Not just Muslim Cell Phones, Now Chinese Oil in Alberta

[William Ashley]

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/world/story.html?id=2389622

I'm all for the free market but a majority stake in the tar sands is sorta funny for Alberta no? Don't they still call Chinese chincs there?

This at the same time Nortel is sold to US ciena - seems like all the big deals are all foreign buyouts while unemployment is rising and corporate taxes are getting lower..? Odd wouldn't you say?

Doesn't it sting albertans to know that Canada sold out athabasca to the Chinese?

Their NeoNazi supporters must be furrious knowing that they will be working for their Chinese Bosses.

http://reviewcanada.ca/reviews/2008/01/01/pages-from-the-conservative-handbook/

sure they got rid of them

http://www.stopracism.ca/content/conservative-attack-ad-racist

explain why their marketing wing is full of racists?

since when are there two classes of Canadians? don't we all deserve the same equal rights? why is harper and his party trying to deprive rights from Canadians who don't fit his aryan WASPy image?

Surely this racist person clement is selling out a state owned corporation for his own pocket while giving over Canadian corporate control to China.... to the Chinese... he is giving your life force to the Chinese... how much did the tarsands cost to be sold for 1.9 Billion?

If you doubt my racist claims of clement - why did he invite an apartide official to Canada? -- Glenn Babb you can tell it runs deep into his blood and mind. But clearly he has submitted himself to Chinese infuences.. seeing them as his master, a master by made in china toys sold to be put in the trash bin the next day, sold to give us cancerous air so that we can put that peice of plastic in the trash tomorrow.

And all this to buy more canadian land from the banks we already own... watch that 2 billion evaporate into the 150 billion given to the banks.. MADNESS PURE MADNESS, are they purposely spitting in the face of true blooded Canadians?

Edited January 2, 2010 by William Ashley

[ZenOps]

Well..

You can also just look at it from the viewpoint that if you don't sell the Tarsands to China, China will just spend the $1.9 billion buying oil anyways (and possibly not all from Canada) sometime over the next 20 years or so.

This deal works well for Canadians because Chinese have little to no interest in Canadian real estate (land) They really only want the resources. And a one time lump sum early on is exactly what Canada needs right now. Land is of course not an issue for most Canadians, because 89% of Canada is owned by the British Crown Corporation anyhow (and not for sale to anyone, white or otherwise)

Canada is very strapped for infrastructure, including pipelines. We really only have the one main highway in Canada or the one main railroad, which China views as a very weak point in doing business with Canada. Canada is without doubt a very young nation with little to no infrastructure built (Rome had not only a ring road, but 8 seperate highways leading into it) China is built much the same.

Even Britain thinks Canada has too little infrastructure... I'm still in the camp that we have a long way to go. Two seperated highways in Canada would go a long way to alleviating my fears of a nightmare scenario of some natural disaster hitting the one highway - causing Canada to crumble.

Most of the $2 billion will go towards the construction of the $16.2 billion Mackenzie pipeline, which is also sorely needed (and been on the table for many decades, but unable to build due to lack of funds). Canada is not building anywhere fast enough to meet demand from Britain, US or China.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/mackenzie-pipeline-gets-a-boost/article1415219/

"The 1,197-kilometre line would bring up to 1.2 billion cubic feet a day of natural gas from onshore basins near the Arctic coast to the northern edge of Alberta, where it would connect to the province's distribution system."

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1809900,00.html

"And in the U.K. diesel costs $11.50 per gallon, compared to around $3.90 in the U.S."

Edited January 2, 2010 by ZenOps

[Topaz]

So what about Harper's view of human rights in China and then turning around and doing business with China??? Either he's for human rights at ALL costs or he just mouthing off to Canadians on one side of his mouth when he really rather do business! Is it any wonder why some of us don't think too much of Harper as PM??? The Tories keep saying that Iggy is in politics for himself, well nothing could be truer about the Tories, for themselves, the gas and oil industries and any other business that will benefit them in the future!!

[Smallc]

So what about Harper's view of human rights in China and then turning around and doing business with China???

What about it?

Either he's for human rights at ALL costs

When did he say that?

[Topaz]

It seems that money will talk louder than human rights, especially in the global downturn now. I know Canada is not the only counry doing business with China, but it just seems these countries are saying "believe in what I say, not what I do" http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061115/china_snub_061114/20061115?hub=CTVNewsAt11

[ZenOps]

Hehe. Stephen Harper = Hippo critical

Democracy from a man who prorogues parliament (maybe twice) to stay in office. As for the US two party system - you had your choice between electing a Black guy or a loser.

The next time you might only get a chace to elect a White woman to presidency. I dunno - but that sounds just about as democratic as North Korea, where you might get the chance to vote for Kim Jong Il - or Kim Jong Il Junior.

China human rights issues? Like what? Tiananmen?

PSHHH... Totally pales in comparison to the 1,021 nukes that the US set off in Nevada - of which they have now compensated some 75,000 US families for cancerous radiation related deaths (IMO, its probably closer to a million)

IMO, its their own populace though - Does the US have a right to nuke 1 million of its own citizens? Does China?

Edited January 2, 2010 by ZenOps

[Smallc]

The next time you might only get a chace to elect a White woman to presidency.

John McCain is a white woman?

[kimmy]

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/world/story.html?id=2389622

I'm all for the free market but a majority stake in the tar sands is sorta funny for Alberta no? Don't they still call Chinese chincs there?

Your comments have indeed exposed profound ignorance... just not in the way you intended to.

I am guessing you're from Ontario?

That's my guess because the only time I encountered Canadians who know so little about Canada outside their province was when I lived in Ontario.

Thanks for the link to Kinsella's review of Flannigan's book. That's an interesting piece of history regarding the early days of the Reform Party. To think that Reform took concerns about Neo-Nazi infiltration so seriously that they contacted a high-ranking Liberal insider to help them investigate the problem, and that Kinsella helped them with Chretien's knowledge and blessing, is a fascinating bit of history. I didn't know about any of that, and it speaks well for all involved.

I notice that Kinsella mentions that these Neo-Nazis and white supremacists were mostly in the Greater Toronto Area.

-k

[maple_leafs182]

John McCain is a white woman?

Our democratic system isn't very democratic, we elect politicians instead of ideas. Politicians can be bought out.

Look how much influence lobbyists have in Washington.

Conservative attorney Larry Klayman filed a lawsuit against the White House Monday demanding that it release information on healthcare meetings with lobbyists.

The lawsuit, filed in federal district court, charges the Obama administration violated the Federal Advisory Committee Act and the Freedom of Information Act by not providing relevant information about closed-door meetings on healthcare policy.

Klayman’s suit refers to reports of meetings between administration officials on the "Health Reform De Facto Advisory Committee" and lobbyists representing the pharmaceutical industry, Planned Parenthood, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, AARP and others.

Source

GM launched the EV1 electric car in 2001, they were forced to by the zero admissions mandate passed in California. Car companies lobbied saying their wasn't a market for electric cars. They won.

Car companies make a lot of money off maintenance and selling parts for their vehicles, there was virtually no maintenance for electric cars.

What kind of maintenance does an EV need?

Very little. That's part of the beauty of it. Check the batteries once a month or so to be sure they don't need water, and the connections are clean and tight. Keep your tires properly inflated for good performance. Maintain the clutch, brakes, and suspension as you normally would. Change the brushes on the motor (a minor operation) at about 80,000 miles. That's it.

Source

If California stuck with that mandate, we wouldn't be as reliant on oil as we are today.

I would probably be driving an electric car right now.

Corporations have the power to shape society whether we like it or not.

Money is power, private Central Banks control money.

We need to end Central banks and their system of debt/credit that they created and control.

Central banks not only supply the nation with its money, they loan it to the nation at interest. This puts the nation into instant debt. This is the very reason the American Revolution happened.

"The colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters had it not been that England took away from the colonies their money, which created unemployment and dissatisfaction. The inability of colonists to get power to issue their own money permanently out of the hands of George the III and the international bankers was the PRIME reason for the Revolutionary War." - Benjamin Franklin

Here is another quote

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs." - Thomas Jefferson, Letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin (1802)

See the part I made bold, does that not sound like what is going on right now. I mean that is exactly what is going on now.

I think it may be time for a new revolution?

Not just in America but hear in Canada.

[Smallc]

I'm not in favour of any revolutions.

[bush_cheney2004]

If California stuck with that mandate, we wouldn't be as reliant on oil as we are today.

I would probably be driving an electric car right now.

You don't live in California. But you can still buy an electric car....in Saint Jerome, Quebec.

http://www.zenncars.com/

Go for it....start the revolution on your own dime.

Edited January 2, 2010 by bush_cheney2004

[eyeball]

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/world/story.html?id=2389622

I'm all for the free market but a majority stake in the tar sands is sorta funny for Alberta no? Don't they still call Chinese chincs there?

I doubt if they call them Commies anymore, unless it's yes sir Mr. Commie, right away sir.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

I doubt if they call them Commies anymore, unless it's yes sir Mr. Commie, right away sir.

There are 91 projects ongoing in the oil sands. This so-called majority stake is in one company that holds two leases on two different pieces of land. They are no-where near the largest or most prosperous company invested there. Even Israel has a company up there cleaning the sand.

[ZenOps]

Just a side note:

Canada's cellphone infrastructure is also in its infancy. I believe we pay the highest rates of the "first world". Heaven knows that any Visa/mastercard/Lotto 6/49 business completely stops when a Celltower goes down in a remote part of Canada (which is pretty well everywhere outside of each the major provincial cities.)

China would probably invest more in Canada, but as I mentioned are hesitant to do so (due to lack of infrastructure and possible reliability). Brits have been proven trustworthy if not a little bit imperialistic. Its the Canadian government which is the problem.

Chinese are no idiots, they don't want a section of land that has no roads going to it. The money *must* be invested where it can be of most use (that is placed where one can make the most money by extracting the most resources out) and at least a little bit of redundancy.

Right now, that is pipelines. Back in the 1800's it was pick axes for the gold rush, in the late 1800's it was iron and the railroads. Its not entirely a bad idea to expand Canada's cellphone internet structure nowadays as well.

Edited January 3, 2010 by ZenOps

[Jerry J. Fortin]

Just a side note:

Canada's cellphone infrastructure is also in its infancy. I believe we pay the highest rates of the "first world". Heaven knows that any Visa/mastercard/Lotto 6/49 business completely stops when a Celltower goes down in a remote part of Canada (which is pretty well everywhere outside of each the major provincial cities.)

China would probably invest more in Canada, but as I mentioned are hesitant to do so (due to lack of infrastructure and possible reliability). Brits have been proven trustworthy if not a little bit imperialistic. Its the Canadian government which is the problem.

The Canadian Government?

The country is wide open for foreign investment. In fact, that investment is what is keeping us in "our place". Its time to grow up and start doing for ourselves.

[ZenOps]

BTW: I'm not sure why North America always specifies China as communist.

China had an Imperial (British Monarchy Crown-like) system starting from the first Emperor in 221 BC all the way up to the last emperor in 1916 AD. The last Chinese emporer deposed from power while playing a game in his own tennis court in China (sounds strange to some, but that was the thing to do at the time - much like golf is now)

The "Chinese Imperialists" of the last 2000 years did not just disappear when Communism "took over" China in 1949. In many ways - it slightly reverted to a republican state (where petty warlords banded together to form a power greater than a singular king or emperor)

Its like how people here say Canadian freedom or Canada is "free". Canada isn't free, Tibet is "freer" than Canada is.

You can bet your ass though - that every monarchy on the planet fears "communism" or a reversion to a Republican Roman style type of leadership. Royal families are very protective of their hoardes.

ME - I'm imperialist sympathetic thats why I'm in Canada

Edited January 3, 2010 by ZenOps

[kimmy]

I am kind of wondering if William Ashley is going to come by to defend his ignorant, inflammatory remarks, or if this was just a hit-and-run.

-k

[waldo]

I am kind of wondering if William Ashley is going to come by to defend his ignorant, inflammatory remarks, or if this was just a hit-and-run.

-k

and I am kind of wondering why you don't actually point out the remarks you perceive as ignorant, the remarks you perceive as inflammatory... and challenge them yourself. Or... is yours just a hit-and-run?

[kimmy]

and I am kind of wondering why you don't actually point out the remarks you perceive as ignorant, the remarks you perceive as inflammatory... and challenge them yourself. Or... is yours just a hit-and-run?

As I mentioned earlier, characterizing Albertans as racists. Suggesting Albertans refer to Chinese people as "chincs" and the reference to neo-Nazis.

I'm surprised that this sort of thing needs to even be pointed out. What planet are you people from?

-k

[waldo]

As I mentioned earlier, characterizing Albertans as racists. Suggesting Albertans refer to Chinese people as "chincs" and the reference to neo-Nazis.

I'm surprised that this sort of thing needs to even be pointed out. What planet are you people from?

other than you commenting favorably concerning Kinsella's involvement in helping the Reform Party, all I read in your previous (first) reply was a back-handed stab at Ontario... you didn't say anything about (Alberta) racist characterizations in the OP... perhaps you could point them out. I read the OP neo-Nazi reference, with an Alberta perspective, as one that applied to the Heritage Front within Alberta... which, in itself, was simply a lead in to the Reform Party-Kinsella article. The marketing angle link was a nice touch given the nature of the referenced Conservative attack ad...

thanks for clarifying your concerns about ignorant and inflammatory remarks within the OP

[Jerry J. Fortin]

other than you commenting favorably concerning Kinsella's involvement in helping the Reform Party, all I read in your previous (first) reply was a back-handed stab at Ontario... you didn't say anything about (Alberta) racist characterizations in the OP... perhaps you could point them out. I read the OP neo-Nazi reference, with an Alberta perspective, as one that applied to the Heritage Front within Alberta... which, in itself, was simply a lead in to the Reform Party-Kinsella article. The marketing angle link was a nice touch given the nature of the referenced Conservative attack ad...

thanks for clarifying your concerns about ignorant and inflammatory remarks within the OP

Alberta has room for foreign investment. We have somehow lost the desire to do for ourselves.

[kimmy]

other than you commenting favorably concerning Kinsella's involvement in helping the Reform Party, all I read in your previous (first) reply was a back-handed stab at Ontario... you didn't say anything about (Alberta) racist characterizations in the OP... perhaps you could point them out.

I pointed quoted the "chinc" portion and called his comments ignorant. I would think that most people with any sort of thinking capacity of their own would be able to grasp why.

I read the OP neo-Nazi reference, with an Alberta perspective, as one that applied to the Heritage Front within Alberta... which, in itself, was simply a lead in to the Reform Party-Kinsella article.

According to Kinsella, the Heritage Front people were not "within Alberta", they were within Toronto.

Regardless, characterizing Albertans as neo-Nazis who'll be furious to have Chinese bosses is just disgusting.

The marketing angle link was a nice touch given the nature of the referenced Conservative attack ad...

It's a big leap of logic to transform the commentary about Ignatieff's opportunistic return to Canada into an attack on people of other races. It's a much bigger leap of logic to somehow posit that the Conservative party's marketing group is somehow representative of Albertans.

It's obvious that Mr Ashley is not interested in the foreign investment angle of this story and was merely using it as a pretext to launch his ignorant and poorly-thought out generalizations about the people of a province.

-k

[Michael Hardner]

I pointed quoted the "chinc" portion and called his comments ignorant. I would think that most people with any sort of thinking capacity of their own would be able to grasp why.

Yes, I concur that W. Ashley needs to be smarter when he posts.

And - another thing - I'd like to see more left-of-centre posters hold their own kind to a high standard. That would be one way that LOC posters could distinguish themselves from ROC posters.

[Oleg Bach]

The Canadian Government?

The country is wide open for foreign investment. In fact, that investment is what is keeping us in "our place". Its time to grow up and start doing for ourselves.

That's a stupid term "foreign investment" - what investment? What true caring heart does China have for our nation? This is pillaging and our seniour tribal leaders selling our future for next to nothing that will ensure the future of China while degrading our own. What do you think China will do as far as keeping things tidy once they take more control of the operation in Alberta..do you think they will care about the spread of cancer and other diseases amongst our Canadian population in close proximity of industry? No f**king way - they kill their own for profit and power and harming us will not bother them much...Look at the area around even Orangeville Ontario - China has bought up huge tracks of farm land and wet land - they plan long term--do you think they are going to respect his area? They do not respect their own natural resources let alone ours - There are but a few that benefit though these types of sales and it is not the average or even above average Canadian - just the billionares who get a kick out of abusing us.

[waldo]

I pointed quoted the "chinc" portion and called his comments ignorant. I would think that most people with any sort of thinking capacity of their own would be able to grasp why.

Yes... yes, you did - while making your back-handed slag against Ontario/Ontarians. You may have intended to explicitly state something about racist characterizations... but you didn't. You simply, as you've now stated in this your latest reply, quoted from the OP and made a reference to "profound ignorance".

According to Kinsella, the Heritage Front people were not "within Alberta", they were within Toronto.

within Toronto... or mostly in... in consideration of the Alberta chapter of the Heritage Front?

I notice that Kinsella mentions that these Neo-Nazis and white supremacists

were mostly

in the Greater Toronto Area.

Regardless, characterizing Albertans as neo-Nazis who'll be furious to have Chinese bosses is just disgusting.

interesting... that's quite a leap from the OP statement that speaks to "neo-Nazi supporters being furious"

It's a big leap of logic to transform the commentary about Ignatieff's opportunistic return to Canada into an attack on people of other races. It's a much bigger leap of logic to somehow posit that the Conservative party's marketing group is somehow representative of Albertans.

and you could argue that position; equally... those opposed to the attack ad could similarly argue from the position stated within the linked to article; specifically:

Like the usual racist line, the Conservatives accuse Ignatieff - read Asians, Blacks, and other minorities - off not being loyal to Canada because they are supposedly "foreign", not really Canadian, and ready to leave the country for greener pastures at the drop of a hat - or election.

If the Conservative attack ad is not racist it, at a minimum, fuels racism and gives weight to the bias that "foreigners" can't be trusted. The ad also may dissuade minorities to avoid public service for fear that their loyalties might be questioned.

It's obvious that Mr Ashley is not interested in the foreign investment angle of this story and was merely using it as a pretext to launch his ignorant and poorly-thought out generalizations about the people of a province.

I expect, if he's interested/inclined, he will reply. As for the latest call for some to hold others to higher standards, the same can be said... can be requested... of those with apparent sensitivities that reach well beyond what's actually stated.