Widow suing Khadr

[GostHacked]

The soldier he killed had a family and had rights no different than he did. Some of you believe since he was an American soldier you can devalue his life and its value for politically partisan reasons. I call that out.

The US government has devalued the all the lives of every single military frontliner by drumming up bullshit reasons for war. Every single US soldier killed in Iraq was a complete waste. That is the real shame here.

[Canada_First]

It wouldnt matter if it was an American, a Russian, a German, or an Ethiopian. He was in a war-zone and he threw a grenade at people that were attacking the compound he was in.

BIG....

F&^KING....

DEAL...

Yes if this person was a Taliban it would be as you said. But this person is a Canadian born citizen. Joining a foreign army and attacking our allies is an act of treason. It's that simple. Can you not see that this is wrong? That joining an army, that's not your home country, that's the enemy of your own country is wrong? Why is that hard to understand?

[cybercoma]

She can't sue anyway. Her husband was no longer a human being. He was the property of the United States military. The military should be suing for destruction of property.

[dre]

Yes if this person was a Taliban it would be as you said. But this person is a Canadian born citizen. Joining a foreign army and attacking our allies is an act of treason. It's that simple. Can you not see that this is wrong? That joining an army, that's not your home country, that's the enemy of your own country is wrong? Why is that hard to understand?

I understand why you think that... I just dont personally care much about it myself. And no... its not an act of treason. Canadians are free to decide where their own allegiances lie.

[WWWTT]

I have watched as a "kid" carrying a nail bomb tripped in his sandals on stairs blowing a chunk out of his stomach. I have seen kids in crowds throwing stones and knocking people out and bashing each other over the head with metal bars.I have seen kids with gun holes, knife holes, smashed in faces.

So ees my perspective is a bit different but what looks like a "kid"to some of you was a terrorist, a violent murderer to others..

"Kids" to me is a concept that for people who have not had to work in the legal system or deal in the world of terrorism they of course have a different perspective on an and so when they see and so someone like Omar on t.v. looks like aa misunderstood teenager who just needs a hug and a hot dog.

The point you "kid' voyeurs are in denial over is that he was never a "kid" when he committed his crimes. His biological age did not make him a kid.

As Drum has repeated over and over, Kadr has never denied he threw a grenade and killed a medic. Never.The issue as to his being tortured is a separate issue. The evidence he admits to does not magically go away because he was tortured. He admitted it when he was not tortured. In fact he has been honest about it unlike you people on this forum denying it. Its kind of ironic, the very thing he admits some of you posters deny.

Those of you trying to make a legal argument there is no evidence as to what he did other than when he as tortured are dead wrong.

Not even his lawyer argues that and its a moot point now. His lawyer is now arguing that because he was not an adult when he did his crimes, he should not be treated as an adult under the criminal code but as a youth under the Youth Offender's Act and therefore should no longer be retained..

Now for those of you who can't wait for him to be released, take him in. Hire him, and have your daughter marry him. Go on put up or shut up.

Its easy to be a liberal and lecture the rest of us on how to treat him - as long as he aint your neighbourhood.

Oh I know how it works, Those "kids"when they get released after committing violent crimes, suddenly they are not "kids" when they move into the neighbourhoods of you liberal righteous folk.

I worked with these "kids" on release. Not all are monsters but can you get real. K will have permanent psychiatric issues that will impair adjustment back into society.He is not cuddly. He will bite. if he is cornered, pressured, told no he will act out or bite.

He will have major problems with his sexual identity and how to express it, his temper, and there is a very high likelihood he wil engage in some sort of self mutilation if he remains solely dependent on his religion to keep himfrom drinking,smoking, taking drugs, repressing his sex drive.

He will as part of his damage that needs to be worked out over many years, struggle to repress his primal drive ad engage in dangerous forms of behaviour such as driving too quickly, fighting, challenging authority.

He will have an urge to punish and kill himself-he will not feel Canadian no matter how many times his lawyer or some of you do gooder librerals tell him because those of you who are the first to call him cuddly will be the first to run from him when you see him in public..

Kadr is a wolf not a domesticated dog. This "kid" label you slap on him is no different than calling a young wolf a puppy and not differentiating a wolf pup from a puppy. He is not going to domesticate. He has permanent damage that will prevent that.

Eventually he will engage in self destructive behaviour unable to cope with his freedom.

For those of you who call him "kid", please understand if he is to be rehabilitated, it will take intensive, non stop supervised therapy and even then the guarantee is very low of that happening given his family and lawyer are both the biggest obstacles to his rehab. at this point.

Why do you make such long winded claims when they can not be verified?

Now I have recounted events before, but never to the extent that you have.

Also, I have never intended to make such claims to reaffirm my debating position as you have.

I received a warning point in the past for doubting your claim to be a lawyer, and I disagree with CA for it because he is allowing posters to make claims that can not be confirmed to gain leverage in debating.

And when doing so, this devaluates this site as a reputable debate site!

WWWTT

Edited June 15, 2015 by WWWTT

[Canada_First]

I understand why you think that... I just dont personally care much about it myself. And no... its not an act of treason. Canadians are free to decide where their own allegiances lie.

So any Canadian can join a military and kill Canadian soldiers then come back to Canada and everything is fine? Is that what you're saying?

I'm fairly certain that the RCMP will view that differently. Identified ISIS soldiers are being charged with terrorism in absentia so no I don't think they can choose to kill Canadians and our allies.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Canada_First

[On Guard for Thee]

So any Canadian can join a military and kill Canadian soldiers then come back to Canada and everything is fine? Is that what you're saying?

I'm fairly certain that the RCMP will view that differently. Identified ISIS soldiers are being charged with terrorism in absentia so no I don't think they can choose to kill Canadians and our allies.

Are you now trying to say Khadr was a ISIS soldier....

[eyeball]

The only salient fact that ever has and ever will exist in Khadr's case is that he was a kid.

This writing on this is all over the wall in 100 foot bold italicized letters - that the SCC just underlined.

[GostHacked]

So any Canadian can join a military and kill Canadian soldiers then come back to Canada and everything is fine? Is that what you're saying?

I'm fairly certain that the RCMP will view that differently. Identified ISIS soldiers are being charged with terrorism in absentia so no I don't think they can choose to kill Canadians and our allies.

Well even when allies end up killing a bunch of Canadian soldiers, there was not much done about it. This is the US airforce pilot firing on Canadian soldiers on the ground in Afghanistan. It was simply a 'mistake'.

[dre]

So any Canadian can join a military and kill Canadian soldiers then come back to Canada and everything is fine? Is that what you're saying?

I'm fairly certain that the RCMP will view that differently. Identified ISIS soldiers are being charged with terrorism in absentia so no I don't think they can choose to kill Canadians and our allies.

He didnt kill Canadian soldiers. He killed a soldier from a foreign country and those soldiers initated the violend.

I could care less if they were ALL dead, Omar included.

[eyeball]

I could care less if they were ALL dead, Omar included.

What purpose would indifference serve?

[Canada_First]

He didnt kill Canadian soldiers. He killed a soldier from a foreign country and those soldiers initated the violend.

I could care less if they were ALL dead, Omar included.

So put it on the other foot then. You wouldn't mind if an American Muslim killed Canadian soldiers then just returned to the US like nothing happened?

That's your position? You don't feel that the American Muslim should face any charges whatsoever.

[On Guard for Thee]

So put it on the other foot then. You wouldn't mind if an American Muslim killed Canadian soldiers then just returned to the US like nothing happened?

That's your position? You don't feel that the American Muslim should face any charges whatsoever.

Thats pretty much what did happen, although I dont think they pilot in the US fighter jet was Muslim. Would that have made a difference to you...

[dre]

So put it on the other foot then. You wouldn't mind if an American Muslim killed Canadian soldiers then just returned to the US like nothing happened?

That's your position? You don't feel that the American Muslim should face any charges whatsoever.

Yup thats my position. I just dont care. I wouldnt even award his widow with breakfast at Dennies.

I would just treat him as any other POW. Keep him locked up until theres a cessation of hostilities then let him go.

[dre]

What purpose would indifference serve?

My opinion on something doesnt have to serve a purpose. Its just what I think. If I was in charge there would not be one single American or Canadian casualty in Iraq or Afghanistan. Not one.

[Canada_First]

Yup thats my position. I just dont care. I wouldnt even award his widow with breakfast at Dennies.

I would just treat him as any other POW. Keep him locked up until theres a cessation of hostilities then let him go.

You support terrorism sir. Plain and simple then. What I described us terrorism and now you're on record supporting it...wow. I wonder if a majority of Canadians feel as you do? Sad times we live in when people have no loyalty to their country.

I'm sorry but I do not think that Canadians should be free to kill Canadian mitary members. Then come and live in Canada free and clear. Wow....it's called treason.

[Canada_First]

My opinion on something doesnt have to serve a purpose. Its just what I think. If I was in charge there would not be one single American or Canadian casualty in Iraq or Afghanistan. Not one.

So your solution would've been to allow the Taliban to keep harboring terrorism and have Saddam Hussein still in power. Thanks for sharing.

[On Guard for Thee]

So your solution would've been to allow the Taliban to keep harboring terrorism and have Saddam Hussein still in power. Thanks for sharing.

You mean Saddam the old ally of the US...I spent a few weeks in Baghdad up to the invasion, and the streets were peaceful, you could get a bottle of wine with dinner, the markets flourished, and I dont recall one suicide bomber. Look at it now..Way to go Bush

[drummindiver]

I understand why you think that... I just dont personally care much about it myself. And no... its not an act of treason. Canadians are free to decide where their own allegiances lie.

You understand how erroneous your thinking is on this, right?

I'm Canadian. My allegiance is to xyz (Russia, North Korea, Iran, whomever). I will sell nuclear/military/technical/porn site password information. I am expunged from any treasonous charges or culpability as my allegiance is to whomever I want.

Real world doesn't work that way.

[drummindiver]

You support terrorism sir. Plain and simple then. What I described us terrorism and now you're on record supporting it...wow. I wonder if a majority of Canadians feel as you do? Sad times we live in when people have no loyalty to their country.

I'm sorry but I do not think that Canadians should be free to kill Canadian mitary members. Then come and live in Canada free and clear. Wow....it's called treason.

Dude, get used to it on MLW. I've been arguing that this is effed up, but most on this board support Kadhr and his family. We live in strange times.

[drummindiver]

You mean Saddam the old ally of the US...I spent a few weeks in Baghdad up to the invasion, and the streets were peaceful, you could get a bottle of wine with dinner, the markets flourished, and I dont recall one suicide bomber. Look at it now..Way to go Bush

lol.

Extremist muslims blow shit up. Not their fault. Never their fault.

It has to be Bush's fault.

Same as the 3000 killed during Ramadan last year.

[On Guard for Thee]

Dude, get used to it on MLW. I've been arguing that this is effed up, but most on this board support Kadhr and his family. We live in strange times.

It seems what is truly effed up is your understanding of law. With the latest case of another gitmo detainees convictions in the same kangaroo court being thrown out, Khadr will in all likelihood see his thrown out as his appeal procedes.

[drummindiver]

It seems what is truly effed up is your understanding of law. With the latest case of another gitmo detainees convictions in the same kangaroo court being thrown out, Khadr will in all likelihood see his thrown out as his appeal procedes.

d

Edited June 18, 2015 by drummindiver

[dre]

You understand how erroneous your thinking is on this, right?

I'm Canadian. My allegiance is to xyz (Russia, North Korea, Iran, whomever). I will sell nuclear/military/technical/porn site password information. I am expunged from any treasonous charges or culpability as my allegiance is to whomever I want.

Real world doesn't work that way.

Oh yeah? So in the real world Kadr has been charged with treason? Oh wait....

And your example is just terrible. You are trying to compare a Canadian selling Canadian state secrets, with a Canadian that may have thrown a grenade at American soldiers. Apples and oranges.

[drummindiver]

Oh yeah? So in the real world Kadr has been charged with treason? Oh wait....

And your example is just terrible. You are trying to compare a Canadian selling Canadian state secrets, with a Canadian that may have thrown a grenade at American soldiers. Apples and oranges.

Yes, he was charged with a multitude of other charges, including murder, of which he was found guilty, to which he admitted guilt. You and several others don't care about these facts as it was just some damn "mucicans" what got killed and stuff.

However, I was referencing your assertion that "I understand why you think that... I just dont personally care much about it myself. And no... its not an act of treason. Canadians are free to decide where their own allegiances lie."

So, my analogy holds up very well against your argument. You are not allowed to arbitrarily decide if you are for or against Canada. Allegiance covers more than just one specific article, in this case a citizen of our country murdering an American. You can extrapolate that to selling secrets, or whatever else, but again, allegiance is not don't murder allies specific, rather don't murder allies inclusive.