Handguns and Assault Rifles

[Dougie93]

Just now, Zeitgeist said:

Ha ha.  Read about US prison riots and native activism, the reserves down there, and of course the atrocities against Indians in the Indian War and in other incidents.  Far worse than anything done by Canada.  

Seems like a canard.

I look to the future rather than ruminate about the past.

Canada is a racist apartheid police state, what America is, is neither here nor there to that.

[Dougie93]

That being said, what I would say to the warriors of Chief Tecumseh, is that I am Brock, he is me.

I remember who saved the British Crown at the Heights of Queenston, was the Grand River Mohawks who came to our aid in the darkest hour.

No better friend to the Iroquois than me, I would kill and die for them, as they killed and died for the Orangemen of Upper Canada, we never forget.

Edited August 5, 2019 by Dougie93

[Zeitgeist]

4 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

Seems like a canard.

I look to the future rather than ruminate about the past.

Canada is a racist apartheid police state, what America is, is neither here nor there to that.

Repeating statements doesn’t make them true.  The Proclamation of 1763 required white settlers to enter into treaties with Indigenous.  The United States had no such provisions.  They had an outright war on the Indians, removed them from west of the Mississippi, and were involved in military battles against them until the end of the 19th century.  Look up Wounded Knee.  Indigenous have treaties within Canada that there would be no obligation to keep without the existence of Canada.  Other national programs, as mentioned, would cease.  I suppose federal waterway, train, and energy corridors could devolve to the provinces.  Basically everything gets messy, and as long as even just one jurisdiction chooses to retain the country, all that federal infrastructure remains in the hands of the federal government, including the St. Lawrence Seaway.  Quebec would love that...

[bush_cheney2004]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Ha ha.  Read about US prison riots and native activism, the reserves down there, and of course the atrocities against Indians in the Indian War and in other incidents.  Far worse than anything done by Canada.  

 

And still, those "Indians" will far more readily and proudly identify as "Americans" than the "aboriginals" in Canada....for several reasons.   Native Americans paid their dues from the very beginning, and are part of the club without any blessing from the Crown/British, and often despite them.

Would you still insist on a handgun and "assault rifle" ban in Canada were it not for yet more comparisons and fear of what happens in the United States ?

Why does U.S. social and political conflict often drive such knee jerk reactions if everything is so swell north of the border ?

"Hey...lets ban guns because of what is happening in another country.   Great idea ! "   <= Who will vote for that ?

 

[Dougie93]

4 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Repeating statements doesn’t make them true.  The Proclamation of 1763 required white settlers to enter into treaties with Indigenous.  The United States had no such provisions.  They had an outright war on the Indians, removed them from west of the Mississippi, and were involved in military battles against them until the end of the 19th century.  Look up Wounded Knee.  Indigenous have treaties within Canada that there would be no obligation to keep without the existence of Canada.  Other national programs, as mentioned, would cease.  I suppose federal waterway, train, and energy corridors could devolve to the provinces.  Basically everything gets messy, and as long as even just one jurisdiction chooses to retain the country, all that federal infrastructure remains in the hands of the federal government, including the St. Lawrence Seaway.  Quebec would love that...

Canada is utterly lawless, thus invoking the law is pointless, Canada is a racist apartheid Company Town, where the Liberal elites are above the law, thus I say down with Canada, and good riddance, and rightly so.

Edited August 6, 2019 by Dougie93

[Charles Anthony]

Folks, 

Avoid thread derailment.   

[Dougie93]

Anywhoo, back to guns.

In Canada, I would say the overall value pick, is the Norinco M305, which is a Chinese copy of the American M-14.

Bizarrely, a Non-Restricted weapon in Canada, even though it's a semi-automatic 7.62 x 51mm NATO battle rifle.

A NATO battle rifle is in my opinion the most effective infantry rifle on earth, I would choose it over both the Armalite and the Kalashnikov.

For old school soldiers like me, the Assault Rifle is a step down from the Battle Rifle. Battle Rifle packs twice the punch at twice the range.

The Belgian made equivalent, with the exact same action and ammunition, the FN FAL, is Prohibited in Canada.

And yet the Chinese copy of the M-14 is not even Restricted. 

As it is Non-Restricted, you're not bound to the range like you are with the Armalite.

A Military Assault Weapon which you can take hunting on Crown land with you.

You can pick one up for around $600.00.  Way more affordable than an Armalite.

Americans can't get them, they embargo the Chinese manufacturer.

Pretty much the most popular rifle in Canada, for shooters in the know.

Edited August 6, 2019 by Dougie93

[bush_cheney2004]

Twelve different shootings in Toronto over the civic holiday weekend, but who noticed ?

 

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Twelve different shootings in Toronto over the civic holiday weekend, but who noticed ?

I noticed the one in the Bridal Path.

That's the super rich neighborhood, but somebody is using one of the mansions as an AirBnB, so all these black kids rented the mansion and started partying in the rich neighborhood. lol.

I think the kid who was shot survived, small caliber handgun GSW looks like.   Guaranteed he wasn't shot by a lawful gun owner with a legal gun.

[Zeitgeist]

8 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

And still, those "Indians" will far more readily and proudly identify as "Americans" than the "aboriginals" in Canada....for several reasons.   Native Americans paid their dues from the very beginning, and are part of the club without any blessing from the Crown/British, and often despite them.

Would you still insist on a handgun and "assault rifle" ban in Canada were it not for yet more comparisons and fear of what happens in the United States ?

Why does U.S. social and political conflict often drive such knee jerk reactions if everything is so swell north of the border ?

"Hey...lets ban guns because of what is happening in another country.   Great idea ! "   <= Who will vote for that ?

 

You think the natives are happier and better off down south?  Read Diary of a Part-time Indian.  The reason we’re hearing more about Indigenous concerns in Canada is because they’re being given a major spotlight.  

Look, it has been harder for mainstream Canada trying to support Indigenous languages and culture than it might have been the American way, which was basically, “This is how it’s going to go, folks. You lost the war.  Take it or leave it.”  I suppose only the Indigenous can tell you which system they prefer.  If it’s the American way, I’m sure mainstream Canada would be happy to reduce funding for Indigenous affairs.  

Edited August 6, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Zeitgeist]

3 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

Anywhoo, back to guns.

In Canada, I would say the overall value pick, is the Norinco M305, which is a Chinese copy of the American M-14.

Bizarrely, a Non-Restricted weapon in Canada, even though it's a semi-automatic 7.62 x 51mm NATO battle rifle.

A NATO battle rifle is in my opinion the most effective infantry rifle on earth, I would choose it over both the Armalite and the Kalashnikov.

For old school soldiers like me, the Assault Rifle is a step down from the Battle Rifle. Battle Rifle packs twice the punch at twice the range.

The Belgian made equivalent, with the exact same action and ammunition, the FN FAL, is Prohibited in Canada.

And yet the Chinese copy of the M-14 is not even Restricted. 

As it is Non-Restricted, you're not bound to the range like you are with the Armalite.

A Military Assault Weapon which you can take hunting on Crown land with you.

You can pick one up for around $600.00.  Way more affordable than an Armalite.

Americans can't get them, they embargo the Chinese manufacturer.

Pretty much the most popular rifle in Canada, for shooters in the know.

This and anything like it should be banned immediately.  Absolutely no justification for it.  

[Dougie93]

Just now, Zeitgeist said:

This and anything like it should be banned immediately.  Absolutely no justification for it.  

They're everywhere.  There's a whole cottage industry in Canada built around that specific gun, because for some reason its the only battle rifle that wasn't banned back in the 90's

Here's another loophole, the magazines for that M-14 have to be pinned to five rounds, but the regulation is only on the magazine.

There is no capacity limit on bolt action rifle magazines.  And here's the kicker, there is no restriction on loading a bolt action rifle magazine on an semi automatic rifle, they didn't write that into the regulation.'

Turns out, the AIA bolt action  Lee Enfield magazine happens to fit that M-14 too.  

So not only does everybody and their sister got that rifle in Canada, they've got them with ten round magazines instead of five, and it's perfectly legal.

 

[Zeitgeist]

6 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

They're everywhere.  There's a whole cottage industry in Canada built around that specific gun, because for some reason its the only battle rifle that wasn't banned back in the 90's

Here's another loophole, the magazines for that M-14 have to be pinned to five rounds, but the regulation is only on the magazine.

There is no capacity limit on bolt action rifle magazines.  And here's the kicker, there is no restriction on loading a bolt action rifle magazine on an semi automatic rifle, they didn't write that into the regulation.'

Turns out, the AIA bolt action  Lee Enfield magazine happens to fit that M-14 too.  

So not only does everybody and their sister got that rifle in Canada, they've got them with ten round magazines instead of five, and it's perfectly legal.

 

Makes Bill Blair and all the supposed government concern over shootings laughable.  These guys are useless.  

[Dougie93]

Just now, Zeitgeist said:

Makes Bill Blair and all the supposed government concern over shootings laughable.  These guys are useless.  

That's right, 

The AR15 is only Restricted in Canada because people are hysterical about that gun, that's the only gun they know, so the government makes it Restricted by the name of the weapon only.  

This gun is much more powerful than an AR15, but nobody knows about this gun except the gun community, so it has no profile, so it's not even Restricted never mind banned.

 

[Dougie93]

You know what I think it really is tho?

It's the Chinese.

The Americans embargo the manufacturer Norinco, so Canadians are actually some of Norinco's biggest customers.

This has to be one of their biggest civilian gun export markets, if not the biggest. Norinco is huge in the Canadian gun market.

I think the Chinese have influence here, because Canada banned every single other battle rifle, not Restricted them, all other Battle Rifles are Prohibited, can't get them at all.

Except the one made by the Chinese.  The one made by the Chinese is not only not Prohibited, it's not even Restricted Class.

The Chinese must be lobbying the Liberals not to ban it.

That's why gun owners in Canada own so many of these, it's the only Battle Rifle you can buy in Canada, and you don't even need the Restricted PAL to buy it.

Edited August 6, 2019 by Dougie93

[bush_cheney2004]

37 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

You think the natives are happier and better off down south?  Read Diary of a Part-time Indian.  The reason we’re hearing more about Indigenous concerns in Canada is because they’re being given a major spotlight. 

 

Is this also why you want a knee jerk reaction to ban guns in Canada....because of what is "spotlighted" in other nations ?

 

Edited August 6, 2019 by bush_cheney2004

[Zeitgeist]

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Is this also why you want a knee jerk reaction to ban guns in Canada....because of what is "highlighted" in other nations ?

 

We don’t want the mass murder shit shows down south.  Shootings have escalated up here.  We need to reverse the trend.  Why any civilian would need a “battle rifle” in Canada is beyond me.  Ridiculous and stupid.  

[bush_cheney2004]

4 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

We don’t want the mass murder shit shows down south.  Shootings have escalated up here.  We need to reverse the trend.  Why any civilian would need a “battle rifle” in Canada is beyond me.  Ridiculous and stupid.  

 

They are not just "down south"....and I am confident that other nations do not determine gun policy and legislation based on all the shootings in Canada.

Ban all the guns you want if you can, but probably not because of what you see in other nations.

[Dougie93]

19 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

We don’t want the mass murder shit shows down south.  Shootings have escalated up here.  We need to reverse the trend.  Why any civilian would need a “battle rifle” in Canada is beyond me.  Ridiculous and stupid.  

Down south?  This is the same rifle which Justin Bourque used to shoot the Mounties in Moncton.

Still not banned tho.  Not even Restricted.  

It's the Chinese.  Norinco is an entrenched interest.

The Liberals banned every single battle rifle, every single one, except the one which is made in China but can't be sold in the US, and that one, is not even Restricted?

Once you take away the US civilian gun market, there's not so many other options, Canada's gun market is very important to Norinco, and that gun is a huge seller in Canada. 

Edited August 6, 2019 by Dougie93

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, Dougie93 said:

Down south?  This is the same rifle which Justin Bourque used to shoot the Mounties in Moncton.

Still not banned tho.  Not even Restricted.  

It's the Chinese.  Norinco is an entrenched interest.

The Liberals banned every single battle rifle, every single one, except the one which is made in China but can't be sold in the US, and that one, is not even Restricted?

Once you take away the US civilian gun market, there's not so many other options, Canada's gun market is very important to Norinco, and that gun is a huge seller in Canada. 

That’s important information, Dougie, and further evidence of the Trudeau government’s obsequious attitude towards China.  So not only are we importing billions worth of Chinese goods as they stopped buying our canola, beef, and pork, and are detaining two Canadians without probable cause, we are also allowing a Chinese gun manufacturer to sell weapons useful for mass murder to civilians.  Why isn’t this all over the media?

Edited August 6, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[cannuck]

14 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

It's just my opinion,  bear in mind, to even have a state funded media, is an anathema to me, as a classical liberal limited government conservative.

The NDP is just the unionist wing of the Liberal Party of Canada, Canada is a de facto one party state, with a fake opposition.

And because the CBC is the state propaganda arm for that, they are the enemies of freedom, may their children go blind.

Dougie:  you grasp of internationally military and diplomatic history is impressive, and from what little I know, accurate.  However, you really know diddly squat about recent Canada.  The NDP was formed in a formal alliance between the CCF (Co-operative Commonwealth Federation - who's Regina Manifesto defines their very core beliefs and was only taken down from the NDP website a few years ago - out of embarrassment and pure political ambition) and the CLC (Canadian Labour Congress).  The NDP is both a true Marxist party and a trade union, but NOT in any way "Liberal" - although some luminaries such as Ed Schrier were indeed genuine Liberal/liberals).  It was PET clutching his beloved Communist Party (of Europe/France) card that shifted the LPC over to the left to tread on NDP ground and steel votes from Tommy Douglas et al.

You are right, though: it is today near impossible to tell them apart.  The real difference is that Liberal lefties wear their allegiance proudly on their arms as they walk into the offices with bags of cash to bribe their way into contracts, whereas the NDP big biz/union supporters have to put their money into party back room boys' accounts off shore - or just postpone their rewards for LAP (Life After Politics) - usually as a board appointment.

Edited August 6, 2019 by cannuck

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, cannuck said:

Dougie:  you grasp of internationally military and diplomatic history is impressive, and from what little I know, accurate.  However, you really know diddly squat about recent Canada.  The NDP was formed in a formal alliance between the CCF (Co-operative Commonwealth Federation - who's Regina Manifesto defines their very core beliefs and was only taken down from the NDP website a few years ago - out of embarrassment and pure political ambition) and the CLC (Canadian Labour Congress).  The NDP is both a true Marxist party and a trade union, but NOT in any way "Liberal" - although some luminaries such as Ed Schrier were indeed genuine Liberal/liberals).  It was PET clutching his beloved Communist Party (of Europe/France) card that shifted the LPC over to the left to tread on NDP ground and steel votes from Tommy Douglas et al.

You are right, though: it is today near impossible to tell them apart.  The real difference is that Liberal lefties wear their allegiance proudly on their arms as they walk into the offices with bags of cash to bribe their way into contracts, whereas the NDP big biz/union supporters have to put their money into party back room boys' accounts off shore - or just postpone their rewards for LAP (Life After Politics) - usually as a board appointment.

I thought the Chrétien Liberals were pretty centrist and effective.  The Liberals have swung left and become overspenders again.  They’ve also empowered some dubious, undermining special interests.  We’ll see what the election brings.  

[Dougie93]

3 hours ago, cannuck said:

Dougie:  you grasp of internationally military and diplomatic history is impressive, and from what little I know, accurate.  However, you really know diddly squat about recent Canada.  The NDP was formed in a formal alliance between the CCF (Co-operative Commonwealth Federation - who's Regina Manifesto defines their very core beliefs and was only taken down from the NDP website a few years ago - out of embarrassment and pure political ambition) and the CLC (Canadian Labour Congress).  The NDP is both a true Marxist party and a trade union, but NOT in any way "Liberal" - although some luminaries such as Ed Schrier were indeed genuine Liberal/liberals).  It was PET clutching his beloved Communist Party (of Europe/France) card that shifted the LPC over to the left to tread on NDP ground and steel votes from Tommy Douglas et al.

You are right, though: it is today near impossible to tell them apart.  The real difference is that Liberal lefties wear their allegiance proudly on their arms as they walk into the offices with bags of cash to bribe their way into contracts, whereas the NDP big biz/union supporters have to put their money into party back room boys' accounts off shore - or just postpone their rewards for LAP (Life After Politics) - usually as a board appointment.

I am aware of the history of the CCF and the NDP, but that doesn't alter the fact that the Liberal Party of Canada has successfully entrenched itself into every organ of government, so that no matter who you vote for, they will do what the Liberals do, once in power. 

Doesn't matter what these NDP clowns say they are going to do, they are not going to be allowed to deviate significantly from the Liberals anymore than the Cuckservatives would be, and that goes for the Greens too.

The Elite consensus in Canada, is the Liberals.

No matter who you vote for, all roads lead to the Liberal consensus which can never be voted out.

All the opposition parties in Canada are fake, it's a fake opposition, it's a bait and switch.

It's the same as it is in Russia, the Liberals are a Deep State, like the Siloviki, the RCMP is Canada's FSB.

The Liberals employ the exact same strategy as Putin, play on peoples fears of the Americans so they will rally around your blatant police state corruption.

The job of the CBC state propaganda arms in Canada is to whip up these fears of the Americans to facilitate that, same as in Russia.

Edited August 6, 2019 by Dougie93

[Argus]

19 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

You seem like a responsible person, but do you honestly think it’s necessary in Canada to have armed protection?

Probably not. But then, my fire and earthquake insurance will probably never be used. I'm still happy to have the peace of mind. The last time my alarm went off, while I was away, it took the cops 21 minutes to show up. I realize that's not an emergency call but even so. We have a very low number of police in this city and it can take them a while to get somewhere.

19 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

 Don’t you worry about what might result from most people keeping arms in their homes?

Only a little. I worry a lot more about all the guns in the hands of criminals, and all the criminals running around loose, even though the police know perfectly well who they are and what they're doing

 

[Dougie93]

The police themselves are dangerous, the most likely people in Canada to kick down your door and shoot you for no good reason, are the police.

Supposedly Canadians don't need assault rifles?  So why does every cop car have an assault rifle on the dash now?

Why do the police need assault rifles in the Country Which Does Not Need Assault Rifles?

The police are not the military, the police are civilians, unionized government employees, they are not soldiers, they are not under the same type of control as the army is.

The police are no more the military than you are, so why do they need military weapons?

Here's a hint; it's because Canada is a police state and you are the threat to that police state, they fear you, if you ever stand up for your rights.

The purpose of the police having military weapons is not to protect them, it's to intimidate you. 

Overwhelming firepower, lest you ever challenge the entrenched interests who run this federation like a Company Town.

To include the police themselves who are one of the most powerful entrenched interests of them all.

Edited August 6, 2019 by Dougie93