Do you believe that Jesus really existed ?

[Deluge]

27 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

So the answer is you don't use faith outside your religious beliefs

Faithis different than reasonable expectations.

I don't use or need faith that when I sit on a chair that it will hold my weight 

Please explain what SHARED experiences (your personal experience are not relevant to me) we have that would give me ability to believe your Bible 

 

I use faith all the time, and so do you. Every single thing you do each day is based on faith. 

You not believing in the Bible doesn't prove it untrue. Truth is truth with or without your consent. 

God created the Earth and its inhabitants. Show me evidence that proves otherwise. 

 

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by Deluge

[Deluge]

16 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

So true

And with thousands of different denominations in Christianity alone how would one know if the god they're pretending to believe in is the right one.

Growing up I had one foster family that was Catholic and another that was fundamentalist baptist and they didn't pray to the same god

That's what prayer is for - if you pray in faith, you'll get answers.

[SkyHigh]

2 minutes ago, Deluge said:

I use faith all the time, and so do you. Every single thing you do each day is based on faith. 

You believing, or not believing, in the Bible doesn't determine whether it's true or not. Truth is truth with or without your consent. 

God created the Earth and its inhabitants. Show me evidence that proves otherwise. 

 

 

Really? How do I use faith?

You're right my beliefs are irrelevant to truth and so is faith. One can come to any belief using faith therefore not a path to truth

I asked you for evidence and since you're the one making a claim the burden of proof is on you to prove it not me to prove the negative, but I'm guessing you have none 

Just for fun though let me drop some science on you.

Based on extensive recorded history of the Egyptians and modern archeological digs, there is irrefutable evidence a mass exodus of Hebrews from Egypt and their 40 years in the wilderness never happened 

[SkyHigh]

12 minutes ago, Deluge said:

That's what prayer is for - if you pray in faith, you'll get answers.

So back to faith, aka what one uses when they have no reasonable or rational arguments 

Edited February 15, 2023 by SkyHigh

[Deluge]

3 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

So back to faith, aka what one uses when that have no reasonable or rational arguments 

I've already explained that you use faith in everything you do. Your entire life is centered on it. 

[SkyHigh]

Just now, Deluge said:

I've already explained that you use faith in everything you do. Your entire life is centered on it. 

You claimed that but haven't actually made an argument

Please do

[Deluge]

16 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Really? How do I use faith?

You're right my beliefs are irrelevant to truth and so is faith. One can come to any belief using faith therefore not a path to truth

I asked you for evidence and since you're the one making a claim the burden of proof is on you to prove it not me to prove the negative, but I'm guessing you have none 

Just for fun though let me drop some science on you.

Based on extensive recorded history of the Egyptians and modern archeological digs, there is irrefutable evidence a mass exodus of Hebrews from Egypt and their 40 years in the wilderness never happened 

Every time you go to sleep. If you didn't have faith that you'd wake up in the morning you'd have a hard time going to sleep. 

Wrong. Faith and belief can still be true, depending on the event. 

The point is, you don't have evidence that God didn't create the earth and its inhabitants. I don't have direct proof that God did, so we're kind of at an impasse. All we can really do is look at what makes sense, so let's talk about how you think the Earth and all its inhabitants came into existence. 

Edited February 15, 2023 by Deluge

[Deluge]

8 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

You claimed that but haven't actually made an argument

Please do

I did in the other response. Go there, so we can tie these two together. 

[SkyHigh]

1 minute ago, Deluge said:

Every time you go to sleep. If you didn't have faith that you'd wake up in the morning you'd have a hard time going to sleep. 

Wrong. Faith is universal - your beliefs are just yours. 

The point is, you don't have evidence that God didn't create the earth and its inhabitants. I don't have direct proof that God did, so we're kind of at an impasse. 

All we can really do is look at what makes sense. Now, let's talk about how you think the Earth and all its inhabitants came into existence. 

What are you talking about faith I'll wake up? I'm in my late 30's in excellent physical condition with no preexisting conditions, I live in a country where life expectancy is in the 80s. Again that's not faith it's a reasonable expectation.

Again you made a claim it's your job to prove it, but  since you ignored the evidence I did give I'll assume you agree the exodus didn't happen?

 

 

[SkyHigh]

3 minutes ago, Deluge said:

I did in the other response. Go there, so we can tie these two together. 

Honest question

Do you understand the difference between making a claim and making an argument that is supported with facts?

[Deluge]

1 minute ago, SkyHigh said:

What are you talking about faith I'll wake up? I'm in my late 30's in excellent physical condition with no preexisting conditions, I live in a country where life expectancy is in the 80s. Again that's not faith it's a reasonable expectation.

Again you made a claim it's your job to prove it, but  since you ignored the evidence I did give I'll assume you agree the exodus didn't happen?

Faith and reasonable expectations are one and the same; or were you not aware of that? 

OK, I'll go first: The idea of a divine being with creative powers makes so much more sense than the idea of a living planet with complex lifeforms being randomly formed.

I'm saying divine intelligence created intelligent lifeforms. What are YOU saying? 

[Deluge]

4 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Honest question

Honest answers in the other box. We're closing this one down.

[SkyHigh]

3 minutes ago, Deluge said:

Faith and reasonable expectations are one and the same; or were you not aware of that?

Not only is that not true colloquially that not even true biblically

[SkyHigh]

5 minutes ago, Deluge said:

Honest answers in the other box. We're closing this one down.

So the answer is no you don't know the difference 

[Deluge]

Just now, SkyHigh said:

Not only is that not true colloquially that not even true biblically

Faith has the broader meaning, but they still coincide for the purposes of this discussion. 

[SkyHigh]

6 minutes ago, Deluge said:

OK, I'll go first: The idea of a divine being with creative powers makes so much more sense than the idea of a living planet with complex lifeforms being randomly formed.

Again just a claim please support this with evidence, or just admit you don't care if what you believe is true

[Deluge]

1 minute ago, SkyHigh said:

So the answer is no you don't know the difference 

You're losing this discussion, SkyHigh. I suggest you get over to the other box. 

[Deluge]

Just now, SkyHigh said:

Again just a claim please support this with evidence, or just admit you don't care if what you believe is true

I already stated that we're at an impasse. Do you disagree? 

[SkyHigh]

1 minute ago, Deluge said:

Faith has the broader meaning, but they still coincide for the purposes of this discussion. 

Words mean something you can't just make up meanings 

Do you even know how your bible defines faith?

 

 

 

 

[Deluge]

Just now, SkyHigh said:

Words mean something you can't just make up meanings 

Do you even know how your bible defines faith?

Is Merriam Webster's just making up meanings? 

Faith:

b(1)

: firm belief in something for which there is no proof

[SkyHigh]

2 minutes ago, Deluge said:

I already stated that we're at an impasse. Do you disagree? 

I agree but we're at an impasse because you're making up proprietary definitions to words

[SkyHigh]

1 minute ago, Deluge said:

Is Merriam Webster's just making up meanings? 

Faith:

b(1)

: firm belief in something for which there is no proof

Exactly

So very different from reasonable expectation

[Deluge]

Just now, SkyHigh said:

I agree but we're at an impasse because you're making up proprietary definitions to words

Wrong. You're trying to tell me that the word "Faith" is exclusive to faith in God. 

[Deluge]

Just now, SkyHigh said:

Exactly

So very different from reasonable expectation

Nope. Faith and reasonable expectations coincide in this discussion. 

[SkyHigh]

1 minute ago, Deluge said:

Wrong. You're trying to tell me that the word "Faith" is exclusive to faith in God. 

No I'm not 

You just admitted my point

Faith is used when there is no proof of the claim you're making, therefore not a path to truth in any circumstance