Should Hamas support rallies in Canada be stopped?

[blackbird]

This article shows the bias of the BBC and CBC.

quote

‘Definitely a value judgment’

Re: CBC tells journalists to not call Hamas ‘terrorists’ in leaked memo — Oct. 11

Why do the CBC and the BBC pander to terrorists? Is it because of the “soft bigotry of low expectations,” that ingrained belief by the progressive left that one must not judge others too harshly, especially when they are not as intelligent, sophisticated and worldly wise as you?

Or is it because they sympathize with their cause and believe that one person’s terrorist is another’s freedom fighter, and thus there can be no such thing as a terrorist, because it is all so very subjective? Take for example the 9/11 attacks on the U.S. Could those acts not also have been deemed the actions of freedom fighters wronged by the evils of imperialist, colonial powers?

Or, lastly, perhaps they are just acts of evil by racists or antisemites or bigots or barbarians? Yet, with all these choices, the Beeb and the CBC choose the one least condemnatory of the perpetrators. Does that not tell us something? It is definitely a value judgment and one about which justice-seeking Brits and Canucks should be asking ourselves … why?   unquote

Letters: 'Why do the CBC and the BBC pander to terrorists?' (msn.com)

Is this really the kind of public broadcaster Canadians want?  Can they be trusted with anything they broadcast or report?  If they are this heavily biased, how can they be trusted with anything they broadcast?  Yet it is the taxpayers that pay billions of dollars for this public broadcasting service.  How is this educating (or brainwashing) Canadians, including the young people?  It will be setting the future course for Canadians in the world.  This is no small thing.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

So if a criminal is hiding in a crowded shopping center or taking hundreds hostage, it is by the same token all right for the law enforcement officers to burst into the center and start shooting with machine guns and grenades into crowded people either trapped by gunman or taken hostage killing several hundred women and children as well as the gunman?

A civillian criminal situation is different.  You surround the mall and deal with the single shooter.

A WAR is entirely a different thing. In war you must destroy the enemy.  And yes - if the enemy is hiding behind civillians then they die.

It has ALWAYS been that way. 

[eyeball]

19 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

A civillian criminal situation is different.  You surround the mall and deal with the single shooter.

A WAR is entirely a different thing. In war you must destroy the enemy.  And yes - if the enemy is hiding behind civillians then they die.

It has ALWAYS been that way. 

You just think it should be that way - it justifies your blaming the general population before punishing them collectively. Indiscriminate bombing in the hope Hamas will be the collateral damage appears to be Israel's strategy now.  

[CdnFox]

56 minutes ago, eyeball said:

You just think it should be that way

Well it has been for about 3000 years now - so i'm not alone.

Quote

- it justifies your blaming the general population before punishing them collectively.

You just think that way because it justifies your jew hatred.

Quote

Indiscriminate bombing in the hope Hamas will be the collateral damage appears to be Israel's strategy now.  

And yet again -  you can't make your point without lying. The bombing is far from indescriminate.  Every location is believed to be a military target. 

And meanwhile - Gaza is still launching missiles at isreal ever single day.  Which actually IS indiscriminate bombing given their accuracy.  Yet - not  a word from you about that.

So lets recap

You:  Targeted military strikes at targets that were deliberately placed among the civilians = 'Indescriminate" and very very bad.

Also you:  Randomly firing rockets at civilian population centers hoping to kill people = perfectly fine, no cause for concern.

 

You are a colossal hypocrite and dishonest.  The civvie casualty rate would be about 50 times higher if it was indiscriminate or civillian targets. But hamas put its' weapon and military systems where it would cause the most casualties if attacked.  And you've got not a single word against hamas who started the war killing civvies deliberately and is STILL trying to do so every day.

[eyeball]

53 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

You just think that way because it justifies your jew hatred.

Fu ck off. Jews are victims of this too.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Nothing useful comes out of threads like these. 

Edited October 29, 2023 by SpankyMcFarland

[Army Guy]

7 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

So if a criminal is hiding in a crowded shopping center or taking hundreds hostage, it is by the same token all right for the law enforcement officers to burst into the center and start shooting with machine guns and grenades into crowded people either trapped by gunman or taken hostage killing several hundred women and children as well as the gunman?

Police and military operate in very different ways....to kill one man the answer would be no it would not be worth the damage it would cause to civilians, not saying it would not happen, if the target was say Hitler, Stalin, Bin Laden, or other high value target  then i would say yes it would be worth the risk...It happens all the time...

 

[eyeball]

2 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Nothing useful comes out of threads like these. 

Perhaps. There must be thousands of forums around the world where you'll find the same sorts of thread.

Each skirmish presents a teachable moment to the world. There are references to colonialism and a connection with other recent social justice movements that have clarified the public's awareness of this perennial conflicts root causes and possible solutions. Its what woke is.

If I was on a team of Palestinian and Israeli  moderates trying to generate a consensus the people could get behind, it's how much the actions of institutions belonging to the Big Powers have played into everyone's misfortune. I'm not talking about ancient history here but living memory.

My hope is that sooner or later an attempt at an international acknowledgement and reconciliation of the dysfunctional circumstances and festering animosities stemming from the not so distant past might emerge. We have, once again, the biggest perennial example of festering geopolitical dysfunction on the planet bar none to understand why and hopefully learn from.

Edited October 30, 2023 by eyeball

[CdnFox]

3 hours ago, eyeball said:

Fu ck off. Jews are victims of this too.

They are the only victims and i notice you seem just fine with their civillians being targeted every day. Not by accident but as the primary target.

[CdnFox]

4 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Each skirmish presents a teachable moment to the world.

Well the gaza people are certainly getting schooled at the moment

And the rest of the world is learning that when you wantonly kill other people's civillians without provocation that it can blow up in your face really quick.  The ground war has started and i notice that despite their bluster hezbolla and others are cowering back and not getting involved.

IF the isrealis are thorough in their 'education' this time, perhaps there won't need to be a next time.  It's too bad they were more lenient the last few times.

[Army Guy]

7 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

So based on your post both sides terrorized each other. That is what I have been saying all along that both Hamas and state of Israel are guilty for killing women and children but a few people attacked me saying that what I should say is that killing Palestinian women and children is self defense by Israel but killing Israeli civilians only was murder. Both sides are evil. This is what I say and most of the world agrees. Look at the scale of recent demonstrations against Israel's actions in Gaza. The entire downtowns of Capital cities were full of protesting people, People cannot sit idle when so many defenseless women and children are being murdered by one side. THIS IS GENOCIDE.

Did you read the source i gave you...do you understand why in the beginnings of Israel terrorism was used mostly against British targets which later turned to Palestinians becasue they and the rest of the Arab coalition blockaded the Jewish cities to starve them out...Israel stopped terrorist attacks as a mode of operation becasue they had to get organized to fight, well equipped armies...to do that you need another army...

Since then Israel has been fighting for their basic right to exist...which has forced them to develop their military into the machine it is today.. if their was no threats there would be no need to have such an army...

Every target Israel strikes has been identified as a military target...civilians are collateral damage, which is legal in mordern warfare...many other measures have been taken to reduce civilian deaths... on the terrorist side they went looking for civilians not military targets but the soft targets like women and children, and murdered them...these acts are against inter national law and the conventions... if they were not Israel would right now be killing anything with a heart beat...and it is not....

The people in these demonstrations don't have a clue what they are protesting about. Palestinians are masters at creating their own narrative, twisting it to suit them, the Hospital rocket attack was one of those examples...besides do you real think that any Muslim would need an excuse to protest anything Israel did or did not do...These are the same people that celebrated the killing of thousands of Israelis civilians...ya nice guys you stick up for...

Genocide....this is not genocide...what the turkey done to the kurds and is still doing is genocide, what Somalia war lords did to their people was genocide, unfortunately there are hundreds of examples of genocide in our history, and this is not one of them...

People pick and choose what they want to be anger with, do you hear any media cover over what turkey is doing to the Kurds, what do you think they are doing in Syria, fighting ISIS....Even the Canadian government who was training the Kurds, to fight ISIS, stopped becasue of what turkey was about to do, and they just left them hanging in the wind to be slaughtered by Turkish military...there are dozens of examples of genocide going on around the world in the last 5 years, and we just shrugged our shoulders...but when Israel is mentioned people lose their minds...

You'll have to start doing some more research to get the full story, I've tried but i am not getting any where, you and many others have already made up your minds on this topic...that and a 5 bucks will get you a coffee at star bucks...the truth is always some where in the middle ground, read both sides of the story. 

Nothing you or i think, will change the fact that Israel is not going to stop until they have destroyed Hamas... I wish you luck on your research...

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, Army Guy said:

Nothing you or i think, will change the fact that Israel is not going to stop until they have destroyed Hamas... I wish you luck on your research...

And hopefully crippled any chance of future terror groups operating out of the region. With luck the war will leave such a lasting impact on the population that never again will they ever allow terrorist to become gov't and lead them down this path. 

Assuming isreal doesn't just keep the place once they've taken it, which would probably be the smart move.

[eyeball]

39 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

They are the only victims and i notice you seem just fine with their civillians being targeted every day. Not by accident but as the primary target.

What you noticed was your hallucination.

[eyeball]

41 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Well the gaza people are certainly getting schooled at the moment

Look who's fine with civilians being killed now.?

[CdnFox]

26 minutes ago, eyeball said:

What you noticed was your hallucination.

Oh - you mean that gaza isn't shooting rockets at isreali targets right now?

https://www.westernjournal.com/just-10-days-hamas-fired-monstrous-amount-missiles-israel/

As usual you were wrong. They're still launching them even today, and have been by the thousand.

You know nothing of this conflict - you havent' got a clue. You're as dumb as the people who are managing to get themelves bombed back to the stone age because they supported hamas.

[CdnFox]

24 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Look who's fine with civilians being killed now.?

I was "fine" with it all along if it's necessary to strike military targets and there's no other way. I've been pretty clear about that.  Get between israel and hamas and you're going to get killed, there's no other way. If you can avoid it great but if you can't, you have to do what you have to do in order to defend your people.

What i'm not fine with is deliberately targeting civvies for the sake of it. Which is what hamas does.

It's pretty telling that you can't see the problem with targeting civvies deliberately.

[CITIZEN_2015]

@Army Guy I will do the research you suggested another time when I have more time but before I have this question for you:

If after the second world war the Jews from Europe had come to Canada instead of Palestine and had taken over Canada and declared a Jewish state, would you have accepted that or would you have fought back?

Edited October 30, 2023 by CITIZEN_2015

[CdnFox]

38 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

@Army Guy I will do the research you suggested another time when I have more time but before I have this question for you:

If after the second world war the Jews from Europe had come to Canada instead of Palestine and had taken over Canada and declared a Jewish state, would you have accepted that or would you have fought back?

Ask the first nations.

[Brigitte]

 First, Canada does  have limitations on peaceful protests. Protesters can't block streets nor prevent people from going into a restaurants, nor harass specific people on order to prevent them doing things we all do in our daily lives , eg taking children to school.  However,  while these events being protested are about an external issue, I envision  how it can become an internal issue, one  that challenges how we in Canada deal with dissent. That is, what we are witnessing is protestors,  who live in Canada , celebrating and supporting what is considered IN OUR COUNTRY to be   terrorist's acts.  So, terrorism is justified. I ask- would that justify terrorism in Canada, if they felt it justifiable? 

[Army Guy]

16 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

@Army Guy I will do the research you suggested another time when I have more time but before I have this question for you:

If after the second world war the Jews from Europe had come to Canada instead of Palestine and had taken over Canada and declared a Jewish state, would you have accepted that or would you have fought back?

you act like it was Jews that just planted their flag in the desert and claimed it was theirs.... The Jewish state was the making of the UN, with the British running things on the ground... the entire project created many nations including Israel all had inter national approval...

Where were the Jews going to go, they were refused entry to most countries, including Canada, the UN, was dividing up land through out the middle east,  it created many countries out of nothing, nobody has any problem with these states just Israel...why is that...The land originally allotted to Israel was Jordan, but Arabs refused, the Jews were allotted the smallest piece that was left. the Arabs at the time did not even give Palestinians a second thought here, and just threw them in with the Israelis, neither did the UN, had they solved the problem back then this would not be happening...everyone just assumes Israel is to blame here for everything...  

[Army Guy]

23 hours ago, eyeball said:

You just think it should be that way - it justifies your blaming the general population before punishing them collectively. Indiscriminate bombing in the hope Hamas will be the collateral damage appears to be Israel's strategy now.  

Do you have a source for that, or your assuming that this is fact...like many facts surround this conflict based on someone's arse.

[Army Guy]

17 hours ago, eyeball said:

Look who's fine with civilians being killed now.?

Nobody is fine with the killing of civilians, but in case of war it is a reality, civilians pay the highest price in ALL conflicts not just this one...It is even written into inter national law and the conventions, that all measures must be taken to limit the amount of collateral damage the civilian population takes, you don't know what measure were taken, your assuming they are just killing as many as possible.. 

[eyeball]

6 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

Do you have a source for that, or your assuming that this is fact...like many facts surround this conflict based on someone's arse.

October 20, 2023

Damning evidence of war crimes as Israeli attacks wipe out entire families in Gaza

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/10/damning-evidence-of-war-crimes-as-israeli-attacks-wipe-out-entire-families-in-gaza/

I'll take the word of aid groups on the ground before listening to the arseholes that are hidden underground or flying overhead.

 

3 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

Nobody is fine with the killing of civilians, but in case of war it is a reality,

Then war is a crime. That politicians commit.

[Army Guy]

5 minutes ago, eyeball said:

October 20, 2023

Damning evidence of war crimes as Israeli attacks wipe out entire families in Gaza

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/10/damning-evidence-of-war-crimes-as-israeli-attacks-wipe-out-entire-families-in-gaza/

I'll take the word of aid groups on the ground before listening to the arseholes that are hidden underground or flying overhead.

 

Then war is a crime. That politicians commit.

Unfortunately Amnesty inter national does not bring war crime charges, any one in the media can scream these are war crimes...they have no professional training in what composes war crimes they can assume like you and me, the real question you should ask is,  are those that can bring charges are they listening , investigating, right now there is nothing being heard or done with that information...

Amnesty inter national is just one voice in the wind that counts no more than yours.

War should be a crime, but whom is going to police the world? man was built everything around violence, it's in our laws , it is how we settle disputes, it is how we spend most of our time, and money... 

[WestCanMan]

23 hours ago, CdnFox said:

And meanwhile - Gaza is still launching missiles at isreal ever single day.  Which actually IS indiscriminate bombing given their accuracy.  Yet - not  a word from you about that.

One of the reasons Israel has to end this Gaza threat is because it's actually extremely draining economically.

It costs way more money to make missiles that are capable of shooting down other missiles than it does to make rockets that just "blow up somewhere in a city". 

Gaza can just keep draining Israel economically by continuing these strikes, Israel can't just keep shooting down rockets forever. Eventually you have to put an end to that threat.