Federal Election 2019

[WestCanMan]

33 minutes ago, dialamah said:

 I won't vote Conservative, even though I don't like JT much - Conservative ideology is too much like fundamental Christians/Muslims for my liking - demanding that people conform to certain sexual mores and behaviors, excluding people based on "tribalism", rejecting science and making the economy/low taxes a priority over the environment and people.  Not interested in any of that.  

Conservatives aren't bigots. Stop watching CNN. Real bigotry is dividing people into groups like the Libs and Dems do. 

Yes there are a lot of christian fundamentalists who favour the Republican party, and some of them have an anti-lgbtq stance, but that's a minority within that voting block. The majority of conservatives don't care about homosexuality. It's just a naturally occurring thing. 

The strongest consensus that you'll find within the ranks of modern conservatives is a more sensible stance on abortion. It went from within 3 months, to 6 months, to 1 second before the head pops out, to post-natal "I don't like it, kill it." It's insane.

"Denying science"? LMAO! Global warming is a hoax and people like Beto O'Rourke who say that "100% of climate scientists agree" it's a thing are straight-up lying to you. You should be ashamed if you believe that, because it means that you have your head in the sand, just getting all your info from one source.

I bet that you eat up all the nonsense about how bad the oil sands are too lol. You just watch left-wing media and you memorize, regurgitate, memorize, regurgitate and you don't question anything.  

[dialamah]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Conservatives aren't bigots. Stop watching CNN.

I don't watch CNN, or CBC for that matter.  I read this forum; this is where I got my learning on Conservatives.   Before I came here 4 years ago I was much more apolitical, I didn't even really know what differentiated Liberals from Conservatives.   It's been an education, and not a fun one.

You are right, not all Canadian or even American conservatives are bigots, perhaps not even many.  Nonetheless, the Conservative ideology accepts bigotry more readily than does the Liberal ideology.  Thus, a bigot is more likely to find a home with conservatives than liberals.

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Real bigotry is dividing people into groups like the Libs and Dems do

Not long after I started reading this forum, I noticed that conservative types seemed awfully fond of assigning people to "the other side" and then insulting them.  I thought maybe this was some kind of bias on my part, so I took a few hours and counted back through a variety of threads.  Turns out that the conservative posters were nearly twice as likely to insult liberals than the other way around.  Of course, this is a pretty small sample, so I can't say it's germane to the larger world of conservatives vs. liberals - but I do see a similar trend on FB as well.  Insulting "the other" is a divisive tactic.  

Further, it is conservatives/republicans who are most concerned about refugees, immigrants, Mexicans and Muslims coming into "their" country.   It is conservatives who tend to want to punish women for having abortions, people for being gay or transexual.  Who is 'dividing people into groups' there?   Not liberals.

Conservatives are no less divisive than liberals; take some responsibility for your "side", instead of always pretending that conservatives have some moral high ground on creating cohesion in society.  They don't.

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

LMAO! Global warming is a hoax

LMAO, say the residents of entire communities who have already had to relocate due to climate change.  LMAO say the mayors along the Florida Coastline, as they try to figure out how to protect their cities from the inevitable effects of climate change.  LMAO say scientists as they watch landscapes change, animals migrate due to climate change.  No doubt you'll be laughing till the effect of climate change hits your pocketbook or your life.

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

I bet that you eat up all the nonsense about how bad the oil sands are too lol.

I try to avoid 'extremes' on either side; I double check and research both liberal claims and conservative claims.  

You are so sure you know everything about me, eh?  I admit, I don't know very much about the oil sands, really - one side says they leave a huge mess (plausible), and the other side says that the mess can be cleaned up (plausible).   I support the pipeline and believe it is the safest way to move oil.  I don't think we can give up oil all-of-a-sudden or completely, until we have more viable green alternatives and more buy-in from the climate change deniers.  It'll come eventually, I'm sure, and hopefully not too late.  I think Alberta has a valid complaint against BC, but I also think Alberta (and Alberta residents) could show a little more concern for the environmental effects of the oil industry.

Quote

You just watch left right-wing media and you memorize, regurgitate, memorize, regurgitate and you don't question anything.  

Two can play at that game, eh?

Edited April 30, 2019 by dialamah

[jacee]

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Conservatives aren't bigots. Stop watching CNN. Real bigotry is dividing people into groups like the Libs and Dems do. 

Yes there are a lot of christian fundamentalists who favour the Republican party, and some of them have an anti-lgbtq stance, but that's a minority within that voting block. The majority of conservatives don't care about homosexuality. It's just a naturally occurring thing. 

The strongest consensus that you'll find within the ranks of modern conservatives is a more sensible stance on abortion. It went from within 3 months, to 6 months, to 1 second before the head pops out, to post-natal "I don't like it, kill it." It's insane.

"Denying science"? LMAO! Global warming is a hoax and people like Beto O'Rourke who say that "100% of climate scientists agree" it's a thing are straight-up lying to you. You should be ashamed if you believe that, because it means that you have your head in the sand, just getting all your info from one source.

I bet that you eat up all the nonsense about how bad the oil sands are too lol. You just watch left-wing media and you memorize, regurgitate, memorize, regurgitate and you don't question anything.  

That whole post has a US context.

Did you let your camouflage slip? 

[WestCanMan]

3 hours ago, dialamah said:

You are right, not all Canadian or even American conservatives are bigots, perhaps not even many.  Nonetheless, the Conservative ideology accepts bigotry more readily than does the Liberal ideology.  Thus, a bigot is more likely to find a home with conservatives than liberals.

The Dems down south openly associate with Louis Farrakhan Jr., they publicly support some of his ideas. He is one of the most outspoken bigots in all of North America.

Ilhan Omar is also an outspoken anti-Semite and she's a Dem Congresswoman. 

The Liberals here have refused to comment specifically on hate rallies against Jews that were held by Muslims out on the streets in various cities in Ontario. Actual hate rallies with calls for genocide no less.

I guess I can stop right there, your point is shot to hell.

Quote

Not long after I started reading this forum, I noticed that conservative types seemed awfully fond of assigning people to "the other side" and then insulting them.  I thought maybe this was some kind of bias on my part, so I took a few hours and counted back through a variety of threads.  Turns out that the conservative posters were nearly twice as likely to insult liberals than the other way around.  Of course, this is a pretty small sample, so I can't say it's germane to the larger world of conservatives vs. liberals - but I do see a similar trend on FB as well.  Insulting "the other" is a divisive tactic.  

I'm reminded of the time that Trump referred to Hillary's supporters as the "basket of deplorables". Oh wait, that was Hillary. Ever hear the never-ending cries of collusion, despite zero evidence, after two years worth of investigation by the FBI? Notice that Hillary paid Russians for that info? Isn't that collusion?

 

Here's the most disgusting, despicable act of bigotry in our country over the 4 years. Trudeau slammed Canadians for bigotry over the hijab cutting story (where the girl even pinned the attack on a visible minority), and then when it was determined to be fake, he doubled down on his condemnation of Canadians instead of admitting to his own gaffe and calling out the perpetrator for her own bigotry.

Here's another example of your poster boy being as divisive as humanly possible.:

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Further, it is conservatives/republicans who are most concerned about refugees, immigrants, Mexicans and Muslims coming into "their" country.   It is conservatives who tend to want to punish women for having abortions, people for being gay or transexual.  Who is 'dividing people into groups' there?   Not liberals.

Republicans are worried about 1) illegal immigrants and 2) terrorists. That's not racist at all. Mexicans don't want the caravans either and no one wants terrorists except for Trudeau.

No one is punishing women for having abortions, that's an outright lie. Ditto for homosexuality and transsexuality. There's just a bathroom issue that has a lot to do with people being concerned about who's going into the bathroom with their little girls. Unfortunately that's an actual issue, but again, it's not discriminatory. They don't want straight males going into the girls' washrooms either.

Quote

 

Conservatives are no less divisive than liberals; take some responsibility for your "side", instead of always pretending that conservatives have some moral high ground on creating cohesion in society.  They don't.

 

The / sign is less divise than Liberals.

Quote

LMAO, say the residents of entire communities who have already had to relocate due to climate change.  LMAO say the mayors along the Florida Coastline, as they try to figure out how to protect their cities from the inevitable effects of climate change.  LMAO say scientists as they watch landscapes change, animals migrate due to climate change.  No doubt you'll be laughing till the effect of climate change hits your pocketbook or your life.

The climate is always changing. What we call a "big change" is actually not a big change at all in the grand scheme of things, and it's part of a larger cycle that has nothing to do with "man-made greenhouse gases".

The only reason that things seem worse is because there are 7 billion people on the planet now and we have video recordings of every event that happens on any corner of the earth. If a small flood happened somewhere 80 years ago, very few people would be affected by it, no one would videotape it, and so it wouldn't make news anywhere else on the planet.  

Every year people get all hyped up about these huge hurricanes over the Atlantic: "There have never been this many level 5 hurricanes - ahhhhhhhhh it's the end of times!!!!!!" Again - fake. No one tracked category 5 hurricanes out over the ocean until just recently. We wouldn't know if there were 1,000 of them in 1958.

Quote

 

I try to avoid 'extremes' on either side; I double check and research both liberal claims and conservative claims.  

 

Maybe you're not doing a good job of checking up on some of these accusations. Like the phony ones against Kavanaugh and Trump for example. My favorite was Lisa Swetnik's story "I went to ten gang parties back in the '80's and it was always Kavanaugh and his gang." LMAO!!!!!!!!!! Who would go to a 2nd one? A 3rd one? A 9th one, are you f'n kidding me? Nope. Ten gang rape parties. Doesn't remember where any of them were. Didn't report any of them. Didn't bother to stop her friends from going to any of them. Is that what a plausible accusation even looks like? That accusation made Avanatti a star in the democrat party ffs.

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You are so sure you know everything about me, eh?  I admit, I don't know very much about the oil sands, really - one side says they leave a huge mess (plausible), and the other side says that the mess can be cleaned up (plausible).   

Nope. One side actually says that large parts of the oil sands were actually a toxic wasteland before they came and that it supports life now. It's better now than it was when they started. 

But don't stop listening to Leonardo DiCaprio - he spent a lot of money to get there on his private jet to raise awareness of CO2 emissions. His rally cry should be something like "STOP THE PEONS FROM POLLUTING!!!!"

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I support the pipeline and believe it is the safest way to move oil.   

The pipelines are being shut down because foreign lobbyists from Saudi Arabia and the US want them shut down. Some people don't want Alberta oil on the market against their blood oil, or their domestic oil, and some extremely wealthy railway owners make boatloads of money on oil that is shipped by rail. How much does it cost to buy off a few hereditary chiefs? How many SJWs will take money to go be professional protestors? 

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I don't think we can give up oil all-of-a-sudden or completely, until we have more viable green alternatives and more buy-in from the climate change deniers.

Once again - climate change is real, but humans aren't a part of the equation.

Quote

I also think Alberta (and Alberta residents) could show a little more concern for the environmental effects of the oil industry.

Alberta makes a small percentage of the oil in the world. Alberta doesn't use slave labour or child labour. Their workers are paid handsomely. Their respect for the environment is unmatched. It's not part of a country where political/religious beheadings are commonplace, religious bigotry is mandatory, leaving the official religion of the country will get you the death penalty, and misogyny is a time-honoured tradition. 

[WestCanMan]

3 hours ago, jacee said:

That whole post has a US context.

Did you let your camouflage slip? 

Nope. I'm Canadian. But I'll admit that I watch a lot of American news. CTV and CBC are like CNN-lite, or CNN North. I can't watch Ezra Levant ramble on and I am not as far right as Gavin McInness, etc. Canada is like a black hole for conservative viewpoints on television. Even Global News is a farce. 

Re: Beto - if a Canadian ever said anything as absurd as "100% of climate scientists" and I knew about it then I'd be all over it. 

[jacee]

4 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

The Liberals here have refused to comment specifically on hate rallies against Jews that were held by Muslims out on the streets in various cities in Ontario. Actual hate rallies with calls for genocide no less.

Link? 

 

[dialamah]

4 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I guess I can stop right there, your point is shot to hell

Bigots are more likely to find a home with conservatives.  Just look at Donald Trump.  Also, consider that Twitter cannot design an algorithm that would effectively ban White Supremacy because so many Republicans (aka conservatives) would be banned.

But external experts Motherboard spoke to said that the measures taken against ISIS were so extreme that, if applied to white supremacy, there would certainly be backlash, because algorithms would obviously flag content that has been tweeted by prominent Republicans—or, at the very least, their supporters. So it’s no surprise, then, that employees at the company have realized that as well.

The rest of your post appears to be some weird mix of conspiracy theories and science denial, so I will just leave you to it.

[bush_cheney2004]

1 minute ago, dialamah said:

Bigots are more likely to find a home with conservatives.  Just look at Donald Trump.  Also, consider that Twitter cannot design an algorithm that would effectively ban White Supremacy because so many Republicans (aka conservatives) would be banned.

 

 

Gee...this too seems to have a U.S. context.

Odd, since the  bigots in Canada have long found a home with Liberals....for generations.

[jacee]

9 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

How many SJWs will take money to go be professional protestors? 

Now there's a worn out troll lie. 

Surely you can do better to earn your troll bucks. 

[jacee]

9 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Here's the most disgusting, despicable act of bigotry in our country over the 4 years. Trudeau slammed Canadians for bigotry over the hijab cutting story (where the girl even pinned the attack on a visible minority), and then when it was determined to be fake, he doubled down on his condemnation of Canadians instead of admitting to his own gaffe and calling out the perpetrator for her own bigotry.

You think the PM should have publicly humiliated an 11 year old girl? Are you for real?

Bigots seeks to dehumanize others, but they really only dehumanize themselves.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, jacee said:

You think the PM should have publicly humiliated an 11 year old girl? Are you for real?

Bigots seeks to dehumanize others, but they really only dehumanize themselves.

I can't remember the story too well.  Did he apologise to those he called bigots?  Was the 11 year old at least sent to her room?

[WestCanMan]

10 hours ago, jacee said:

Link? 

 

It was discussed here before at length. Bergen or Rempel asked Trudeau to condemn the al quds day hate rally held in Toronto, where a call for genocide against jews was made, and all he would say is that the Libs condemn all hate speech.  

[WestCanMan]

9 hours ago, dialamah said:

Bigots are more likely to find a home with conservatives.  Just look at Donald Trump.  Also, consider that Twitter cannot design an algorithm that would effectively ban White Supremacy because so many Republicans (aka conservatives) would be banned.

But external experts Motherboard spoke to said that the measures taken against ISIS were so extreme that, if applied to white supremacy, there would certainly be backlash, because algorithms would obviously flag content that has been tweeted by prominent Republicans—or, at the very least, their supporters. So it’s no surprise, then, that employees at the company have realized that as well.

The rest of your post appears to be some weird mix of conspiracy theories and science denial, so I will just leave you to it.

I posted specifics about prominent Democrats openly socializing with the country’s biggest bigot and you came back with a generic accusation by who?

I forgot to mention Hillary’s mentor, the grand wizard of the kkk, who was the longest-sitting Dem Senator. She also praised Margaret Sanger,  another huge racist. 

[dialamah]

22 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

I can't remember the story too well.  Did he apologise to those he called bigots?  Was the 11 year old at least sent to her room?

A kid lies.  Lots of people believe her.  When the truth come out, people who think they might fit the description of "bigot" are butthurt because a kid lied and lots of people believed her.  Everybody else shake their heads, assume (or at least hope) the parents had a firm discussion with her (and her brother) about lying. The butthurt people use the opportunity to slam Muslims and Liberals generally, and Trudeau specifically.  Not to mention dismissing or minimizing any future attacks on Muslim women.

[dialamah]

7 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

It was discussed here before at length. Bergen or Rempel asked Trudeau to condemn the al quds day hate rally held in Toronto, where a call for genocide against jews was made, and all he would say is that the Libs condemn all hate speech.  

What is wrong with condemning all hate speech exactly?  

[WestCanMan]

5 hours ago, jacee said:

You think the PM should have publicly humiliated an 11 year old girl? Are you for real?

Bigots seeks to dehumanize others, but they really only dehumanize themselves.

The PM should have called her blatant attempt at creating a false narrative of “danger for muslims from bigoted Canadians” as despicable and hateful. Instead he doubled-down on his previous comments where he denigrated Canadians. 

I don’t care how old she was. 

[jacee]

11 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

I can't remember the story too well.  Did he apologise to those he called bigots? 

I can't find where he said that. Can you? 

I just find this:

“incidents like this cannot be tolerated.” 

Mistaken perhaps, but seems pretty benign nonetheless. 

I'm not sure why the bigots got so riled about it.  

29 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Was the 11 year old at least sent to her room?

Do you really think this needs to be made public to appease the hysterical  bigots? 

Such a tempest in a teapot. 

[DogOnPorch]

Seeing how many adults were involved in this so-called hijab hoax, it was likely a staged event to try and drum up sympathy for Islam. The kid was merely the tool employed.

Edited May 1, 2019 by DogOnPorch

[WestCanMan]

1 minute ago, dialamah said:

What is wrong with condemning all hate speech exactly?  

When the 11 yr old got her hijab cut (hoax) Trudeau didn’t do a generic comment about religious intolerance, he rushed in before the dust settled or any evidence was in and lambasted Canadians in general for “islamophobia”.

Trudeau didn’t even comment on the hate rally until he was asked to. There was video evidence of it but he was apparently unaffected by it. When he was pressed on the matter did he generally comment on anti-Semitism by muslims, or specifically about that particular hate rally? Nope. He just made a general reply that equally indemnified all Canadians. That’s a pathetic double-standard. 

[DogOnPorch]

1 minute ago, WestCanMan said:

When the 11 yr old got her hijab cut (hoax) Trudeau didn’t do a generic comment about religious intolerance, he rushed in before the dust settled or any evidence was in and lambasted Canadians in general for “islamophobia”.

Trudeau didn’t even comment on the hate rally until he was asked to. There was video evidence of it but he was apparently unaffected by it. When he was pressed on the matter did he generally comment on anti-Semitism by muslims, or specifically about that particular hate rally? Nope. He just made a general reply that equally indemnified all Canadians. That’s a pathetic double-standard. 

 

Really angering the Chinese community...who still apparently await some sort of an apology from the PM.

[dialamah]

6 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I posted specifics about prominent Democrats openly socializing with the country’s biggest bigot and you came back with a generic accusation by who?

I didn't know who Farrakhan was, so checked out your claim.  Seems like the Democrats who socialized with him did disavow him, though it took some pressure - rightly applied, imo.

When will we see your hero Trump disavow white supremacists or apologize for his bigotry and hate?  When will Twitter be able to clamp down on hate speech without also clamping down on republicans?  They managed to eliminate ISIS related hate speech from their platform, but so much more difficult to eliminate the hate among your own countrymen, eh?

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I forgot to mention Hillary’s mentor, the grand wizard of the kkk, who was the longest-sitting Dem Senator. 

They knew each other, apparently, but "mentor" seems to be an overstatement.

In any case, mentor or not, you also "forgot" to mention this:

However, in 1952 Byrd avowed that “After about a year, I became disinterested [in the KKK], quit paying my dues, and dropped my membership in the organization,” and throughout his long political career (he served for 57 years in the United States Congress) he repeatedly apologizedfor his involvement with the KKK:

[WestCanMan]

2 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

Seeing how many adults were involved in this so-called hijab hoax, it was likely a staged event to try and drum up sympathy for Islam. The kid was merely the tool employed.

Not really to drum up support for islam, it’s more specifically to make muslims appear to be victims. That’s their requirement for “jihad”, which is their struggle for fairness. 

Its the same reason why Palestinian refugee camps still exist. People wouldn’t have any reason for hating Israel if muslims weren’t seen to suffering gravely. 

[DogOnPorch]

Just now, WestCanMan said:

Not really to drum up support for islam, it’s more specifically to make muslims appear to be victims. That’s their requirement for “jihad”, which is their struggle for fairness. 

Its the same reason why Palestinian refugee camps still exist. People wouldn’t have any reason for hating Israel if muslims weren’t seen to suffering gravely. 

 

Drum up sympathy were my words...which is what it did until proven a lie.

[WestCanMan]

2 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I didn't know who Farrakhan was, so checked out your claim.  Seems like the Democrats who socialized with him did disavow him, though it took some pressure - rightly applied, imo.

When will we see your hero Trump disavow white supremacists or apologize for his bigotry and hate?  When will Twitter be able to clamp down on hate speech without also clamping down on republicans?  They managed to eliminate ISIS related hate speech from their platform, but so much more difficult to eliminate the hate among your own countrymen, eh?

They knew each other, apparently, but "mentor" seems to be an overstatement.

In any case, mentor or not, you also "forgot" to mention this:

However, in 1952 Byrd avowed that “After about a year, I became disinterested [in the KKK], quit paying my dues, and dropped my membership in the organization,” and throughout his long political career (he served for 57 years in the United States Congress) he repeatedly apologizedfor his involvement with the KKK:

Democrats still socialize with Farrakhan. The black caucus has never disavowed him. Bill Clinton and Obama stood at Aretha Franklins funeral with him. 

 

Hillary called Byrd her mentor, I didn’t invent that. 

The kkk was an actual part of the democrat party and they keep trying to act as though they somehow magically turned away, but it has always been Republicans who have treated blacks as equal. They still do. It’s Dems who act like blacks are somehow different, have different needs, etc. 

 

[WestCanMan]

6 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

Drum up sympathy were my words...which is what it did until proven a lie.

I agree it drummed up sympathy, but it’s really important for muslims to be specifically perceived as “victims of actual violence and discrimination” because it’s like the key that starts their engine. 

They don’t do things like that to get “support”, they need to be perceived as victims to justify what inevitably comes later.