Moderating Mapleafweb's Moderation

[bush_cheney2004]

That's not hate speech. It might be considered offensive, but who cares about that?

Agreed...not even close to being "hate speech". Forum rules are different I guess.

Wouldn't it depend on the group? How do you feel about Republican, Trump supporting evangelicals?

[waldo]

The description was referenced, and the credentials of the originator provided.

yes, that anecdotal summation of NP "journalist" Fisher was referenced... the summation he declares based on the dozen interviews he had with refugees in the city of Lebanon. No where in his article does Fisher refer to "illiterate desert dwellers"... the credit for that gem belongs to the MLW member in question.

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[bush_cheney2004]

Try using the word "cesspool" instead....it is MLW precedent approved based on a search of the archives.

[Guest]

yes, that anecdotal summation of NP "journalist" Fisher was referenced... the summation he declares based on the dozen interviews he had with refugees in the city of Lebanon. No where in his article does Fisher refer to "illiterate desert dwellers"... the credit for that gem belongs to the MLW member in question.

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Yeah, it seemed reasonable to me.

Is this fellow not a journalist, then? The blurb provided seems to indicate he has some credentials. I believed it.

Does the original comment seem like hate speech to you? Like I said, it might be considered offensive. Is, I'm sure, by some. But so what? There's nothing wrong with offensive. Offended seems to be the most common state that exists these days.

Edited March 28, 2016 by bcsapper

[cybercoma]

Try using the word "cesspool" instead....it is MLW precedent approved based on a search of the archives.

Glad to know that got under your skin so much that you still whine about it.

[eyeball]

A lot of people cannot see that such criticism has nothing to do with racism.

The problem isn't the criticism it's the overtly racist manner in which it's presented.

The wounded tone of the racists whining about being called racists is the most laughable demand for political correctness on the planet bar none.

[jacee]

I would have no idea whether or not a person was illiterate, or a desert dweller, but I would have no issue with that description being applied when it was accurate.

It isn't accurate:

7. Syrian refugees are relatively well-educated

... pre-war Syria had an 86 per cent literacy rate

http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=news.nationalpost.com/news/world/from-the-150000-babies-born-to-the-strong-education-eight-things-you-dont-know-about-syrian-refugees

[GostHacked]

Methinks, methinks is being used in an insulting fashion.

[Bob Macadoo]

Methinks, methinks is being used in an insulting fashion.

I'm not insulted.....probably condescending is more apropos.

[Guest]

The problem isn't the criticism it's the overtly racist manner in which it's presented.

The wounded tone of the racists whining about being called racists is the most laughable demand for political correctness on the planet bar none.

Yeah, so you keep saying.

What do you think of the question I asked there? I don't like to keep bringing Squid's post back into it, but do you see any difference between the two?

[Guest]

It isn't accurate:

7. Syrian refugees are relatively well-educated

... pre-war Syria had an 86 per cent literacy rate

http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=news.nationalpost.com/news/world/from-the-150000-babies-born-to-the-strong-education-eight-things-you-dont-know-about-syrian-refugees

If it wasn't accurate, then it would be a lie. Maybe the article was talking about the other 14%. The problem is not with the accuracy, it's with the phrase. And the people to whom it applied. The phrase, "illiterate rednecks", for instance, could be applied to a group of people living somewhere else without censure.

[Big Guy]

Methinks, methinks is being used in an insulting fashion.

Methinks I apologize if it offends you. I have been assured by a poster I find particularly irritating, that he/she will not read anything from Big Guy after he/she reads "methinks". I am quite prepared to accept that restriction on my communications if it guarantees that I receive no comments from the irritating poster.

[jacee]

If it wasn't accurate, then it would be a lie. Maybe the article was talking about the other 14%. The problem is not with the accuracy, it's with the phrase. And the people to whom it applied.

You are very confused, bcsapper.

There was no article, just Argus:

Argus, on 27 Mar 2016 - 3:56 PM, said:

So I got a warning point the other day from MH for 'insulting and abusive behaviour'.

This was for referring to the Syrian refugees coming to Canada as 'illiterate desert dwellers'

The phrase, "illiterate rednecks", for instance, could be applied to a group of people living somewhere else without censure.

Could it?

Not without some relevant context or evidence, I suspect.

You could try it and see if you get a 'warning'.

Argus' comment was clearly a lie and a racial slur made in ignorance of Syria and Syrian people.

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Edited March 28, 2016 by jacee

[Guest]

You are very confused, bcsapper.

There was no article, just Argus:

Could it?

Not without some relevant context or evidence, I suspect.

You could try it and see if you get a 'warning'.

Argus' comment was clearly a lie and a racial slur made in ignorance of Syria and Syrian people.

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I thought he made reference to an article, and named the journalist. There was some question as to said journalists credentials, if I remember correctly.

I bet one wouldn't need much in the way of context or evidence for the remark I suggested.

[Argus]

You conveniently erased the "illiterate" portion of the comment (do you know what the current literacy rate of the country is)?, thought not, but you can always blame Mat Fisher for misguiding you.

I know that they don't read or write English or French, which makes them illiterate for all intents and purposes here.

[Argus]

a warning point! Those brutes... how are you holding up? I recall that post; I took exception to that post - oh wait, you seem to have sanitized a part of your labeling: you referred to Canada's Syrian refugees as, "illiterate desert dwellers". Carry on.

.

Is it racist to call someone illiterate? And if you can't read or write English or French are you not illiterate in this country? Have we not spoken on previous occasions about studies showing low literacy rates in Canada among immigrants being a major cause of their low economic success rate (and no, it doesn't count that they might or might not be literate in arabic)?

Edited March 28, 2016 by Argus

[Argus]

As was mentioned earlier, this is a borderline racist remark against an entire group of people. We all have a responsibility to stop hate speech dead in its tracks, including MLW. I'm glad to hear you were given a warning. If you do it again, I would hope you will get suspended. All I can is that you have been warned. It's up to you whether you want to address groups of people with respect, humility and empathy.

How is it borderline racist to call Syrian refugees desert dwellers when they come from the desert? How is it borderline racist to say they are illiterate when they don't understand a word of English or French?

[Argus]

Oh Yea. Methinks they are all picking on you because you are are brilliant and they are not letting you express yourself.

Brilliant only in comparison to some. I, at least, am capable of articulating my opinion in a logical and coherent manner on the subjects under discussion. You evidently lack that ability, and so resort to insults in attempts to shut down discussions.It is your schtick here.

Poor you. As I stated before, if I felt the way you do then I would have the class to quit rather than be whining all the time looking for sympathy

And once again, here is an example of your poor behaviour. I came to the moderating topic to discuss a moderating issue, giving specific examples. You simply came to insult me. You've expressed not one word of opinion on the facts being discussed. Instead your participation is like that of a sulky child making fart sounds while the adults are talking. That is almost always your response to a topic you don't like. Maybe you should consider having the class to just not participate when the discussion is beyond your limitations instead of constantly making a fool of yourself.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Argus

[Argus]

yes, that anecdotal summation of NP "journalist" Fisher was referenced... the summation he declares based on the dozen interviews he had with refugees in the city of Lebanon. No where in his article does Fisher refer to "illiterate desert dwellers"... the credit for that gem belongs to the MLW member in question.

.

I also cited Mark MacKinnon, you might remember, who said the same thing.

The 25,000 refugees Canada is importing contrast with Europe’s new arrivals in almost every way. Generally speaking, they were the most economically vulnerable of the Syrian refugees living in Jordan, Turkey and Lebanon

They were Syria’s olive farmers and shopkeepers before the war, not its university graduates. Of the dozens of refugees headed to Canada that I met (and I was focused on the government-selected pool, rather than private sponsorships), I can remember only one who spoke passable English.

Many of their kids, worryingly, had been out of school for years.

[Argus]

Methinks, methinks is being used in an insulting fashion.

Bigguy doesn't like to have his idiotic opinions challenged. I mocked his use of 'methinks' in an earlier post, and used one of his 'i do not respond to posts' refrains about methinks, so since then he tries to start every post with 'methinks' in hopes I won't answer it, even when he's responding to my posts!

Edited March 28, 2016 by Argus

[Argus]

Argus' comment was clearly a lie and a racial slur made in ignorance of Syria and Syrian people.

To you, any criticism of any kind towards any non-white person or group is racism.

Both MacKinnon and Fisher have made the point that all the talented, educated, skilled, entrepreneurial refugees headed north to Europe, and what we're getting is the poor, rural olive growers and cigarette salesmen. Both have also made the point that these refugees will need expensive and ongoing care from the government for a very long time. That's an added and unneeded cost to taxpayers. And I honestly could not care less if saying so offends your dainty sensibilities.

[rotary]

I know that they don't read or write English or French, which makes them illiterate for all intents and purposes here.

No it doesnt make them illiterate anywhere. Perhaps you don't understand the word. The answer to the question I posed to you, according to UNESCO as of 2015 was 86.4%. I hope I haven't befuddled you with both grammar and math in one fels swoop.

[Argus]

No it doesnt make them illiterate anywhere. Perhaps you don't understand the word. The answer to the question I posed to you, according to UNESCO as of 2015 was 86.4%. I hope I haven't befuddled you with both grammar and math in one fels swoop.

The context of the discussion was in the economic weight they present to Canada in their lack of skills, education and ability to sustain themselves. 91% of Syrian women, for example, have never worked outside the home, and of those who have, the vast majority have only worked as farm labour. They will not be able to get more than subsistence level jobs, at best, here. And they are illiterate insofar as their ability to read or write in Canada goes. Sorry if realism and logic offend your delicate politically correct sensibilities, OGFT.

[rotary]

The context of the discussion was in the economic weight they present to Canada in their lack of skills, education and ability to sustain themselves. 91% of Syrian women, for example, have never worked outside the home, and of those who have, the vast majority have only worked as farm labour. They will not be able to get more than subsistence level jobs, at best, here. And they are illiterate insofar as their ability to read or write in Canada goes. Sorry if realism and logic offend your delicate politically correct sensibilities, OGFT.

You're wrong on all counts. Sorry if I offend your typically right wing sensibilities.

[Argus]

You're wrong on all counts. Sorry if I offend your typically right wing sensibilities.

You're free to point out I'm wrong if that's your opinion. You're free to post information which you feel contradicts what I'm saying. The point where the discussion goes off the rails on this site is when you feel indignant about my opinion and feel the need to express that indignation as character assassination. Nobody here cares about your indignation. Nobody here cares that you're offended. Least of all me.

And to return to the point of this topic. It is that sort of thing which should be moderated, for that is what brings down the quality of discussion, not me calling the Syrians illiterate desert dwellers

Edited March 28, 2016 by Argus