The Battle of Charlottesville

[bush_cheney2004]

3 minutes ago, marcus said:

The problem is that the racists and the bigots cannot distinguish or tell the difference.

 

So such imprecise language is fine for the haters of "racists and the bigots", but not Muslims ?

The pretzel is getting bigger...and softer.

[DogOnPorch]

7 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

So such imprecise language is fine for the haters of "racists and the bigots", but not Muslims ?

The pretzel is getting bigger...and softer.

 

"Hater, Racist, Bigot"...etc...all designed to shutdown free speech. 

Funny how even a street riot in the South boils down to Islam.

What would General Lee think???

[bush_cheney2004]

2 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

"Hater, Racist, Bigot"...etc...all designed to shutdown free speech.

 

Indeed....such progressive haters not only wish to shut down free speech, but the very definitions of language itself.

 

[DogOnPorch]

2 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Indeed....such progressive haters not only wish to shut down free speech, but the very definitions of language itself.

 

 

They're giving it the ol' college try. The only reassuring part is that they too will grow old and desire stability re: the future rather than giving everything away to "refugees"

The silly thing re: the protest is that if it was suddenly 1862, most folks sure as Hell would want to be in the Army of Northern Virginia under Lee rather than in the Army of the Potomac under Pope or Hooker or Burnside etc...piles of blue bodies....and not even a Gettysburg Address yet!

[betsy]

17 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

So we have speculation on one side, and on the other.. a murderer.

This is why violence is inevitable.

It's not a speculation to say the leftwing came to riot.   They were there to COUNTER!

Violence was inevitable!

Charlottesville officials should've seen that coming.

Edited August 14, 2017 by betsy

[betsy]

I watched the news - they showed footage several times!  Both sides committed violence.  And I say, from what I see.....the left wing were there trying to intimidate the ultra-right.  

 

 

Anyone who can't understand that Trump was simply stating facts, is terribly biased. 

When you label someone "fascist" - or anything derogatory - for simply stating a view that you don't agree with - that's bigotry!

Hate and bigotry - was exhibited by both sides!

 

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by betsy

[betsy]

Some people with twisted logic condemn Trump for supporting supremacists!  Why do they say Trump supports Supremacists?  Because Supremacists supported and voted for Trump!

Say again?

If a pedophile voted for you......does that mean you support pedophilia.  Or, you're a pedophile yourself?

 

I never heard of any candidate saying in his campaign:  pedophiles, don't vote for me!

Was Trump supposed to have said, "ultra-right, don't even think of voting for me!" 

DOH!

 

Left wing only shows there's a dysfunction in their thinking!

Edited August 14, 2017 by betsy

[Michael Hardner]

Trump played up his fascist leadership creds by offering to pay legal bills  for people who beat down opponents at rallies.

You support this guy, this is what you get.

[betsy]

10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Trump played up his fascist leadership creds by offering to pay legal bills  for people who beat down opponents at rallies.

 

We're not talking about Trump's rally.  That's another issue for another thread!

 

 

Quote

You support this guy, this is what you get.

 

You sound like the fake-news media!

FYI. We had division during Obama's. Have you forgotten Black Lives Matter?   Look back in history.  Racial tensions was always there.  It didn't start with Trump.

 

The left wing had shown fascism!  Here's another definition, according to merriam.

Fascism:

a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control

 

The left are the ones who love to dictate. 

Legislate this and that! Heck, they even want to dictate to you in your own home, to accept what they want you to accept, to believe what they want you to believe.......they want to control you how to live your life!  They also want to control  when, and where  you die!

They  use propaganda through the media!

They're FASCISTS!

Edited August 14, 2017 by betsy

[Michael Hardner]

Sorry, Trump set the tone for violence.  It belongs in this thread, as the bloodletting was set up at that time.  

They knew they were getting this kind of leader.  He instigates, he doesn't pacify. He is still signaling that the Nazis have a reasonable viewpoint. All that is left is for the violence to play out.

[betsy]

14 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Sorry, Trump set the tone for violence.  It belongs in this thread, as the bloodletting was set up at that time.  

They knew they were getting this kind of leader.  He instigates, he doesn't pacify. He is still signaling that the Nazis have a reasonable viewpoint. All that is left is for the violence to play out.

 

I don't know from what looking glass you're seeing this.....but I'd say, your view is quite so distorted.

 

Left wing trouble-makers had come to his rally to disrupt his right at campaigning.   Trump, if anything else, was simply showing us how to handle bullies! 

That's emerging as a pattern. isn't it?  Left wing, as instigators for trouble!

 

 

If you want to really point fingers on who's deceitfully instigated and promoted racial division, it's Obama.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by betsy

[Michael Hardner]

How to handle bullies=use violence against people you disagree with

 

[betsy]

9 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

How to handle bullies=use violence against people you disagree with

 

 

Bullies, Michael.  Bullies. 

Left wing who went to a Republican campaign to disrupt.

 

And if you use logic......the left wing wanted to disrupt the Republican rally because they disagree with Trump's message.

Edited August 14, 2017 by betsy

[Altai]

It first start with hate speech and insults under the pretext of freedom of speech. Then turns out as some attacks against places and persons subject to hate speech and insults. Then it turns out as an open demand for terrorism revealed with violent protests (so-called protests).


This is why free speech cannot include hate speech and insults. All the fights start with hate speech and insults.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Altai

[Chrissy1979]

Can betsy criticize the Nazis enough to say that the Nazis who were there in full body armour with guns might have also been looking for a fight? Or are Trump's Nazis wholly innocent in this? I just know Trump can't criticize them directly. Maybe Putin won't let him because he knows how divisive to the country being silent about Nazis could be.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Chrissy1979

[Guest]

7 hours ago, marcus said:

I don't agree. There are many types of Muslims. Islam, just like most other religions, works differently to different people.

The problem is that the racists and the bigots cannot distinguish or tell the difference. This is why there is a fear of "Muslims". Because when you have the betsys and the scarletts and the DoP's commenting about Muslims, they are all the same to them. They group them all together. Then you have people like you, who express that you understand that Muslims come with different beliefs, but then you don't challenge the betsys and scarlettes and DoP's.

I prefer to challenge people like you, who assert that all Muslims are just fine, and any criticism of their behaviour is racism and bigotry. There's more than enough of that view to go around.

That said, I've argued with DoP on here about Muslims and Islam.  Most of the time we agree. 

[Guest]

30 minutes ago, Altai said:

This is why free speech cannot include hate speech and insults.

There's no point in free speech if it doesn't.  No-one is going to mind me saying kittens are cute.

[DogOnPorch]

5 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

I prefer to challenge people like you, who assert that all Muslims are just fine, and any criticism of their behaviour is racism and bigotry. There's more than enough of that view to go around.

That said, I've argued with DoP on here about Muslims and Islam.  Most of the time we agree. 

 

Well, unlike the vast number of Islam's infidel supporters on MLW, this quivering, fearful Islamophobe has read the Quran. So I ask Islam's supporters....where is Islam working out????

Silence follows.

Islam doesn't work out anywhere. It's not peaceful...but rather violent. Rather than treating folks as equals, it divides the world by gender, religion and race (guess who are the TOP Muslims?)...not for this Dog (Islam hates dogs and other animals as unclean). Not for this Dog, at all!

I'll take-up arms if needed to prevent Islam from ruling my life.

Simple enough.

[Altai]

3 hours ago, bcsapper said:

There's no point in free speech if it doesn't.  No-one is going to mind me saying kittens are cute.

Your freedom ends beyond the line where it start to harm others.

When we consider it in a singular manner, yes people have right to say whatever they want, including insults. Again when we consider it in a singular manner, people have also right to live in peace without being disturbed by others.  If someones which someones does not like are able to walk on the street, this means there is nothing wrong with them. Any groups we create in our minds to separate others from ourselves, based on skin color, based on ethnic, based on belief, based on whatever we name it and we cant disturb them just because we dont like something about them. If you think there is a problem, you need to go to a court togetger proofs/evidences of your legimate disturbance. 



We have talked this before in another topic. I dont want to derail this topic. Below I put the link.
 

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by Altai

[Argus]

10 hours ago, marcus said:

Hate is hate. If you dislike a person because of their colour, ethnic background or the religion they practice, it's defined as racism.

Hate is hate - but it's okay to hate if someone disagrees with you, and okay to attack them in the streets. And if anyone disagrees, why, then they're a racist.

[Argus]

9 hours ago, marcus said:

Abrahamic religions have many similarities and their books say some really fucked up shit. Sometimes these books contradict themselves as well. 

Cop out. There are over 50 Muslim nations. Which Muslim nation has a gay pride event?  Which one? Which one treats women equally? Even one? Which among them show equality and respect for citizens of other religions? Egypt? Syria? Iran? Saudi Arabia? Indonesia? Pakistan? Which has freedom of speech?

[Argus]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Trump played up his fascist leadership creds by offering to pay legal bills  for people who beat down opponents at rallies.

You support this guy, this is what you get.

And yet I, who have condemned Trump as thoroughly as anyone since he started running, and have condemned white supremacists and anti-Semites for years, believe the real culprits in the street violence in Charlottesville were the far left. That is something being ignored by the media. Trump might have 'energized' the far right, but he didn't invent them. There have been white militia groups and white racist groups forever. And the nazis have taken great delight in their constitutional right to march and demonstrate for a long time. What's happened lately is you now have these organized groups of far left types, many of them violent anarchists along the lines of the 'black block' who have determined they have the right to decide whose speech is allowed. If they disapprove, they try and shut it down, as they succeeded in doing in Charlottesville. The real difference between Charlottesville and places like New York, Portland, Seattle and other places is the police in Charlottesville were almost entirely incompetent.

As to the guy who drove his car into leftist protesters, I don't think of that as terrorism so much as someone from a street gang attacking other people from a rival street gang. Do we term drive by shootings terrorism? They'd been brawling in the street all day and one of them (these are not exactly bright people) decided to do something even stupider than his idiotic political/ideological beliefs would suggest.

[Argus]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Sorry, Trump set the tone for violence.  It belongs in this thread, as the bloodletting was set up at that time.  

They knew they were getting this kind of leader.  He instigates, he doesn't pacify. He is still signaling that the Nazis have a reasonable viewpoint. All that is left is for the violence to play out.

I don't disagree that Trump does like the violence. He's a fan of wrestling, after all. And he certainly didn't mind when his supporters roughed up hecklers at his rallies. But let's not forget that there was also a lot of violent counter demonstrations during the election, with groups from the Left trying to shut down his rallies and prevent people from attending. And the real cause of street violence like we saw in Charlottesville is the far left, not the far right.

[Argus]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

There's no point in free speech if it doesn't.  No-one is going to mind me saying kittens are cute.

Damn you! Now i'm triggered! I'll have to go to my therapist for another dozen visits! If I find you I'm filing a complaint with your local human rights board! Those kinds of words shouldn't be allowed to be seen in public! 

[Wilber]

15 minutes ago, Argus said:

As to the guy who drove his car into leftist protesters, I don't think of that as terrorism so much as someone from a street gang attacking other people from a rival street gang. Do we term drive by shootings terrorism? They'd been brawling in the street all day and one of them (these are not exactly bright people) decided to do something even stupider than his idiotic political/ideological beliefs would suggest.

Does anyone dispute that if the driver of that car was a Muslim instead of someone with know neo Nazi leanings, people would be calling it an act of terrorism?