  Now no one will touch this issue of the hate-filled Al Qud celebrations in Canada now for fear you will latch onto them as a racist Islamophobe and follow them around the board, re-writing everything they say and demanding they not talk about Islamists unless they talk about  <<insert Dia's favourite case of of the day here, anything, ANYTHING!! as long as we don't talk about Muslim extremism>>

[dialamah]

1 hour ago, Goddess said:

It just means that in this age of Islamic terrorism, I feel they should be the ones who are turning in imams and condemning these kinds of celebrations. 

And they do; most of the tips to authorities about Muslims come from other Muslims.  

1 hour ago, Goddess said:

I have never once said "All bad Muslims are representative of all other Muslims". 

You don't have to; it's implicit in statements like "Oh, she must have said no to him because Muslim men don't like it when women say no".  Or when there's a crowd of Muslims standing outside a courthouse condemning the Muslim killer inside and you are saying "Why don't Muslims condemn such acts of violence against women?"

1 hour ago, Goddess said:

And many are connecting it to the migration of Muslim people - not that they are causing it, but that they are "awakening" the sleeping anti-semitism already present and emboldening others to the same

That's plausible, I agree.  In my opinion, it's even more plausible that the rise of "populist" political leaders and parties is even more significant in the rise of antisemitism and attacks on Muslims and other minorities in Canada, the States and around the world.  

1 hour ago, Goddess said:

I believe everyone - even Muslims - have a duty to speak up and not just sit back and say, "Meh....let other people handle it."   

Ok.  So, when DoP says something brilliant like his most recent "All Muslims follow the same Koran, so they're either ticking time bombs or not really Muslims", why aren't you pointing out to him that not all Muslims believe exactly the same thing, hmm?   If some nutball on here said that "Jews wanted to take over the world and we must protect ourselves from them" wouldn't you object to that as antisemitic?  Could it be because you agree with him - only "real Muslims" engage in terrorism, beat up women and kill gays? 

1 hour ago, Goddess said:

I find it very odd that you continually have to make sure that no one here discusses these things, and if they dare to, you make sure you're here to sling the racist and Islamophobe mudballs until something sticks.

Oh, look - there you go again - accusing me of calling people Islamophobes.    If only you could actually "discuss" instead of slinging lies.

1 hour ago, Goddess said:

Now no one will touch this issue of the hate-filled Al Qud celebrations in Canada now for fear you will latch onto them as a racist Islamophobe and follow them around the board, re-writing everything they say and demanding they not talk about Islamists unless they talk about  <<insert Dia's favourite case of of the day here, anything, ANYTHING!! as long as we don't talk about Muslim extremism>>

OMG. Poor baby; I prevented the rest of the board from joining you in demonizing Muslims?

But I think you are wrong; nothing I say has ever stopped you and your crew from discussing whatever you like, whilst attacking me for disagreeing.  

 

[Goddess]

32 minutes ago, dialamah said:

If only you could actually "discuss" instead of slinging lies.

Here's my post, without the links:

5 hours ago, Goddess said:

The one I witnessed was absolutely a hatefest and I was stunned that nobody - nobody - said anything about it.

Where are all the "moderate Muslims"?

Point out the "lies".

[dialamah]

15 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Point out the "lies".

Ok.  

2 hours ago, Goddess said:

you make sure you're here to sling the racist and Islamophobe mudballs until something sticks

I did not call call you or anyone here an Islamophobe or a racist, though I did refer to 'racist' generally in one comment.   The news story I linked to also referred to this person's racist comments so I don't think I was wrong about that.

2 hours ago, Goddess said:

you perceive anti-Muslim in pretty much everything anyone says. 

You posted on October 1 about the CRA removing tax-exempt status from an Islamic organization.  I did read that when you posted it, but since you failed to imply that Muslims are busily funding ISIS, I had no reason to object, eh?   And on September 28, Argus posted the story about the school in Malaysia that had some dumb-ass course about wife-beating - which again I read when he posted it.   He also failed to demonize Muslims in any way, so there was nothing to object to in that way, though the story itself was pretty objectionable.  Pretty sure if you look through the topic here and elsewhere, you'll find plenty of negative comments about Muslims that don't also demonize them as a group and to which I have not objected, and have even agreed with.  So much for your paranoia that I perceive 'anti-Muslim' in pretty much everything anyone says.   

I notice you still haven't said anything about DoP demonizing all Muslims as incipiently violent.  Do you agree with him?  

[DogOnPorch]

2 hours ago, dialamah said:

 

I notice you still haven't said anything about DoP demonizing all Muslims as incipiently violent.  Do you agree with him?  

 

I do no such thing. My source is the Quran which I quote verbatim when I feel inclined to do so. It reads a little like Mein Kampf...for comparison. Sure there's wisdom...even insight...but you just KNOW where the plot is heading.

My points stand...though you feel it is to 'on-point' for polite conversation. You yourself are incapable of disclosing who are the 'bad Muslims'. You (or I) don't know where the next bombing...stabbing...beheading...etc...in the name of Allah will come from. Nor are you capable of pointing to anywhere on this planet where Islam is practiced that is to be admired once Islam gets to call the shots.

I wouldn't care so much if this death cult stuck to its desert...but it wants to dominate the entire planet as per the Quran's demand...Allah's orders. 

So...myself...and MANY others...have a problem with this cult's little plan.

That you do not is an issue...yes.

[dialamah]

4 hours ago, DogOnPorch said:

You yourself are incapable of disclosing who are the 'bad Muslims'. You (or I) don't know where the next bombing...stabbing...beheading...etc...in the name of Allah will come from.

I also don't know where the next drone strike or bomb drop, in the name of Western capitalism, will take out a few dozen civilians or schoolchildren.  Do you?

You seriously think there is some moral high ground we inhabit here, as we sell arms to the most oppressive and brutal regime in the Middle East?   We're unassailably the "good guys" as we casually accept countless civilian casualties as the necessary byproduct of exporting "Western freedom and democracy" - aka capitalism - to other countries. 

You paint Muslims as aggressors, Westerners innocent victims of a cult maddened by religious fanaticism.  You are apparently blind to the Western military in their countries, the imposition of dictators and coups engendered by Western governments, the ongoing wars waged in and against Middle Eastern countries, all well before Islamic terrorists began targetting Westerners in their own countries.  Western aggression and foreign policy has resulted in the death of 100s of thousands of Muslims in the Middle East, but as far as you are concerned, they are the agressor because they've managed to kill a few thousand non-Muslims in retaliation.

You are ridiculous, which is why I keep you on ignore most of the time.

Edited October 31, 2018 by dialamah

[DogOnPorch]

1 hour ago, dialamah said:

 

You are ridiculous, which is why I keep you on ignore most of the time.

 

Go ahead...keep defending your death cult. Nothing less...or more...is expected of you.

[GostHacked]

7 hours ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

Go ahead...keep defending your death cult. Nothing less...or more...is expected of you.

Who here is defending a death cult?

[Goddess]

16 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

Who here is defending a death cult?

Truck plows through a crowd - "He's just mentally ill, you're all racists if you think otherwise."

Man beats his wife - "He didn't know it was wrong to beat your wife with a hockey stick for 1/2 hour."

Man molests young girls at a waterpark - "Their stories weren't consistent, therefore he's innocent."

Muslim leaders call for the death of Jews every year at Al Qud - "How dare you wonder why none of the Muslims at the event objected to it!!  You f'in racist!!"

Every terror attack - "It's the West's fault, it has nothing whatsoever to do with the religion."

Don't agree with burkas? - "It's their choice to be treated like that.  How dare you question their question their choice, you f'in racist!!"

No go zones popping up in every country - "They dont' exist, it's just people demonizing Muslims."

Anti-semitism on the rise, Jews leaving France in droves - "There's anti-semitism everywhere, so if you're worried about that you're a f'in racist!"

Muslim Rape Game - "It doesnt' exist.  Those women are liars."

Edited October 31, 2018 by Goddess

[DogOnPorch]

56 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Truck plows through a crowd - "He's just mentally ill, you're all racists if you think otherwise."

Man beats his wife - "He didn't know it was wrong to beat your wife with a hockey stick for 1/2 hour."

Man molests young girls at a waterpark - "Their stories weren't consistent, therefore he's innocent."

Muslim leaders call for the death of Jews every year at Al Qud - "How dare you wonder why none of the Muslims at the event objected to it!!  You f'in racist!!"

Every terror attack - "It's the West's fault, it has nothing whatsoever to do with the religion."

Don't agree with burkas? - "It's their choice to be treated like that.  How dare you question their question their choice, you f'in racist!!"

No go zones popping up in every country - "They dont' exist, it's just people demonizing Muslims."

Anti-semitism on the rise, Jews leaving France in droves - "There's anti-semitism everywhere, so if you're worried about that you're a f'in racist!"

Muslim Rape Game - "It doesnt' exist.  Those women are liars."

 

Too funny...just as you predicted, as well.

I stand in awe of your ESP...

[Argus]

9 hours ago, dialamah said:

I also don't know where the next drone strike or bomb drop, in the name of Western capitalism, will take out a few dozen civilians or schoolchildren.  Do you?

In the name of western capitalism? Western capitalists have no interest in spreading their dogma by force. When western nations bomb anyone it is always targeted to avoid innocent deaths and it is always defensive. We aren't in Afghanistan because we want to conquer their shitty country but because they harbored a massive terrorist organization which flew planes into western buildings. And we're still there because the moment we leave it will return to being the shithole of crazed Islamist fanaticism it was when we arrived.

9 hours ago, dialamah said:

You seriously think there is some moral high ground we inhabit here,

There is certainly a moral high ground between attacking terrorists, and occasionally, unavoidably hitting innocent civilians, and deliberately attacking innocent civilians.

9 hours ago, dialamah said:

We're unassailably the "good guys" as we casually accept countless civilian casualties as the necessary byproduct of exporting "Western freedom and democracy" - aka capitalism - to other countries. 

Total bullshit. We're not exporting anything. This sounds like the ranting of an Islamist, or maybe a far left progressive. It's kind of hard to tell them apart sometimes. If the West wanted to force others to embrace their ideals they'd have forced them by now. Yet we've never made any effort to do so. 

9 hours ago, dialamah said:

You paint Muslims as aggressors, Westerners innocent victims of a cult maddened by religious fanaticism.  You are apparently blind to the Western military in their countries, 

You are apparently blind to the fact the only reason there is any western military in your countries is because of attacks on westerners. There is a cause and effect here, and it has bugger all to do with the West trying to force people to embrace freedom. If the Muslim nations of the middle east weren't run by crazed, bloody lunatics there'd be no issues.

[Argus]

Yeah, no reason whatsoever for us to want to screen potential immigrants from Pakistan to see if they're religious fanatics. Why, they're all such tolerant, enlightened folks...

The trial stems from an argument Asia Bibi, whose full name is Asia Noreen, had with a group of women in June 2009.

They were harvesting fruit when a row broke out about a bucket of water. The women said that because she had used a cup, they could no longer touch it, as her faith had made it unclean. Prosecutors alleged that in the row which followed, the women said Asia Bibi should convert to Islam and that she made three offensive comments about the Prophet Muhammad in response.

She was later beaten up at her home, during which her accusers say she confessed to blasphemy. She was arrested after a police investigation.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-46040515

Edited October 31, 2018 by Argus

[Argus]

Following the latest convictions just the other day of another group of Pakistani child rapists in the the Rotherham district of the UK it has been revealed that the special agency set up to investigate so-called 'grooming gangs' is investigating a further 426 Muslim men in the area. This is separate from the multiple investigations into other Pakistani rape gangs across the US which have already resulted in numerous convictions.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/grooming-gangs-rotherham-suspects-victims-girls-rape-uk-nca-prosecutions-a8609511.html