Rob Ford, mayor of Toronto UPDATES

[BubberMiley]

Perhaps Ford will rethink is stance regarding a safe injection site in Toronto now.

I don't see how anything "now" is any different from a few days ago. One more person claims he's seen the video after the previous three. Big deal. No one's been able to "authenticate" it, other than seeing it for what it is. It hasn't been made public, and if Lisi pleads guilty there's a very good chance it will never be made public. The "evidence" remains pretty much the same as it ever was, and that's why he won't resign.

[On Guard for Thee]

I suspect they won't make the video public for now because it may prejudice the case against Lisi. The obvious question that comes to my mind is who hired Lisi to get the video?

[jacee]

I suspect they won't make the video public for now because it may prejudice the case against Lisi. The obvious question that comes to my mind is who hired Lisi to get the video?

Yup.

Eta

I expect that's why the police want to talk to Rob, about his phone call to Lisi just before Lisi went out threatening people to get the video, and after.

Rob Ford has not complied with the police request to interview him.

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/11/01/cops-want-to-talk-to-mayor-rob-ford

Following Sandro Lisis bail hearing for extortion charges Friday, Det.-Sgt. Gary Giroux the lead investigator in Project Brazen 2 told reporters hes trying to speak to Ford about the case that led to investigators earlier this week finding the video of the mayor appearing to smoke crack cocaine.Ive made the invitation through the mayors chief of staff and that invitation is, ah, Im going to pursue (that invitation), Giroux said in front of Old City Hall courthouse.

Edited November 2, 2013 by jacee

[Guest American Woman]

Smoking a substance, even crack, may not in itself be a crime. Selling it and possessing illegal drugs are crimes, but is using illegal drugs a crime?

How do you use it without possessing it?

At any rate, I'd say his political career is over. Illegal or not, he threw too many other people under the bus. But then, the people of Toronto have the final say.

[Rue]

For me the tragedy is that all other municipal issues have come to a grinding halt as the death watch on

Ford has consumed municipal political attention away from such issues as:

1-the need to icrease subway,implement bullet trains and elaborate mass transit to accommodate the huge

increase in population and offset rush hours and car pollution;

2-the need to rebuild sewers, roads and infrastructure that are crumbling and directly as a result

of weather changes that have caused increased intense rain falls in very short time periods causing

mold, flooding, sewer backwash, sinkholes, collapsing roads;

3-the need to sell off city homes that are too expensive to fix;

4-the need to find a way to combat wide spread fraud in city homes whereby people get subsidized housing

then sub-let it illegally to others;

5-a need to get the city out of the housing business and transfer the responsibility to non profit organizations

and cooperatives and take money saved and earned from selling off certain homes and placing it in interesting bearing trust funds to fund non profit organizations and coops for the poor;

6-a need to reconnect communities to community centres which are being neglected;

7-municipal government reform-the current system is not working-we have too many aldermen/women and a Mayor's office with antiquated powers that often collide and conflict and prevent consensus (not just because of Ford's personality);

8-surplus property the city should have sold off long ago and should not sell (i.e., empty former borough buildings);

9-new police training on how to handle the mentally ill;

10-upgrading and increasing recycling and using garbage for thermal electricity;

11-new initiatives to use solar energy in the downtown core and to conserve water;

12-incentives for car pooling, municipal non profit organization projects and mass transit;

13-amalgamation of overlapping services with provincial government;

14-mass commuter ferries between Toronto and Burlington-Hamilton-Niagra on the Lake;

15-reforms to animal welfare programs run by the city.

I could go on and on but none of the above seem to get anyone's attention and to me these issues transcend left or right wing politics but seem dwarfed by all this Ford nonsense.

Edited November 2, 2013 by Rue

[Guest American Woman]

For me the tragedy is that all other municipal issues have come to a grinding halt as the death watch on

Ford has consumed municipal political attention away from such issues as: [...]

I felt the same way about Clinton and the BJ,

Edited November 2, 2013 by American Woman

[jacee]

For me the tragedy is that all other municipal issues have come to a grinding halt ...

The drama continues ...

http://www.ctvnews.ca/mobile/canada/ford-mum-on-meeting-with-deputy-mayor-insists-he-s-not-resigning-1.1525147

Stopping by Torontos city hall on Saturday afternoon, Ford wouldn't comment on if he had already met with Deputy Mayor Norm Kelly, but did tell reporters he's not going anywhere."I told you before I'm not resigning," he said, as he entered an elevator.

Ford doesn't have to "resign".

He has to take a leave and go to rehab though.

He also has to go and talk to the police.

.

Edited November 2, 2013 by jacee

[The_Squid]

Any public official involved with drug dealers, uses crack and associates with criminals should not be in the public trust. There should be a way to impeach them. Hopefully Torontonians wake up ( you listening Ford supporters on MLW?) and put enough pressure on him to quit.

He's corrupt and a buffoon.

[Sheogorath_The_Mad]

Anyone wanna do some digging and find out how many of those saying "The media is blowing this out of proportion" were the same people who ate up the "Jack Layton whore house" story?

[Guest American Woman]

Anyone wanna do some digging and find out how many of those saying "The media is blowing this out of proportion" were the same people who ate up the "Jack Layton whore house" story?

And the opposite - how many of those defending how the media handled this were saying that the media was blowing 'Layton and the whore house' out of proportion?

[Sheogorath_The_Mad]

And the opposite - how many of those defending how the media handled this were saying that the media was blowing 'Layton and the whore house' out of proportion?

I don't see the similarities.

[Guest American Woman]

I don't see the similarities.

Then perhaps you shouldn't be 'throwing stones.'

[cybercoma]

So Layton was in a whorehouse, was he?

For someone that's constantly saying we need to reserve judgment until there's a conviction or things have been investigated, it's pretty inconsistent that you would defame the dead when he wasn't even charged, the place was a massage parlour, and it was a single event (as opposed to Ford being tailed for months). More to the point, Ford is on camera with crack dealers smoking "something" out if a crack pipe, but you won't even let people assume that it's crack. He also has had constant contact with serious drug dealers and went as far as writing a character reference in city letterhead for one.

I can really see how Layton going to a massage parlour that's advertised in the street as offering therapeutic massages, I can see how you would see that as a really similar situation to Ford's. I mean Jack Layton had an Asian wife. He must have been involved with human traffickers, had persistent contact with them, and was a consumer of the sex trade just like Ford with his drug-dealing posse.

Or are you trying to tell us that you're really so gullible to believe that Ford was just a victim of circumstances, caught in the wrong places at the wrong times (hundreds if times btw). The man getting drunk and breaking beer bottles behind a school before pissing in public there must be the victim here.

Edited November 3, 2013 by cybercoma

[jacee]

The man getting drunk and breaking beer bottles behind a school before pissing in public there must be the victim here.

Vodka.

Two vodka bottles - 1 for him and one for Lisi.

IE, He drank a mickey, and then DROVE away.

[Guest American Woman]

So Layton was in a whorehouse, was he?

For someone that's constantly saying we need to reserve judgment until there's a conviction or things have been investigated, it's pretty inconsistent that you would defame the dead when he wasn't even charged, the place was a massage parlour, and it was a single event (as opposed to Ford being tailed for months). More to the point, Ford is on camera with crack dealers smoking "something" out if a crack pipe, but you won't even let people assume that it's crack. He also has had constant contact with serious drug dealers and went as far as writing a character reference in city letterhead for one.

I can really see how Layton going to a massage parlour that's advertised in the street as offering therapeutic massages, I can see how you would see that as a really similar situation to Ford's. I mean Jack Layton had an Asian wife. He must have been involved with human traffickers, had persistent contact with them, and was a consumer of the sex trade just like Ford with his drug-dealing posse.

Or are you trying to tell us that you're really so gullible to believe that Ford was just a victim of circumstances, caught in the wrong places at the wrong times (hundreds if times btw). The man getting drunk and breaking beer bottles behind a school before pissing in public there must be the victim here.

If that post is directed at me, you don't know what you're talking about. If it's not directed at me, perhaps you should make it clear who you are directing it at.

[Black Dog]

And the opposite - how many of those defending how the media handled this were saying that the media was blowing 'Layton and the whore house' out of proportion?

I guess this is pretty clever if you're the kind of person who thinks smoking hard drugs and consorting with criminals while in office is the same thing as a single incident that took place in 1996 and did not result in any charges or serious harm. Normal people probably don't see the connection.

[Guest American Woman]

I guess this is pretty clever if you're the kind of person who thinks smoking hard drugs and consorting with criminals while in office is the same thing as a single incident that took place in 1996 and did not result in any charges or serious harm. Normal people probably don't see the connection.

"Normal people" likely can see that I wasn't comparing the two people but rather comparing the media coverage of the two. The media was all over Ford before the existence of the video was confirmed by the police. Furthermore, since it's apparently escaped you, the video was also "one incident" and didn't result in any charges or serious harm.

Sure there were other incidents with Ford - just as there were others with Layton (you know that as well as I do), but the issues here are the crack smoking video and the whore house incident.

But don't let that stop you from making up an opportunity to insult me based on what's in your head.

[BubberMiley]

The media was all over Ford before the existence of the video was confirmed by the police.

But its existence was confirmed by three independent witnesses, two of whom took notes while watching. It's no great revelation that the police, in all their authority, saw the same thing. But I guess it helps save face for irresponsibly questioning the character of the original witnesses.

[Rue]

The original Toronto Star story without having the original tape asked readers to take the word of journalists that evidence they wrote their stories on existed even though they could not produce that evidence.

At one time newspapers followed a code of ethics that would not permit printing something as fact without having it exist first hand.

Second hand evidence would only be used to confirm first hand evidence and never be relied on itself.

The Globe piggy backed on the story and are equally responsible for the same behaviour.

The Sun and National Post were much more careful.

Clearly the Star and Globe had a bias against Ford, the Sun supported him, the National Post went both ways on him. It was never hidden by any of these papers. The talk show radio hosts dealing with Ford never hid their biases. John Oakley on 640 defends him, John Moore on 1010 and CBC 99.1 can barely can contain their hatred of Ford. Even John Tory let his bias slip applauding the Police Chief's comments.

Hey the media is bias. Its par for the course.

Yes there was a double standard with Jack Layton. The press did not run stories of his fights with his wife.Should they have? Well here's the question. When does a politician's private life cross the line to constitute a story the public has the right to note. Some on this forum have argued if a politician is drunk in public that is sufficient. Some say any behaviour that undermines an elected position.

Let's face it standards are not the same for all politicians. How and when its decided how detailed to get on someone's private life becomes very subjective and surely the particularmedia's political bias in favour or against the particular politicians plays into that.

No one reported George Bush Sr.'s mistress or George Bush Jr.'s showing up at the White House hammered when he fell of the bandwagon a few times and yet the media went to town on Clinton's wandering pecker.

Something tells me Stephen Harper is too boring to find a sex scandal or any scandal about but I bet you anything the press tried its hardest to find something perv like about Obama and could not find it. The best they could do is the being born outside the US shtik.

With Ford, he is on self destruct. There is a clear pattern of self sabotaging behaviour going on. I personally think he wants to get caught subconsciously. I think he is a desperately conflicted and unhappy man and his anger, alcoholism, bully behaviour, lack of respect for his own body, all are symptoms of tragic psychological flaws.

I really do think he is another Chris Farley. He knows people are laughing at him not with him. His whole life he has been ridiculed for being fat so adapted this tough guy persona to compensate but deep inside he wants to be loved.

Me I am not a therapist. I do not have time to hug him. I don't think it is realistic to think he can use his office to self destruct and expect people to look the other way or make excuses. If Ford was your son, brother, husband, father you would and should not make excuses about such behaviour, why then would his being Mayor make it acceptable?

On a case by case basis there are legal issues to be made about proving his guilt. There is good argument to be made his extreme bullying stance as a politician makes him vulnerable. For example he preaches zero tolerance of bad or questionable behaviour in others but with himself he says look the other way. It is just too much of a disconnect at this point.

He can hang in all he wants but its like the guy who wet his pants in school and is trying to walk around pretending nothing is wrong and is trying to smile and act like everything is fine. Uh no. Not at this point.

When I was in elementary school I remember a guy shitting his pants in grade 5. Our whole class stunk up and he sat their on the edge of his pants trying to pretend nothing was wrong.

After school he waddled him and at one point as he waddled stiff legged a piece of excrement rolled out one of his pant legs. Oh yah we were cruel taunting him.

At this point Ford is walking around with crap in his pants trying to act as if its not there. We all smell it. Many are laughing at it. It matters little at this point other than he needs to change his pants and get medical help for crapping his pants.

Edited November 3, 2013 by Rue

[g_bambino]

I don't see how anything "now" is any different from a few days ago...

Having much of the content of the police file is different; we have confirmation of the existence of the video plus a whole raft of other damning evidence.

[BubberMiley]

Having much of the content of the police file is different; we have confirmation of the existence of the video plus a whole raft of other damning evidence.

No, like when we were asked to take the reporters' word for it that they saw the video, now we're asked to take the chief's word for it. Until we see the video, the situation hasn't really changed.

Although it's true that we've seen damning surveillance video of Rob Ford urinating inside a washroom and outside his car.

[cybercoma]

Rue, the reporters at Gawker and The Star saw the video first hand. It wasn't second-hand speculation. They reported on what they witnessed themselves.

[cybercoma]

Having much of the content of the police file is different; we have confirmation of the existence of the video plus a whole raft of other damning evidence.

the video doesn't exist. This is just police bias against Ford for cutting their funding.

[g_bambino]

The original Toronto Star story without having the original tape asked readers to take the word of journalists that evidence they wrote their stories on existed even though they could not produce that evidence.

Hey the media is bias. Its par for the course.

Good grief. Is this tired sqwaking still going on? How and, more importantly why, would three journalists working for two different media outlets in two different countries conspire and put their careers at great risk just to exercise a bias against Ford, who basically consistently makes himself a target for negative press, anyway? And, besides, why do you target these journalists when printing claims without revealing the source (any more than "people close to the prime minister" or "a source within the ministry") has been going on for... well, a century or more? Do they lack ethics simply because they went after that poor, suffering underdog Ford?

[g_bambino]

No, like when we were asked to take the reporters' word for it that they saw the video, now we're asked to take the chief's word for it. Until we see the video, the situation hasn't really changed.

In regard to the video, specifically, what's changed is the Chief of Police has said the video exists. Of course, he too may be in on the anti-Ford conspiracy...

As for the rest, there's more than just the public urination. You should read it, if that's all you're aware of.