Trudeau Embarrassing Canada on the Global Stage Again

[WestCanMan]

9 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

Trump is a bigger asshole than JT and the world knows it.  Outside America the world just shakes its head at the ridiculous US administration, except perhaps guys like Netanyahu, Putin, and Taxme. 

Trump is pro-America and the world knows that. Trudeau is proud to boast that he's a post-nationalist. The world knows that he's a spineless dolt and Canada is a doormat right now.

[Zeitgeist]

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Trump is pro-America and the world knows that. Trudeau is proud to boast that he's a post-nationalist. The world knows that he's a spineless dolt and Canada is a doormat right now.

I get the "post-national" ideal, but now isn't the time with so many nationalists about.  You need fair and enforceable international rules, which the anti-globalists won't support.  Trump is interested in the zero-sum game, which in the long run is a zero-zero game.  Weakening other countries weakens markets for your goods and slows growth internationally.  Expressing cultural identity and having strong local democracy is good, but not when it includes notions of supremacy or dominance.  We've been through enough wars to know that having unfair rules or ignoring good rules hurts everyone in the long run.  Canada has accepted the dominance of other powers.  For example, France got a permanent seat on the Security Council even though Canada had one of the largest armed forces at the end of the Second World War (after the U.S., Russia, and Great Britain) and France didn't have a military.  In that regard and some others, "the game is rigged," as Trump says.  His problem is that he talks a good line about fairness but fails to see how he perpetuates unfairness and seeks new unfair advantages.  Trudeau is naïve, but he has sought to work with other countries for progressive international solutions.  With Trump it's America First, so the likes of Trudeau don't stand a chance.  

[WestCanMan]

49 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I get the "post-national" ideal, but now isn't the time with so many nationalists about.  You need fair and enforceable international rules, which the anti-globalists won't support.  Trump is interested in the zero-sum game, which in the long run is a zero-zero game.  Weakening other countries weakens markets for your goods and slows growth internationally.  Expressing cultural identity and having strong local democracy is good, but not when it includes notions of supremacy or dominance.  We've been through enough wars to know that having unfair rules or ignoring good rules hurts everyone in the long run.  Canada has accepted the dominance of other powers.  For example, France got a permanent seat on the Security Council even though Canada had one of the largest armed forces at the end of the Second World War (after the U.S., Russia, and Great Britain) and France didn't have a military.  In that regard and some others, "the game is rigged," as Trump says.  His problem is that he talks a good line about fairness but fails to see how he perpetuates unfairness and seeks new unfair advantages.  Trudeau is naïve, but he has sought to work with other countries for progressive international solutions.  With Trump it's America First, so the likes of Trudeau don't stand a chance.  

America has trade deficits with most of the countries they deal with.

It's popular to diss Trump and call him a bully but his job is to promote the US economy and protect their workers. 

Trudeau pretends to care about the workers at SNC, but now there's talk about SNC employees making a lot of illegal donations to the Liberal party. So maybe he was just covering his own ass? He certainly doesn't give a crap about 200,000 jobs in Alberta.

 

[eyeball]

19 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

The U.S. and other Five Eyes allies have already rejected Huawei for 5G, and Canada is late to the game.  

This aspect of the China/Canada/US trade thingy always tickles my funny bone.  What possible difference could it make in the scheme of things whether its Bejing looking at people's surfing habits or the 5 Eyes?

And when did everyone become so nonchalant about the 5 Eyes spying on us?  I think I must have missed that part.

[bush_cheney2004]

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

...And when did everyone become so nonchalant about the 5 Eyes spying on us?  I think I must have missed that part.

 

When...goes way back to WW2...and subsequent ECHELON.

There is no data privacy....get over it.

[eyeball]

9 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

When...goes way back to WW2...and subsequent ECHELON.

There is no data privacy....get over it.

I did, years ago.  Honestly, I just don't get what the concern is about.  Like the other 99% of us, I just generate a meaningless noise that probably only causes the stupid 5 Eyes to cross.  I might as well be worried about chemtrails if I'm going to worry about ECHELON.  BTW is shouting ECHELON supposed to make it more scary or is there some cryptic milspeak meaning to the letters?

Edited May 7, 2019 by eyeball

[bush_cheney2004]

5 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I did, years ago.  Honestly, I just don't get what the concern is about.  Like the other 99% of us, I just generate a meaningless noise that probably only causes the stupid 5 Eyes to cross.  I might as well be worried about chemtrails if I'm going to worry about ECHELON.  BTW is shouting ECHELON supposed to make it more scary or is there some cryptic milspeak meaning to the letters?

 

Nothing cryptic, just one of many intercept and analysis programs that need umbrella codewords, long since divulged to the public domain.  If we know about it, it isn't much of a secret anymore.

You are right about one thing, we do use torrents of meaningless noise to flood "enemy" intercepts.   Stuff like baseball box scores or cake recipes.   It's a fun game to play.

But getting back to Trudeau, it appears at face value that he was not prepared for such a world of spying and backstabbing, and Chretien could only carry him so far.

Trudeau's naive "sunny ways" were a waste of time and now he has to play hard ball anyway...from down many runs.

[Rue]

On 4/30/2019 at 8:25 PM, Mikeyboy said:

Of course he made a mistake and apologized later to Abe but why not focus on the positive outcome as opposed to your shitty gotcha mantra.Trudeau has managed to finesse a Pacific free trade partnership with a key player in world trade.We get access to Japanese markets for many of our products and they continue to invest in our auto sectors etc.I suggest you travel more and if you did you would realize how blessed we are as a non tribal secular society and appreciate a PM who at least tries to establish trade relations with ECC and the Pacific in the light of the unreliable US markets ,thanks to Trump.Your wonderful Harper government managed a free trade agreement with Israel and that thug Netyanou to bring in oranges and tile to Canada duty free in exchange for ??

I HAVE put aside your worship of Trudeau. All I can say about that is you may have malaria.

In regards to your hyperbole about Trudeau managing to finesse a Pacific free trade partnership with a key player in world trade please explain that. Our entering into an agreement with the Trans Pacific has nothing to do with finessing Japan. It has to do with taking advantage of the fact the US did not. Yes there will be increased trade with Japan but it works both ways, there will be increased trade from  Japan to Canada. No ne finessed anyone and this has nothing to do with Trudeau and everything to do with world market conditions.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/cptpp-in-effect-sunday-1.4955582

https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/cptpp-free-trade-deal-takes-effect-what-it-means-for-canada-1.4235054

 

In regards to trade with Israel how about instead of you spelling Netanyahu's name wrong you find out about what is being traded before you refer to oranges.

https://lop.parl.ca/sites/PublicWebsite/default/en_CA/ResearchPublications/TradeAndInvestment/201445E

https://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/ci-ci/assets/pdfs/fact_sheet-fiche_documentaire/Israel-FS-en.pdf

https://tradingeconomics.com/israel/exports/canada

https://www.tradecommissioner.gc.ca/israel/market-facts-faits-sur-le-marche/0002032.aspx?lang=eng

https://ciirdf.ca/proposition-de-valeur/

[Rue]

On 5/6/2019 at 12:08 PM, WestCanMan said:

Trump is pro-America and the world knows that. 

With respect I disagree with the above comment.

source:https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/404629-trump-is-failing-to-bring-back-american-jobs

"Our study reveals that the Trump administration has awarded more than $50 billion in new federal contracts to companies that continue to shutter U.S. factories as they seek cheaper labor abroad.   

As a result, top federal contractors - Carrier’s parent company United Technologies, General Motors, Honeywell and Siemens - are now offshoring jobs at the fastest rate since the Great Recession. In fact, annual offshoring by taxpayer-funded corporations under Trump is on track to be three times greater than under the Obama and Bush administrations.

Overall, more than 133,000 Americans have received pink slips since Trump took office.

President Trump has the power to stop giving taxpayer dollars to companies that outsource jobs.  However, even though he’s signed more than 100 executive orders and memoranda, he has yet to sign a single one that delivers on his promise to “create more jobs” by stopping offshoring.

For working-class voters who supported Trump, his inaction is political hypocrisy."

Also just for fun:

https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/general/news/2017/04/26/431299/100-ways-100-days-trump-hurt-americans/

 

The only thing Trump is pro is his ego.

 

[Rue]

16 hours ago, eyeball said:

This aspect of the China/Canada/US trade thingy always tickles my funny bone.  What possible difference could it make in the scheme of things whether its Bejing looking at people's surfing habits or the 5 Eyes?

And when did everyone become so nonchalant about the 5 Eyes spying on us?  I think I must have missed that part.

You giggle too much Eyeball.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/china-russia-pose-grave-national-security-threats-to-canada_2875189.html

 

 

[bush_cheney2004]

Trudeau and Freeland acknowledge their weakness on the world stage...again:

 

Quote

Canada affirms Arctic co-operation with U.S. despite climate impasse

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/climate-change-us-arctic-policy-1.5125715

 

[WestCanMan]

51 minutes ago, Rue said:

With respect I disagree with the above comment.

source:https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/404629-trump-is-failing-to-bring-back-american-jobs

"Our study reveals that the Trump administration has awarded more than $50 billion in new federal contracts to companies that continue to shutter U.S. factories as they seek cheaper labor abroad.   

As a result, top federal contractors - Carrier’s parent company United Technologies, General Motors, Honeywell and Siemens - are now offshoring jobs at the fastest rate since the Great Recession. In fact, annual offshoring by taxpayer-funded corporations under Trump is on track to be three times greater than under the Obama and Bush administrations.

Overall, more than 133,000 Americans have received pink slips since Trump took office.

President Trump has the power to stop giving taxpayer dollars to companies that outsource jobs.  However, even though he’s signed more than 100 executive orders and memoranda, he has yet to sign a single one that delivers on his promise to “create more jobs” by stopping offshoring.

For working-class voters who supported Trump, his inaction is political hypocrisy."

Also just for fun:

https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/general/news/2017/04/26/431299/100-ways-100-days-trump-hurt-americans/

 

The only thing Trump is pro is his ego.

 

"$50 billion in new federal contracts to companies that continue to shutter U.S. factories as they seek cheaper labor abroad" is a lot. But does your source say how many $B the gov't has awarded to companies in general? Twice that? Probably 50x that amount? 

Unemployment in the US is so low that those 133,000 people all found work within 5 minutes of being laid off.

LOL at the idea that working class voters haven't benefitted greatly from the Trump administration. More jobs, higher average wage, lower taxes.... Are you kidding me?

 

[Rue]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

"$50 billion in new federal contracts to companies that continue to shutter U.S. factories as they seek cheaper labor abroad" is a lot. But does your source say how many $B the gov't has awarded to companies in general? Twice that? Probably 50x that amount? 

Unemployment in the US is so low that those 133,000 people all found work within 5 minutes of being laid off.

LOL at the idea that working class voters haven't benefitted greatly from the Trump administration. More jobs, higher average wage, lower taxes.... Are you kidding me?

 

No to no.1 because it has not care to provide stats?

 In regards to no.2 unemployment rates do not and have never been accurate because as you know they do not account for permanently unemployed or any unemployed people who do not receive unemployment benefits.

https://slate.com/business/2018/05/the-unemployment-rate-is-historically-low-and-meaningless.html

https://www.valuewalk.com/2015/04/why-the-us-unemployment-rate-may-be-wrong/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/anaswanson/2015/03/31/what-if-americas-unemployment-rate-is-really-wrong/#1d42cb0d5e83

 In regards to 3  I can concede some of what you say yes but here is why I do not think it is as significant as you seem to suggest:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/09/upshot/how-good-is-the-trump-economy-really.html

Also I would argue some of the credit Trump is taking for himself is not as a result of his policies since he was elected:

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/30/16945146/trump-economic-record

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/12/trump-miracle-economy-credit/548882/

Also I think the price or cost of what I s happening should also be considered not just the numbers:

https://www.truthdig.com/articles/the-untold-story-of-trumps-booming-economy/

That said Wes, I concede 71% of Americans feel Trump has made the economy better and will give him credit for it and so he will be re-elected.

He has people convinced he changed the economy.

The only way I can see an argument made as to  anything he has done is to argue his tax cuts have had a positive impact on the economy but Wes

GROWTH  rates in  the US economy have not really changed that much.

Getting back to the thread I think both Trudeau and Trump for entirely different reasons have embarrassed their nations.

 

 

 

Edited May 7, 2019 by Rue

[Hal 9000]

[Rue]

1 minute ago, Hal 9000 said:

Sorry Hal I can't see the point you are making. Is that Moishe Dayan?

 

[Hal 9000]

No point, just thought it might give some levity....and no, it's not Moshe Dayan.

[eyeball]

4 hours ago, Rue said:

You giggle too much Eyeball.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/china-russia-pose-grave-national-security-threats-to-canada_2875189.html

That's a little rich coming from the original forum giggler.

In the meantime...

Quote

 

Overall, we rate The Epoch Times Right-Center Biased and High for factual reporting regarding USA news, however we rate them Mixed overall due to the publication of Pseudoscience. This source is also highly biased against communist news in regards to China.

Detailed Report

 

 

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, Rue said:

No to no.1 because it has not care to provide stats?

 In regards to no.2 unemployment rates do not and have never been accurate because as you know they do not account for permanently unemployed or any unemployed people who do not receive unemployment benefits.

https://slate.com/business/2018/05/the-unemployment-rate-is-historically-low-and-meaningless.html

https://www.valuewalk.com/2015/04/why-the-us-unemployment-rate-may-be-wrong/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/anaswanson/2015/03/31/what-if-americas-unemployment-rate-is-really-wrong/#1d42cb0d5e83

 In regards to 3  I can concede some of what you say yes but here is why I do not think it is as significant as you seem to suggest:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/09/upshot/how-good-is-the-trump-economy-really.html

Also I would argue some of the credit Trump is taking for himself is not as a result of his policies since he was elected:

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/30/16945146/trump-economic-record

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/12/trump-miracle-economy-credit/548882/

Also I think the price or cost of what I s happening should also be considered not just the numbers:

https://www.truthdig.com/articles/the-untold-story-of-trumps-booming-economy/

That said Wes, I concede 71% of Americans feel Trump has made the economy better and will give him credit for it and so he will be re-elected.

He has people convinced he changed the economy.

The only way I can see an argument made as to  anything he has done is to argue his tax cuts have had a positive impact on the economy but Wes

GROWTH  rates in  the US economy have not really changed that much.

Getting back to the thread I think both Trudeau and Trump for entirely different reasons have embarrassed their nations.

 

 

 

I'm not one of those people who moans about "Obama's economy had the slowest recovery since WWII" or whatever it is that they say. The economy was in a tailspin when Obama was elected and it got squarely back on track while he was there. He deserves kudos imo.

I think you'd have to be a sore loser not to concede the fact, that the Dems constantly try to make, that the economic numbers were all trending upwards when Obama was Prez. I guess Bush could also say that the stimulus package that Obama got voted in was one that the Republicans were trying to get put through as well. Republicans say Obama doubled the debt, but the stimulus pkg that he had to implement at the start was probably a big part of that. Back and forth, blah blah blah. 

But back to the topic at hand... we all know that trends hit a natural peak and then plateau and trend downwards again for a bit, then go up... but what happened when Trump became President wasn't just the continuation of Obama's economy at all. 

https://www.macrotrends.net/1358/dow-jones-industrial-average-last-10-years

Look at the DJ Avg for Oct 2013 to Nov 6th 2016: 

Nov 22 2013 the DJ hit 16K for the first time. It was at 17,888 at closing on Friday Nov 4th, right before the election. It went up 1,888 points inBarack's last 3 years. By Dec 26th the DJ avg was already up 1,888 points from when Trump took over, just 50 days later. By Jan 2018 it was up 10,000 points from where it was on Nov 22 2013. That's insane. 10,000 points is 63% of the 16,000 it was at in Nov 2013.

The plain fact is that the US economy responded to Trump like a dog responds to the word treat, walk, park or ball. People trying to give Obama credit for that are talking out of their asses. 

 

[egghead]

6 hours ago, Rue said:

With respect I disagree with the above comment.

source:https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/404629-trump-is-failing-to-bring-back-american-jobs

 

To be fair, it was old news (2017??), and you forgot to mention that he let those companies brought money back with tax discount.

Edited May 8, 2019 by egghead

[bush_cheney2004]

Another Trudeau government embarrassment...this time for VE-Day.    I never knew that German (Nazi) soldiers were celebrated by Veterans Affairs Canada.

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/veterans-affairs-nazis-video-ve-day-1.5130515

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Another Trudeau government embarrassment...this time for VE-Day.    I never knew that German (Nazi) soldiers were celebrated by Veterans Affairs Canada.

It's called inclusivity.  Veterans Affairs were probably approached by the Minister for Inclusivity and Diversity and told what to put in the video.

[GostHacked]

On 5/10/2019 at 4:52 PM, bush_cheney2004 said:

Another Trudeau government embarrassment...this time for VE-Day.    I never knew that German (Nazi) soldiers were celebrated by Veterans Affairs Canada.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/veterans-affairs-nazis-video-ve-day-1.5130515

Operation Paperclip. ..... Botching a video is embarrassing.  Bringing Nazi's into the USA after WWII was on purpose.

[Dougie93]

11 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

Operation Paperclip. ..... Botching a video is embarrassing.  Bringing Nazi's into the USA after WWII was on purpose.

The National Socialists were never the enemies of the Americans to start off with.

The Americans originally underwrote the fascists as the Bulwark Against Communism.

The dispute arose over Hitler flipping sides to Mussolini at which point Germany threatened the route through Suez to India and Indochina.

Thus why Britain and France declared war on Germany.

When the Germans took France and imperiled Britain, America intervened to protect its investments, having bailed the Entente Cordiale out in 1916.

Once the Americans had secured their European assets, they welcomed the fascists back into the fold as the Bulwark Against Communism.

[GostHacked]

1 minute ago, Dougie93 said:

The National Socialists were never the enemies of the Americans to start off with.

The Americans originally underwrote the fascists as the Bulwark Against Communism.

The dispute arose over Hitler flipping sides to Mussolini at which point Germany threatened the route through Suez to India and Indochina.

Thus why Britain and France declared war on Germany.

When the Germans took France and imperiled Britain, America intervened to protect its investments, having bailed the Entente Cordiale out in 1916.

Once the Americans had secured their European assets, they welcomed the fascists back into the fold as the Bulwark Against Communism.

Also good to note.

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

Also good to note.

Also note that the British and French Empires in India and Indochina were not any different that what Hitler wanted to build in Eastern Europe.

Moreover Hitler's plan was based on the American conquest of the Indians in North America.

Even tiny Belgium which Canada went to war for in 1915, was a monstrous slave empire comparable to the Nazis, see; the Congo.