GrittyLeftist Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 2 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said: ...and Canada gets off benefiting from the Americans dropping bombs on people, including defence contracts, military procurements, NATO interventions, mining around the world, oil services contracts, etc. A U.S. demise means that Canada and other nations will no longer have the big stick they have relied on to enforce the "rules based order", and if this is inevitable what Canada should have done may be quite different. Agree 100%, although "gets off" is maybe a little unfair. What alternative action do you propose that Canada should have taken? Quote It is no longer true and Canada's own government(s) have recognized the erosion of relevance and significance on the world stage. Canada has less influence at the UN and may be paying a price internationally because of the close alignment (our buddy) with American policies and interventions (e.g. Iraq, Syria, Ukraine, Haiti, Venezuela, Afghanistan, Saudi/Yemen, etc.). Mexico, Cuba, Brazil, and other America's nations are not viewed as so closely aligned with the Americans...recently (and ironically), Canada still hasn't learned that the U.S. is not Canada's buddy where U.S. interests are concerned. Definitely agree with a lot of this. I would say it's more that Canada is well aware that whatever "friendship" we have with the US takes a backseat to business interests. Again, what alternative do we have? If there were a "tell the yanks to F right off option" that was possible, effective, and not ruinous, I would be very interested in knowing what it is. Quote Canada is America's closest and oldest...enemy. Risks and threats are assessed from Canada just like any other nation, including post 9/11 risks. Methinks it is Canada that wants and needs the relationship to be more amicable and bilateral than it really is. Canadian governments use words like "harmonizing" and "collaborating" despite the influence and power imbalance tilting mostly the American way. American corporations are already exploiting Canadian resources, and Canada's governments beg them to do it (Foreign Direct Investment). Canada lacks the population size, market size, and domestic capital to exploit resources on a national scale, depending on investment from and exports to the U.S. and other nations. Canada is far more dependent on exports (30% of GDP) than either China (20%) or the United States (13%). Funny, I'd actually put that the other way around - America is Canada's closest and oldest enemy. Maybe that's just semantics. Canada definitely is trying to make it more of a "friendship" than it really is - people don't want to bomb their friends. Sucking up to the bully is not really admirable behaviour, but if the bully has demonstrated a willingness to kill millions of civilians to get what they want on several occasions across several decades, at some point in time geopolitical realities intrude on abstract morality. You are correct that American corporations are exploiting our resources, but we get to keep some of the money that is made, get to keep our own government, and get to keep a fig leaf to hide our loss of sovereignty behind - lots of countries would happily trade struggles with us. The best way to make sure America doesn't bomb you is to make sure they own a bunch of your infrastructure. Don't get me wrong, this is not my preferred situation, it's just that I don't know how to improve it. Quote
Army Guy Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 Well , I've been called a lot of things , but kulak is a first... 1 Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Dougie93 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 Just now, Army Guy said: Well , I've been called a lot of things , but kulak is a first... it simply means higher income farmer with larger farm there was three levels Bednyak, that's the poor peasants on the Indian Reservations Serednyak, that's the white trash in the trailer park & immigrants in the ghetto then Kulak, that's the middle classes basically 1 Quote
Dougie93 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 to the cultural Marxist Philosopher Kings in Ottawa, you are a "White Supremacist Insurrectionist" that's just the Woke commie way of saying Kulak cancellation is just proxy for extermination, if the Woke had their druthers you'd be lined up against a wall and shot Quote
GrittyLeftist Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 2 hours ago, blackbird said: It can cause a lot of harm by spreading this false ideology of choosing gender to children, who become very conflicted. It can destroy their lives, make it impossible to have a family and a normal life. They could end up committing suicide as many do. Some may opt to seek escape from the mess with alcohol or drugs and O. D. on fentanyl. It also causes division and stress to families who have children who pursue changing their gender. There is a father in jail now who refuses to accept the authorities and judge's direction to keep silent about his daughter transitioning to a boy. People into that sort of thing are doing their best to spread their lifestyle and changing gender to other young people and society at large. It also can cost the medical system a lot of money as more people seek psychiatric care and drugs or sex change surgery. Teaching that to kids in school is the just the beginning of an ongoing disaster. Some good points made here. Did some googling, according to Transgender people and suicide - Centre for Suicide Prevention (suicideinfo.ca) 1 in 3 Trans youth attempt suicide every year. Not sure how they are defining who is "trans" - are these people who have had the operation, people who want the operation, people who are confused about their gender, all of the above, something else entirely? More research needed. For sure it would cause division and stress within a family, I could see that. ...Aaaaaand have now done enough googling to know there is a big old rabbit hole here. I'm not going down it at the moment but wow there's a lot to understand and unpack if anyone wants to put the time in. Instead, I'll just own the fact that I don't have an informed opinion on this matter Quote
Army Guy Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 Kulak it is then. not sure i can embrace the whole white supremist thing, but compromises will have to be made, the only I'm not to worried about getting lined up against a wall, the left don't have the balls to pull a trigger or even touch a gun... Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Dougie93 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 Just now, Army Guy said: Kulak it is then. there was nobody the Communists hated more than the middle class the middle class was the "bourgeoisie" who were standing in the way of the revolution in order to effect the revolution, the Kulaks must be cancelled Quote
Dougie93 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 (edited) it all goes back to Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel what you are experiencing in Canada right now is called the Hegelian Dialectic the contradictions of society are smashed together until it incites a top down revolution from the streets they start by tearing down Sir John A. MacDonald, but you are on the hit list too, make no mistake the brainwashed Bolshevist college students are always the vanguard, that's Communist S.O.P. what the Woke are doing was done in every Communist takeover ever, this is how it works Communism is not political, it's a religion, Communism is a leftist utopian Shangri-la Edited May 20, 2021 by Dougie93 Quote
Army Guy Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 22 minutes ago, GrittyLeftist said: Canada definitely is trying to make it more of a "friendship" than it really is - people don't want to bomb their friends. Sucking up to the bully is not really admirable behaviour, but if the bully has demonstrated a willingness to kill millions of civilians to get what they want on several occasions across several decades, at some point in time geopolitical realities intrude on abstract morality. You are correct that American corporations are exploiting our resources, but we get to keep some of the money that is made, get to keep our own government, and get to keep a fig leaf to hide our loss of sovereignty behind - lots of countries would happily trade struggles with us. The best way to make sure America doesn't bomb you is to make sure they own a bunch of your infrastructure. Don't get me wrong, this is not my preferred situation, it's just that I don't know how to improve it. Must be one hell of a friendship, one where we can take advantage at every turn... maybe step brother would be a better description, a relationship forged out of survival and necessity, rather than love or friendship .. Your chioce of the word bully to describe the US is interesting, seems to be very Canadian to describe our closet allied and trading partner. I also find it puzzling that most US adventures or as you put it killing millions of civilian's across the decades, Canada for the most part has been a willing participant in some form or way.. and no mention of our own adventures that have resulted in dead civilians...yes i am talking about Canada... you know what they say about glass houses..... As for resources, it's not like we can exploit our resources, can't even build a pipe line, or solve soft wood lumber...and sovereignty we gave that up long ago...we just think we run things here... I would say best way to remain on the good side of things with the US is to pay our own way to start with, on things that matter to the US, such as NATO, NORAD, 5 eyes, USUKCANNZAUS pact, our allied know we have little to offer, I'm not sure why they even let us at the table....what do we bring to the table, beside great beer, hockey, and a love for the cold... 1 Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
bush_cheney2004 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 17 minutes ago, GrittyLeftist said: Agree 100%, although "gets off" is maybe a little unfair. What alternative action do you propose that Canada should have taken? First and foremost, it should be Canadian choices made to support more independence from the American hegemon. This means less NAFTA and more diversified export nations...less dependency on the U.S. economy. It means maintaining a viable military to have a "seat at the table". It means more east-west infrastructure projects like pipelines and refineries instead of going south, and it means fewer trade barriers between provinces. It means more R&D investment and higher worker productivity. The cultural, media, and political dynamics all follow a more independent path capable of independent policy decisions. Years ago, MP Carolyn Parrish famously said, "Damn Americans ... I hate those bastards." There was more wisdom in this politically fatal quip than some Canadians want to admit. Quote Definitely agree with a lot of this. I would say it's more that Canada is well aware that whatever "friendship" we have with the US takes a backseat to business interests. Again, what alternative do we have? If there were a "tell the yanks to F right off option" that was possible, effective, and not ruinous, I would be very interested in knowing what it is. That's the whole point...Canada has painted itself into an economic and military corner that makes it nearly impossible to the "tell the yanks to F right off..." It is unwise to keep digging the hole but expecting different results. Nation states don't have friends...they have interests...the two should not be confused. Quote Funny, I'd actually put that the other way around - America is Canada's closest and oldest enemy. Maybe that's just semantics. Canada definitely is trying to make it more of a "friendship" than it really is - people don't want to bomb their friends. Sucking up to the bully is not really admirable behaviour, but if the bully has demonstrated a willingness to kill millions of civilians to get what they want on several occasions across several decades, at some point in time geopolitical realities intrude on abstract morality. Just the other side of the same historical coin. Canada stayed with Great Britain until the American bastards supplanted the British after WW1/WW2. Canada does not cry tears for those who have fallen in such conflicts....Canada exports more APCs to Saudi Arabia instead. 2 Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Dougie93 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Your chioce of the word bully to describe the US is interesting, seems to be very Canadian to describe our closet allied and trading partner. I also find it puzzling that most US adventures or as you put it killing millions of civilian's across the decades, Canada for the most part has been a willing participant in some form or way.. and no mention of our own adventures that have resulted in dead civilians...yes i am talking about Canada... you know what they say about glass houses..... none of that was by choice Canada was born of the fear of American invasion, America is the enemy at the gates the whole point of Canada was to be a British NATO against the Americans the problem was simply that the British Empire impaled itself on the Somme, and then proceeded to collapse so Canada was forced to render unto American Caesar to survive without the British Empire to prop Canada up 2 Quote
Army Guy Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 11 minutes ago, Dougie93 said: it all goes back to Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel what you are experiencing in Canada right now is called the Hegelian Dialectic the contradictions of society are smashed together until it incites a top down revolution from the streets they start by tearing down Sir John A. MacDonald, but you are on the hit list too, make no mistake the brainwashed Bolshevist college students are always the vanguard, that's Communist S.O.P. what the Woke are doing was done in every Communist takeover ever, this is how it works Communism is not political, it's a religion, Communism is a leftist utopian Shangri-la Sorry brother, i survived the cold war, multi tours in Bosnia, Germany, Afghanistan, Cyprus, Sinai not to mention every evil RCR/ PPCLI instructor i've had through out my career, Canadian collage kids just don't don't scare me, that and I'm to old to give a shit right now... besides with a few Royals we could turn this thing around in a couple of hours....or watch it burn to the ground, depends on how much beer there is. Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Dougie93 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Army Guy said: Sorry brother, i survived the cold war, multi tours in Bosnia, Germany, Afghanistan, Cyprus, Sinai not to mention every evil RCR/ PPCLI instructor i've had through out my career, Canadian collage kids just don't don't scare me, that and I'm to old to give a shit right now... besides with a few Royals we could turn this thing around in a couple of hours....or watch it burn to the ground, depends on how much beer there is. no fears on earth gentleman, charge your glasses Victoria Queen & Empress :toasts: Quote
Army Guy Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Dougie93 said: no fears on earth gentleman, charge your glasses Victoria Queen & Empress :toasts: to the Queen.... Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Dougie93 Posted May 20, 2021 Report Posted May 20, 2021 12 minutes ago, Army Guy said: to the Queen.... the Leafs have taken to the ice against the dirty Fenian Habs an extra shot and beer chaser, for Billy Barilko :toasts: Quote
Army Guy Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 1 hour ago, GrittyLeftist said: School districts have sued parents for not using the gender address their child preferred? That seem pretty outrageous. I just did some googling but couldn't find anything about that. Can you please provide some evidence to support this claim? Quote Robert Hoogland, from Surrey, British Columbia, has a 14-year-old daughter. In February 2019, the Supreme Court of British Columbia, Canada ordered that the girl receive testosterone injections without obtaining parental consent. “The court also declared that if either of her parents referred to her using female pronouns or addressed her by her birth name, they would be considered guilty of family violence,” The Federalist noted. the court decided that the girl receive medical treatments, of a 14 year old, and if the father did not stop calling his daughter daughter he would be found guilty of family violence... Questions here are when does a parents responsibility end and when does a Childs take precedence. I thought it was 16, but i guess i'm wrong... https://fbanews.org/2021/03/20/canadian-father-arrested-after-calling-transgender-son-female-pronouns/#:~:text=A Canadian father%2C Robert Hoogland%2C was ar Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Zeitgeist Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Dougie93 said: none of that was by choice Canada was born of the fear of American invasion, America is the enemy at the gates the whole point of Canada was to be a British NATO against the Americans the problem was simply that the British Empire impaled itself on the Somme, and then proceeded to collapse so Canada was forced to render unto American Caesar to survive without the British Empire to prop Canada up Now now. Canada has had its moments of excellence: invention of telephone, smart phone, penicillin, snowmobiles, hockey, basketball, lacrosse, and arguably football. We have the best public education system in the English speaking word, solid public universities, and a number of areas of excellence in extraction, biotech, A.I., agriculture, mass media, and even aerospace. If anything our problem has been trying to do too many things. Canada did important work in peacekeeping under Pearson and punched far above its weight in both world wars. We have a less polarized and less violent society than the US. We’re very open and accepting. It’s also a big, beautiful country with a varied geography and a ton of resources. Many great things about Canada. However, choices are compromises. Universal healthcare and lower cost generic drugs costs also means less R and D. It’s worth retaining but involves compromise. Canadians have been a tough group who hacked a modern civilization out of a cold harsh wilderness, but these days it’s become too complaisant, relying too heavily on one trading partner and foolishly refusing to unlock the potential of our resources and create the national infrastructure and interprovincial trade for true energy independence. Only Canada would ignore its tremendous oil power. Unfortunately, this movement of letting the radical lunatics run the asylum has become a pattern under Trudeau. It wasn’t always thus. Canada was in a good place under Harper. The Liberals are not the party of Chrétien. They’re in direct competition with the NDP for the left. They’re not a centrist party anymore. And don’t get me started on the state of our military... Edited May 21, 2021 by Zeitgeist Quote
Dougie93 Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 f*ck Canada, I wouldn't cross the street to piss on it if it was on fire Quote
Zeitgeist Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Dougie93 said: f*ck Canada, I wouldn't cross the street to piss on it if it was on fire We’ve had this conversation before. You said yourself that the Canadian military has given you a good life and good military training. It’s important to appreciate the good things about your country, and there’s plenty to appreciate. Fight to change what needs to change. Edited May 21, 2021 by Zeitgeist Quote
Dougie93 Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said: We’ve had this conversation before. You said yourself that the Canadian military has given you a good life and good military training. It’s important to appreciate the good things about your country, and there’s plenty to appreciate. Fight to change what needs to change. Canadian soldiers are soldiers of the Crown, that's a mercenary for the Queen I hated commie Canada while I was serving in the army, we all did, the Canadian criminals who stabbed us in the back it's not my country, it's not even a country, just a former British colony now American protectorate Quote
Zeitgeist Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Dougie93 said: Canadian soldiers are soldiers of the Crown, that's a mercenary for the Queen I hated commie Canada while I was serving in the army, we all did, the Canadian criminals who stabbed us in the back it's not my country, it's not even a country, just a former British colony now American protectorate And once again, the Queen didn’t pay your cheques or fight the battles the constitute the storied history of your regiment. Neither did the Brits or the Yanks. The Queen has been a good monarch, but don’t overestimate her impact. The Canadian people and the country of Canada bred and paid you. They should be your first loyalty. The Queen of Canada symbolizes that. She’s the figurehead. I say that as a dual citizen of Canada and Britain. Edited May 21, 2021 by Zeitgeist Quote
Dougie93 Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 Just now, Zeitgeist said: And once again, the Queen didn’t pay your cheques or fight the battles the constitute the storied history of your regiment. Neither did the Brits or the Yanks. The Queen has been a good monarch, but don’t overestimate her impact. The Canadian people and the country of Canada bred and paid you. They should be your first loyalty. The Queen of Canada symbolizes that. once again, Canada is not a republic and I was not a citizen soldier British military service to the Crown, that's a mercenary for the Queen, I owed no fealty to Canada per se Quote
Zeitgeist Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, Dougie93 said: once again, Canada is not a republic and I was not a citizen soldier British military service to the Crown, that's a mercenary for the Queen, I owed no fealty to Canada per se I think you do. It would be like saying you owe nothing to the Brits as a British soldier. What do you think this Queen business is all about? Quote
Dougie93 Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 1 minute ago, Zeitgeist said: I think you do. It would be like saying you owe nothing to the Brits as a British soldier. What do you think this Queen business is all about? I served with the British Army too, as a Canadian, owing fealty to nobody other than Elizabeth Windsor all you are bound to do as a soldier of the Crown is follow the Queens Regulations & Orders you don't even have to be a Canadian citizen to serve Quote
Army Guy Posted May 21, 2021 Report Posted May 21, 2021 1 minute ago, Zeitgeist said: We’ve had this conversation before. You said yourself that the Canadian military has given you a good life and good military training. It’s important to appreciate the good things about your country, and there’s plenty to appreciate. Fight to change what needs to change. No question the people within the military are for the most part top shelf. The biggest threat to our military is our own government both liberal and conservative and of course it's people. As for the training , they do what they can with the amount of funding they receive. I remember when i first joined in the 80's we spent 8 months out of the year training. Today units would be lucky to get out once or twice a year, maybe 1 month at a time.... Todays military is a wreck, a shell of what it once was...Can't even seem to buy trucks without mounds of red tape...and now it is being torn apart by poor government policies...lack of funding, training , and new mission set... current government policies are there to ensure nothing gets purchased on time , on schedule or not at all. Our country has done many terrific things as you mentioned, different generation, different time, i mean what have we done recently that could compare to our past exploits...build a pipe line, updated our health care, or education system, make our own medical equipment, medical PPE, or medication , we can smoke weed for many that would be an exploit.... Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
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