Canada at the start of Delta dominated fourth Covid wave, so get vaccinated to save lives.

[OftenWrong]

2 hours ago, Argus said:

So he was saying Swedish people have a herd immunity because so many have had covid.

Yes, it’s a different paradigm but not radical idea. Controlled exposure where safe to do so. And the evidence is what we heard recently, people who’ve had corvid have the highest immunity, and longer lasting.

This happens every year with the flu. It’s called letting it burn out. 

Protect/ vaccinate the vulnerable, NOT, everybody because it prolongs the exposure, which is also a bad thing.

 

[Infidel Dog]

Hey Argus, I've noticed you have a problem observing the obvious so I thought I'd help you out with something.

Have you really not noticed yet that your strawmen aren't doing too well at diverting from the point. Somehow we always seem to wind up back at that the original point. 

If I were you I'd adopt a different strategy. 

Edited September 8, 2021 by Infidel Dog

[Infidel Dog]

Me I'm tired of hammering you with the obvious so I'm ready to move on with some wild hypotheses. Just for fun.

Some anti-vax-mandate doctors think the vaccines encourage if not create the variants.

If you think that's out there though, there's this other theory that the protein spiking element of the mRNA "vaccine" will eventually cause antibodies to attack healthy cells. And if you think that's crazy I heard one doctor hypothesize that in 5 years 75% of the vaccinated will be dead. It's just worth a chuckle right now but then you can't help thinking - what if he's right? 

Edited September 8, 2021 by Infidel Dog

[Argus]

6 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

But let that play out for a minute.  If just about everyone else gets vaccinated and the vulnerable mask up, then those who flout all responsibility suffer the consequences, 

And if they'd just crawl off into the woods and die that would be fine, but they're not. They're cramming into the hospitals they were angrily protesting in front of.

[Argus]

4 hours ago, Infidel Dog said:

And Israel has had 1.1 million cases in a population of 9.1. The Swedish stat is also comparable to other European countries of a similar population. What's your point?

I would have thought that was obvious. But I keep forgetting just how low the IQ is of the anti vaxxer morons. My point is they don't have herd immunity, nowhere near it.

[Yzermandius19]

Most vaccinated country on the planet

Edited September 9, 2021 by Yzermandius19

[Yzermandius19]

there is no vaccinating our way out of covid

Israel knows

[Infidel Dog]

@ Argus:

And again you miss the obvious. It's almost like you're doing it on purpose.

That stat is for the length of the pandemic. It's what they call "Total Cases." Herd immunity isn't something you have at the beginning of a pandemic because you declare it. It's something you achieve over the length of time the virus is present in your region.

Seriously? You didn't know that? Or were you just bullshitting and hoping I didn't know that obvious fact?

Or were you thinking that when I posted that Graph of diminishing cases in Sweden against skyrocketing cases in Israel that I didn't understand the obvious possible implication.

If cases continue to stay low something impressive is happening in Sweden. Dare we name it, yes possibly...Herd Immunity.

[Infidel Dog]

Oh wait...raps himself on the head, because he did miss the obvious of what Argus is doing again or perhaps still.

It's another one of his goofy strawmen to divert from the point again.

Well duh...nice try Guy. Almost had me that time. I blame the fact that it's getting late.

Oh and BTW Liberty Daily was right and you were wrong. 

Edited September 9, 2021 by Infidel Dog

[Yzermandius19]

2 hours ago, Argus said:

And if they'd just crawl off into the woods and die that would be fine, but they're not. They're cramming into the hospitals

so are the vaccinated

should they crawl off into the woods and die as well?

Edited September 9, 2021 by Yzermandius19

[Infidel Dog]

Israeli doctor and Director of Herzog Hospital,  Kobi Haviv told Channel 13 News: “95% of seriously ill patients are vaccinated. Fully vaccinated people account for 85-90% of hospitalizations. We are opening more and more COVID branches. The effectiveness of vaccines is declining or disappearing.”

Would you like to see him say it? Go to Rumble video.

Israeli Doctor Kobi Haviv: 'Fully vaccinated account for 85-90% of hospitalizations'

 

 

[Yzermandius19]

5 hours ago, Infidel Dog said:

Israeli doctor and Director of Herzog Hospital,  Kobi Haviv told Channel 13 News: “95% of seriously ill patients are vaccinated. Fully vaccinated people account for 85-90% of hospitalizations. We are opening more and more COVID branches. The effectiveness of vaccines is declining or disappearing.”

Would you like to see him say it? Go to Rumble video.

Israeli Doctor Kobi Haviv: 'Fully vaccinated account for 85-90% of hospitalizations'

pay no attention to Israel

their data doesn't fit the covid doom narrative

that supports government mandated segregation of the vaccinated and unvaccinated

one must cheer the implementation of the new Jim Crow laws

or you obviously want to kill Grandma, you unfeeling monster!

Edited September 9, 2021 by Yzermandius19

[myata]

13 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

This happens every year with the flu. It’s called letting it burn out. 

Protect/ vaccinate the vulnerable, NOT, everybody because it prolongs the exposure, which is also a bad thing.

I worked in a part of Europe and have many contacts there, now this is based on the first hand information but not scientific of course, significance has not been verified etc yada. From my immediate circle I don't know anyone in Canada who had Covid (one suspected but never tested), but probably a dozen or so overall in Europe. Most describe the experience as "flu-like", though some said something was off but given the media one wouldn't know what to read from it. Some had it light, at home for couple or a few days. Two were severe cases, took several weeks to recover or hospital. Two more were in the family, parents of friends, 60+, some weeks at home. All have recovered.

I agree that the focus should be on the maximum protection of the vulnerable groups; excellent and readily available treatment, including early treatment like monoclonal (that has been approved as far as I know) as and when needed; smart and targeted suppression; and quality information. There's no point is rising the scare but no one can tell what effect a prolonged exposure of mass vaccinated population to the virus would be. All life is known to adapt to the environment and viral life is an expert at that. I would hate to predict a future where the race would be between the next variant and the next mandatory booster. Right out of post-apocalyptic fantasy.

[Yzermandius19]

I had covid back in March

was lethargic af and had body aches for three straight days

it was like the day after working out every muscle group in my body, for those three days

had some random temperature fluctuations where I would get cold for like an hour 

then it would go away

also had a sore throat for like a week

never lost my sense of smell

didn't get diarrhea

no long term side effects

was annoying but not a big deal

Edited September 9, 2021 by Yzermandius19

[myata]

4 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

I had covid

was lethargic af and had body aches for three straight days

was like the day after working out every muscle group in my body

had some random temperature fluctuations where I would get cold for like an hour

That describes a moderate flu to me. I had a worse one years back still recall feeling totally miserable for 3-4 days. And of course there are ones with sore throat and runny nose for couple of days. Not to dismiss it or make light, but the fact is that it's nothing catastrophic for majority of population. And so, instead of using the shotgun method, maybe we should think, design and implement smart, intelligent and effective methods of protecting those for whom the risk of severe illness is high?

Masking shotgun did not do it, a fact. Waves two and three had all time highs with full masking mandates in place.

Vaccines work to some extent and it's great because they can be used to protect the vulnerable. But will it eliminate Covid? As can be seen, almost certainly not. And if not, using them in the shotgun mode may bring other serious problems, like what to do when vaccine protection expires, and the long term effects.

[Yzermandius19]

30 minutes ago, myata said:

That describes a moderate flu to me. I had a worse one years back still recall feeling totally miserable for 3-4 days. And of course there are ones with sore throat and runny nose for couple of days. Not to dismiss it or make light, but the fact is that it's nothing catastrophic for majority of population. And so, instead of using the shotgun method, maybe we should think, design and implement smart, intelligent and effective methods of protecting those for whom the risk of severe illness is high?

Masking shotgun did not do it, a fact. Waves two and three had all time highs with full masking mandates in place.

Vaccines work to some extent and it's great because they can be used to protect the vulnerable. But will it eliminate Covid? As can be seen, almost certainly not. And if not, using them in the shotgun mode may bring other serious problems, like what to do when vaccine protection expires, and the long term effects.

agreed on all points

[Infidel Dog]

I haven't had the Covid, but one time, against my better judgement I got the flu vaccine. 

A couple of days later I got the worse flu of my life.

I figured, 'OK I must be one of those guys who don't deal well with vaccines.'

Years later I somehow got talked into getting the first covid jab.

I was almost immediately struck by every adverse reaction they tell you about - hyper allergy symptoms and weird flu-like symptoms. And they lasted about a month.

Never again!

Also they tell me the second jab is the one most likely to kill you if you happen to be one of the unlucky ones with that and failing that there's the bucket of adverse reactions - again more likely with the second jab. Some of those can be pretty horrific.

I'd rather deal with the "Papers Please" Jab-Nazis than any of that. They'll have to drag me out of my house kicking and screaming to jab me twice. It's OK Argus and Citizen they won't be needing volunteers to help them, I'm sure.

 

[myata]

Nobody should be mandated to have them against their will, unless in specific work areas that deal directly with vulnerable population and where contact cannot be excluded (and still, without doing covid-steps we have to remain in full knowledge that vaccination does not fully prevent infection, with symptoms or non symptomatic).

Businesses cannot be required to perform passport checks but they can choose to if they like. Mass gatherings, need serious analysis and discussion. Private corporations, serious discussion. Public sector, not mandatory unless justified by specific reasons and conditions in a specific work area.

[Argus]

14 hours ago, Yzermandius19 said:

so are the vaccinated

should they crawl off into the woods and die as well?

Most of those needing medical care are unvaccinated. Virtually all the vaccinated in need of care are older and have underlying health conditions. And they likely caught covid from one of the unvaccinated morons.

Alberta health authority cancels all elective surgeries in Calgary region as COVID-19 hospital admissions soar

But about four-in-five of the Albertans in hospital for COVID-19 are unvaccinated. The others are at least partially vaccinated, Kenney said Friday.

 

Edited September 9, 2021 by Argus

[Argus]

3 hours ago, Infidel Dog said:

I haven't had the Covid, but one time, against my better judgement I got the flu vaccine. 

A couple of days later I got the worse flu of my life.

I figured, 'OK I must be one of those guys who don't deal well with vaccines.'

Years later I somehow got talked into getting the first covid jab.

I was almost immediately struck by every adverse reaction they tell you about - hyper allergy symptoms and weird flu-like symptoms. And they lasted about a month.

Never again!

 

Have a nice death!

Bloody wimps. I get the flu shot every year and it's never done anything harmful. Got the shingles vaccine too. That one hurt but only for a day.

Edited September 9, 2021 by Argus

[Argus]

8 hours ago, Yzermandius19 said:

pay no attention to Israel

their data doesn't fit the covid doom narrative

There is nothing about their data when taken in context which contradicts what the medical community has been saying, as I explained in an earlier post. But LOL at the anti-vaxxers, who of course ignore context, all siting eagerly on the end of their chairs praying desperately for more deaths and infections in Israel to 'prove' they're right.

[Accountability Now]

3 hours ago, Infidel Dog said:

I haven't had the Covid, but one time, against my better judgement I got the flu vaccine. 

A couple of days later I got the worse flu of my life.

I figured, 'OK I must be one of those guys who don't deal well with vaccines.

That is my exact same experience. Never had the flu before that one flu shot and never had it after but ironically a few days after taking it I had to go to emergency with a 105F fever.  To be honest I was hoping these vaccines actually worked a little better and would stop transmission so that COVID would end and I wouldn't need the shot. Unfortunately that isn't the way it is and much like you I would rather lay low with the vaccine restrictions than take the risk on a vaccine that is so new. 

[Accountability Now]

35 minutes ago, Argus said:

There is nothing about their data when taken in context which contradicts what the medical community has been saying, as I explained in an earlier post. But LOL at the anti-vaxxers, who of course ignore context, all siting eagerly on the end of their chairs praying desperately for more deaths and infections in Israel to 'prove' they're right.

The data on the Israel and the UK both go to show the vaccines work but their effectiveness wane after a shorter time than hoped.  I'm curious how many people will roll up their sleeves for a third or fourth shot because that's what will happen the way this is going.  The numbers in Canada are starting the same way they did in the UK...now the percentages are much higher including 67% of the recent deaths being fully vaccinated. 

[Argus]

58 minutes ago, Accountability Now said:

The data on the Israel and the UK both go to show the vaccines work but their effectiveness wane after a shorter time than hoped.  I'm curious how many people will roll up their sleeves for a third or fourth shot because that's what will happen the way this is going.  The numbers in Canada are starting the same way they did in the UK...now the percentages are much higher including 67% of the recent deaths being fully vaccinated. 

Getting a shot was no big deal for me. I had no side effects for either one. Yes, I'll get a booster. Hopefully this won't be something you have to do every year but if we do, we do.

Those figures are deceptive. Almost everyone over 50 is vaccinated. And the majority of those who are not vaccinated are much younger. That means the risk profile for the elderly comes into play in slanting deaths towards them. 

However when you compare vaccinated vs unvaccinated within the same age groups the unvaccinated are getting much more ill and dying at a much higher rate.

Edited September 9, 2021 by Argus

[myata]

The problem with the shotgun method is that if it doesn't work, you're right back to square one.