'Florida'

[jacee]

Only if there was absolute no reasonable doubt in terms of the way the prosecution says things happened. I think 15 years in prison is too severe a punishment. Before any shot from any gun, his nose was broken, and there was somebody on top of him, slamming his head against the side walk. Excuse him for not being able to aim for just an arm or leg.

Why did Zimmerman accost Trayvon?

Stalk someone, accost him ... he takes you down ... you shoot him dead ... and walk away free.

Sounds like open season on teenagers to me.

Edited July 16, 2013 by jacee

[Guest American Woman]

The media has a lot to answer for including NBC who ran that edited tape intended to show Zimmerman as racist. He is suing them over that one. Don't forget they also ran pictures of Martin when he was 12, not as he looked then.

But there was the other side, too; I heard over and over about Zimmerman's head being slammed against the sidewalk with no mention that Zimmerman was advised not to approach Martin, that police officers were on the way. Zimmerman had a gun, so there's no way he could have been fearing for his life, so why did he choose to ignore the police dispatcher's advice and approach him, knowing police officers were on the way? But for that decision on his part, the rest wouldn't have happened.

The juror in the interview said they believed that Martin threw the first punch and that it was Zimmerman's voice on the tape so under Florida's self defense laws (not the Stand Your Ground) there was enough reasonable doubt to acquit. The jury understood and got it right. Now maybe there will be changes in the law, who knows.

She also said that Zimmerman "went above and beyond what he really should have done." And that doesn't amount to any guilt? She also said that he's guilty of not using good judgement. So again, if he didn't use good judgement, there's a guilt factor.

Now that race baiter Al Sharpton is muckraking and stirring the pot.

That's too bad, as it takes away from the real issues, IMO. There's enough to be critical of regarding this case without turning it into something it's not. That approach, I believe, does more harm than good all the way around.

[Shady]

Why did Zimmerman accost Trayvon?

Stalk someone, accost him ... he takes you down ... you shoot him dead ... and walk away free.

Sounds like open season on teenagers to me.

That's not at all what happened. Sounds like you've been listening to the media and not the trial.

[scribblet]

None of which meant anything as far as evidence and reasonable doubt. All it boils down to is was Zimmerman afraid for his life, the jury believed he was, and that Martin threw the first punch. Mjuch of what is written and discussed has nothing to do with the evidence and Florida law.

Speaking about the young girl, did anyone see her interview with Piers Morgan? She came across much better than she did on the witness stand, IMO had she been dressed in a similar manner and spoke as she did with Piers, the jury might have found her more credible.

Does the name Pat Mahaney mean anything here, maybe not. Will Sharpton et al have a days of justice march for this guy, not likely.

http://thewaytheballbounces.blogspot.ca/2013/07/media-watch-white-guy-zimmerman-vs-six.html

http://www.wcpo.com/dpp/news/region_central_cincinnati/college_hill/pat-mahaney-dies-victim-of-north-college-hill-bored-beating-has-died

[Guest American Woman]

None of which meant anything as far as evidence and reasonable doubt. All it boils down to is was Zimmerman afraid for his life, the jury believed he was, and that Martin threw the first punch.

Only two people know who threw the first punch, and one of them is dead. At any rate, again, but for the fact that Zimmerman ignored the advice from the police dispatcher, none of this would have happened. In that regard, Zimmerman went after Martin, when he had no business doing so. He knew the police were on their way. He certainly didn't fear for his life when he chose not to wait for the police. Again, some of this should account for something.

[scribblet]

Not sure about that as we can all say woulda coulda shoulda and I don't think it was evidence. Experts along with the eye witness all said Zimmerman was on the bottom and was beaten, in which case the jury had to consider the possibility that had Zimmerman not reacted, Zimmerman himself may have been killed. There was reasonable doubt and no option for a lesser charge.

In fact, Z. should not have been charged at all - from last year

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/drop-george-zimmerman-murder-charge-article-1.1080161
A medical report by George Zimmerman’s doctor has disclosed that Zimmerman had a fractured nose, two black eyes, two lacerations on the back of his head and a back injury on the day after the fatal shooting. If this evidence turns out to be valid, the prosecutor will have no choice but to drop the second-degree murder charge against Zimmerman — if she wants to act ethically, lawfully and professionally.

There is, of course, no assurance that the special prosecutor handling the case, State Attorney Angela Corey, will do the right thing. Because until now, her actions have been anything but ethical, lawful and professional.

She was aware when she submitted an affidavit that it did not contain the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. She deliberately withheld evidence that supported Zimmerman’s claim of self-defense. The New York Times has reported that the police had “a full face picture” of Zimmerman, before paramedics treated him, that showed “a bloodied nose.” The prosecutor also had photographic evidence of bruises to the back of his head.

[Shady]

Only two people know who threw the first punch, and one of them is dead. At any rate, again, but for the fact that Zimmerman ignored the advice from the police dispatcher, none of this would have happened. In that regard, Zimmerman went after Martin, when he had no business doing so. He knew the police were on their way. He certainly didn't fear for his life when he chose not to wait for the police. Again, some of this should account for something.

I'm not sure what you mean "went after" Martin. He followed him for a short period if time. Which isn't against the law. He may have even said something. Which again isn't against the law. One can't physically assault another simply for following or talking. Martin had NO injuries aside from the gun shot. Before the gun shot, Zimmerman suffered a broken nose, bruises and lacerations. I think you have it mixed up as to who went after who. Edited July 17, 2013 by Shady

[BubberMiley]

Media-generated conflicts to divide the population are weird to begin with, but they're even weirder when they seem to have no relation to ideology. I don't see why a right-winger would necessarily feel Martin should have been shot or a left-winger would feel that Zimmerman is the enemy, but people just take the positions that have been defined for them and fight for their team anyway.

[The_Squid]

The Feds may charge him under the hate-crime legislation. Hopefully they do...

[Guest American Woman]

The Feds may charge him under the hate-crime legislation. Hopefully they do...

I think Zimmerman would have reacted the same regardless of race, don't you? When he was talking to the dispatcher, he wasn't even sure Martin was Black. I hope Zimmerman isn't charged under the hate-crime legislation, as I see no evidence of a hate crime. Sometimes an incident is just what it is, regardless of the race of those involved.

[The_Squid]

I think Zimmerman would have reacted the same regardless of race, don't you? When he was talking to the dispatcher, he wasn't even sure Martin was Black. I hope Zimmerman isn't charged under the hate-crime legislation, as I see no evidence of a hate crime. Sometimes an incident is just what it is, regardless of the race of those involved.

If a white guy was walking along minding his own business, like Zimmerman's victim was doing, there would not have been an "incident" as you put it. Although, I think a young man getting killed while doing nothing wrong is a little more than an "incident".

If it was a white guy that was killed, Zimmerman would have likely been convicted.

If you don't see race as a factor in this case, I think you're being purposely blind to the racism that is prevelant in the USA.

[Guest American Woman]

The media has a lot to answer for including NBC who ran that edited tape intended to show Zimmerman as racist. He is suing them over that one. Don't forget they also ran pictures of Martin when he was 12, not as he looked then.

You might find this article interesting: Former Top Journalism Professor Blasts Media for Zimmerman Coverage

[The_Squid]

"NewsBusters, a project of the Media Research Center (MRC), the leader in documenting, exposing and neutralizing liberal media bias."

Not the best source for.... Anything.... LOL

[Guest American Woman]

If a white guy was walking along minding his own business, like Zimmerman's victim was doing, there would not have been an "incident" as you put it. Although, I think a young man getting killed while doing nothing wrong is a little more than an "incident".

If it was a white guy that was killed, Zimmerman would have likely been convicted.

If you don't see race as a factor in this case, I think you're being purposely blind to the racism that is prevelant in the USA.

And I think you're seeing racism everywhere. Perhaps it's not as prevalent as it's made out to be.

Again, when the dispatcher asks Zimmerman the race of the person he is calling about, he's not sure. He says he looks Black. It was dark. It was raining. Martin was wearing a hoodie. It's not as if Zimmerman saw a kid and thought 'He's Black! He's got to be up to no good!" As I said, there's nothing to suggest that Zimmerman found Martin suspicious because he was Black. From all accounts, he found him suspicious because he was a young kid hanging around his neighborhood and there had been some break-ins.

"NewsBusters, a project of the Media Research Center (MRC), the leader in documenting, exposing and neutralizing liberal media bias."

Not the best source for.... Anything.... LOL

Care to take a stab at refuting it? What do they say that's incorrect?

Edited July 17, 2013 by American Woman

[The_Squid]

No, I don't care to refute a loony rightwing rag. You keep going on about that "liberal bias" and perfect utopian racial equality found in the USA.

LOL

[dre]

I dont think that Martin just attacked him and started punching him out of the blue. I also dont think Zimmerman planned to shoot the kid.

The question is how did the two get close enough together for punches to be thrown? If Zimmerman was just following from a distance that would not have happened. So one of them closed the distance on the other one. I dont think it was Martin because if Martin turned and started moving towards Zimmerman in a threatening manner I think Zimmerman would have drawn the gun THEN and told him to stay the hell back. He wouldnt wait until this person he thought was a dangerous criminal was face to face with him.

That means that Zimmerman closed the distance on Martin. I remember somewhere a quote from Zimmerman to the effect of "these damn guys always get away"... I think what happened is Zimmerman tried to apprehend this guy with the intention of keeping him there until the cops arrived. He tried to grab him. Then the rest of the story is just as Zimmerman said... Martin started punching him (id have done the same), and Zimmerman shot him in self defense.

[scribblet]

You might find this article interesting: Former Top Journalism Professor Blasts Media for Zimmerman Coverage

Thanks.. another one here http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2013/07/13/Media-Zimmerman-Coverage-Rap-Sheet?NewsWatchCanada.ca

I suppose nothing is true unless it comes from the 'loony left' though.

I think forgotten in all of this is that Neighbourhood watch volunteers were on the watch for young men who had the same general appearance of Martin. There had been a number of burglaries in that neighbourhood, all committed by young black men, and was stated as such at the trial. It is more than likely that Zimmerman would have ignored Martin has he not fitted that description.

[GostHacked]

-TSS-, on 16 Jul 2013 - 5:33 PM, said:

The media really whipped up hysteria and lynch-mentality in a case which was already sensitive enough. Not very responsible, one must say. They seem to enjoy provoking confrontation.

The media in my view assists the 'divide and conquer' strategy. The more division, the less unity and the less power we collectively have to change things for the better.

[jacee]

I think forgotten in all of this is that Neighbourhood watch volunteers were on the watch for young men who had the same general appearance of Martin. There had been a number of burglaries in that neighbourhood, all committed by young black men, and was stated as such at the trial. It is more than likely that Zimmerman would have ignored Martin has he not fitted that description.

They were the skittles burglars?

Zimmerman was told by 911 not to follow Martin. There was no reason for him to try to detain Martin for police because there was no evidence of wrongdoing and not even any 'suspicious' circumstances.

Martin defended himself from a power-hungry dumb thug with a gun who accosted him for no reason, against the orders of police.

What's the lesson here for kids buying skittles?

Edited July 17, 2013 by jacee

[Shady]

They were the skittles burglars?

Zimmerman was told by 911 not to follow Martin. There was no reason for him to try to detain Martin for police because there was no evidence of wrongdoing and not even any 'suspicious' circumstances.

Martin defended himself from a power-hungry dumb thug with a gun who accosted him for no reason, against the orders of police.

What's the lesson here for kids buying skittles?

Actually it was Msrtin that physically assaulted Zimmerman. You don't get to assault someone just because you think they're following you. That's not how the law works.

[Shady]

And this nonsense about Skittles is meaningless. I can beat the hell out of someone with bubble gum in my pocket. What difference does it make?

[Moonlight Graham]

Racism anyone?:

"She [Martin's friend] also testified that Martin referred to Zimmerman as a "creepy ass cracker" during their telephone conversation."

hahaha. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Trayvon_Martin#Witness_8_.28Rachel_Jeantel.29

Edited July 17, 2013 by Moonlight Graham

[Guest American Woman]

They were the skittles burglars?

Zimmerman was told by 911 not to follow Martin. There was no reason for him to try to detain Martin for police because there was no evidence of wrongdoing and not even any 'suspicious' circumstances.

Martin defended himself from a power-hungry dumb thug with a gun who accosted him for no reason, against the orders of police.

What's the lesson here for kids buying skittles?

Not to buy skittles? M&M's, perhaps?

Do you honestly think ludicrous, totally irrelevant comments help people see your view or promote discussion?

While I agree that Martin should have heeded the advice of the police dispatcher, I doubt if either one of the two men involved were initially "defending" themselves from the other. Likely it was an encounter of two hot-heads, one who was armed.

From what I understand, Zimmerman was not on neighborhood watch duty at the time, but he thought Martin looked suspicious. He called the police. That should have been the end of it.

It's been pointed out that while Zimmerman was 'beat up,' Martin had no bruises. This I find odd, because why would Zimmerman not fight back? Seems to me the fact that he shot Martin without having so much as thrown a punch might be indicative of his mindset, and I doubt that's what the Florida law intends - especially since Martin was not on Zimmerman's private property.

I still have a lot of questions about the verdict.

[jacee]

Actually it was Msrtin that physically assaulted Zimmerman. You don't get to assault someone just because you think they're following you. That's not how the law works.

Trayvon ran, Zimmerman ran after him, against the instructions of 911. Trayvon had every right to stand his ground and fight to defend himself from the threat posed by Zimmerman running after him.

https://audioboo.fm/boos/717340-george-zimmerman-call-to-police

Some other relevant info:

http://m.motherjones.com/politics/2012/03/what-happened-trayvon-martin-explained

Zimmerman also

blatantly violated major principles of the Neighborhood Watch

manual, ABC News has learned.The manual, from the National Neighborhood Watch Program, states: "It should be emphasized to members that they do not possess police powers, and

they shall not carry weapons

or pursue vehicles. They should also be cautioned to alert police or deputies when encountering strange activity.

Members should never confront suspicious persons

who could be armed and dangerous....

"According to Chris Tutko, the director of the National Neighborhood Watch Program, there are about 22,000 registered watch groups nationwide, and

Zimmerman was not part of a registered group

another fact the police were not aware of at the time of the incident.

Edited July 17, 2013 by jacee

[Shady]

Trayvon ran, Zimmerman ran after him, against the instructions of 911. Trayvon had every right to stand his ground and fight to defend himself from the threat posed by Zimmerman running after him.https://audioboo.fm/boos/717340-george-zimmerman-call-to-police

Some other relevant info:http://m.motherjones.com/politics/2012/03/what-happened-trayvon-martin-explainedZimmerman alsoblatantly violated major principles of the Neighborhood Watch

manual, ABC News has learned.The manual, from the National Neighborhood Watch Program, states: "It should be emphasized to members that they do not possess police powers, and they shall not carry weapons

or pursue vehicles. They should also be cautioned to alert police or deputies when encountering strange activity.Members should never confront suspicious persons

who could be armed and dangerous....

"According to Chris Tutko, the director of the National Neighborhood Watch Program, there are about 22,000 registered watch groups nationwide, and Zimmerman was not part of a registered group

another fact the police were not aware of at the time of the incident.

Nope, Zimmerman didn't run after him. You're just making stuff up now. Martin is the one that turned back to confront Zimmerman. We now know from his friend that Msrtin was worried that Zimmerman was a gay rapist. It sounds like Martin was doing some gay bashing.