blackbird Posted January 16 Report Posted January 16 (edited) It is hard to understand why Canada has so many problems with its health care system, homeless people, housing costs, and on and on. A Canadian who spent time working in China was asked what he likes about China. This is what he said on FB. quote people have been asking me what I like about China. In October, I wanted to visit a specialist doctor, I got an appointment for the next day, the recommended medication was provided to me on the spot, and a problem which had been bothering me for 8 months, was fixed within two weeks. I needed a criminal check upon departure in case I need to provide one from China in Canada, it was completed the next day. I needed to fix stuff at the bank; everything was finished in 2 hours without appointments. I called yesterday, and got a dentist appointment the next day, 40 dollars for a good cleaning. Tomorrow, I will take a train that will take me to Beijing, the train will go at 320 km/h and 25 minutes later, I will have covered a distance that would have taken 2 hours by car. In Beijing, at the metro gate, I will show my phone, and my fare will automatically be debited. Later today, I will go shopping, to help me carry my things back, I will take a taxi, I will use my phone, press some buttons and a car will show up and bring me home for 2 dollars, the fare will automatically be debited from my money app. My son wanted a very specific computer part, after ordering it on my phone, the wrong one was received. I contacted the seller, and 3 days later the good part showed up, and I got to keep the bad one. It is insane how this society is efficient. unquote Meanwhile, in Canada, I am not qualified for the Canadian Dental Care Plan because I have access to a very bad union plan for retirees, that covers up to about $435 a year after you subtract the $635 annual premiums to pay for the plan. Not worth the paper it is written on. I must pay $2,800 for a partial denture out of pocket. A dental cleaning, xrays, and check-up is around $500. A crown is about $1700. The private plan would only cover a fraction of these costs. The health care system is a disaster with thousands of people dying on waiting lists. It takes at least a month to get an appointment with my doctor. Millions do not even have a family doctor and must go to the ER or a walk-in clinic and wait hours to see a doctor. Many ERs close frequently. People have even died waiting in ER waiting rooms. Below is a Zian burger with a lamb broth. He says this would cost you about $2.00. Edited January 16 by blackbird 1 1 Quote
John Stone Posted January 16 Report Posted January 16 agreed............better to be a communist in China than in Korea. A country with a population of 1.5 billion, functions adequately and is on the cusp of being the World's leading economy is doing something right. Nixon should be considered their saviour .............. with a nod to Kissinger. 1 Quote
herbie Posted January 16 Report Posted January 16 China is very adept at and not afraid to control their economy.Too bad for the Soviets they were so incompetent. It seems like suddenly one of our hardcore members is recognizing that socialist ideals are not terrible works of Satan. Quote
ExFlyer Posted January 16 Report Posted January 16 Communism is service...everybody gets the same. But, when you look at what is going on in China...seems they are doing very well and overall people seem to be happy. Yes there are dissident but hey, we have them here too Is it good, is it bad... that is perspective of the observer. 1 Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
John Stone Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 (edited) 17 hours ago, ExFlyer said: Communism is service...everybody gets the same. But, when you look at what is going on in China...seems they are doing very well and overall people seem to be happy. Yes there are dissident but hey, we have them here too Is it good, is it bad... that is perspective of the observer. 17 hours ago, ExFlyer said: Communism is service...everybody gets the same. But, when you look at what is going on in China...seems they are doing very well and overall people seem to be happy. Yes there are dissident but hey, we have them here too Is it good, is it bad... that is perspective of the observer. Lol I think you are putting lipstick on a pig re: China. Any domestic comfort they enjoy has been on the backs of Western investment / technology / science Those with only a modicum of knowledge re: China's history would agree, that China has been akin to the rise of a Phoenix. I would rather have a stable albeit Communist country feeding 1.5 billion people than an unstable, nuc power with 1.5 billion starving people. Nixon and Kissinger deserve much credit (Pyrrhic?) - that said the alternative of locking China out of global economics would have without a doubt led to war. Edited January 17 by John Stone 1 Quote
ExFlyer Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 1 hour ago, John Stone said: Lol I think you are putting lipstick on a pig re: China. Any domestic comfort they enjoy has been on the backs of Western investment / technology / science Those with only a modicum of knowledge re: China's history would agree, that China has been akin to the rise of a Phoenix. I would rather have a stable albeit Communist country feeding 1.5 billion people than an unstable, nuc power with 1.5 billion starving people. Nixon and Kissinger deserve much credit (Pyrrhic?) - that said the alternative of locking China out of global economics would have without a doubt led to war. Nope....just putting it in perspective. I am unsure of your position...are you in favour of strengthening trade with our second largest trade partner, China, or are you in dispute with the lipstick on the pig??/ Our second largest trade country is needed to help Canadians. 1 Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
blackbird Posted January 17 Author Report Posted January 17 (edited) 2 hours ago, John Stone said: Lol I think you are putting lipstick on a pig re: China. Any domestic comfort they enjoy has been on the backs of Western investment / technology / science None of us has any way of knowing how accurate that is. In any case, it has no relevance to the facts of how the people are being served by their government. Ordinary citizens are paying for services that are not being properly delivered in Canada. When people need health care, they don't care what kind of political system is running things or how that system came to be. What they care about it the essential services that they need. The point is in Canada we are being neglected by our leaders in many ways and our public health care system is an example of mismanagement and bureaucratic abuse. I am not advocating Communism or Socialism. I am simply pointing out the horrendous way Canadians are being treated in essential services and how this compares with a report on how things are in China in the areas mentioned. Canadians should not be burdened with a health care system that causes the death of people on long waiting lists for essential health care and closing ERs. It is a deplorable situation. Whoever is in charge needs to do a proper job or get out of the way. They should not be in power collecting huge salaries and pensions while the people under their rule suffer a very poor essential service and crime is really out of control. Nobody votes for that kind of thing. Edited January 17 by blackbird Quote
John Stone Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 22 minutes ago, blackbird said: None of us has any way of knowing how accurate that is. In any case, it has no relevance to the facts of how the people are being served by their government. Ordinary citizens are paying for services that are not being properly delivered in Canada. When people need health care, they don't care what kind of political system is running things or how that system came to be. What they care about it the essential services that they need. The point is in Canada we are being neglected by our leaders in many ways and our public health care system is an example of mismanagement and bureaucratic abuse. I am not advocating Communism or Socialism. I am simply pointing out the horrendous way Canadians are being treated in essential services and how this compares with a report on how things are in China in the areas mentioned. Canadians should not be burdened with a health care system that causes the death of people on long waiting lists for essential health care and closing ERs. It is a deplorable situation. Whoever is in charge needs to do a proper job or get out of the way. They should not be in power collecting huge salaries and pensions while the people under their rule suffer a very poor essential service and crime is really out of control. Nobody votes for that kind of thing. ........... supposedly a democracy is empowered with the vote? 47 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: Nope....just putting it in perspective. I am unsure of your position...are you in favour of strengthening trade with our second largest trade partner, China, or are you in dispute with the lipstick on the pig??/ Our second largest trade country is needed to help Canadians. I think ur Prime Minister is courageous - a bold move politically. Surprising that he accomplished anything - were the planets aligned? 1 Quote
Michael Hardner Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 26 minutes ago, blackbird said: The point is in Canada we are being neglected by our leaders in many ways and our public health care system is an example of mismanagement and bureaucratic abuse. I am not advocating Communism or Socialism. I am simply pointing out the horrendous way Canadians are being treated in essential services and how this compares with a report on how things are in China in the areas mentioned. I think you have pinpointed it with clarity here. I will quibble with one thing... I don't think it's neglect. I think it's incompetence. They are not able to manage. The older the industry, the worse it is. I've been managing in Canada for 30 years and the old way of doing things does not work anymore. They use authority to rationalize everything and they don't listen to others or consult on what works. That's the Canadian way. So old industries and organizations like government and Healthcare need to be cleaned out, they need a transfusion of new blood. 5 minutes ago, John Stone said: ........... supposedly a democracy is empowered with the vote? And yet a country like ours that votes for its government receives inept leadership when it comes to services. It's a paradox for sure. 1 Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
ExFlyer Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 1 hour ago, John Stone said: I think ur Prime Minister is courageous - a bold move politically. Surprising that he accomplished anything - were the planets aligned? Why? He is travelling to many countries trying to encourage and develop trade. It takes time for deals to develop and begin. Old deals have to expire before new ones can begin. The results of his efforts should be seen within a year or 2. Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
John Stone Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 23 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: Why? He is travelling to many countries trying to encourage and develop trade. It takes time for deals to develop and begin. Old deals have to expire before new ones can begin. The results of his efforts should be seen within a year or 2. Why?? The PM is the sharp end of party policy? There has been some changes since Justin had the door hit him on the a$$ Not to mention the fact that China could have been ..................... ungracious ........ but the chance to poke the U.S. in the eye was likely too great. ........ advantage; China. 1 Quote
User Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 This thread is a joke, right? China is essentially a step above a 3rd world country with the majority of its people still living outside of those fancy looking cities and they are not getting anywhere near the same quality of life, services, or care the average Canadian gets. 1 Quote
ExFlyer Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 1 hour ago, John Stone said: Why?? The PM is the sharp end of party policy? There has been some changes since Justin had the door hit him on the a$$ Not to mention the fact that China could have been ..................... ungracious ........ but the chance to poke the U.S. in the eye was likely too great. ........ advantage; China. Carney is the Prime Minster of Canada. It is his responsibility and obligation to present Canada to the World...and he is doing that. Yes he is gracious and is well received in all the countries he has visited. He has been good for Canada and has not been obnoxious to anyone. He has put Canada in a good light everywhere he has gone. Kudos to his efforts. Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
John Stone Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 5 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: Carney is the Prime Minster of Canada. It is his responsibility and obligation to present Canada to the World...and he is doing that. Yes he is gracious and is well received in all the countries he has visited. He has been good for Canada and has not been obnoxious to anyone. He has put Canada in a good light everywhere he has gone. Kudos to his efforts. Indeed. the guy has international equity, accumulated over decades ........... and brother, Kanada needs international equity. 1 Quote
ExFlyer Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 1 hour ago, User said: This thread is a joke, right? China is essentially a step above a 3rd world country with the majority of its people still living outside of those fancy looking cities and they are not getting anywhere near the same quality of life, services, or care the average Canadian gets. China is the worlds 2nd biggest economy...hardly 3rd world. Where the people live is of no concern....are our farmers living in the middle of nowhere in the prairies in the same category? Or the ones living in NWT or Nunavut or Northern BC or Yukon? Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
John Stone Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 4 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: China is the worlds 2nd biggest economy...hardly 3rd world. Where the people live is of no concern....are our farmers living in the middle of nowhere in the prairies in the same category? Or the ones living in NWT or Nunavut or Northern BC or Yukon? 4 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: China is the worlds 2nd biggest economy...hardly 3rd world. Where the people live is of no concern....are our farmers living in the middle of nowhere in the prairies in the same category? Or the ones living in NWT or Nunavut or Northern BC or Yukon? It has been said that 50 miles outside Beijing, China is 3rd world? However, even if that is true (it isn't) ................. 600 million are living pretty good. Quote
ExFlyer Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 Just now, John Stone said: It has been said that 50 miles outside Beijing, China is 3rd world? However, even if that is true (it isn't) ................. 600 million are living pretty good. What is said is one thing...what is reality is another. China is the worlds 3rd largest county (0.2% smaller than Canada). China's population is around 1.4 billion people That is a lot of people and a lot of land and being the worlds largest economy....something must be working well. Bottom line, China is doing very well and Carney dealing with them is a good idea. Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
User Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 10 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: China is the worlds 2nd biggest economy...hardly 3rd world. Where the people live is of no concern....are our farmers living in the middle of nowhere in the prairies in the same category? Or the ones living in NWT or Nunavut or Northern BC or Yukon? It could be the biggest economy in the known universe... but it is the per capita that matters and stating they are the 2nd biggest economy doesn't refute or change what I said, that for most of their people, they are in fact a step above a 3rd world. We are in a thread talking about the efficiency of services being better there, when most of their people do not have anywhere near the average quality of life of a Canadian. You people live in purposeful ignorance. 7 minutes ago, John Stone said: However, even if that is true (it isn't) ................. 600 million are living pretty good. So what? The discussion in this thread is not that less than half the people in China are living "pretty good" The vast majority of Canadians are living "pretty good" and even better than the average person in China. Quote
ExFlyer Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 13 minutes ago, User said: It could be the biggest economy in the known universe... but it is the per capita that matters and stating they are the 2nd biggest economy doesn't refute or change what I said, that for most of their people, they are in fact a step above a 3rd world. We are in a thread talking about the efficiency of services being better there, when most of their people do not have anywhere near the average quality of life of a Canadian. You people live in purposeful ignorance. .. Per capita?? What does that imply or even mean? And your basis of "a step above 3rd world" means what and what proof do you have of that?? And your claim of "their people do not have anywhere near the average quality of life of a Canadian. " is based on what proof?? "China provides significant social welfare, achieving near-universal basic health insurance and expanding elder care, yet faces challenges with system strain, urban-rural disparities, and severe human rights issues like suppressed freedoms" ": China has built a system with near-universal basic health coverage, financing it through taxes and subsidies, greatly improving access, especially for the poor, though it faces funding pressures and cost-sharing issues. Poverty Reduction: Significant strides have been made in poverty alleviation, with extensive programs ensuring basic needs and medical care for impoverished populations. Elder Care: Policies focus on a blend of home, community, and institutional care, aiming to support the elderly, though traditional family support remains crucial" How is our poverty reduction or elder care working???? Seems that you "live in purposeful ignorance" and just make unsubstantiated claims? I hate to even try to defend a dictatorship like China but what I hate even more is people making statements without merit. Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
herbie Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 More like it's just as Carney has said: the biggest economy in the world has become completely untrustworthy. So we deal with #2. When you're so goddam brainwashed all you think is so and so BAD, everything BAD trade BAD you've bought completely into the Trump/MAGA mentality Nixon, Reagan and both Bushes wouldn't recognize you as a Republican. Quote
User Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 2 hours ago, ExFlyer said: Per capita?? What does that imply or even mean? It means exactly what I said it meant: that for most of their people, they are in fact a step above a 3rd world. We are in a thread talking about the efficiency of services being better there, when most of their people do not have anywhere near the average quality of life of a Canadian. 2 hours ago, ExFlyer said: And your basis of "a step above 3rd world" means what and what proof do you have of that?? OK Sea Lion, here you go: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index 2 hours ago, ExFlyer said: And your claim of "their people do not have anywhere near the average quality of life of a Canadian. " is based on what proof?? Statistics, actual data... you should try it sometime. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/rankings/quality-of-life 1 Quote
West Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 TDS is now leading people to support China. Wild times we live in 1 Quote
ExFlyer Posted January 17 Report Posted January 17 33 minutes ago, User said: It means exactly what I said it meant: that for most of their people, they are in fact a step above a 3rd world. We are in a thread talking about the efficiency of services being better there, when most of their people do not have anywhere near the average quality of life of a Canadian. OK Sea Lion, here you go: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index Statistics, actual data... you should try it sometime. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/rankings/quality-of-life Hey...you don't have to like them and they could care less what you think, the bottom line is they are the worlds largest economy and their citizens get advantage of it. The only one that has personal experience is the one that started the thread blackbird... and he described it ...you are just making noise. In believe him more than you Have a great evening...good by Quote You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to tell me what mine should be.
User Posted January 18 Report Posted January 18 15 minutes ago, ExFlyer said: Hey...you don't have to like them and they could care less what you think, the bottom line is they are the worlds largest economy and their citizens get advantage of it. The only one that has personal experience is the one that started the thread blackbird... and he described it ...you are just making noise. In believe him more than you Have a great evening...good by Like them? This was a discussion about simple facts, my like for them or not has nothing to do with anything. You still have not figured out what per capita means. Quote
Alvincityfan Posted January 18 Report Posted January 18 China is a Third World country. That's a fact. China has achieved a certain level of development. That's also a fact. The question is, how do you explain this development? The simplest approach is to attribute it to a gift from the West, or some kind of mistake by the West. And to argue that "China could have developed better if the CCP hadn't controlled it." As for the hard work of the Chinese people? A large number of engineers, scientists, and workers have dedicated their entire lives to building China. These people could have had better lives in the West, or anywhere else in the world; they actually endured lower wages and harsher working conditions. And there's no doubt that a significant number of these people are CCP members. Do you accept that the CCP has indeed built, defended, and led China? Do you accept that members of the Chinese Communist Party are just ordinary Chinese people? Is it possible that this political system and ideology are indeed the most suitable path for China's development? What I see is that even the relatively pragmatic ones still say, "I don't deny that China is an authoritarian, dictatorial, police state, a terrible place," followed by "but," and so on. If even the pragmatic segment of Canadians cannot recognize the true situation in China, then no one can. I think this is enough to make Canadians reflect on whether there's something wrong with the Canadian media. Isn't it? Quote
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