Federal Election 2019

[WestCanMan]

Check the poll...

[August1991]

WestCanMan, you ask posters now who they will vote for?

In effect, you are asking posters to declare whether they prefer Team A or Team B. (Or "Someone else -Please say in your comments?" WTF?)

Better to ask (more polite, nuanced): "IYO, which party will win in the next federal election?"

=====

In your next OP, you can ask about majority/minority.... 

Edited April 24, 2019 by August1991

[QuebecOverCanada]

I might vote Conservative. Bernier's campaign is going no where sadly and Trudeau has got to go for a while now.

[jacee]

Don’t make election about immigration, corporate Canada tells political leaders

https://www.nationalnewswatch.com/2019/04/26/dont-make-election-about-immigration-corporate-canada-tells-political-leaders/#.XMQn0-FE00N

I certainly agree.

Don't make the election about xenophobia.

We have always benefited from immigration, and we will always plan for immigration to meet our economic needs and accept refugees to meet our international obligations. 

This nonsense is just a distraction from our real challenge: Moving from an outdated economy always too heavily reliant on extraction industries to a sustainable industrial model and planning to meet the financial demands of climate change.

[OftenWrong]

1 hour ago, jacee said:

We have always benefited from immigration, and we will always plan for immigration to meet our economic needs and accept refugees to meet our international obligations. 

We don't always plan very effectively. We are not doing it properly right now, the evidence is there if you are willing to acknowledge it. In recent times this government has had to make changes to their position on how to handle the influx of people who call themselves refugees, but who do not qualify. This has a ripple effect throughout the system creating a huge backlog, and refugee applicants cannot be processed in a reasonable time due to huge backlog. The problem continues to grow. This is a valid topic for discussion, just like anything else.

Also, the idea of taking orders from corporate Canada? Sorry, no. We know what they hold as dear to their hearts, nothing but money. It is quite interesting that they would take a political position on immigration. Very interesting.

[OftenWrong]

 

On 4/23/2019 at 11:08 PM, WestCanMan said:

Check the poll...

It says the poll is closed. ?

[Michael Hardner]

4 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Also, the idea of taking orders from corporate Canada? 

Why would we stop NOW ?

[OftenWrong]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

Why would we stop NOW ?

Awokeness.

[jacee]

4 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

 

It says the poll is closed. ?

Ya ... 3 people responded. 

[OftenWrong]

Just now, jacee said:

Ya ... 3 people responded. 

No one can respond if its closed, doh.

[jacee]

9 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

We don't always plan very effectively. We are not doing it properly right now, the evidence is there if you are willing to acknowledge it. In recent times this government has had to make changes to their position on how to handle the influx of people who call themselves refugees, but who do not qualify. This has a ripple effect throughout the system creating a huge backlog, and refugee applicants cannot be processed in a reasonable time due to huge backlog. The problem continues to grow. This is a valid topic for discussion, just like anything else.

Yes, of course it is. And you have just pointed out that our system is working: The influx of asylum-seekers from the US is not of our making, they are being processed, yes there are backlogs, some qualify as refugees and many don't.

What evidence can you provide that the problem is "growing"? That's not my understanding.

18 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Also, the idea of taking orders from corporate Canada? Sorry, no. We know what they hold as dear to their hearts, nothing but money. It is quite interesting that they would take a political position on immigration. Very interesting.

'Corporate Canada' has a right to express an opinion. Governments may or may not 'take orders' from them, depending how it plays for them politically, who their political donors are, etc. That's just the usual political gaming, and as Michael says "Why should we stop now?" 

I think we should take away some of the power of Corporate Canada to control our politicians, by implementing Proportional Representation. I think That's a much more important issue for the next federal election than immigration. 

[OftenWrong]

47 minutes ago, jacee said:

What evidence can you provide that the problem is "growing"? That's not my understanding.

Surely you're aware of the sudden influx of people crossing into Canada illegally that has overwhelmed the system? That is a real and continuing problem. The backlog is huge now and has put strain on other resources, including housing for the homeless. It's my understanding that the government is scrambling to find places for these refugee applicants to stay, including use of hotels and resorts, which the taxpayer is covering. That's a separate issue.

The third problem is that Mr. Trudeau has politicized the issue himself. He portrays the Liberal party as the only ones who care about immigration. Of course, the other parties must now defend their position. Immigration is a high profile topic in the political debate, sustained by the immoderate PM himself. 

[Michael Hardner]

6 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Surely you're aware of the sudden influx of people crossing into Canada illegally that has overwhelmed the system? That is a real and continuing problem. The backlog is huge now and has put strain on other resources, including housing for the homeless. 

But - as JC asked - is it still 'growing' ?  Or are we talking about a few years ago ?

[OftenWrong]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

But - as JC asked - is it still 'growing' ?  Or are we talking about a few years ago ?

Let' say the influx since 2017 is 20,000 a year. The average before 2017 was 5,000 a year. That is what they are prepared to handle.

[Michael Hardner]

30 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Let' say the influx since 2017 is 20,000 a year. The average before 2017 was 5,000 a year. That is what they are prepared to handle.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-federal-statistics-show-slight-increase-in-irregular-migrant-claims-in/

"Let's say" ... or you could look it up.

Unbelievably the government has put its own statistics behind a password wall...

It's not 20K

[OftenWrong]

2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-federal-statistics-show-slight-increase-in-irregular-migrant-claims-in/

"Let's say" ... or you could look it up.

Unbelievably the government has put its own statistics behind a password wall...

It's not 20K

I usually do not post without looking things up. You can view the statistics from here-

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/refugees/asylum-claims/processed-claims.html

If you are having further difficulty, feel free to ask.

Best,
OW

[eyeball]

4 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Also, the idea of taking orders from corporate Canada? Sorry, no. We know what they hold as dear to their hearts, nothing but money. It is quite interesting that they would take a political position on immigration. Very interesting.

 lol.

It's cute watching conservatives getting all concerned about greedy corporations.  Don't get me wrong its encouraging to see but just too late.

[eyeball]

4 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Awokeness.

Too little too late.

[OftenWrong]

23 minutes ago, eyeball said:

 lol.

It's cute watching conservatives getting all concerned about greedy corporations.  Don't get me wrong its encouraging to see but just too late.

You have confused a commitment to defend democracy and to uphold the law, which are among the fundamental tenets of conservatism, with mere partisanship. Confusion is not unusual among liberals.

It is never too late when so many liberals are going the wrong way. Someone has to stand up and speak out against the BS. Otherwise, up we all go...

[Michael Hardner]

6 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

I usually do not post without looking things up. You can view the statistics from here-

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/refugees/asylum-claims/processed-claims.html

If you are having further difficulty, feel free to ask.

Best,
OW

Seems like you don't have stats after 2016, which I have difficulty with.  As I posted the CDN government had the more recent stats and for some stupid reason has shuttered them.

This shows 10K claims made in 2016 though - weren't you saying 20K ?  Also - this isn't the 'irregular border crossers' but people making official claims at ports of entry.

Make sense ?

[OftenWrong]

34 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Seems like you don't have stats after 2016, which I have difficulty with.  As I posted the CDN government had the more recent stats and for some stupid reason has shuttered them.

This shows 10K claims made in 2016 though - weren't you saying 20K ?  Also - this isn't the 'irregular border crossers' but people making official claims at ports of entry.

Make sense ?

No. 2018 data
https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/refugees/asylum-claims/asylum-claims-2018.html

Shows a total of 19419 RCMP interceptions. 2017 data similarly shows 20,593 RCMP interceptions. These are not the ones detained at border crossings. Those are shown separately in other graphs below. The total comes closer to 50,000 per year, which is the number I remember reading about, from memory. However I didn't want to say without backing it up.

Scroll further down to the data which shows-

Summary of Asylum Claimants processed by the Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA), January - December 2017

Shows the grand totals, they are much higher than 20,000. It has gone up about ten-fold from the data before 2016.

Edited April 27, 2019 by OftenWrong

[OftenWrong]

35 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Make sense ?

No. The government web site is not easy to navigate. On the left is a sidebar, click on the year you want.

[jacee]

5 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

You have confused a commitment to defend democracy and to uphold the law, which are among the fundamental tenets of conservatism, with mere partisanship. Confusion is not unusual among liberals.

It is never too late when so many liberals are going the wrong way. Someone has to stand up and speak out against the BS. Otherwise, up we all go...

But ... you're OftenWrong.

[Michael Hardner]

1 hour ago, OftenWrong said:

1. Shows a total of 19419 RCMP interceptions. 2017 data similarly shows 20,593 RCMP interceptions. These are not the ones detained at border crossings. Those are shown separately in other graphs below. The total comes closer to 50,000 per year, which is the number I remember reading about, from memory. However I didn't want to say without backing it up.

Scroll further down to the data which shows-

Summary of Asylum Claimants processed by the Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA), January - December 2017

2. Shows the grand totals, they are much higher than 20,000. It has gone up about ten-fold from the data before 2016.

1. Ok - I accept that.  Here's a table specifically about border crossing 

https://irb-cisr.gc.ca/en/statistics/Pages/Irregular-border-crosser-statistics.aspx

2. I think yours shows total claimants not so-called 'illegal' ones.

 

[OftenWrong]

3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

2. I think yours shows total claimants not so-called 'illegal' ones.

The definition is shown in the link. For the purposes of this report, irregular border crossers are defined as individuals who entered Canada between official ports of entry.

I interpret this to mean, people who entered Canada at an illegal point of entry. So anywhere other than the official ports. Therefore it is only a portion of the total.

The numbes say to me it could be 40-50,000. However to be conservative I said, "Let's say it's 20,000 a year". I am way ahead of you. Now that you agree, what was your question again?

Edited April 28, 2019 by OftenWrong