Harper attacks Justin

[Moonbox]

It's something pathetically small like $30,000 across the entire country if sent out to all 166 seats, and the Liberals are doing it too, but they hilariously justify that by saying they're delivering a 'positive message'. What a pile of dog crap.

[cybercoma]

I liked Rex Murphy's column on the Tory 'attack ads'

In more recent times much has been made of the Conservative attack ads. The “He didn’t come home for you” ads they ran against Ignatieff are supposedly of the genre. Well, maybe they were. But, really where was the real “attack” in them?

They merely asked harshly a very legitimate question. Should a man who spent his entire adult life and career outside Canada be elected prime minister? People might not have liked putting the question so directly; we are sticklers for politesse in this country. But it was Ignatieff’s own resume that was the substance of that ad. It was fair. We make far too much of attack ads, and misname every ad that throws a criticism across the partisan aisle as of that genre

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2013/04/20/rex-for-saturday/

A few years late on this one, don't you think?

[silver72]

I guess we'll have to wait and see when and if we get one and I do and its attack ad, I putting on it, "Return to sender".

[Fletch 27]

To date, these "attack adds" have been right on the mark and proved accurate. Ignattief and Dions "Attack adds" were proved correct and factual. It is a shame that these "attack adds" can not be simply named for what they are.... "Educational pieces".. And there is nothing again but FACTS behind the latest "add" targeted at Justin.

In my opinion; for Justin to cry foul over this only highlights his complete lack of any ability to work under pressure.. What would he do if Obama tried to push him on trade? When the QC goes after him, how fast will he buckle, Crack and cry foul?

The Liberals know as well as all of the parties that "Attack adds" WORK. For heavens sake, the Liberals perfected them! So now why Justin play ball? He SIMPLY does not know how to. If You cant stand the professional heat?... Stay out of the kitchen

[jacee]

I guess we'll have to wait and see when and if we get one and I do and its attack ad, I putting on it, "Return to sender".

Yes it will be interesting to see who gets this attack flyer:

ALL constituents, as it should be for a taxpayer funded flyer? (Many of whom will complain)

Or just Tory supporters - a Party flyer?

I suspect the latter, and I think it's fraud to send this out on the taxpayers' dime.

This is a trick Mike Harris pulled.

Edited April 25, 2013 by jacee

[Fletch 27]

Lets not forget that Justin used a TAX PAYER funded set, props and Cameras for his Filming of his "Let play nice" video. It was filmed on a CBC set with tax-payer funded resources... Yet the CBC will not comment or investigate how this happened or was omitted...

Yes it will be interesting to see who gets this attack flyer:
ALL constituents, as it should be for a taxpayer funded flyer? (Many of whom will complain)
Or just Tory supporters - a Party flyer?

I suspect the latter, and I think it's fraud to send this out on the taxpayers' dime.
This is a trick Mike Harris pulled.

[eyeball]

Because the alternative to dealing with a dictatorship is rainbows and moondrops, right? If only we stopped propping up Saudi Arabia a kind, democratic government would take over. And once we leave Afghanistan, another kind, democratic government will take over there. In fact, were it not for us, kind, democratic governments would be erupting all over the Muslim world! Simply untrue.

Maybe not in the short term but sooner or later people would tire of being ruled by abusers, just like people in our societies did. You have zero, no way at all to know what might happen. We know that democratic governments once they got started began erupting all over the Christian world despite all its undemocratic bloodthirstiness. Were it not for us and the sort of diddling we committed in Iran for example, democratic governments quite likely would have started budding throughout the Muslim world decades ago too. We were really only a generation or so ahead of them but now we've probably set them back centuries.

In addition to stopping BTW I'd still expect arrests, apologies and reparations from our side. It'll probably be too late for arrests because by the time we get around to reconciling our past the guiltiest humans responsible will be long dead. Their corporations will still be kicking though so I guess it'll have to be them that carries the liability.

If what you say is true it will probably be due to their having been sacked to such an extent that the natural, social and financial capital they'll need to recover lost ground is just gone. If this is the case then I expect endless warfare until we use everything up. Easter Island on a global scale but filled with a hatred that will last eons.

Edited April 25, 2013 by eyeball

[carepov]

To date, these "attack adds" have been right on the mark and proved accurate. Ignattief and Dions "Attack adds" were proved correct and factual. It is a shame that these "attack adds" can not be simply named for what they are.... "Educational pieces".. And there is nothing again but FACTS behind the latest "add" targeted at Justin.

In my opinion; for Justin to cry foul over this only highlights his complete lack of any ability to work under pressure.. What would he do if Obama tried to push him on trade? When the QC goes after him, how fast will he buckle, Crack and cry foul?

The Liberals know as well as all of the parties that "Attack adds" WORK. For heavens sake, the Liberals perfected them! So now why Justin play ball? He SIMPLY does not know how to. If You cant stand the professional heat?... Stay out of the kitchen

Yes the ads work. They will keep working until they don't. They are not "educational pieces" because they are biased - they are propaganda at best, they are offensive and disrespectful to all supporters of Trudeau/Dion/Ignatief.

Trudeau has not "cried foul" - he has not "buckled" - he has responded quite well.

[c33]

Lets not forget that Justin used a TAX PAYER funded set, props and Cameras for his Filming of his "Let play nice" video. It was filmed on a CBC set with tax-payer funded resources... Yet the CBC will not comment or investigate how this happened or was omitted...

Nice try. Degrassi is filmed by a private production company and airs on a network other than CBC. I'm sure there is a film tax credit involved in there some where so I guess you can cry and scream about the injustice of that.

[Fletch 27]

Well, If "fact based" is what you call Biased... Sure, lets go with Biased..

Maybe the past supporters of Dian and Ignattief have some reflecting to do? Did he just not "Visit"? Sounds like an education to me!

Yes the ads work. They will keep working until they don't. They are not "educational pieces" because they are biased - they are propaganda at best, they are offensive and disrespectful to all supporters of Trudeau/Dion/Ignatief.

Trudeau has not "cried foul" - he has not "buckled" - he has responded quite well.

[carepov]

Well, If "fact based" is what you call Biased... Sure, lets go with Biased..

Maybe the past supporters of Dian and Ignattief have some reflecting to do? Did he just not "Visit"? Sounds like an education to me!

All good lies are "fact-based". Micheal Moore's films are "fact-based". Donald Trumps claims that Obama is a foreigner is "fact based". 9/11 truther theories are "fact-based"....

[PIK]

Nice try. Degrassi is filmed by a private production company and airs on a network other than CBC. I'm sure there is a film tax credit involved in there some where so I guess you can cry and scream about the injustice of that.

What about being paid to be in the house but yets goes out and gets major pay for speaking?

[PIK]

Now this new so called scandal, is it legal? Or are they handing out brown envelopes? And CBC will be giving alot of free air time to get justin elected.

Edited April 25, 2013 by PIK

[c33]

What about being paid to be in the house but yets goes out and gets major pay for speaking?

I was responding to a specific complaint from an esteemed poster. What does this have to do with it?

Now this new so called scandal, is it legal? Or are they handing out brown envelopes? And CBC will be giving alot of free air time to get justin elected.

Now you're just making stuff up.

[jacee]

The Liberals know as well as all of the parties that "Attack adds" WORK.

Only for 'low information voters'.

If You cant stand the professional heat?... Stay out of the kitchen

Attack ads aren't professionalism.

They're not even common decency.

[jacee]

The Liberals know as well as all of the parties that "Attack adds" WORK.

Only for 'low information voters'.

If You cant stand the professional heat?... Stay out of the kitchen

Attack ads aren't professionalism.

They're not even common decency.

[Moonbox]

Their corporations will still be kicking though so I guess it'll have to be them that carries the liability.

This is just goofy chip-on-your shoulder nattering now. I know 'corporation' is your pet word and for you it conjures up all sorts of visions of evil, but who are these corporations and what, specifically, are they guilty of?

If what you say is true it will probably be due to their having been sacked to such an extent that the natural, social and financial capital they'll need to recover lost ground is just gone. If this is the case then I expect endless warfare until we use everything up. Easter Island on a global scale but filled with a hatred that will last eons.

Things are not going to improve until they reject fundamentalism and religion as the ultimate authority over their lives and decisions. The cultures that have grown to be prosperous have all done this (more or less) and the Muslim world can expect to remain in the Dark Ages until they embrace a more secular light. Any legal or political system that operates merely on interpretations of human writing and teachings from over 1000 years ago is doomed to remain brutal, ignorant, oppressive and violent. Pre-Industrial Europe was no better.

[eyeball]

This is just goofy chip-on-your shoulder nattering now. I know 'corporation' is your pet word and for you it conjures up all sorts of visions of evil, but who are these corporations and what, specifically, are they guilty of?

Yeah, and this is just you sneering down you nose.

Things are not going to improve until they reject fundamentalism and religion as the ultimate authority over their lives and decisions. The cultures that have grown to be prosperous have all done this (more or less) and the Muslim world can expect to remain in the Dark Ages until they embrace a more secular light.

Yep, just like we did except it was easier for us because we didn't have anyone squashing us and we still had a planet for the taking.

Any legal or political system that operates merely on interpretations of human writing and teachings from over 1000 years ago is doomed to remain brutal, ignorant, oppressive and violent. Pre-Industrial Europe was no better.

Any legal or political system that reinterprets recent history to suit it's own rosy view of itself is just as doomed.

but who are these corporations and what, specifically, are they guilty of?

Imperialism, in a pet word.

Edited April 25, 2013 by eyeball

[Moonbox]

Yeah, and this is just you sneering down you nose.

You bet. You deserve it.

Yep, just like we did except it was easier for us because we didn't have anyone squashing us and we still had a planet for the taking.

If anything, it was harder, because they didn't have the internet or mass media to keep them informed, and it started happening in the 1400's, well before colonialism, and enlightenment has been a gradual process every since the start of the reformations.

It's easier for you, however, to ignore fact and history and just blame the man and corporations for the Islamic world's failings. The possibility that they're prone to villainy all on their own hasn't even occurred in your jilted mind. I recommend you look up the Arab slave trade in African from the 9th to 19th centuries. That might give you some perspective.

Any legal or political system that reinterprets recent history to suit it's own rosy view of itself is just as doomed.

You shouldn't be talking history, because there appears to be some fairly enormous gaps in your knowledge of it (ie. the last thousand years).

Edited April 25, 2013 by Moonbox

[Argus]

A few years late on this one, don't you think?

I don't know what you are trying to say.

[Moonlight Graham]

It creates the risk of a moral equivalence between butchers and innocent victims. It's that simple.

No, it means both are thought of as human beings, which they are. It doesn't excuse the actions of the criminals, or necessarily leads to appeasement or not punishing them harshly.

[Argus]

Maybe not in the short term but sooner or later people would tire of being ruled by abusers, just like people in our societies did.

The North Korean government seems in no danger of being overthrown. The Iranian theocracy is quite healthy and in no danger after a generation in power. I think you would agree neither are being propped up by the west. It's a little much to ask for the west to allow its oil supply to be in the hands of extremely hostile nations for a generation. The job of western governments is to ensure the smooth running of their nations, and that includes securing their energy supplies. The OPEC oil embargo prompted a lot of 'interference' in middle east countries, and I really can't blame anyone for that intervention. It was necessary.

You have zero, no way at all to know what might happen.

Nor you. But I'd suggest a more likely scenario than rainbows and gumdrops is military clashes among middle east nations and unrestrained (since you would have no western interference) efforts at obtaining nuclear weapons to be used against Israel, and afterward, presuming they survive, against each other.

We know that democratic governments once they got started began erupting all over the Christian world despite all its undemocratic bloodthirstiness. Were it not for us and the sort of diddling we committed in Iran for example, democratic governments quite likely would have started budding throughout the Muslim world decades ago too. We were really only a generation or so ahead of them but now we've probably set them back centuries.

Why? Interference in south/central American nations was far higher than in the middle east, and for far longer. For that matter, you don't get much more interference than the South Koreans and Japanese experienced. Didn't seem to hurt either their cultures or their democratic aspirations.

[Argus]

Only for 'low information voters'.

We call them "the Canadian electorate".

[eyeball]

The possibility that they're prone to villainy all on their own hasn't even occurred in your jilted mind.

You're sneering again, the only reason you're saying this is because we disagree. Riddle me this, how did it occur to me to assign villainy to dictators? This statement of your's says a whole lot more about how jilted your own thinking is not mine.

You shouldn't be talking history, because there appears to be some fairly enormous gaps in your knowledge of it (ie. the last thousand years).

Where did this fairly enormous gap between the last thousand years and the last couple of generations suddenly come from? Perhaps what's appearing to you is just another fairly enormous brain fart blowing back at you.

[eyeball]

Stephen Harper is stepping up his attack on rival Justin Trudeau’s musings about the “root causes”

“This is not a time to commit sociology, if I can use an expression,”

I'd like nothing better than to see Harper start an election fight on this issue. .

Edited April 26, 2013 by eyeball