bush_cheney2004 Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 That is fine all we need is a majority as this thing gets worse and worse more and more will look for other solutions. Good luck with that comrade...but just understand that as of now, you have no idea what "worse" really looks like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 Huh? Interest rates are at extremely low levels. Savers are in cash, or near cash. Boomers have trillions saved. And dre, you speak of gasoline? ---- If your neighbour's house is on fire, you may help to put the fire out because of so-called solidarity. IMHO: You stop the fire because it may spread to your own house. NOt a fan of reading huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 Far from ignoring it, I am exploring ways to exploit current economic challenges and opportunities. I am very wary of socialists and commies who rally to change the rules of the game when things don't go their way...I have already seen that movie. The real socialism going on is all these international banking bailouts where money is siezed from tax payers around the world, and dumped into institutions like the ECB and IMF that have a history of making terrible decisions... like lending hundreds of billions of dollars to a country whos civil service ammounts to more than 1/2 of GDP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 France wants Eurobonds so they can do it themselves and that is clearly one solution. Maybe that is what we should be talking about instead of having the argument we are having. That is my point. All the people in this thread making accusations about the Euro countries being like drunks or whatever are not helping or contributing to the solution of what could a large scale global economic collapse. It is something that needs real discussion not the disservice provided in this thread. The problem isnt European countries its the ECB/EP. These people are maggots... we are witnessing one of the largest scale attacks on democracy in history. If we wanna help our European friends and we can afford to then fine... but we should talk to them one on one, and we shouldnt give a dime to the EP/ECB... the Brussels Bunglers who played a huge part in causing these problems and making them worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 The problem isnt European countries its the ECB/EP. These people are maggots... we are witnessing one of the largest scale attacks on democracy in history. No, the Europeans already have far more experience with such things, and you never witnessed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 My question is what is the price for not sending our money to Europe and if the price we pay is more then sending the money then are we just punishing our selves? Why is no one addressing this? Part of what you say is true. But at the same time it's like you're arguing in favor of bailing out the rich bankers again, like the US did. And what was the result of that? Did the rich bankers and financiers realize the error of their ways, gain humility and start changing the way they did business? Hell no! They're even bigger now, richer, and more arrogant, and are getting involved in the same risky ventures while lobbying strenuously (bribing) politicians to ease restrictions. And what have the Europeans learned from the last couple of years? They're trooping down to the polls to throw out the governments which are cutting back on spending and social programs, and voting in ones, as in France, who will ignore it all, give them more social programs, more spending, and more benefits! Does it sound to you like the Greek in the street wants to reform anything? He still doesn't want to pay taxes. He still wants all his benefits. And he's angry and resentful at anyone who won't arrange that for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 Does it sound to you like the Greek in the street wants to reform anything? He still doesn't want to pay taxes. He still wants all his benefits. And he's angry and resentful at anyone who won't arrange that for him. He resented paying taxes because of the examples set by the most powerful and wealthy who have long enjoyed a field that is tilted in their direction. He's angry at the governments and officials who help facilitate this and probably views his benefits as compensation for the economic mismanagement he is suffering as a result. As for the other deeply moral nuances that saturate this issue, the poor beleaguered taxpayer that is fed up with bailouts on his dime and who views himself as the victim really has no one else to blame but himself. For ignoring the sad state of affairs that develops when economic playing fields are tilted and for failing to recognize that they need to demand more accountability and transparency in the highest offices of all the lands where all the tilting starts. Maybe when they start feeling the ground shift under them they'll stop ignoring it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 As far as I can tell, he only mentioned that Harper should participate with G20 nations on possible solutions. This could mean as much as just talking to them and providing suggestions. No mention at all so far about us "bailing out Europe." It will be like the non bail out our banks received. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anti-Am Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 Agreed that we should not bail out the greedy banksters in Europe. Harper should also shut his mouth if he has nothing constructive to say. He's kind of biting the hands of the people he is seeking a trade deal with. It makes no sense to criticize them and then say we won't help you. My advice to Harper: Shut up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 as distasteful as bailouts are not to do so brings risk of dire consequences for Canada, the US and the entire world...harper and his followers are extremely naive if they believe we are immune to a financial collapse in europe... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 Europe has the resources to solve this on their own. It's their creation...and they should solve the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 Europe has the resources to solve this on their own. It's their creation...and they should solve the problem. Actually the problems in most of these countries were greatly amplified by the same thing that caused the subprime meltdown... false booms created by reckless banking practices followed by busts. Countries like Greece suffered huge falst property booms caused by interest rates set way too low. This is a global problem. Short term governments with short term problems think they can fix every economic problem by easing credit, cutting rates, and printing money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 as distasteful as bailouts are not to do so brings risk of dire consequences for Canada, the US and the entire world...harper and his followers are extremely naive if they believe we are immune to a financial collapse in europe... The problem is a bailout just perpetuates the very thing that caused all these problems. Its more short term thinking that will cause more problems down the road. And as I said before the last thing we want to do is give money to the European Parliament or the European central bank. These people have put 1/2 of Europe in an economic prison and forced them to accept monetary policy designed countries like Germany... Its killing them, and its crushing European democracy as well. These are the very last people that should ever see a dime of our money. If we want to help our friends in Europe we should talk to these countries one on one, and see what we can really do to help them. If they owe us money we should write down that debt to nothing... and we should expand trade with them. But the very LAST thing we should do is give more money to the Brussels Bunglers. Europe needs to be rid of these idiots and we should support them there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted June 12, 2012 Report Share Posted June 12, 2012 (edited) Are those the real choices? How about don't give the kid any more money so he can't afford to keep buying matches?Real interest rates are below zero; heck, nominal interest rates are almost zero. 10 year rates. This is not gasoline. This is water to stop a fire.Wild Bill, look carefully at interest rates. What explains market-determined, long term, nominal interest rates? Mark Steyn certainly can't. Edited June 12, 2012 by August1991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted June 12, 2012 Report Share Posted June 12, 2012 (edited) The problem is a bailout just perpetuates the very thing that caused all these problems.Problem one.Its more short term thinking that will cause more problems down the road.Problem two.Dre, you would refuse to give penicillin to someone because it will just lead to penicillin-resistant bacteria. I think rather that when the patient is ill, a doctor should prescribe penicillin. OTOH, whatever the patients (politicians) request when healthy, more penicillin will not make a healthy person healthier. ---- The European/Western economy in general is now sick; it needs penicillin. The danger is that politicians, when things are good, will ask for more penicillin (steroids). Penicillin and steroids are different. The equivalent difference in macroeconomic policy sadly doesn't exist. Edited June 12, 2012 by August1991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.