reason10 Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 The term Native American is a LIE in so many ways. Let's run down the list. 1. When the tribes first arrived at this hunk of rock on the opposite side of the civilized world, Amerigo Vespucci had not been born. So there was NO America. So there can't be a Native American. 2. The Columbus lie (about his thinking the people he saw in the Caribbean were Indians since he was sailing to India) is a stupid lie. Back then, there was no India. It was Hindustan. 3. The word INDIAN comes from Columbus's lack of Spanish language expertise. https://massinitiative.org/why-did-columbus-refer-to-the-natives-he-encountered-as-los-indios/ Quote Abbey writes that “Columbus knew he was nowhere near India” and that he was so charmed by the people he found in the Caribbean–so sweet, happy, blessed –he called them Los Gentes en (or in ) Dios , meaning “the people in God.” This is what Columbus wrote to Ferdinand and Isabella, Abbey reports, and the name Indios … 4. Why is it called Bureau of Indian Affairs? Why isn't it called Bureau of Native American affairs? https://www.bia.gov/bia 5. If you really want to point to ignorance and racism, perhaps you should start with the Federal Government. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/01/29/2021-01606/indian-entities-recognized-by-and-eligible-to-receive-services-from-the-united-states-bureau-of There are 574 American Indian tribes. Whether they are called Indian (which is correct) or Native American (which is a lie) why are they ALL lumped in one entity? They are from different parts of the country. They have different customs. They don't even speak the same language. What about THESE Indians? They speak Spanish. They're from South America. How do they AT ALL resemble Indians in the United States? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 Why does any of this matter? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, reason10 said: The term Native American is a LIE in so many ways. Let's run down the list. 1. When the tribes first arrived at this hunk of rock on the opposite side of the civilized world, Amerigo Vespucci had not been born. So there was NO America. So there can't be a Native American. 2. The Columbus lie (about his thinking the people he saw in the Caribbean were Indians since he was sailing to India) is a stupid lie. Back then, there was no India. It was Hindustan. 3. The word INDIAN comes from Columbus's lack of Spanish language expertise. https://massinitiative.org/why-did-columbus-refer-to-the-natives-he-encountered-as-los-indios/ 4. Why is it called Bureau of Indian Affairs? Why isn't it called Bureau of Native American affairs? https://www.bia.gov/bia 5. If you really want to point to ignorance and racism, perhaps you should start with the Federal Government. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/01/29/2021-01606/indian-entities-recognized-by-and-eligible-to-receive-services-from-the-united-states-bureau-of There are 574 American Indian tribes. Whether they are called Indian (which is correct) or Native American (which is a lie) why are they ALL lumped in one entity? They are from different parts of the country. They have different customs. They don't even speak the same language. What about THESE Indians? They speak Spanish. They're from South America. How do they AT ALL resemble Indians in the United States? What rot. They were named Indians because Columbus was looking for a quicker route to Asia and didn't know there was another continent in the way. How does a bunch of Europeans naming a continent after a Spaniard have anything to do with the people who were already living there? The Indies were a region, not a country which among others included modern India, Pakistan and Indonesia (Dutch East Indies) Europeans have a bunch of different cultures and languages. What's your point? Edited November 30, 2022 by Aristides Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeBeard Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 The people who named them “Indians” thought they made it to the Indian Ocean. They should be called whatever they wish to be called. Why is it up to you? 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 Another insane thread. Calling them Native Americans has nothing to do with the timing of the arrival of Amerigo Vespucci. They are called so because we renamed the land America and because we are a thoroughly ethnocentric society we renamed the peoples of that place accordingly. Exactly as we would call beings from Mars "martians" even though those beings would have no relationship to the name or notion what Mars is. That's what ethnocentricity is--we view all the world from our own perspective with little regard for the perspectives of other cultures. Abandoning the term Native American is totally reasonable, but thinking that Indian is somehow more correct is lunacy. It's not better. It's worse. It too is a name imposed upon them by ethnocentric outsiders with zero concern for their perspective--and compounded by the fact that there are actual Indians on the Indian subcontinent who seem to have embraced that designation. We could correctly call the people who were here before us indigenous people or some variation. Canada has a very considerate and respectful designation (IMO) with First Nations. Or we could get totally wild and ask the collective peoples what they prefer instead of imposing, once again, some purely external name. I mean, after a conquest of land, a raft of broken promises and a little light genocide, we could probably afford to be a bit more considerate going forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeBeard Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 7 hours ago, reason10 said: So there was NO America. So there can't be a Native American. By that logic, this means that since there was no America when the first white settlers came to what is now America, their descendants can’t be called Americans either. The logic there is….. questionable, to say the least. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 1 hour ago, TreeBeard said: By that logic, this means that since there was no America when the first white settlers came to what is now America, their descendants can’t be called Americans either. The logic there is….. questionable, to say the least. NOT just questionable, but lacking, as usual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbie Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 So to abide by the resident fool's terms we should refer to them as Turtle Islanders, I suppose. Columbus used "Indians" as that was what he was commissioned to discover - a route to India. In a 500+ year old example of "covering one's ass" he made sure he could continue milking his employers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbie Posted November 30, 2022 Report Share Posted November 30, 2022 another banned word, eh? Can't write resident idjut in proper English Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 10 hours ago, Aristides said: What rot. They were named Indians because Columbus was looking for a quicker route to Asia and didn't know there was another continent in the way. How does a bunch of Europeans naming a continent after a Spaniard have anything to do with the people who were already living there? The Indies were a region, not a country which among others included modern India, Pakistan and Indonesia (Dutch East Indies) Europeans have a bunch of different cultures and languages. What's your point? Nope. Get someone with an education to read the first post and explain it to you. The Spanish phrase is In Dios, which is the origin of the Indian name. Had nothing to do with Indies on the other side of the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 10 hours ago, TreeBeard said: The people who named them “Indians” thought they made it to the Indian Ocean. They should be called whatever they wish to be called. Why is it up to you? That is a lie. Get someone with an education to read the first post to you. The phrase is the badly spoken Spanish In Dios, which is where the term INDIANS comes from. The American government STILL has an Indian Affairs Bureau, not a Native American Bureau. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 7 hours ago, TreeBeard said: By that logic, this means that since there was no America when the first white settlers came to what is now America, their descendants can’t be called Americans either. The logic there is….. questionable, to say the least. LIke I've said many times, there are Floridian third graders smarter than you. The white settlers NAMED this country. The white settlers FOUGHT A GODDAM REVOLUTIONARY WAR to name and create the United States of America. Indians were here before there was an America. So there's NOTHING "Native' American about them. They are American Indians. North American Indians, to be exact. That's what they call themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 5 hours ago, robosmith said: NOT just questionable, but lacking, as usual. You children do not understand logic. You have never originated a single logical post here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted December 1, 2022 Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 7 minutes ago, reason10 said: Nope. Get someone with an education to read the first post and explain it to you. The Spanish phrase is In Dios, which is the origin of the Indian name. Had nothing to do with Indies on the other side of the world. A: Indigenous people were not Christian B: They didn't speak Spanish. ? If I call you mo-ron, that doesn't make it your name, even if it is accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted December 1, 2022 Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 2 hours ago, reason10 said: LIke I've said many times, there are Floridian third graders smarter than you. The white settlers NAMED this country. The white settlers FOUGHT A GODDAM REVOLUTIONARY WAR to name and create the United States of America. Indians were here before there was an America. So there's NOTHING "Native' American about them. They are American Indians. North American Indians, to be exact. That's what they call themselves. Why does this matter at all? And what makes you think they give a damn about what you think they should be called? Are you going to decide what Catholics and Jews should be called? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 6 hours ago, Rebound said: Why does this matter at all? And what makes you think they give a damn about what you think they should be called? Are you going to decide what Catholics and Jews should be called? Are you equating Indians with religions? Seriously? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted December 1, 2022 Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 3 hours ago, reason10 said: Are you equating Indians with religions? Seriously? You are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted December 1, 2022 Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 4 hours ago, reason10 said: Are you equating Indians with religions? Seriously? Just answer the question Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 5 hours ago, Aristides said: You are. No I'm not. I'm just pointing out the stupidity of woke goose steppers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 4 hours ago, Rebound said: Just answer the question Asked and answered. There is no such thing as a Native American. That is a bullschit left wing term that oozed into the national consciousness a few years ago and has ZERO basis in fact. They are called INDIANS. They call themselves INDIANS. History calls them INDIANS. The government agency that deals with them is the Bureau of INDIAN affairs. If you want to change the subject and drag RELIGION into this, you only look childish and stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted December 1, 2022 Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 4 minutes ago, reason10 said: No I'm not. I'm just pointing out the stupidity of woke goose steppers. Yes you are. En Dios is all about religion, a foreign religion in a foreign language. Want to find a goose stepper, just look in your mirror. You probably still call Inuit, Eskimos another name dreamed up by the white man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 2 minutes ago, Aristides said: Yes you are. En Dios is all about religion, a foreign religion in a foreign language. Want to find a goose stepper, just look in your mirror. You probably still call Inuit, Eskimos another name dreamed up by the white man. It is impossible for me to be a goose stepper. I'm a conservative Republican. And apparently I have a better grasp of history than you DemoNazis. You're constantly trying to change history to fit whatever RACIST narrative you want to spew on people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 On 11/30/2022 at 7:48 AM, Rebound said: Why does any of this matter? Maybe it shouldn't. But if you look at the responses in this thread, obviously it has gotten the attention of the amateur Gestapo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted December 1, 2022 Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, reason10 said: I'm a conservative Republican. That is an oxymoron. A Conservative is loyal to the Crown. A Republican is against the Crown. The tens of thousands of American Conservatives who fought for the King in the revolutionary war were called Tories. Tory is the name we call Conservatives. And the people who first settled in the western hemisphere are the First Nations, not "Indians." Edited December 1, 2022 by Queenmandy85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reason10 Posted December 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2022 41 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: That is an oxymoron. A Conservative is loyal to the Crown. A Republican is against the Crown. The tens of thousands of American Conservatives who fought for the King in the revolutionary war were called Tories. Tory is the name we call Conservatives. And the people who first settled in the western hemisphere are the First Nations, not "Indians." 41 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: That is an oxymoron. A Conservative is loyal to the Crown. A Republican is against the Crown. The tens of thousands of American Conservatives who fought for the King in the revolutionary war were called Tories. Tory is the name we call Conservatives. And the people who first settled in the western hemisphere are the First Nations, not "Indians." What you need to know is that in America the concept of "Conservative" and "Liberal" have undergone drastic changes in definition. It has been 200 years since the Tory. At one time, Liberal used to mean Laissez-Faire free market capitalism with very little government intervention. That changed in the Early Sixties during what was called the Port Huron Statement, which turned liberalism into radical socialism, anti Americanism, and neo Nazism. It took the philosophies and policies of William F. Buckley, Ronald Reagan and Rush Limbaugh to completely reinvent the term conservatism, which today means free market capitalism, the rule of law, liberty, secure borders and efficient low cost government, which most of America agrees with. I've heard the term "First Nations" before. Interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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