Jack Weber Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) Of couse it was. Just like the per captia thing right. You just never mentioned either of them until somebody else did. Stop trying to piggyback on other people's comments. Kinda like you piggy backing Kimmy last night because you have never had any of the information you claimed was untrue,huh Professor Kitzel? I'll put my knowledge of the Spanish Civil War up against yours any day of the week... Unless you don't want to be proven,yet again,to be a clueless twit parroting FOX news talking points? Edited August 27, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 And can others do the same to you. Your out-of-context quoting is pretty damned awful. The irony of someone as dishonest as you running to the moderator going "Daddy daddy! They said mean things about me!" is pretty rich. I'd love the good Professor to try to do something like that... I'd love to see him refute the evidence against him. I suspect he's got very few friends here,and more than a few that would like to see him take the Deep-6... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 Kinda like you piggy backing Kimmy last night What kimmy and I do behind close doors is none of your business! In all seriousness, all I did was agree with her. You on the other hand keep using other people's posts by saying "yeah, that's what I meant to say" or "yeah, that's what I was going to write." It's ridiculous. I'll put my knowledge of the Spanish Civil War up against yours any day of the week... Who the hell cares about the Spanish Civil War? Other than you, and a few others. Who in some perverse way, thought it was a defense for Al Qaeda, Hamas, and other present day terrorist groups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) What kimmy and I do behind close doors is none of your business! In all seriousness, all I did was agree with her. You on the other hand keep using other people's posts by saying "yeah, that's what I meant to say" or "yeah, that's what I was going to write." It's ridiculous. Who the hell cares about the Spanish Civil War? Other than you, and a few others. Who in some perverse way, thought it was a defense for Al Qaeda, Hamas, and other present day terrorist groups. My knowledge of the Spanish Civil War is a microcosm of how I,and many others here,dwarf your miniscule knowledge of anything other than Fox News talking points... You only agreed with Kimmy,who also admitted that she might not be sure because she was'nt a historian,because you have no earthly clue about what your talking about... And the subject matter of this thread changed,Professor Kitzel,when you did not get entirely correct the reasons behind the Mujahideen in Afghanistan,and the historical ramifications of propping up Islamic extremists to figth Communism...The same way a nation props up someone like Suharto,a Fascist,for ostensibly the same thing... Don't worry,Professor...With your publicly displayed feeble grasp of history,I suspect that those historical links seem unfathomable to you... At some point in time you may come to realize that you have made yourself look like a fool,and in the future,refrain from enterring into discussion you are clearly out of your limited depth to talk about... Edited August 27, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) What out of context quoting? I'm sure many people could give examples, but I'll point out the one you've been lately making the rounds with about me: When I said that I think we should hold our governments to a higher international standard than we hold others...you claimed that I was "racist" and held "brown people" to a lower standard. If that's not a wilfully out-of-context use of my remark, I don't know what is. In all seriousness, all I did was agree with her Kimmy made a cautious remark, phrased it plainly as a possibility, and one that she wasn't too sure about. So, we get back to the one of the original issues: Suharto. Most likely over a million deaths. Possibly way over a million deaths. Are you still going to say he's not in the same league as Hussein? Edited August 27, 2010 by bloodyminded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 Well...No one can ever accuse you of being a deep thinker,Professor Kitzel... The main reason is that you made an idiotic claim I,and everyone else,have yet to see you back up. You could have simply said that you were'nt sure about these things,but...Because you're immature,arrogant,and,an ideologue and cannot admit you don't have a very good grasp of history,you continued down this road. And now you've had kimmy halfheartedly,and alot more politely,try to make your points for you because you were entirely intellectually ill equipped to do so.This is why you have to try to obfuscate,make wildly innaccurate statements about posters supporting Saddam...It's simply because you cannot admit you don't know what you're talking about AND you seem to revel in the O'Reilly,Hannity,Limbaugh method of bully debating and then trying to change the subject when you begin to fall behind... I have no sympathy for the likes of you at all,and I don't mean conservatives because I have debated conservatives here regularily and sometimes agreed with them(please,spare calling me a leftist because I'll have to defy you to prove it and we'll have to go through your charade of cluelessness again.)...It's simply because you don't have anything to offer other than Fox news ideological talking points and a poor grasp of history...Besides the fact that I also think you'd be doing this country a huge service and moving to the place you clearly would rather be living in... I truly enjoy watching you get hoisted on your cluelessly arrogant,immature,ideological driven petard because you deserve every inch of it...And then try to wriggle your way of the hook... I'll bet I speak for more than just myself on that,as well... Sign the petition,folks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 and the historical ramifications of propping up Islamic extremists to figth Communism...The same way a nation props up someone like Suharto, a Fascist, for ostensibly the same thing... I completely disagree. Helping Afghanistan fight off the Soviets was entirely the right thing to do. Comparing it with the support of someone like Suharto is wrong, which was wrong. When I said that I think we should hold our governments to a higher international standard than we hold others...you claimed that I was "racist" and held "brown people" to a lower standard. I'm sorry but it sounded bigoted. For whatever reasons, you have a higher standard for Western countires than Middle Eastern countires, except of course Israel. And the only common link is race and/or religion. As if they couldn't possibly live up the standards that we set for ourselves. Sign the petition, folks... It'd be nice if you could post once without whining about Breitbart, Fox News, or the Tea Party. That act got old long ago. Especially when I barely ever mention them at all in any of my posts. But it seems like the only way you can discuss things, is through erecting strawman after strawman. Come to think of it, it's probably the only thing you can erect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) I completely disagree. Helping Afghanistan fight off the Soviets was entirely the right thing to do. Comparing it with the support of someone like Suharto is wrong, which was wrong It'd be nice if you could post once without whining about Breitbart, Fox News, or the Tea Party. That act got old long ago. Especially when I barely ever mention them at all in any of my posts. But it seems like the only way you can discuss things, is through erecting strawman after strawman. Come to think of it, it's probably the only thing you can erect. Communist insurgency in Viet Nam...Suharto was strategically in Indonesia to prevent the spread of Communism...It's precisely the same thing as the Mujahideen being supported...It's the same reason why Trujillo and the Duvalliers were supported...It's the same reason why Pinochet was installed...It's the same reason why Mobuto Sese Seko was propped up... The US State department was fine with doing it in Afghanistan,you seem to agree with that plan...Yet you say backing Suharto,for precisely the same reasons was wrong... You'll have to explain that for everyone... What you call "whining' is simply the truth that you don't have the maturity to face about yourself... You backed Andrew Breitbart(who was standing up for a bigotted Tea Party member) when he tried his character assassination attempt on Shirley Sherrod.In that thread,started by Lictor,once it was found out that Mr.Breitbart had used an incomplete and doctored version of a speech made my Ms.Sherrod,you simply could'nt admit you'd been had by a race baiting charltan.So you tried to change the subject there...Everyone here saw you do that,so,I'll defy you to tell us all that it was something different because the evidence was fairly obvious and it's still there... I don't care if you don't mention him at all anymore...In that thread you said"Godspeed,Andrew Breitbart"...You now wear that stupid statement,and you're not going to wriggle off the hook. I don't care if it's getting old for you that I,and almost everyone else,mentions the fact that you only seem capable of Fox News talking points...And once someone gets you off those talking points,you get exposed for the clueless ideologically driven twit that you have proven yourself to be over..and over..and over... So all that leaves an pissant Limbaugh following sheep,such as yourself...Is to intimate I have an erectile dysfunction problem... If that's not the most pathetic last stand of a beaten simpleton,I don't know what is??? There's a line from the movie Dirty Rotten Scoundrel's that applies in this instance,and for these puposes,I'll have to ad-lib it... "Know your limitations,Shady(Reggie was the name used in the film)..You are a moron!!!!" Those are words you should learn to live by,kiddo... How's my teeth looking now? Edited August 27, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 I completely disagree. Helping Afghanistan fight off the Soviets was entirely the right thing to do. Comparing it with the support of someone like Suharto is wrong, which was wrong. I'm sorry but it sounded bigoted. For whatever reasons, you have a higher standard for Western countires than Middle Eastern countires, except of course Israel. And the only common link is race and/or religion. No, the only common link is that responsibility for one's own behaviour trumps responsibility for others' behaviour. Nothing more sinister than that. And it's not "except of course Israel," it's allies generally. And along this line, I feel more responsible for Canada's behaviour than for Israel's or for the U.S.'s. And as a corollarly to all this, I would further suggest that powerful states be held to higher standards than weaker ones--that too has nothing to do with race, and only applies to the US and its allies because the US happens to be very powerful, and Canada is in close agreement on international matters with a few exceptions, making us co-responsible. Race amounts to zero in my formulation. As if they couldn't possibly live up the standards that we set for ourselves. That's up to them, not me; if I have a responsibility, it's to how my state behaves. At any rate, our standards are not universally higher than everyone else's anyway. Does everyone support state terrorism and mass murder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) I would further suggest that powerful states be held to higher standards than weaker ones I disagree. I think we should hold everyone to an equal standard. Otherwise, you're just giving certain people, or certain groups room to act poorly. Edited August 27, 2010 by Shady Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) I disagree. I think we should hold everyone to an equal standard. Otherwise, you're just giving certain people, or certain groups room to act poorly. Ok...actually, my original claim on this matter was that "we should be held to the same standards, if not higher ones." Therefore, when the US, Canada, UK et al--who compose "terrorist lists" and so on--are directly and intentionally complicit in massive terrorism, that makes us rogue, terrorist states. If not...why not? Edited August 27, 2010 by bloodyminded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 Ok...actually, my original claim on this matter was that "we should be held to the same standards, if not higher ones." Therefore, when the US, Canada, UK et al--who compose "terrorist lists" and so on--are directly and intentionally complicit in massive terrorism, that makes us rogue, terrorist states. If not...why not? If your premise is that Canada is a rogue terrorist state, then realy, what's the point on continuing the discussion. You may wanna instead post on one of those kook, fringe websites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) If your premise is that Canada is a rogue terrorist state, then realy, what's the point on continuing the discussion. You may wanna instead post on one of those kook, fringe websites. That's not what he's saying... You would have been able to decipher that if had any higher brain functions,other than the ones the Fox News carnival barkers tell you to use... The rest of your half baked diatribe is your usuual feeble attempt at an obfuscation because you are intellectually ill-equipped to be in this type of discussion... I,and everyone else,will now await your "Jack keeps bringing up Fox news" post you will use as cover to deflect the fact you know very little about what you're talking about... Edited August 28, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted August 28, 2010 Report Share Posted August 28, 2010 (edited) If your premise is that Canada is a rogue terrorist state, It isn't my premise. It's the premise of those who defend this behaviour. then realy, what's the point on continuing the discussion. You may wanna instead post on one of those kook, fringe websites. You're really making a disciplined effort to avoid the issue. I'm still wondering what you make of these serious questions, and how you align them with your beliefs: 1. What do you think of the direct, intentional involvement in Indonesia's state terror? 2. Do you suppose that complicity in these mass murders tells us something about the often joint policies of the most powerful nations, and how they contradict the popular narratives of spreading freedom and defending democracy? 3. Why is the terrorism of Hamas worse than this? Edited August 28, 2010 by bloodyminded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 28, 2010 Report Share Posted August 28, 2010 (edited) It isn't my premise. It's the premise of those who defend this behaviour. You're really making a disciplined effort to avoid the issue. I'm still wondering what you make of these serious questions, and how you align them with your beliefs: 1. What do you think of the direct, intentional involvement in Indonesia's state terror? 2. Do you suppose that complicity in these mass murders tells us something about the often joint policies of the most powerful nations, and how they contradict the popular narratives of spreading freedom and defending democracy? 3. Why is the terrorism of Hamas worse than this? Obfuscation is the only thing Professor Kitzel is disciplined at... Of course,there's an obvious reason for this...Professor Kitzel is completely clueless about these things and says all sorts of idiotic things to try to change the subject to get off the hook of publicly acknowledging his inherent cluelessness... I'd love to see a cogent retort of your questions by the history major.... Edited August 28, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hermarx1001 Posted August 28, 2010 Report Share Posted August 28, 2010 words words words Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 28, 2010 Report Share Posted August 28, 2010 words words words Mental illness...Mental illness...Mental illness.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 30, 2010 Report Share Posted August 30, 2010 Hey Professor Kitzel... Post #348 and #349... Have'nt seen you capable of answering yet you comment on others confusion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANADIEN Posted August 30, 2010 Report Share Posted August 30, 2010 (edited) Geez, you guys aren't being very tolerant. They have the right to burn whatever books they please. As long as the books are their private property. And if you don't agree with what they're doing, then you obviously hate Christians. Anyways, it looks like this situation is fallout from the proposed "bridge building" centre at Ground Zero. And it looks as though it's already bearing some "bridge building" fruit! Typical... It is, as we shall never forget, intolerant to be against hateful acts. Let me introduce myself. I'm the kettle and you're the pot, right? Edited August 30, 2010 by CANADIEN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Bandelot Posted September 7, 2010 Report Share Posted September 7, 2010 Petraeus: Planned Quran-burning could endanger troops The U.S. commander in Afghanistan on Monday criticized a Florida church's plan to burn copies of the Quran on September 11, warning the demonstration "could cause significant problems" for American troops overseas. "It could endanger troops and it could endanger the overall effort in Afghanistan," Gen. David Petraeus said in a statement issued Monday. With about 120,000 U.S. and NATO-led troops still battling al Qaeda and its allies in the Islamic fundamentalist Taliban movement, Petraeus warned that burning Qurans "is precisely the kind of action the Taliban uses and could cause significant problems -- not just here, but everywhere in the world we are engaged with the Islamic community." And one of his deputies, Lt. Gen. William Caldwell, told CNN's "The Situation Room" that event "has already stirred up a lot of discussion and concern" among Afghans. "What I will tell you is that their very actions will in fact jeopardize the safety of the young men and women who are serving in uniform over here and also undermine the very mission that we're trying to accomplish." "I would hope they would understand that there are second- and third-order effects that will occur that will affect that young man and woman who's out there on point for America, serving their nation today, because of their actions back in the United States," he said. An armed Christian organization that had pledged to protect the Dove World Outreach Center withdrew its support from the Quran-burning last week, stating the event "may diminish the work of the Holy Spirit to witness to Muslims." That group's founder, Shannon Carson, said he agrees with the church's stance on Islam, which he called a cult "that is invading our nation." But he complained that the "liberal media" is using stories on Jones's plans "to distract, divide and enrage the public." Oh oh, the serene face for freedom of speech develops a tick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted September 7, 2010 Report Share Posted September 7, 2010 The church wasn't granted a burn permit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Bandelot Posted September 7, 2010 Report Share Posted September 7, 2010 Sept. 6, 2010 Former Vice Chief of Staff of the Army Gen. Jack Keane, an adviser to Petraeus, called it "outrageous" and "insulting to Muslims." "It's also insulting to our soldiers in terms of what they stand for and what their commitment is to this country and to the Muslims in this country," Keane told ABC News. But late today, Jones vowed he would go ahead with the Quran burning, even knowing the concerns of Petraeus and Keane for the safety of U.S. troops. A Facebook page dedicated to the day, entitled "International Burn A Koran Day" has more than 8,000 fans. "On September 11th, 2010, from 6pm - 9pm, we will burn the Koran on the property of Dove World Outreach Center in Gainesville, FL in remembrance of the fallen victims of 9/11 and to stand against the evil of Islam. Islam is of the devil!" the page declares. Link They might plan to only burn one copy of the book. It's not so much about the burning of the book itself, but the idea behind it, and the bigger fire that it could lead to. That's what has the General concerned here. And he seems like a very serious, responsible man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted September 7, 2010 Report Share Posted September 7, 2010 ....They might plan to only burn one copy of the book. It's not so much about the burning of the book itself, but the idea behind it, and the bigger fire that it could lead to. That's what has the General concerned here. And he seems like a very serious, responsible man. Such risks didn't seem to bother Wikileaks....let it burn. Use Jet A aviation fuel as an accelerant. Toast some infidel marshmallows too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted September 7, 2010 Report Share Posted September 7, 2010 (edited) Burn! Yah, baby... http://english.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2010/09/06/2010090600753.html Me love you long time, too! Edited September 7, 2010 by DogOnPorch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Bandelot Posted September 7, 2010 Report Share Posted September 7, 2010 Yeah, what does General Patreus know about it anyway. He should mind his own business. Lets all be silly and let our emotions guide our thoughts and actions. Consequences? So what. What consequences? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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