Ban the Burka?

[Mr.Canada]

Ninety-five per cent of Quebecers support a proposed provincial law barring the face veil from government offices, schools, and other publicly funded institutions, says the poll, released exclusively to the Montreal Gazette Friday.

Albertans are most likely to support the veil ban, with 82 per cent approving the bill; followed by Ontario, with 77 per cent support; the Atlantic provinces (73 per cent) and British Columbia (70 per cent). Support for withholding government services from those wearing the face veil was lowest in Manitoba and Saskatchewan, at 65 per cent.

Bloc Québécois supporters favoured the bill most (95 per cent), along with Conservatives (86 per cent) and Liberals (81 per cent). Three-quarters of NDP supporters agreed with the bill.

Source

It appears that Canadians want it banned. Maybe it's time for a debate in the HOC on the issue to ban it across Canada if possible. If not then lets push our provinicial governments to have debate in our provincial legislatures.

Edited March 28, 2010 by Mr.Canada

[Muddy]

So it should be banned. In a free society of equals we should be able to look into the face of our equal citizens.Male or female. No one should be allowed to wear a mask unless they are physically deformed. Bank robbers are not allowed to wear a mask. I wonder why? I love the joy I get from passers by who smile in recognition of me as a fellow human being. This is not a mandated Koranic Islamic religious symbol. It is most certainly a male subjugation and ownership of his female family members in the Islamic world though. Without being able to be blessed by a persons countenance does foster mistrust and suspicion. Is that masked person smiling at me for openng a door or are they frowning at my western manners,laughing,insulted or grateful? We communicate with facial expressions and our countenance gives us our individual uniquness. Canada should be a start for Islamic female liberation.No more hiding females faces from the sun . No more arranged marriages. I say freedom from this course tradition of female ownership by male dominance.

Where are the left wing feminists liberators of the sixties and seventies ? Why are they so quiet of this symbol of male ownership?

Then there is the safety issue if one drives with a full mask. Of course in much of the Arab world women are not allowed to drive. Is that a safety factor? Just a few thoughts.

[Smallc]

This article isn't about the Burka per say.

[Argus]

This article isn't about the Burka per say.

That's actually quite astute of you. No, it's is the societal resentment towards those who insist on propogating an Islamist view of women and their place in the world. That is combined, of course, with a resentment towards a growing number of foreigners living among us and a feeling of being overwhelmed by them. It's not coincidental that the resentment towards the burka is lowest in places where you rarely, if ever, will see one.

Fatima Al-Dhaher, the Muslim who was subjected to Coulter's notorious "get a camel" remark, doesn't wear a burka. But she does wear a towel on her head. Why? Towels aren't required Islamic apparel. They're a sign of a backward middle east culture which she deliberately embraced, despite apparently growing up in Canada. Also embraced by her is the hateful middle east politics, as evidenced by the facebook group she belonged to which used words like "Kikeroaches" to describe Jews.

So from my perspective - this is the second/third generation of "Canadianized" Muslims which I am to be more comfortable with?

I'm all for banning burkas - and bedsheets. If you want to wear a bedsheet go "home".

[Michael Hardner]

They're a sign of a backward middle east culture which she deliberately embraced, despite apparently growing up in Canada.

You threw in a bit of opinion on why you don`t like other cultures in here, I guess for flavouring of some kind, but it spoils your entire post.

[Michael Hardner]

It appears that Canadians want it banned. Maybe it's time for a debate in the HOC on the issue to ban it across Canada if possible. If not then lets push our provinicial governments to have debate in our provincial legislatures.

The people have no say on such things, nor should they. Minority rights are protected by law. Charest is just doing a cute political handstand, and shame on him for that.

Banning this costume or not banning it is just a symbolic gesture. It`s estimated that there are 50 women in Quebec that wear one of these, so is it even worth the effort to legislate this ?

Edited March 28, 2010 by Michael Hardner

[Argus]

You threw in a bit of opinion on why you don`t like other cultures in here, I guess for flavouring of some kind, but it spoils your entire post.

Would you disagree with my terming middle eastern cultures backward? Is it an opinion or is it a trueism?

[Argus]

Banning this costume or not banning it is just a symbolic gesture. It`s estimated that there are 50 women in Quebec that wear one of these, so is it even worth the effort to legislate this ?

I think the open societal condemnation of the extreme of middle eastern dress will give pause to those considering donning not just the burka but the bedsheet and towel as well. The more they realize how dissaproving our society and culture are of their homeland culture's desire to cover up women and make them as anonymous as possible the more the open-minded of them will decide that maybe they ought to not dress like their fifth century ancesters here.

[Mr.Canada]

They also spoke about it on Question Period this morning.

Their's a poll question on the ctv/qp website asking whether or not to ban the face covering Canada wide while using public services.

[Smallc]

I'm all for banning burkas - and bedsheets. If you want to wear a bedsheet go "home".

You may be surprised, but I agree with you for the most part. In pubic, people should be able to see other people's faces.

[Argus]

You may be surprised, but I agree with you for the most part. In pubic, people should be able to see other people's faces.

I understand if you've grown up in Syria or Iran and have been wearing a bedsheet (and sorry, I can't recall its name) all your life and you're middle aged - okay I understand why you'd still wear it after coming to Canada.

But for someone who grows up here to don that kind of apparal is, to me, a rejection of Canada's culture and values and an embracing instead of the Islamist mindset and foreign value system of the countries their parents came from. If you feel that nationalistic about your "homeland" then you should go home.

[Michael Hardner]

Would you disagree with my terming middle eastern cultures backward? Is it an opinion or is it a trueism?

I know you will mock me, but the term is imbued with cultural perspective.

Just as when the Imams of countries call the west 'decadent' there is truth in the statement, but it's a value statement and has no place in the argument. We're talking about our laws, our policies with regards to reasonable accommodation. We shouldn't be so insecure about our culture that we need to name-call other cultures during a reasoned debate.

[Michael Hardner]

I think the open societal condemnation of the extreme of middle eastern dress will give pause to those considering donning not just the burka but the bedsheet and towel as well. The more they realize how dissaproving our society and culture are of their homeland culture's desire to cover up women and make them as anonymous as possible the more the open-minded of them will decide that maybe they ought to not dress like their fifth century ancesters here.

Certainly, as many condemn Christian faiths for - for example - favouring less freedom for women the pendulum should swing to other religions as well. That's not the same as banning their right to dress as they please.

Are ski masks banned in Quebec ?

[eyeball]

Ban the Burka?

I'd rather force men who can't control themselves at the sight of a woman to wear blinders. Burka's make men look threatening, not women.

[Moonlight Graham]

Does this mean i can't be a ghost for Halloween?

[Guest TrueMetis]

Does this mean i can't be a ghost for Halloween?

If it's about not allowing the face to be covered then we won't be able to be a lot of things for Halloween.

[Topaz]

If a North American went oversea to a country to live, wouldn't that person have to follow the laws and rules of that country? If so, than any person leaving their country better know what the customs and laws of the country are and if they don't fit in, think twice about going to that country.

[punked]

If a North American went oversea to a country to live, wouldn't that person have to follow the laws and rules of that country? If so, than any person leaving their country better know what the customs and laws of the country are and if they don't fit in, think twice about going to that country.

Funny I always thought tolerance was built into the law. Must have misread Section two of the charter which gurentees me freedom of religion, and expression. I think is you who needs to know what the laws of this country are.

[g_bambino]

Are ski masks banned in Quebec ?

I don't know if they are officially, but would you consider it appropriate to expect service in a Crown office while wearing one (let alone anywhere not state run)?

I've a friend who works as a bank teller, and he explained to me that women in burqas are acceptable (he has served them) but a man in a mask would have security all over his ass in a second.

[DrGreenthumb]

Funny I always thought tolerance was built into the law. Must have misread Section two of the charter which gurentees me freedom of religion, and expression. I think is you who needs to know what the laws of this country are.

This is a ridiculous intrusion of the government into people`s lives. Maybe when the government attacks Christianity the bigots will wake up and respect people`s freedom. If these women want to wear a burka they have a right to dress however they damn well choose. I can understand a requirement to remove the head covering temporarily for identification purposes when required by law enforcement or security, for voting, driver liscening or border crossing,etc but other than for public safety reasons this is just an outright attack on personal freedom.

[g_bambino]

I can understand a requirement to remove the head covering temporarily for identification purposes when required by law enforcement or security, for voting, driver liscening or border crossing,etc

But that's essentially all that's being proposed. From the OP's link:

The bill would require all public sector employees to have their faces uncovered, as well as any citizen using government services; for example, someone applying for a medicare card or paying her car registration...

I would like to think that customer service business owners/managers should have the right to ask customers to uncover their face; in a bank, for instance. If I have to put a shirt on to get served in a restaurant, why should it be considered ridiculous that someone be asked to uncover their face?

[fix]

Edited March 28, 2010 by g_bambino

[eyeball]

...why should it be considered ridiculous that someone be asked to uncover their face?

Apparently it's not as hard as asking certain men to control themselves in the presence of uncovered women.

[Muddy]

Apparently it's not as hard as asking certain men to control themselves in the presence of uncovered women.

Boorish men will always be with us and should be chastised and a gentlmen present will always do just that.

[bjre]

So it should be banned. In a free society of equals we should be able to look into the face of our equal citizens.Male or female. No one should be allowed to wear a mask unless they are physically deformed.

So you want them lost their freedom to choose their way of wearing?

What will be the punishment if they do so? Send them to jail and let tax payers pay the cost? So that jails, courts, cops will take even more from tax? So that lawyers will take more? So that cost of production in Canada will go even higher? Export can be even less attractive due to cost increase? So that people have less money to buy what they need. So that banks can make mortgage even longer so that they can charge even more interests?

Bank robbers are not allowed to wear a mask....

How many bank robbers are female and wear that? in percentage?

I wonder why? I love the joy I get from passers by who smile in recognition of me as a fellow human being. This is not a mandated Koranic Islamic religious symbol. It is most certainly a male subjugation and ownership of his female family members in the Islamic world though. Without being able to be blessed by a persons countenance does foster mistrust and suspicion. Is that masked person smiling at me for openng a door or are they frowning at my western manners,laughing,insulted or grateful? We communicate with facial expressions and our countenance gives us our individual uniquness. Canada should be a start for Islamic female liberation.No more hiding females faces from the sun . No more arranged marriages. I say freedom from this course tradition of female ownership by male dominance.

Where are the left wing feminists liberators of the sixties and seventies ? Why are they so quiet of this symbol of male ownership?

Then there is the safety issue if one drives with a full mask. Of course in much of the Arab world women are not allowed to drive. Is that a safety factor? Just a few thoughts.

I wonder why? Why it looks just like what nuns wear in movies?

[Moonlight Graham]

If it's about not allowing the face to be covered then we won't be able to be a lot of things for Halloween.

lol true.