Derek 2.0 Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Good. Best thing which could happen to a grossly top-heavy organization with, the last time I looked, more HR specialists than infantry soldiers. No need to offer a wiki version of the Leslie report, I've read it and have discussed it in various topics here.......with that said, procurement (what the Liberals stated they wanted to fix) issues aren't going to be resolved by taking an axe to personal involved in the various procurement files. As to Headquarters staffing levels, its rich coming from Leslie, whom had massive staffs when he was with ISAF and then as head of the Army. Furthermore, his proposed transformations, though portions would be very viable for the Army, would have crippled the operational abilities of both the navy and air force, as both services (in any nations force) are more teeth than tail by their very nature.. With that said, not selecting Leslie is smart politics. Outside his two-block $72000 move, he has made many, many enemies within the Forces, which would ensure throughout his tenure as MND constant, embarrassing leaks would be the new norm......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 I'm sure a lot of it has to do with the power. I don't think anyone runs for politics without some desire for power. Is that in and of itself a bad motive? Of course not. You mentioned the pay-cut in response to me questioning if a Bay Street man of his stature may be too out of touch and I was merely retorting that a pay-cut doesn't necessary reflect on his character because he could just be after power. And again, I have no idea if any of it is true, I'm just voicing my concerns like everyone else on this forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 No need to offer a wiki version of the Leslie report, I've read it and have discussed it in various topics here.......with that said, procurement (what the Liberals stated they wanted to fix) issues aren't going to be resolved by taking an axe to personal involved in the various procurement files. Given there is now a minister of procurement, it looks like DND will be losing any part (or most part) in that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Given there is now a minister of procurement, it looks like DND will be losing any part (or most part) in that. Who do you think is going to staff the "Ministry of Procurement"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Who do you think is going to staff the "Ministry of Procurement"? People in charge of procurement - for all government departments. That doesn't lend to military officers being much involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 People in charge of procurement - for all government departments. That doesn't lend to military officers being much involved. Huh? Then what are the current staff, civilian and military, that are currently involved in procurement going to be doing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Huh? Then what are the current staff, civilian and military, that are currently involved in procurement going to be doing? I'm not that familiar with military procurement, but isn't that usually done at least partially independently of the rest of the Federal Government's procurement processes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Huh? Then what are the current staff, civilian and military, that are currently involved in procurement going to be doing? They're going to be hived off from DND (and every other department), from what I understand. That's been proposed for a while, but never been done. We'll have to see how it works out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 They're going to be hived off from DND (and every other department), from what I understand. That's been proposed for a while, but never been done. We'll have to see how it works out. Source? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Source? It looks like they're creating a separate Department of Procurement, something that has been talked of, even in the Harper government. We'll know for sure in a few days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 I'm not that familiar with military procurement, but isn't that usually done at least partially independently of the rest of the Federal Government's procurement processes? Yes and no. No in that DND has staff, both military and civilian, continually working on countless programs, in some cases spanning decades, ( on everything from boots to big ticket items) attempting to best solve requirements of the military. Once the Government agrees to fund a given program, then DND presents options that best fit said requirements. Yes in that the Harper Government was the first to put the selection of winners and losers outside of arms reach (The Shipbuilding program for example) of the Government, but then, no Government is bound by said selection. Outside of the last Government, that favored sole source bids on behalf of DND, at no time in our history has military procurement not been a political process........look no further then something as simple as the Ross rifle over the SMLE during the First World War, then the further developed LE No.4 mk I over the M1 Garand (designed by a Canadian) in the Second World War. At times, it looks as if Government tries to screw things up........and I doubt this Government will be any different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Having Big Fat Ralph as Public Safety minister might be cause for cautious optimism for those of us who own firearms. I mean, at least it's not Hedy Fry, right? -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Having Big Fat Ralph as Public Safety minister might be cause for cautious optimism for those of us who own firearms. I mean, at least it's not Hedy Fry, right? -k I suppose its better than Blair or Holland (or someone from urban Toronto), but Goodale is just as much a trained seal as anyone else if so directed from above...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeferMadness Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Having Big Fat Ralph as Public Safety minister might be cause for cautious optimism for those of us who own firearms. I mean, at least it's not Hedy Fry, right? -k cold dead hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vega Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Dion at Foreign Affairs reminds me of Kerry being Sec. of State for Obama. Also, interesting the absence of Chinese/East Asian faces from the Cabinet. Surprising, almost. I'm sure if Ted Hsu would have not stood down, he would be in it, however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Dion at Foreign Affairs reminds me of Kerry being Sec. of State for Obama. Dion's appointment to Foreign Affairs is a bit odd, though as it is the third highest ranking portfolio in Cabinet must certainly be a reward for Dion's service as former leader and his years as one of Chretien's trusted lieutenants. A lot of people had tapped him for Environment or Intergovernmental Affairs, but maybe Trudeau felt he wanted other people in these areas, seeing as Dion's carbon pricing scheme in the 2008 election was a catastrophe, and perhaps that his years in the Intergovernmental portfolio might have proven a challenge, particularly in Quebec (the Clarity Act is certainly a hot button issue among Sovereigntists). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Saw in my tweeter feed (so not verified) that 14 of them did not swear the oath on any holy book nor state "so help me god." This is very promising in my view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeferMadness Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Saw in my tweeter feed (so not verified) that 14 of them did not swear the oath on any holy book nor state "so help me god." This is very promising in my view. Does it matter? It's a meaningless ceremony anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msj Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Does it matter? Almost half admit that myths have no power over them. I think that means something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeferMadness Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Almost half admit that myths have no power over them. I think that means something. I think it's good that they know the myths have no power - whether or not they admit it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G Huxley Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 (edited) Looks like a nice appointment. I especially like this part: "Dion won’t have a lot of time to get comfortable. A number of high-profile international summits — including climate talks in Paris, a G20 meeting in Turkey, and a Pacific nations summit in the Philippines — loom large in the coming months." http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/11/04/dion-tasked-with-resetting-canadas-international-image.htmlI think Dion is the logical choice for a new Kyoto. Edited November 5, 2015 by G Huxley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Does it matter? It's a meaningless ceremony anyway. But being admitted to the Privy Council and to Cabinet is not. These people, whatever you think of the oath, became the most powerful people in the country. As to ceremonies, I'm always mindful of one of Napoleon's functionaries admonishing Napoleon over the granting of some medal to soldiers, challenging Napoleon that such honors flew in the face of the spirit of the Revolution. Napoleon's response was simply "It is with baubles such as these that men are lead." Humans like ceremonies and rituals, so even if they have little in the way of actual utility, symbolism is probably the most important thing humans have, and it is the thing that makes us different than the rest of the animal kingdom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-TSS- Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Canada and Switzerland are a couple of genuine democracies in this world. The USA is a total plutocracy when as the EU is a kleptocracy. It must also be pointed out that a Canadian province or even a US-state have much more control over their own affairs than a member country of the EU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CITIZEN_2015 Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 (edited) Canada has become the best democracy NOW. Did you see our Prime minister walking into the crowd yesterday shaking hands and offering cookies? Where in the world can a leader so freely walk among the people? Most hide in bullet proof cars and others behind the armed guards. As for the Cabinet, it is the best and most capable cabinet handpicked by the best Prime Minister. And a clear case of equality representing true Canadian values in contrast to UnCanadian values Harper and his regime stood for. Equal number of Women (Yeah!!!!) and racially and ethnically diverse (a thorn in the eyes of the few racists in this country). THIS LIBERAL GOVERNMENT IS A PEOPLE'S GOVERNMENT ELECTED BY THE PEOPLE RUN BY THE PEOPLE AND WHO WORKS FOR PEOPLE. Long Live Canada Long Live Government of Canada Long Live Liberal Party of Canada. Edited November 5, 2015 by CITIZEN_2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Long Live Liberal Party of Canada. yikes.... I will change political parties quicker than I change my socks if they don't do what's right. I am not a fan of partisans that are party members for life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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