What “The Enemy” Is Actually Saying

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

3 hours ago, Rebound said:

You’re the one who wants to live under a dictator instead of an elected leader, who accepts new elections.
Putin has held onto power in Russia for 24 years. No election can remove him from power.

Trudeau is intent on destabilizing families and individuals and empowering the state as much as possible. If our parliamentary institutions are checks on power, then presumably Putin wouldn’t be able to be a dictator. My point is that Trudeau is a wannabe dictator pushing immorality and cultural suicide. He is weakening Canada to the point of servitude to China and unaccountable international interests. Anyone who opposes his ESG/SDG state-government stakeholder capitalism is labeled racist, alt-right, etc., including families who oppose gender ideology, vaccine mandates, etc. He made being pro choice a condition for getting a government job.

If we’re in a spiritual battle, which is becoming increasingly clear, Trudeau is a bad guy and especially dangerous because he has the smile and charm to make people think he’s a force for good. Putin has done bad things and I wouldn’t want him as leader, but on the cultural and spiritual front, he has the courage to tell it like it is. Western civilization is under threat from radical left ideologues. Ukraine is the victim of a proxy war fueled by the Biden administration and staunch allies like Trudeau and Freeland. Russia feels cheated and threatened on its doorstep by Western interference and NATO. You may not like how they’ve handled it, but the US would do the same thing.

Rebound · June 15, 2023

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Trudeau is intent on destabilizing families and individuals and empowering the state as much as possible. If our parliamentary institutions are checks on power, then presumably Putin wouldn’t be able to be a dictator. My point is that Trudeau is a wannabe dictator pushing immorality and cultural suicide. He is weakening Canada to the point of servitude to China and unaccountable international interests. Anyone who opposes his ESG/SDG state-government stakeholder capitalism is labeled racist, alt-right, etc., including families who oppose gender ideology, vaccine mandates, etc. He made being pro choice a condition for getting a government job.

If we’re in a spiritual battle, which is becoming increasingly clear, Trudeau is a bad guy and especially dangerous because he has the smile and charm to make people think he’s a force for good. Putin has done bad things and I wouldn’t want him as leader, but on the cultural and spiritual front, he has the courage to tell it like it is. Western civilization is under threat from radical left ideologues. Ukraine is the victim of a proxy war fueled by the Biden administration and staunch allies like Trudeau and Freeland. Russia feels cheated and threatened on its doorstep by Western interference and NATO. You may not like how they’ve handled it, but the US would do the same thing.

No, you are confused.

The issue is that you disagree with Trudeau's policies, and you think you agree with Putin's. But if Trudeau's party loses its next election, he is no longer Prime Minister. Putin, on the other hand, arrests journalists who publish articles which criticize him. He arrests civilians who disagree with the Ukraine War. Were he to lead Canada, Putin would instantly seize power and keep it. He would immediately replace every Army General with people loyal to him. He would hire only ministers strictly loyal to him. All election officials would be replaced with people loyal to Putin. And so forth, and as a result, elections could be held but Putin could not fail, and if he lost, he would discard the results and hold new elections. Oh, and all of the petroleum companies would transfer ownership to Putin or his close friends.

You get to complain all you want about Trudeau. You would not have such luxury under Putin's rule.

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

36 minutes ago, Rebound said:

No, you are confused.

The issue is that you disagree with Trudeau's policies, and you think you agree with Putin's. But if Trudeau's party loses its next election, he is no longer Prime Minister. Putin, on the other hand, arrests journalists who publish articles which criticize him. He arrests civilians who disagree with the Ukraine War. Were he to lead Canada, Putin would instantly seize power and keep it. He would immediately replace every Army General with people loyal to him. He would hire only ministers strictly loyal to him. All election officials would be replaced with people loyal to Putin. And so forth, and as a result, elections could be held but Putin could not fail, and if he lost, he would discard the results and hold new elections. Oh, and all of the petroleum companies would transfer ownership to Putin or his close friends.

You get to complain all you want about Trudeau. You would not have such luxury under Putin's rule.

I’m not sure which is a bigger problem anymore, Permanent Ottawa/Washington or Putin. We’ll see. I agree that in theory we’re a democracy that can turf the likes of Trudeau, but in reality our Canadian bureaucracy, courts, and media are infused by the Liberal Party of Canada. This party’s current agenda is rewriting history and violating taboos with the fervour of Mao’s Cultural Revolution. Canada has become a place where people are afraid to say what they think publicly for fear of cancellation, and their beliefs are constantly disregarded. This is what I mean by spiritual battle. I don’t know if future elections will change this new fundamentalism. In Canada there’s barely an opposition except in name, and they are characterized in media as “alt-right” even though their policies reflect mostly the same radical left woke rhetoric. I don’t know why this is happening in the West. Putin is describing this situation publicly and his communications don’t reach us here. They’re dismissed as disinformation.

Of course Ukraine deserves self-determination and the killing must stop, but both NATO and Russia are fueling the catastrophe, which must be solved politically.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Zeitgeist

Deluge · June 15, 2023

16 hours ago, NYLefty said:

Fascist murderer your hero, Eh?? Move to mother Russia and enjoy living with your comrades

Putin is a commie Nazi murderer hero of your cult. Move to Russia.

Russia IS improving despite there still being a communist strain in that country, but is that enough? Perhaps you shouldn't move there after all; perhaps China is a better fit for you, as there is a strong communistic & oppressive presence over there. Yes, being that you are a complete government slut, you'll fit right in over there.

I say pack your shit and gtfo. Your new home is waiting for you.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Deluge

WestCanMan · June 15, 2023

18 hours ago, NYLefty said:

Fascist murderer your hero, Eh?? Move to mother Russia and enjoy living with your comrades

Putin is a commie Nazi murderer hero of your cult. Move to Russia.

Commies and Nazis hate each other for the same reason that Dems and islamic state hate each other. They're just too similar.

impartialobserver · June 15, 2023

All I have to say about Russia is that if it is such a great place.. why is it seeing a population decline? Not just Covid either. Their decline started in the early 90's. Some parts in the eastern part of Russia are essentially ghost towns with deaths exceeding births in these places at a rate of 3 to 1.

Rebound · June 15, 2023

3 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Ukraine deserves self-determination and the killing must stop, but both NATO and Russia are fueling the catastrophe, which must be solved politically.

Dude, you need to stop smoking so much weed. You sound like John Lennon or the Maharishi.

For starters, war is a political act. The outcome of war is a new political outcome. Vladimir Putin wants to occupy ALL of Ukraine. That is his political goal. The Ukrainian people oppose this. They do not want to be a Russian puppet state.

I don't get you. Does Putin pay you to say this stuff? Cause he invaded Ukraine. The Ukraine didn't invade Russia. They did not threaten Russia. Putin invaded them. He seized the Crimea and once he decided he wanted to take more, he sent in his tanks. That is what happened. There's no border dispute; the borders were agreed upon before Putin was in power.

In Canada, you get to vote. The other people in your country disagree with your opinion on ideal political policies. You're still allowed to say that you disagree. In Putin's Russia, you are not allowed to say that you disagree. You get thrown into prison for doing so.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Rebound

robosmith · June 15, 2023

5 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Trudeau is intent on destabilizing families and individuals and empowering the state as much as possible. If our parliamentary institutions are checks on power, then presumably Putin wouldn’t be able to be a dictator. My point is that Trudeau is a wannabe dictator pushing immorality and cultural suicide. He is weakening Canada to the point of servitude to China and unaccountable international interests. Anyone who opposes his ESG/SDG state-government stakeholder capitalism is labeled racist, alt-right, etc., including families who oppose gender ideology, vaccine mandates, etc. He made being pro choice a condition for getting a government job.

If we’re in a spiritual battle, which is becoming increasingly clear, Trudeau is a bad guy and especially dangerous because he has the smile and charm to make people think he’s a force for good. Putin has done bad things and I wouldn’t want him as leader, but on the cultural and spiritual front, he has the courage to tell it like it is. Western civilization is under threat from radical left ideologues. Ukraine is the victim of a proxy war fueled by the Biden administration and staunch allies like Trudeau and Freeland. Russia feels cheated and threatened on its doorstep by Western interference and NATO. You may not like how they’ve handled it, but the US would do the same thing.

You are imagining things ^here. The WAR in Ukraine is SOLELY DUE to Putin's decision TO INVADE.

Probably to STEAL the huge gas reserves off the Southern coast of Ukraine and cement his near monopoly as an energy supplier to Europe. ?

You ALSO make a lot of unsubstantiated allegations about Trudeau which are clearly OFFTOPIC in a forum about US Politics. How do YOU KNOW Trudeau's "intent"?

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

14 minutes ago, Rebound said:

Dude, you need to stop smoking so much weed. You sound like John Lennon or the Maharishi.

For starters, war is a political act. The outcome of war is a new political outcome. Vladimir Putin wants to occupy ALL of Ukraine. That is his political goal. The Ukrainian people oppose this. They do not want to be a Russian puppet state.

I don't get you. Does Putin pay you to say this stuff? Cause he invaded Ukraine. The Ukraine didn't invade Russia. They did not threaten Russia. Putin invaded them. He seized the Crimea and once he decided he wanted to take more, he sent in his tanks. That is what happened. There's no border dispute; the borders were agreed upon before Putin was in power.

I can tell from your comments that you don’t know the complex history and demographics of the region. Crimea had been part of Russia before the Soviet Union and its major Black Sea fleet base is there. Donbas used to be called NovoRossiya in the time of Catherine the Great. It’s largely Russian speaking and aligned with Russia. The Ukrainian government has been manipulated by both Russia and the West. The current government locked up the opposition leader. There’s been oppression of minority groups and non-Ukrainian 1st language speakers. The main military brigade is neo-Nazi (Azov). There’s rampant organized crime. There West is feeding the population with weapons that are prolonging a war that won’t solve the crisis. Russia won’t back down. This is resulting in thousands of deaths. The corporate capitalization on this is a clear example of disaster capitalism a la Iraq.

You also need to understand that Russia had been assured that former Soviet republics wouldn’t join NATO after the collapse of the Soviet Union. Either that or Russia joins NATO, which was refused. Russia was cheated. I feel sorry for the Ukrainians who are pawns in this geopolitical battle, but the West played dirty early on and these are the fruits. I don’t like that Putin invaded, but he was trying to draw a line when it seemed that there was no other recourse. Only an honest political solution can fix this.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Zeitgeist

robosmith · June 15, 2023

3 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

I’m not sure which is a bigger problem anymore, Permanent Ottawa/Washington or Putin. We’ll see. I agree that in theory we’re a democracy that can turf the likes of Trudeau, but in reality our Canadian bureaucracy, courts, and media are infused by the Liberal Party of Canada. This party’s current agenda is rewriting history and violating taboos with the fervour of Mao’s Cultural Revolution. Canada has become a place where people are afraid to say what they think publicly for fear of cancellation, and their beliefs are constantly disregarded. This is what I mean by spiritual battle. I don’t know if future elections will change this new fundamentalism. In Canada there’s barely an opposition except in name, and they are characterized in media as “alt-right” even though their policies reflect mostly the same radical left woke rhetoric. I don’t know why this is happening in the West. Putin is describing this situation publicly and his communications don’t reach us here. They’re dismissed as disinformation.

Of course Ukraine deserves self-determination and the killing must stop, but both NATO and Russia are fueling the catastrophe, which must be solved politically.

You let us know when Trudeau starts KILLING journalists to maintain his power. Until then, we will assume there are free and FAIR elections in Canada, and opposition Parties still have a shot of being elected.

Of course if the conservatives there are as unpopular as they are here, that will take a long time and CHANGE.

3 hours ago, Deluge said:

Russia IS improving despite there still being a communist strain in that country, but is that enough? Perhaps you shouldn't move there after all; perhaps China is a better fit for you, as there is a strong communistic & oppressive presence over there. Yes, being that you are a complete government slut, you'll fit right in over there.

I say pack your shit and gtfo. Your new home is waiting for you.

"Improving" how? LMAO.

Do you have ANY IDEA how much Russian money Putin HAS STOLEN? He is worth at least $200B.

Deluge · June 15, 2023

5 minutes ago, robosmith said:

"Improving" how? LMAO.

Do you have ANY IDEA how much Russian money Putin HAS STOLEN? He is worth at least $200B.

Yes, improving. He's more or less killed the woke virus in his country, and that supersedes any petty gripe that you have.

robosmith · June 15, 2023

2 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I can tell from your comments that you don’t know the complex history and demographics of the region. Crimea had been part of Russia before the Soviet Union and its major Black Sea fleet base is there.

So what? Crimea was relinquished by Russia long ago AND they gave Ukraine a SECURITY GUARANTEE in the Budapest Memorandum in return for Ukraine giving up their nukes. Of course Putin reneged. ?

2 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Donbas used to be called NovoRossiya in the time of Catherine the Great.

^Ancient history. The USSR was dissolved.

2 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

It’s largely Russian speaking and aligned with Russia.

Sorry but that means NOTHING. Esp not that Russia can invaded and annex it.

2 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

The Ukrainian government has been manipulated by both Russia and the West.

Mostly Russia until very lately. Putin is just pissed that his corrupt puppet was dethroned after he took Putin's bribe to abandon HIS PROMISE to negotiate a trade deal with the West.

2 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

The current government locked up the opposition leader.

Says who? Yanukovych ran away to Moscow AFTER he was impeached by unanimous vote.

2 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

There’s been oppression of minority groups and non-Ukrainian 1st language speakers. The main military brigade is neo-Nazi (Azov). There’s rampant organized crime. There West is feeding the population with weapons that are prolonging a war that won’t solve the crisis. Russia won’t back down. This is resulting in thousands of deaths. The corporate capitalization on this is a clear example of disaster capitalism a la Iraq.

The only alternative Ukrainians have to war is surrender to Putin's jack boots.

Just now, Deluge said:

Yes, improving. He's more or less killed the woke virus in his country, and that supersedes any petty gripe that you have.

So according to ONLY YOU. LMAO

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

8 minutes ago, robosmith said:

You let us know when Trudeau starts KILLING journalists to maintain his power. Until then, we will assume there are free and FAIR elections in Canada, and opposition Parties still have a shot of being elected.

Of course if the conservatives there are as unpopular as they are here, that will take a long time and CHANGE.

"Improving" how? LMAO.

Do you have ANY IDEA how much Russian money Putin HAS STOLEN? He is worth at least $200B.

Yes Russia is somewhat of an oligarchy and kleptocracy. Its democracy is very weak. At least we know this. We have illusions about the extent of our own democracy. That’s why we’re lost. There’s no honest and fair account of what’s happening.

robosmith · June 15, 2023

1 minute ago, Zeitgeist said:

Yes Russia is somewhat of an oligarchy and kleptocracy. Its democracy is very weak. At least we know this. We have illusions about the extent of our own democracy. That’s why we’re lost. There’s no honest and fair account of what’s happening.

Until you PROVE voter fraud, ALL YOU HAVE is the certified vote count and a whole lot of WHINING.

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

2 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Until you PROVE voter fraud, ALL YOU HAVE is the certified vote count and a whole lot of WHINING.

No it’s not about that. It’s on the level of ideological indoctrination. There’s one acceptable way now to see the world, and that worldview is tearing us apart. I won’t elaborate beyond the posts that already explain this.

Rebound · June 15, 2023

49 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Yes Russia is somewhat of an oligarchy and kleptocracy. Its democracy is very weak. At least we know this. We have illusions about the extent of our own democracy. That’s why we’re lost. There’s no honest and fair account of what’s happening.

Nonsense.
Russia has zero democracy. Putin has lead them for over 24 years. Biden will be President until January 20 of 2025 or January 20, 2029, and that’s it, for certain. Not one day longer.

Our system may be imperfect, but we know that Biden won’t be in President beyond Jan 20, 2029, for certain.

robosmith · June 15, 2023

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

No it’s not about that. It’s on the level of ideological indoctrination. There’s one acceptable way now to see the world, and that worldview is tearing us apart. I won’t elaborate beyond the posts that already explain this.

Sorry, but you're not making sense. More than ONE worldview does exist and if THEY did NOT, THEY would NOT be "tearing us apart."

Are you trying to say that DOGMATIC BELIEF in ONE worldview by MANY PEOPLE is tearing us apart?

That is ONLY true for BELIEVERS with NO EVIDENCE. AKA, the MAGA CULT.

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

2 hours ago, robosmith said:

Sorry, but you're not making sense. More than ONE worldview does exist and if THEY did NOT, THEY would NOT be "tearing us apart."

Are you trying to say that DOGMATIC BELIEF in ONE worldview by MANY PEOPLE is tearing us apart?

That is ONLY true for BELIEVERS with NO EVIDENCE. AKA, the MAGA CULT.

Ha, the left are now the totalitarians.

robosmith · June 15, 2023

Just now, Zeitgeist said:

Ha, the left are now the totalitarians.

Based on what? Only the Republicans tried to overturn the 2020 election and are engaging in voter suppression on a massive scale for 2024.

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

37 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Based on what? Only the Republicans tried to overturn the 2020 election and are engaging in voter suppression on a massive scale for 2024.

What? The Dems are re-districting along racial lines. Anyway I wasn’t a Trump supporter and I believed the election results. I’m concerned about where we find ourselves now. The funding of endless war and EDI insanity are our biggest problems now, because they destroy merit and free speech, and the military industrial complex is sucking billions away from people who could really use it, both taxpayers and the poor.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Zeitgeist

WestCanMan · June 15, 2023

5 hours ago, Rebound said:

The Ukraine didn't invade Russia. They did not threaten Russia.

Ukraine absolutely threatened Russia.

If Canada wanted to sign a military alliance with NoKo, Russia, China and Iran that had an Article 5 in it we would cease to exist as a nation very quickly. It would take 1 day for US troops to seize Ottawa and don't think for a second that they wouldn't do it. Your cute, cuddly serial-loser of a POTUS would grow teeth in a heartbeat.

WestCanMan · June 15, 2023

3 hours ago, Rebound said:

Nonsense.
Russia has zero democracy. Putin has lead them for over 24 years. Biden will be President until January 20 of 2025 or January 20, 2029, and that’s it, for certain. Not one day longer.

I heard that Biden is planning to refuse to leave the WH in 2029.

robosmith · June 15, 2023

45 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

What? The Dems are re-districting along racial lines.

Who told you that? Only Republicans are redistricting along racial lines to minimize the Democratic vote because blacks vote Democratic.

45 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Anyway I wasn’t a Trump supporter and I believed the election results. I’m concerned about where we find ourselves now. The funding of endless war and EDI insanity are our biggest problems now,

What "endless war"? Ukraine is less than 2 years old.

45 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

because they destroy merit and free speech, and the military industrial complex is sucking billions away from people who could really use it, both taxpayers and the poor.

Most military expenditures go directly to US workers who have enough merit to produce sophisticated machinery.

Who SHOULD be subsidized in your view?

robosmith · June 15, 2023

36 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Ukraine absolutely threatened Russia.

If Canada wanted to sign a military alliance with NoKo, Russia, China and Iran that had an Article 5 in it we would cease to exist as a nation very quickly. It would take 1 day for US troops to seize Ottawa and don't think for a second that they wouldn't do it. Your cute, cuddly serial-loser of a POTUS would grow teeth in a heartbeat.

You are delusional. No one in the US wants to invade Canada.

And Ukraine's government ONLY wanted to sign a trade agreement with the West.

Military alliance was ONLY necessary to protect from Russian aggression, which Putin mounted cause he could NOT compete with the West economically.

Zeitgeist · June 15, 2023

14 minutes ago, robosmith said:

You are delusional. No one in the US wants to invade Canada.

And Ukraine's government ONLY wanted to sign a trade agreement with the West.

Military alliance was ONLY necessary to protect from Russian aggression, which Putin mounted cause he could NOT compete with the West economically.

You ignore history.