Michael Hardner Posted October 21, 2010 Report Share Posted October 21, 2010 I just discovered I'm about the most centrist guy around! But not as much as Morris, because he said so, and less than me because I said I'm more centrist than Morris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 21, 2010 Report Share Posted October 21, 2010 Ah... senator... cough.. cough... I reserve my right to not respond... Anyway, even if I did vote NDP, campaign for them, and attend political rallies - that could have been years ago, had I done those things in those campaigns for Rae, and the others. Rae wasn't a centrist, and probably not the others either....But yes, everyone matures... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted October 21, 2010 Report Share Posted October 21, 2010 But not as much as Morris, because he said so, and less than me because I said I'm more centrist than Morris. Your pristine logic outdoes mine! I concede defeat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 I have voted Liberal provincially, NDP Federally in my much younger days and for a while Liberal federally - However, I don't find CTV conservative at all, in fact I agree they are pretty banal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 Either way, it remains speculative opinion until someone can show otherwise. And this involves more than, say, two or three examples of "conservative" bias; real patterns of bias have to be exposed. It's a difficult and time-consuming task, but would be do-able if one were so inclined. I've asked (multiple times, to multiple posters) for this sort of hard evidence of the "leftist bias" of the CBC; and all I've ever gotten is one or two possible examples (and, once, a couple more "examples" that didn't even fit the bill, that meant nothing). No ongoinhg bias exposed, no pattern of leftist thought influencing the news. So, as to CTV's conservative bias...I remain agnostic for the time being. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 I've asked (multiple times, to multiple posters) for this sort of hard evidence of the "leftist bias" of the CBC; and all I've ever gotten is one or two possible examples (and, once, a couple more "examples" that didn't even fit the bill, that meant nothing). No ongoinhg bias exposed, no pattern of leftist thought influencing the news. apparently, hard evidence of CBC "leftist bias" is hard to come by... but it certainly remains a go-to reach for some, having long ago reached "meme" designation, particularly within the Conservative Right, particularly when the free-speech victimization card needs to be played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 Either way, it remains speculative opinion until someone can show otherwise. Once again, evidence has already been provided. In an ample amount. CBC is no different than PBS and NPR in America, and BBC in England. They all lean left. But people with CBC coloured glasses on, continue to ignore it. As for CTV, I don't care what kind of bias they have, as long as they're doing it without tax money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 (edited) apparently, hard evidence of CBC "leftist bias" is hard to come by... but it certainly remains a go-to reach for some, having long ago reached "meme" designation, particularly within the Conservative Right, particularly when the free-speech victimization card needs to be played. Yes. One would think that the self-evident, everyday, egregious leftist bias being promoted with tax money would warrant some serious, scholarly and expansive navigation of its innumerable ideological transgressions. So far, they have remained unwilling to tackle the project. Why? Or if not a full scholarly piece, how about a series of articles, say in the National Post or funded by conservative think tanks? Explain the hypothesis, prove a pattern of lefftist distortion complete with examples, and navigate the distinctions between apparent right-wing or business-centric bias and leftist bias. The tools are all available. There are numerous venues for in-depth studies of news media, and the information is all public, right there for them to utilize. What's the problem? Edited October 22, 2010 by bloodyminded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 What's the problem? of course, as you all too well realize, it's not a problem, at all. "They" realize, going in, the project is failed even before starting... otherwise, just how difficult would it be for, say... those Fraser Institute smarty-types to author a white paper on the, "CBC leftist bias". hey now... is there a purposeful reason for "them" not to even attempt to write the white paper, or the series of articles? A self-serving purpose? Let me see, what could it be? What advantage is there to keep perpetuating the CBC "leftist" myth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 "They" realize, for, say... those Fraser Institute smarty-types to author a white paper on the, "CBC leftist bias". YOu mean another one? http://oldfraser.lexi.net/publications/forum/1999/07/section_07.html http://www.friends.ca/news-item/3322 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 of course, as you all too well realize, it's not a problem, at all. "They" realize, going in, the project is failed even before starting... otherwise, just how difficult would it be for, say... those Fraser Institute smarty-types to author a white paper on the, "CBC leftist bias". hey now... is there a purposeful reason for "them" not to even attempt to write the white paper, or the series of articles? A self-serving purpose? Let me see, what could it be? What advantage is there to keep perpetuating the CBC "leftist" myth? YOu mean another one? http://oldfraser.lexi.net/publications/forum/1999/07/section_07.html http://www.friends.ca/news-item/3322 another one? One would have thought you would actually know what a white-paper was... get to it, look harder Dancer. But really, c'mon - a 1999 article from the Fraser Forum (no less), that references 13 online CBC articles, concluding, "a prevalence of cited state sources" in the articles, offering this glaringly weak summation: "An examination of the sources that CBC online journalists use and promote shows their occupational preference not only for government and its agencies, but also for labour and left-leaning organizations over right-wing organizations" ... substantiated with this overwhelming mastery of statistical prowess: "Federal government sources comprised 28 percent of the links, while provincial government sources accounted for 22 percent of the links. Businesses and left-wing groups (including think tanks, lobbyists, and unions) each comprised 10 percent of the links. Media Organizations represented 7 percent of the list of links. Links to competitive market groups (including think tanks and lobbyists) were present only 4 percent of the time less than half the number of links to left-wing groups." Damning stats - hey Dancer... a 6% difference in links, where, *gasp*, "the author includes links to businesses in the same category as left-wing groups! Huh, say what Dancer? Notwithstanding the authors predisposition and that one of the 13 stories was, quite naturally, influenced by it's very topic - the labour movement. Yup, damning Fraser Institute analysis... from 1999 (but still not a Fraser Institute white paper - hey, Dancer?). but... what's this... your second link is profound! Should one accept the linked articles premise, your implied attachment is that anti-American bias is, wait for it... wait for it - "leftist bias". Oh Dancer, please... take us there - you know you want to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 blah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blahblah blah blah yadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yaddayadda yadda yadda So we agree then, your rhetoris was weak and the accusation of Bias against the CBC is valid. Thanks for ackowledgement, your honesty in this case is refreshing and I must say, surprising given your history of being the opposite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 christ, this is exactly what I"m talking about, isn't it? these pitiable excuses summoned from the depths of cherished political myths to "prove" points that are anything but clear. yes - it is exactly what you alluded to. I understand Dancer has a bit of difficulty with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 another one? One would have thought you would actually know what a white-paper was... get to it, look harder Dancer. But really, c'mon - a 1999 article from the Fraser Forum (no less), that references 13 online CBC articles, concluding, "a prevalence of cited state sources" in the articles, offering this glaringly weak summation: "An examination of the sources that CBC online journalists use and promote shows their occupational preference not only for government and its agencies, but also for labour and left-leaning organizations over right-wing organizations" ... substantiated with this overwhelming mastery of statistical prowess: "Federal government sources comprised 28 percent of the links, while provincial government sources accounted for 22 percent of the links. Businesses and left-wing groups (including think tanks, lobbyists, and unions) each comprised 10 percent of the links. Media Organizations represented 7 percent of the list of links. Links to competitive market groups (including think tanks and lobbyists) were present only 4 percent of the time less than half the number of links to left-wing groups." Damning stats - hey Dancer... a 6% difference in links, where, *gasp*, "the author includes links to businesses in the same category as left-wing groups! Huh, say what Dancer? Notwithstanding the authors predisposition and that one of the 13 stories was, quite naturally, influenced by it's very topic - the labour movement. Yup, damning Fraser Institute analysis... from 1999 (but still not a Fraser Institute white paper - hey, Dancer?). but... what's this... your second link is profound! Should one accept the linked articles premise, your implied attachment is that anti-American bias is, wait for it... wait for it - "leftist bias". Oh Dancer, please... take us there - you know you want to! christ, this is exactly what I"m talking about, isn't it? these pitiable excuses summoned from the depths of cherished political myths to "prove" points that are anything but clear. You know, the CBC spent an entire day--virtually a whole day's broadcst to the exclusion of everything else--triumphally showing the propaganda extravaganza of the fall of Saddam's statue, complete with platitudinous "reporting" about the joyful Iraqis... And not a word--not one--on the fact that the Iraqis had been trucked in for the cameras by the military themselves; or that, if someone had taken the radical approach of changing the camera angle, we could have seen that it was a couple dozen celebrants--from a city of millions. So, according to M. Dancer and the other credulous-to-media True Belivers, the CBC has a pro-war, pro-American, and arguably right-wing bias. That's not my theory--that's theirs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 Let's name personalities on CBC and CTV that are clearly Liberal or Conservative. I'll start. I'll say that Craig Oliver and Jane Taber of CTV vote Liberal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 I hardly trust your opinion on who is liberal or conservative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) I hardly trust your opinion on who is liberal or conservative. Then share your precious opinion. How can you argue that Taber and Oliver aren't Liberal supporters? Add something constructive, smallc. Are you telling me that ALL personalities with CBC and CTV are unbiased? Edited October 23, 2010 by lukin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) Let's discuss specific journalists and tell what we think his/her political preference is. Edited October 23, 2010 by lukin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 Then share your precious opinion. How can you argue that Taber and Oliver aren't Liberal supporters? Add something constructive, smallc. Are you telling me that ALL personalities with CBC and CTV are unbiased? No, of course they aren't. I would say that Jane Taber might lean liberal, and I would say that Craig oliver doesn't like the current Conservative government, but I couldn't really say which way he leans on many of the issues. He may be liberal, but he doesn't let it interfere with his job, and that's what's important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 No, of course they aren't. I would say that Jane Taber might lean liberal, and I would say that Craig oliver doesn't like the current Conservative government, but I couldn't really say which way he leans on many of the issues. He may be liberal, but he doesn't let it interfere with his job, and that's what's important. Taber "might" lean Liberal. Good grief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) Taber "might" lean Liberal. Good grief. You think everyone not carrying the "Prairie Stamp of Conservative Approval" is a (L)liberal... It's not like you're terribly objective on the matter... Edited October 23, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) You think everyone not carrying the "Prairie Stamp of Conservative Approval" is a (L)liberal... Such as............ I guess we are similar because you have done nothing but ridicule this station, even though it isn't yet on the air, right? Edited October 23, 2010 by lukin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) Such as............ I guess we are similar because you have done nothing but ridicule this station, even though it isn't yet on the air, right? Wrongo,sport... On almost every chance you get you claim thast all TV news in Canada is coming from the left...Many,including myself,have pointed out that this simply is'nt the case yet you continue to propogate this myth... Please point out where I've ridiculed it??? On at leat 2 occassions on this thread I've said I have no problem with it at all... I don' think it's necessary,but then again,I have the super human ability to seperate the wheat from chaffe (as it were) ... Edited October 23, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 Jack, you claim to have no problem with Sun News, yet you've ridiculed it on many posts. I think what he's trying to say is that Quebecor has applied for a "Made in Canada" right wing kook network along the lines of Fox in the U.S. Hmmm..... Yes... We'll probably get 5 minute commentaries from that shining light of modern thought...Peter Worthington! I can't wait for Gerry Nichols Corner... Ok............... ahem... "Live from the National Citizen's Coalition headquarters,it's Gerry Nichols and "Uncle Gerry's Neo-Liberal Freedom Hour... Gerry's special guests... Preston Manning.... Michael Taube.... and... Charles McVety... Now you're host with most... Gerry Nichols!!!!" yeah...you've been fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 Jack, you claim to have no problem with Sun News, yet you've ridiculed it on many posts. Hmmm..... Ok............... yeah...you've been fair. Fox news,if one can call it that,is a network for right wing kooks....Nothing is fair or balanced about it... Do you think any of the above that I mentioned,many have been columnists in the Sun family of newspapers,is exactly objective????...And you're right,I think all of them are unobjective kooks... I'll give you the CBC because it definately leans to the left,however I usually only watch the At Issue panel on CBC and that's about it... CTV is an enitely different matter because I find it to be right down the middle,which is the way things should be... Or i this more about you requiring Right Wing "jounalistic" invective because you really only want to hear that point of view,and you're not really objective at all??? By the way,you've clearly missed all the times where I've said that I have no problem with it being on the air... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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