cybercoma Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 The problem is when people respond to trolls then they're also instigating the situation. You can't punish a troll for instigating when others encourage the behaviour by responding to it. I think we can do more to hold each ther accountable when it comes to responding to trolls, we need to stop dignifying posts with responses when they clearly don't deserve the attention. We don't need Charles or Greg for that. We could all do better ignoring things that don't need a response, myself included. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) I was very careful to voice my issue with the trolling in the most civil and constructive manner that I could while still airing my great displeasure about a specific member. There is no place here for personal vendetta's to attack and disparage other members by name or not-so-clever references. Several members have been subjected to this because of their views and contrary opinions, complete with cute nicknames and personal insults. This kind of behaviour drives away more members than any alleged "troll". Or as the kids say, "Haters gotta hate". Edited February 18, 2014 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) The problem is when people respond to trolls then they're also instigating the situation. You can't punish a troll for instigating when others encourage the behaviour by responding to it. I think we can do more to hold each ther accountable when it comes to responding to trolls, we need to stop dignifying posts with responses when they clearly don't deserve the attention. We don't need Charles or Greg for that. We could all do better ignoring things that don't need a response, myself included. The problem with this statment is that new members don't know who is a troll and who isn't. By the time the new member has figured it out, that troll has poisoned the experience for the new member. We can get past these trolling incidents eventually but this forum runs the risk that new members will have decided not to bother. Another problem with trolling is that other easily influenced members pick up on it and mimic this behaviour because it is allowed. Edited February 18, 2014 by WestCoastRunner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 The problem with this statment is that new members don't know who is a troll and who isn't. By the time the new member has figured it out, that troll has poisoned the experience for the new member. We can get past these trolling incidents eventually but this forum runs the risk that new members will have decided not to bother. Another problem with trolling is that other easily influenced members pick up on it and mimic this behaviour because it is allowed. well said... from the perspective of a (relatively) new member! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 There is no place here for personal vendetta's to attack and disparage other members by name or not-so-clever references. Several members have been subjected to this because of their views and contrary opinions, complete with cute nicknames and personal insults. This kind of behaviour drives away more members than any alleged "troll". Or as the kids say, "Haters gotta hate". ah yes... how long before your oft played victim act came forward! That's right, everyone here has a personal vendetta to attack and disparage you. "Alleged" troll... oh my! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 ah yes... how long before your oft played victim act came forward! That's right, everyone here has a personal vendetta to attack and disparage you. "Alleged" troll... oh my! No....the trend is obvious...those screaming "Troll !" are the very same members who insult and disparage other members by name or oblique slur. So frustrated are they with an actual competition of ideas, they resort to personal attacks. New members can spot this immediately and some choose to bail. I choose to make the haters chase their own tail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimG Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 The problem with this statment is that new members don't know who is a troll and who isn't. By the time the new member has figured it out, that troll has poisoned the experience for the new member.It is more complicated than you think because one person's troll is another person's attack dog. The poster 'waldo' regularly resorts to dismissive insults and smears (one recent response to the opinion of a published scientist was to call her 'Crazy Aunt Judy') yet this same poster is cheered on by some more reasonable posters who beliefs are validated by his posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 It is more complicated than you think because one person's troll is another person's attack dog. The poster 'waldo' regularly resorts to dismissive insults and smears Yes...very true....more irony with respect to our self appointed "Troll Slayers". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 It is more complicated than you think because one person's troll is another person's attack dog. The poster 'waldo' regularly resorts to dismissive insults and smears (one recent response to the opinion of a published scientist was to call her 'Crazy Aunt Judy') yet this same poster is cheered on by some more reasonable posters who beliefs are validated by his posts. nice try! Among other names, she's well known as Crazy Aunt Judy... and is regularly referred to as such across blogs. As to be expected you take offense cause she plays for your denier team! But hey now... that related post wasn't quoted back... good to know I'm no longer on your ignore list! . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 No....the trend is obvious...those screaming "Troll !" are the very same members who insult and disparage other members by name or oblique slur. So frustrated are they with an actual competition of ideas, they resort to personal attacks. New members can spot this immediately and some choose to bail. I choose to make the haters chase their own tail. sorry, I don't ever remember Moonlight Graham "screaming troll"... or certainly not cybercoma... or GostHacked... or any others in this thread all highlighting you as the principle board troll. Just how far can you dig your own hole? . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) sorry, I don't ever remember Moonlight Graham "screaming troll"... or certainly not cybercoma... or GostHacked... or any others in this thread all highlighting you as the principle board troll. Just how far can you dig your own hole? . How far ? 32,767 posts and counting. Haters screaming "Troll !" every other post becomes the boy crying "Wolf !", and ceases to have any meaning as described above. New members don't need that kind of noise. Edited February 18, 2014 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 here, let me take the high-road and bow out of this thread... by the by, your victim act is so passe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) Reading all the replies....it's obvious what the biggest problem you've got on this board. It's become a clique! Just because "99%" of posters are annoyed by one poster's style....and all "99%" of posters are all screaming "troll!" doesn't necessarily mean that all "99%" are right. Just look at you....you're the biggest intimidators of would-be new members here! How many newbies would want to subject themselves to this kind of atmosphere? To be pounced on by a clique? Heaven forbid they happen to be labelled trolls for saying something. Sure, they'll sign up and be members and get their feet wet....and then off they go to greener pastures. Anyway, what with the numbers of active posters here......who comprise that "99%"? Who are they?99% ......HOW MANY ARE YOU? I think there are only 5 active participants here (or even less), who actually have opposing views from all the others! THAT'S WHY THIS BOARD IS DEAD! Most of the participants are all of the same mold! You all sound the same! And you want to either suspend or ban the few differing ones....GREAT!! There is hardly anyone here, it's not because you're all high-brow with your posts and no one can keep up - in fact this board had become so juvenile - it's because the board is sooooo boring. Wake up and smell the coffee....If you can't get past statements or thread titles that rub you raw without running and snivelling to the mods to take down threads or suspend posters....then you ought to go look for pee-wee forums! That means you're not yet ready for this kind of forum. Ask Greg to create a separate section for you. Edited February 18, 2014 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 in fact this board had become so juvenile - it's because the board is sooooo boring. Wake up and smell the coffee.... with the caveat I've had little interaction in your exclusively religious themed threads/posts, I do recognize an ongoing theme with the latest posts you've presented... clearly, your strong religious conviction has not received the expected/wanted reception you're looking for. Of your threads I have occasionally followed, I've observed many members providing you strong arguments that you've been unable to match. My suggestion to enliven your described boredom would be for you to resist attempts at conversion and work to better match your arguments to the strength of your conviction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) Another improvement would be to not be too stingy with the creation of new thread titles that you tend to lump the new title with an old one because they have the same subject. Some topics are really hot. In the forum I actively frequent now, they've created a separate section for abortion (as an example) because it's popular! Sure it's a lot of re-hash arguments but that section gets a lot of views (which means a lot of people are interested in it)....and some end up signing-up just so to be able to participate in that section! This board for some reason feels too stifling now. Edited February 18, 2014 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) (I can't make the quote on Waldo). In reply to his post above: See what I mean? Right on cue. The self-appointed censors....or "filters"......or "validators"...... "Strong on-going theme," "strong religious conviction..." Hello? Why is that surprising???? Weren't those strong religious convictions expressed in a section called RELIGION? Who needs your approval? Edited February 18, 2014 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 with the caveat I've had little interaction in your exclusively religious themed threads/posts, I do recognize an ongoing theme with the latest posts you've presented... clearly, your strong religious conviction has not received the expected/wanted reception you're looking for. Of your threads I have occasionally followed, I've observed many members providing you strong arguments that you've been unable to match. My suggestion to enliven your described boredom would be for you to resist attempts at conversion and work to better match your arguments to the strength of your conviction. (I can't make the quote on Waldo). In reply to his post above: See what I mean? The self-appointed censors....or "filters"......or "validators"...... Who needs your approval? within my post that you're replying to, you certainly weren't being censored, filtered or validated; I was neither approving or disproving of your posting. I offered you a suggestion to help alleviate your expressed boredom... take it or leave it. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) within my post that you're replying to, you certainly weren't being censored, filtered or validated; I was neither approving or disproving of your posting. I offered you a suggestion to help alleviate your expressed boredom... take it or leave it. . Set your sight straight. It's not me who needs the suggestion. IT'S THIS THREAD! Criticizing my religion posts for "converting" others is one example of attempting to label and marginalize my posts, Mr. Self-Appointed Critic. Who cares if someone indeed tries to convert (whatever religion)...complain if it happens in Federal Politics. Like I said, those who can't get past a statement or title without bristling and snivelling to the mods ought be given his own junior corner. You ought to browse around and see what busy Religion Sections are all about! Your experience with forums (and your views) are awfully limited....and you're not helping anyone here, especially this board, at all. Like it or not, there are people with active interest in the subject of religion....thus the forum I go to now protects that section from people like you, or those whose intent is simply to mock or disparage religion. Some of you ought not to be so close-minded to think that all worldviews and interests revolve only around yours. Edited February 18, 2014 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimG Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) nice try! Among other names, she's well known as Crazy Aunt Judy... and is regularly referred to as such across blogs. As to be expected you take offense cause she plays for your denier team! But hey now... that related post wasn't quoted back... good to know I'm no longer on your ignore list!Don't get so excited - putting you on ignore means I can read the threads without your volumes of irrelevant nonsense. I will occasionally look at what you said about a specific post to see if you provided a concise counter argument that actually addresses the original point. It never happens. Even in this case, the fact that you frequent blogs that resort to sexist name calling shows how childish your information sources are - it does not rebut my statement that you respond to reasoned posts with insults and name calling. If anything, your response implicitly acknowledges that I am right. Edited February 18, 2014 by TimG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) Another suggestion is to do away with the forum rules about trolling. Let it not be an offense to be a "troll." A troll is basically an irritant - but as you see, some people are irritated by just about anything. Everyone on this board has been a troll - by definition. So what's with all this nonsensical pretense? We've got rules against FLAMING. That should be enough. Face it. "Trolling" - which means saying something that irritate someone - can elicit a response! Isn't that what a robust forum is all about? It should be up to the reader to be able to muster his self-discipline on how to handle what he'd consider trolling. Stop treating posters like children that need help every time an argument doesn't go their way....otherwise they'll never grow up. Let them fend for themselves. That makes it easier for the mods, too. I'm on another busy forum that specifically states, "Trolling is allowed." Edited February 18, 2014 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Anthony Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 I think we should revive some interviews with politicans and or popular political folks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 Another suggestion is to do away with the forum rules about trolling. Let it not be an offense to be a "troll." We've got rules against FLAMING. That should be enough. Face it. "Trolling" - which means saying something that irritate someone - can elicit a response! Isn't that what a robust forum is all about? Actually, this suggestion, as silly as it is, sounds rather like trolling. Trolling has two components. One is where a person takes a position they don't actually believe in, simply to cause others to tell them how idiotic a position it is. The second component is to try to incite flames and insults from other people. I regard that particular ploy as worse than flaming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 Staying on point with repetition is a time honoured and effective debating technique, No, actually, it's not. Repitition makes the eyes glaze over and causes one to question the intelligence and imagination of the repetitive person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 Oh, the irony. Thread drift does not constitute trolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted February 18, 2014 Report Share Posted February 18, 2014 no. What's sad is you calling your own 30K+ posting troll act... "a delivery style"! . The problem with trolling is it incites anger and turns discussions into snarling insults. Your style of posting doe sprecisely the same. I don't know that I've ever actually seen you involved in a discussion which I would term polite, respectful or collegial. They all seem to almost instantly degnerate into sneering and mockery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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