cybercoma Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Maxime Bernier was caught receiving his talking points recently. As the reporter points out, this was once considered a huge faux pas. At what point did this become par for the course? As the party that promised unsurpassed openness and transparency, the CPC should be ashamed of themselves, training their MPs to lie in interviews. http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=808802&playlistId=1.1041735&binId=1.810401 French article: http://www2.lactualite.com/alec-castonguay/2012/11/19/la-preparation-au-mensonge-de-maxime-bernier/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 So, what exactly is the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted November 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 The problem is that MPs are not supposed to be puppets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepitsimple Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 It's called discipline. With today's feeding-frenzy media - everyone is looking for the "gotchya" sound-bite - that moment that an MP goes off-message and with a tricky question, says something that he would later regret. It's no secret that certain media will go to just about any ends (Toronto Star vs. Rob Ford) to get their gotchya sound-bite. Sad - but the media reaps what they sew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fletch 27 Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Hence why the media is trusted by only 6% of the population... Less than Steve HArper... Sounds to me like the left is on over-drive bitter mode,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Stil... I don't see a problem with MPs receiving a briefing of affairs, how else are they supposed to know what's going on, read it in the papers. hmmm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 The problem is that MPs are not supposed to be puppets. No, but they're suppose to know the official positions of their party on. Again, I don't see what the big deal is. The only propaganda is this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fletch 27 Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Its called a "mandate"... Something the left will never have nor understand.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 (edited) It's called discipline. With today's feeding-frenzy media - everyone is looking for the "gotchya" sound-bite - that moment that an MP goes off-message and with a tricky question, says something that he would later regret. It's no secret that certain media will go to just about any ends (Toronto Star vs. Rob Ford) to get their gotchya sound-bite. Sad - but the media reaps what they sew. Sow ... 'reap what they sow' = 'harvest what they plant'. Not particularly relevant in this context. And it was the Toronto Sun that landed Ford in court this time. We have freedom of the press so politicians have to answer to us. And whether he likes it or not, Harper answers to us and we have a right to know. The tight control Harper maintains on public messages would be admired by fascist dictators. No doubt he's learned from them and will be a model for future fascist regimes. Edited November 21, 2012 by jacee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Freedom of the press is great, but it's not really held accoutable for its editorial spin. Whether it's left or right leaning, a newspaper or whatever chooses what it wants to publish. It's not reporting the facts of parliamentary life. It's reporting what would look good on a headline and will make them money. Usually, that's bad news. Our MP's are effectively gagged for that reason. The less they give the media to report, the better. No news is good news for the government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Sow ... 'reap what they sow' = 'harvest what they plant'. Not particularly relevant in this context. And it was the Toronto Sun that landed Ford in court this time. We have freedom of the press so politicians have to answer to us. And whether he likes it or not, Harper answers to us and we have a right to know. The tight control Harper maintains on public messages would be admired by fascist dictators. No doubt he's learned from them and will be a model for future fascist regimes. How do they answer to us when the press is running bullshit. Tight control is what keeps people honest, or do you perfer the old way when chretien would let his MP's say or promise anything they wanted knowing it will never happen, but it gets you a good headline in the paper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunrutz Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Maxime Bernier was caught receiving his talking points recently. As the reporter points out, this was once considered a huge faux pas. At what point did this become par for the course? As the party that promised unsurpassed openness and transparency, the CPC should be ashamed of themselves, training their MPs to lie in interviews. http://www.ctvnews.c...&binId=1.810401 French article: http://www2.lactuali...maxime-bernier/ They are doing nothing different than any other political party, sure some do it more than others, but in the end it is just variations of the same theme, and you know that, posting this only again shows how terribly dishonest you are, but then it's your nature, i shouldn't blame you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 How do they answer to us when the press is running bullshit. Tight control is what keeps people honest, or do you perfer the old way when chretien would let his MP's say or promise anything they wanted knowing it will never happen, but it gets you a good headline in the paper. That's a big part of it, they have to be darned careful about what they say because of how it will be spun and used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 The problem is that MPs are not supposed to be puppets. The way our system is, how the PM and executive cabinet are fused with the legislature (as opposed to the separation of powers in a US-type system) and the fact that Canada has 'responsible government' (a government can fall and elections called on any bill of confidence) means strict party discipline is mostly inherent for MP's. Our system and its politicians have created a hierarchy in Parliament for MP's, with the PM (or party leader) on top, the Cabinet (or shadow cabinet in the case of non-governing parties) made up of Ministers below him/her, and other MP's and backbenchers behind them. That's pretty crappy democratic representation, where some MP's are more powerful than others. This hierarchy means MP's are indeed puppets, because MP's who do not follow the party-line (chosen, ultimately, by the party leader) will be punished via demotions, lost promotions, or lost positions in Cabinet, denied speaking spots during Question Period, denied sought-after committee appointments, denied nice sought-after foreign travel trips, or essentially kicked out of the party next election etc. Basically, the party leader/PM owns every MP's ass and nothing can stop the leader short of a party revolt. Party leaders can give some leeway to their members like having more free-votes in the HoC, but discipline will always remain. Because of 'responsible government' and party-discipline, MP's can only express their own opinions in closed and unaccountable cabinet/caucus meetings, but once party positions are formed all MP's are expected to support these positions full-stop on a united front. A publicly in-fighting party can also make the public think the party is in disarray. This is a flaw in the nature of our system. MP's often don't represent their constituency within their party, but rather represent their party within their constituency. This video isn't surprising, since virtually no MP in a major party (esp. a government) can survive their jobs without being a puppet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
login Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 (edited) I think this is issued for Bernier because he is suppose to be the libertarian badboy brand of conservative. For him to appear as just an actor for the party sullies his badboy image. None the less, MPs have the prerogrative to do their job, and if they opt for talking points that is their business, it just shows them as a brand rather than an individual. Edited November 22, 2012 by login Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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