Do you believe that Jesus really existed ?

[Deluge]

On 4/4/2021 at 2:02 PM, Jean-Kevin said:

"Did Jesus Even Exist ?" Youtube video and you can find another videos of him about Jesus or rather someting to go Jesus is a complet fiction.

I don't know if there is a Yeshua ben Yosef would have existed but this personage don't need a matérial basis to exist. Every element of his biography seems to be modelled on a text from the Old Testament. 

Science is the LAST resource you use if you truly want to know whether Jesus existed or not. 

The correct way to go, of course, is faith, prayer and holy scripture. 

[French Patriot]

2 hours ago, Deluge said:

Science is the LAST resource you use if you truly want to know whether Jesus existed or not. 

The correct way to go, of course, is faith, prayer and holy scripture. 

To rely on a book that posits that talking serpents and donkeys are real, --- seems like a poor place to find truth of the life, or not, of the various characters it speaks of. Including Jesus.

If you think him real though, why has no one since his death done what the bible has Jesus saying we can do if we have just a bit of faith or belief?

Jesus said we could do all he did and more.

I am still waiting for just one Christian to show his faith. It would change the world.

Regards

DL

[Deluge]

17 minutes ago, French Patriot said:

To rely on a book that posits that talking serpents and donkeys are real, --- seems like a poor place to find truth of the life, or not, of the various characters it speaks of. Including Jesus.

If you think him real though, why has no one since his death done what the bible has Jesus saying we can do if we have just a bit of faith or belief?

Jesus said we could do all he did and more.

I am still waiting for just one Christian to show his faith. It would change the world.

Regards

DL

That's your problem, dude, you're just "waiting"; and you're going to wait a long time if you just wait. 

"Behold I stand at the door and knock". Rev 3:20

It's up to you to answer the door. 

 

[herbie]

7 hours ago, French Patriot said:

Science is the LAST resource you use if you truly want to know whether Jesus existed or not. 

Science is about the ONLY resource. Something you don't have to believe in, because it works whether you believe in it or not. If you don't know that, you don't know shit.

[French Patriot]

19 hours ago, Deluge said:

That's your problem, dude, you're just "waiting"; and you're going to wait a long time if you just wait. 

"Behold I stand at the door and knock". Rev 3:20

It's up to you to answer the door. 

 

Your problem is believing that talking serpents are real and that Jesus would sin greatly and break his own law for the likes of you.

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

Regards

DL

 

[TreeBeard]

On 2/6/2023 at 7:52 AM, Deluge said:

The correct way to go, of course, is faith

Is there any belief at all that cannot be taken on faith?  Can I have faith that the sun revolves around the earth?

[Deluge]

3 hours ago, French Patriot said:

Your problem is believing that talking serpents are real and that Jesus would sin greatly and break his own law for the likes of you.

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

Regards

DL

 

Your problem is that you either don't understand scripture, or you are mishandling scripture deliberately. 

Ezekiel 18:20 is for those who don't repent, and 2 Corinthians 7:10 is for those who do repent. 

 

2 Corinthians 7:10 tells us that Godly sorrow "worketh repentence". I've actually been there, and it's not easy. 

 

Deut 24:16 does not confirm your take on Jesus's sacrifice. He atoned for everyone, but we have to follow his conditions (commandments) or damnation will follow. 

 

[French Patriot]

19 hours ago, Deluge said:

Your problem is that you either don't understand scripture, or you are mishandling scripture deliberately. 

Ezekiel 18:20 is for those who don't repent, and 2 Corinthians 7:10 is for those who do repent. 

 

2 Corinthians 7:10 tells us that Godly sorrow "worketh repentence". I've actually been there, and it's not easy. 

 

Deut 24:16 does not confirm your take on Jesus's sacrifice. He atoned for everyone, but we have to follow his conditions (commandments) or damnation will follow. 

 

I understand good morals and you do not have them when your plan is to abdicate your own responsibilities for your own actions.

Get behind me Satan.

Regards

DL

[Deluge]

19 minutes ago, French Patriot said:

I understand good morals and you do not have them when your plan is to abdicate your own responsibilities for your own actions.

Get behind me Satan.

Regards

DL

You don't even understand good morals. What you do understand is the gospel according to whomever filled your head with nonsense. 

Best, 

Deluge

[French Patriot]

47 minutes ago, Deluge said:

You don't even understand good morals. What you do understand is the gospel according to whomever filled your head with nonsense. 

Best, 

Deluge

I understand that it is immoral for you to use a scapegoat to pay your dues.

Moral people step up.

You have someone else step up, you pathetic moral coward.

Regards

DL

[Deluge]

1 hour ago, French Patriot said:

I understand that it is immoral for you to use a scapegoat to pay your dues.

Moral people step up.

You have someone else step up, you pathetic moral coward.

Regards

DL

You don't understand the Atonement. 

Moral people follow Jesus' commandments. Immoral people don't. 

Best, 

Deluge

[French Patriot]

On 2/7/2023 at 9:44 AM, French Patriot said:

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

There are his commandments, which you conveniently ignore.

You make a claim without showing the morality of your own.

Tell us again how it is moral for you to use a whipping boy for punishment while you watch?

Regards

DL

[Deluge]

49 minutes ago, French Patriot said:

There are his commandments, which you conveniently ignore.

You make a claim without showing the morality of your own.

Tell us again how it is moral for you to use a whipping boy for punishment while you watch?

Regards

DL

Those are just two scriptures among lots and lots of scriptures. You have to look at the Bible in its totality, not just cherry pick your favorite verses and throw the rest out. 

Go find Jesus and repent of your sins. You'll feel better. 

Best, 

Deluge

Edited February 8, 2023 by Deluge

[Deluge]

4 hours ago, Contrarian said:

The Religious Conservative movement needs some new marketing. 

If you keep it up like this, soon even down down South people will start avoiding such messages in their voting preferences. 

• They, you are against a new generation that is being raised with technology and AI. ?

---> Is my view that in 2023, the religious ultra-conservative is one who bases his truth on 1 book or 1 source AND provides daily ammunition to atheists for mockery. ?

This isn't a popularity contest - it's a quest for what's right and true. 

I'm not compromising my beliefs for election results. If America wants to be led by sht heads, then so be it. 

[Deluge]

9 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I see so someone that was born Hindu or Buddhist was not as lucky as you to be born in the correct truth religion?

God is not a respecter of persons. I'm sure there are plenty of Hindus and Buddhists who will have a better final judgment than some "Christians". 

Sure, I have more knowledge about Christ than most Hindus and Buddhists, but if I don't use that knowledge for the betterment of myself and others around me, then I'm certain there will be Hindus and Buddhists humble enough to accept Jesus and be better off in the afterlife, even though many of them will/have never even hear/heard of Jesus in this life. 

Edited February 15, 2023 by Deluge

[Deluge]

1 hour ago, Contrarian said:

1. So what you are saying is, that after death, every single religion in the world will go before Jesus Christ and will be judged?

You realize every single fanatic in their own religion thinks that, once they slip away, they will meet their perception of truth. 

I think is more complicated than this and for sure one does not need religious or atheists telling one they have the whole idea. 

One side says they have the whole picture, the other side says there is no picture, just stuck on a rock somewhere. 

The arrogance that us humans have reached, not even the Romans had at the height of their power. 

1. I'm saying that every single PERSON in the world will go before Jesus Christ to be judged. We all came from the same place, Contrarion, and isn't primordial goo. 

I realize that truth is truth, and it's the only thing I'm interested in. 

Everything's more complicated with atheists; it's why Satan loves them so much. 

God has the whole picture. 

Arrogance and God don't mix. Arrogance and atheism go hand in hand. 

 

[Deluge]

2 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Life is so much easier when you build a box for yourself with set parameters. 

Is fear Deluge, some can't handle life without having answers and they find it in a book.

Even if that's the Bible or Das Kapital.

You all have "the truth." ?

Are you saying that you have zero convictions of any kind? that everything is in a constant state of flux? 

There's no fear over here, and it's not just a book where I get answers. 

Shitty comparison: the Bible is lightyears ahead of Das Kapital and you know it. 

If you don't believe I have the truth then why don't you prove me wrong? 

[Deluge]

41 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I have zero interest to prove you wrong. The only issue arises between men like you and agnostics men like me is when you cross the line and you start advocating for changes based on your bubble. 

Until then, I don't care what you do in your own home if it makes you a better person. 

It does not matter what I think of the Bible, both books served as a brainwashing instrument since the Roman capitulation to religious fanaticism. Then the Dark Ages, oh God, what a waste for humanity. Then atheism showed us its ugly face with killing that rivaled their brother and sisters from the religious side. 

Of course I have convictions, mine would be similar to the Romans before Christianity took over except for the rituals.  

This guy below is Greek: 

---> There is something I think, however, what is the point of the journey if you knew the destination already? I don't need you to tell me what it is. I can figure it out on my own or get lost on my own accord.  

There is no bubble here. I'd say at least half this nation is still more or less Christian and it has almost zero influence when stacked against secularism. That's got to change. 

The Bible is not a brainwashing instrument. It's a book of principles and faith. Sure, it scares the hell out of anti-Christians, but that doesn't mean sht as far as religious freedoms go. 

Aristotle was a wise man, but he was also wrong. 

[SkyHigh]

On 2/6/2023 at 10:52 AM, Deluge said:

Science is the LAST resource you use if you truly want to know whether Jesus existed or not. 

The correct way to go, of course, is faith, prayer and holy scripture. 

Do you use faith to make decisions in other spheres of life or do you use empirical evidence?

For example when you cross a busy street, do you just close your eyes and have faith no cars are coming or do you look both ways?

Why would you make possibly the most important decision of ones life (salvation) with less information than the menial ones taken countless times a day?

[Deluge]

8 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Is not now.

Do you know why?

because society does not allow it political power the way it does not allow Das Kapital's followers political power. 

The rest, study the Crusades; the Dark Ages, and we'll talk about how clean your bubble is. 

Like Das Kapital. Good Theory, Bad in practice when given the driving wheel of society.

We're not looking for the Crusades, or the Dark Ages. We're looking for Christianity having a seat at the table. It has no seat now, and that needs to change. 

[SkyHigh]

2 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I think old Aurelius triple split remains the most reasonable explanation that I found on the trip in life. 

Anyone that has an issue with this quote, is in a bubble in my opinion: 

Like Pascals wager, but for people with critical thinking skills 

[Deluge]

7 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Do you use faith to make decisions in other spheres of life or do you use empirical evidence?

For example when you cross a busy street, do you just close your eyes and have faith no cars are coming or do you look both ways?

Why would you make possibly the most important decision of ones life (salvation) with less information than the menial ones taken countless times a day?

I misspoke a bit about science and faith, as even the faithful have to put God's word to the test. That's just how it works with the unknown. 

I use faith, and evidence, together, with pretty much all my decisions. For example: when I cross a busy street, I'll use previous experiences to guide me while crossing the street, but I'll still be using faith that something freakish doesn't happen to put me in the hospital, or the morgue. 

 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Like Pascals wager, but for people with critical thinking skills 

I never could quite understand how Pascal's wager would work.  One either believes something or one doesn't. 

Any God worth its salt would be able to figure out who's pretending.  Probably make them mad.

(Notwithstanding the already mentioned benefits of living a decent life, of course)

[SkyHigh]

22 minutes ago, Deluge said:

I misspoke a bit about science and faith, as even the faithful have to put God's word to the test. That's just how it works with the unknown. 

I use faith, and evidence, together, with pretty much all my decisions. For example: when I cross a busy street, I'll use previous experiences to guide me while crossing the street, but I'll still be using faith that something freakish doesn't happen to put me in the hospital, or the morgue. 

 

So the answer is you don't use faith outside your religious beliefs

Faith Is different than reasonable expectations.

I don't use or need faith that when I sit on a chair that it will hold my weight 

Please share any evidence you may have that the bible is true as I have alot of evidence for the contrary 

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by SkyHigh

[SkyHigh]

9 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

I never could quite understand how Pascal's wager would work.  One either believes something or one doesn't. 

Any God worth its salt would be able to figure out who's pretending.  Probably make them mad.

(Notwithstanding the already mentioned benefits of living a decent life, of course)

So true

And with thousands of different denominations in Christianity alone how would one know if the god they're pretending to believe in is the right one.

Growing up I had one foster family that was Catholic and another that was fundamentalist baptist and they didn't pray to the same god