Is it racist to hate Muslim extremists?

[Liam]

In the Troop Surge thread, I opined on the issue of Muslim extremists and the conversation shifted to one of racism. Not wanting to hijack the thread, I'm moving the issue here and posing the question: is it racist to hate Mulim extremists?

[BC_chick]

In the Troop Surge thread, I opined on the issue of Muslim extremists and the conversation shifted to one of racism. Not wanting to hijack the thread, I'm moving the issue here and posing the question: is it racist to hate Mulim extremists?

Everyone hates Muslim extremists - that's not an issue and you know it.

You are a racist when you think most or all Muslims are extremists and/or most or all support extremists.

[ScottSA]

In the Troop Surge thread, I opined on the issue of Muslim extremists and the conversation shifted to one of racism. Not wanting to hijack the thread, I'm moving the issue here and posing the question: is it racist to hate Mulim extremists?

Everyone hates Muslim extremists - that's not an issue and you know it.

You are a racist when you think most or all Muslims are extremists and/or most or all support extremists.

No, I'm a "racist", because I don't think the immigration floodgates being open is a good thing for western society. I think it's a very bad thing indeed. I also think we're warring against Islam, as opposed to Islamic extremism, but Poor Liam is only against Islamic extremism.

Is it racist to think that most Muslims support Islamic extremism if most Muslims DO support Islamic extremism?

But that begs the question: what does "race" have to do with religion? You lefties sure get your isms mixed up, don't ya?

[BC_chick]

But that begs the question: what does "race" have to do with religion? You lefties sure get your isms mixed up, don't ya?

Semantics.... fine, you're a "bigot" if you think most Muslims support extremism.

[Canadian Blue]

ScottSA isn't a racist, he's just a xenophobic, homophobic, bigot.

[Figleaf]

... is it racist to hate Mulim extremists?

That depends on *why* one hates them.

(P.S. Muslims can be or any 'race', so I've taken your use of the word 'racist' to mean more generalized bigotry along religious or ethnic lines, etc.)

[Guthrie]

how do you express your hate of these, 'extremists?'

how do you recognise these, 'extremists,' on the street?

where do these, 'extremists,' spend their time? what do you want to do about those areas where, 'extremists,' live?

what kind of interrogation should your govt use when questioning these, 'extremists?' --- should they be treated the same as those British soldiers? should their confessions be considered as believable as those British soldiers?

why do you believe, "Islam," is responsible for these, 'extremists?'

why do you believe, "Islam," produces these, 'extremists,' more than, "Judaism," or, "Xtianity?"

what part if Islamic religion leads most to producing these, 'extremists?'

what part of everyday life should westerners have separate from these, 'extremists?'

****************************************************************************

answer those questions and I'll answer any of yours (on the same topic)

[bush_cheney2004]

(P.S. Muslims can be or any 'race', so I've taken your use of the word 'racist' to mean more generalized bigotry along religious or ethnic lines, etc.)

Then the answer to this thread's question is clearly "No". Thanks to ScottSA for a lesson in language and logic.

Fin.

[marcinmoka]

Not wanting to hijack the thread, I'm moving the issue here and posing the question: is it racist to hate Mulim extremists?

I agree. NO, since Islamic extremism is not a race, nor do do most muslims support extremist ideals.

Has anyone ever labelled you a "racist" for such an assertion?

[Canadian Blue]

For those afraid of Muslims, I think I know of a way that you can fight back.

ScottSA, check it out.

http://www.comedycentral.com/motherload/in...?ml_video=82843

[Guthrie]

Spanish is not a race, ghetto is not a race, bilingual is not a race --- but Newt Gingrich is a racist:

WASHINGTON -- Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich equated bilingual education Saturday with "the language of living in a ghetto" and mocked requirements that ballots be printed in multiple languages.

"The government should quit mandating that various documents be printed in any one of 700 languages depending on who randomly shows up" to vote, said Gingrich, who is considering seeking the Republican presidential nomination in 2008. He made the comments in a speech to the National Federation of Republican Women.

...

Chicago Tribune

[ft.niagara]

Spanish is not a race, ghetto is not a race, bilingual is not a race --- but Newt Gingrich is a racist:

How can you possibly call NG a racist. Any insulated often impoverished area is a popular term 'ghetto'. Any effort to institutionalize bilingualism institutionalises 'ghettoism'. In fact, he is trying to prevent racism by being antighetto. English (at this time in the US) is the language of inclusion, whereas Spanish (at this time in the US) is the opposite. Look to Canada for all the benefits of bilingualism.

[ft.niagara]

... is it racist to hate Mulims?

That depends on *why* one hates them.

If one hates them because many of them have done bad things, and are responsible for bad things happening here and elsewhere, then it is ok. Thanks, I thought so.

[ScottSA]

What with all the hysteria over the semantics of what to call us evil folk, no one got around to answering my question:

Is it racist to think that most Muslims support Islamic extremism if most Muslims DO support Islamic extremism?

[guyser]

Is it racist to think that most Muslims support Islamic extremism if most Muslims DO support Islamic extremism?

A rhetorical question is a figure of speech in the form of a question posed for rhetorical effect rather than for the purpose of getting an answer.

[DogOnPorch]

Tens of thousands of Iranians apparently chanted 'Death to England' in a Tehran football stadium today. Are they extremists or are they a typical sample of the population? Difficult question. Think about that for a second. If they are all extremists...then there's a heck of a lot of them. If they are typical of the population...like at a Canadian hockey game...what does THAT say? Pretty scary.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story...59-2703,00.html

http://www.javno.com/en/sports/clanak.php?id=31287

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Jihad is obligatory for the Muslims.

---Abu Bakr

[Wilber]

When did Muslims become a race? I always thought it was a religion.

[jbg]

In the Troop Surge thread, I opined on the issue of Muslim extremists and the conversation shifted to one of racism. Not wanting to hijack the thread, I'm moving the issue here and posing the question: is it racist to hate Mulim extremists?

Not at all. We're not hating them on account of their race or religion. We're hating them on account that the extremists want us dead and the "moderates" are neutral on the question of our death.

[Argus]

In the Troop Surge thread, I opined on the issue of Muslim extremists and the conversation shifted to one of racism. Not wanting to hijack the thread, I'm moving the issue here and posing the question: is it racist to hate Mulim extremists?

Everyone hates Muslim extremists - that's not an issue and you know it.

You are a racist when you think most or all Muslims are extremists and/or most or all support extremists.

What race do Muslims belong to? What are the racial characteristics?

Do you even know what the word racism means?

[Charles Anthony]

Is it racist to think that most Muslims support Islamic extremism if most Muslims DO support Islamic extremism?

No, it is not racist in your hypothetical example.

Now, please prove that "most Muslims DO support Islamic extremism" because I know a lot of Muslims and none of them fit your bigotted stereotype.

We're hating them on account that the extremists want us dead and the "moderates" are neutral on the question of our death.

I oppose putting any responsibility on all "moderates" to make apologies for terrorists.

[jbg]

We're hating them on account that the extremists want us dead and the "moderates" are neutral on the question of our death.

I oppose putting any responsibility on all "moderates" to make apologies for terrorists.

I don't want apologies. I want rat-outs of terrorists, and civil insurrections in areas dominated and governed by that ideologies. I want children kept from schools that teach hate. After all, a parent should want their child not to be blown to smithereens conducting a suicide attack on some market in Israel.

[Charles Anthony]

JBG, are you open to the possibility that the people you are labelling are not as free to offer what you want?

Also, what are you offering in exchange?

[ScottSA]

JBG, are you open to the possibility that the people you are labelling are not as free to offer what you want?

Also, what are you offering in exchange?

What kind of an asinine question is that? Of course they are "free" to rat out extremists. What is he supposed to offer them in exchange? How about their lives? Is that good enough or are we supposed to pay wergeld and tribute on top of that for the priviledge of remaining alive in the countries our fathers built.

You also, in a previous post, used the usual fallacious counterargument used by the 'progressive' brigade; from the particular to the general: "I know Muslims who don't fit your definition..." (whatever you think that definition is), thereby implying that most Muslims do not fit my definition.

Let me explain something to you: given that the Koran, and by extension Islam, is at its root a religion of overt violence, it is quite safe to say that Islam is a danger in and of itself. Sam Harris probably treats it best, in "The End of Faith", when he points out, and I paraphrase, that "a moderate Muslim in the west is a Muslim who doesn't want to go to jail for being a good Muslim". We have known this to be true for centuries; Spain and France had firsthand experience with it, as did first the Eastern Roman Empire and later Bysantium. Here's Oriana Fallaci with a brutally honest description of the Rape of Bysantium, for all those whose sterilized version of history has led them to believe that the sack of Constantinople by the Crusaders was bad. It didn't hold a candle to this:

Oriana Fallaci, On the sack of Constantinople

…Crashing aside the Christians at Varna in 1444 they secured possession of Walachia, Moldavia, Transylvania, the territory now called Bulgaria and Romania, then in 1453 they put again under siege Constantinople which on May 29 fell into the hands of Mehmet II and by the way: do you know who was Mehmet II? A guy who, by virtue of the Islamic Fratricide Law which authorized a sultan to murder members of his immediate family, had ascended the throne by strangling his three year-old brother. Do you know the chronicle that about the fall of Constantinople the scribe Phrantzes has left us to refresh the memory of the oblivious or rather of the hypocrites?

Perhaps not. Especially in Europe, a Europe that weeps only for the Muslims, never for the Christians or the Jews or the Buddhists or the Hindus, it would not be Politically Correct to know the details of the fall of Constantinople. Its inhabitants who at daybreak, while Mehmet II is shelling Theodosius’ walls, take refuge in the cathedral of St. Sophia and here start to sing psalms. To invoke divine mercy. The patriarch who by candlelight celebrates his last Mass and in order to lessen the panic thunders: “Fear not, my brothers and sisters! Tomorrow you’ll be in the Kingdom of Heaven and your names will survive till the end of time!”. The children who cry in terror, their mothers who give them heart repeating: “Hush, baby, hush! We die for our faith in Jesus Christ! We die for our Emperor Constantine XI, for our homeland!”. The Ottoman troops who beating their drums step over the breaches in the fallen walls, overwhelm the Genovese and Venetian and Spanish defenders, hack them on to death with scimitars, then burst into the cathedral and behead even newborn babies. They amuse themselves by snuffing out the candles with their little severed heads... It lasted from the dawn to the afternoon that massacre. It abated only when the Grand Vizier mounted the pulpit of St. Sophia and said to the slaughterers: “Rest. Now this temple belongs to Allah” Meanwhile the city burns, the soldiery crucify and hang and impale, the Janissaries rape and butcher the nuns (four thousand in a few hours) or put the survivors in chains to sell them at the market of Ankara. And the servants prepare the Victory Feast. The feast during which (in defiance of the Prophet) Mehmet II got drunk on the wines of Cyprus and, having a soft spot for young boys, sent for the firstborn of the Greek Orthodox Grand Duke Notaras. A fourteen year-old adolescent known for his beauty. In front of everyone he raped him, and after the rape he sent for his family. His parents, his grandparents, his uncles, his aunts and cousins. In front of him he beheaded them. One by one. He also had all the altars destroyed, all the bells melted down, all the churches turned into mosques or bazaars. Oh, yes. That’s how Constantinople became Istanbul. But Doudou of the UN and the teachers in our schools don’t want to hear about it.

The Rage and The Pride, Oriana Fallaci

It's disturbing and polemical, but it's true. What's far worse than that, before the progressive brigade trots out medieval counterexamples, is that while Christianity has moved on from its Cathar heresies and Holy Land Crusades, Islam never did. Islam today is identical to Islam in the 6th century. You may know Muslims who don't fit my "bigoted" stereotype, but you obviously don't know Islam.

[Black Dog]

It's interesting that many of those most opposed to Islamic extremism seem to concur with the extremists on many basic principles. Intolerance of "foreign" cultural influences? Check. Disdain, if not outright hatred, for women and homosexuals? Check. Love of "traditional values" (read: ethno-religious chauvanism)? Check. The belief in the utility of violence? Checkaroonie. Hatrded of "weakness," "softeness" and othe r"

feminie" attributes? Check-o-rama. I really wonder why they can't just get along.

[ScottSA]

It's interesting that many of those most opposed to Islamic extremism seem to concur with the extremists on many basic principles. Intolerance of "foreign" cultural influences? Check. Disdain, if not outright hatred, for women and homosexuals? Check. Love of "traditional values" (read: ethno-religious chauvanism)? Check. The belief in the utility of violence? Checkaroonie. Hatrded of "weakness," "softeness" and othe r"

feminie" attributes? Check-o-rama. I really wonder why they can't just get along.

Yeah, excellent strawman. Unfortunately most of my colleagues on the right are far more tolerant than I am, although I don't think anyone on the right is anti-women. That's just silly. As is traditional values...I don't know anyone on the right who thinks stoning homosexuals and women is a good traditional value. What I find incredibly ironic is that the so-called 'progressives', the ones who will be up against the wall first, are the ones preaching tolerance for a religion that is against everything they believe to be good.