US soldier throws puppy from cliff

[Carinthia]

Bringing this crime to the forefront on this forum has plenty to do with the fact that the one doing the abuse is an American soldier. I agree with you and have said as much, that these cruel people live all over the planet and come from all walks of life, but this instance was used to slam American soldiers.

As for the soldiers in question: If the video is authentic, the Marines involved could face judicial charges, a reduction in rank and pay and a court-martial. They could also be discharged. Link

However, the video hasn't been authentisized yet. It could be a hoax.

"The act itself is atrocious and just to see the disregard for life is just troubling," Hawaii Humane Society spokeswoman Kawehi Yim said.

Others said they believed the clip was staged and not real.

The Marines said while they will look into what happened. They want to determine whether the video clip is authentic.

"We need to find out who is this person, is this a legitimate video? Was it edited?" Perrine said.

I guess you are not the only one to suspect that this story was to denigrate U.S. soldiers. I confess, I do not know the history of why anybody would do that here. And you are so right AW, Canadian soldiers too have things to answer for as do all soldiers from all nations. There are bad apples everywhere.

[kuzadd]

That's not a "spin." That's a fact. But just because high standards are expected doesn't mean the troops, ie: those who enlist in the military, are more moral than civilians. I'm no more shocked that a soldier would engage in abusive behavior than I am that 'Joe citizen' does. Of course the Marines are going to be upset, just as anyone would be; just as a football team would be if their star player engaged in such behavior; just as a school district would be if one of their teachers behaved in such a way, etc. Of course they expect more. Seems to me that would go without saying.

Yet in your previous post you seem to say, there is no higher standard expected?

i said:

But for a soldier, who is alleged to be of a higher standard, or more moral,

aw:

But I'm not sure soldiers are alleged to be more moral. Certainly the leaders of some of the nations these soldiers come from claim to be more moral, but there isn't any morality test for new recruits.

I think we are having issues with words here.

If the standards expected of the soldier are such that this is bad behaviour for the soldier, then it is bad behaviour, that's it.

just as a football team would be if their star player engaged in such behavior;

but we aren't talking about a football player, who I am sorry to say, simply does not have the same type of reputation to uphold as a soldier representing a nation.

As for Canadian soldiers, oh, indeed they have done bad things, that have shone Canada in a negative light, no one would dispute that.

Wether you accept the fact or not, and it is the same for my country, these soldiers represent their country.

What I personally believe about soldiers is irrelevant, to this discussion.

the fact is that this is bad PR for the US marines, as it would be for Canadians.

Edited March 4, 2008 by kuzadd

[Regulus de Leo]

Fortunately this soldier comes from a country which passes and enforces laws which punish cruelty to animals. This man will be found and punished because he comes from a caring society.

Sadly in the Middle East, because dogs are considered unclean and Muslims are not permitted to have dogs (unless they are used for guarding or hunting) dogs are treated like this every day: abandoned, beaten, stoned and starved.

[DogOnPorch]

You have noticed that haven't you?

Can you go dig up ONE topic they have started that had anything positive to say about the US or Israel? I can't.

Doesn't that tell you enough about their motivations?

The have a clear agenda and will use ANY means to promote it, even if that means pretending to be outraged because a dog was abused. In reality it is outrage and hatred of anything American or Israeli.

I wonder how deep the hatred goes, but Buffy answer that question for me in the holocaust thread.

I tend to agree that the suffering of the dog was indeed secondary to the prime motive for posting this. I suppose we all can be guilty of this at times on a political forum. Just when buffy or kuzadd do it is has the subtlty of an anvil being dropped from the top of a building. A tad predictable...but there we go. As I reminded kuzadd a while back...when looking for witches under beds, try not to make it look like you're on some sort of a hunt.

Real animal cruelty isn't found in the USMC...no matter the actions of this sadistic soldier. Go to Google or YouTube and type in Animal Abuse/Cruelty China. Bring your barf bag. There's some real cruelty...

-----------------------------------------------------------

"If seven maids with seven mops

Swept it for half a year.

Do you suppose," the Walrus said,

"That they could get it clear?"

"I doubt it," said the Carpenter,

And shed a bitter tear.

---Lewis Carroll

[bush_cheney2004]

OMIGOD...not a PUPPY! Killing people is fine, but we have to draw the line at defensless puppies. What next? Kittens?

Is swatting flies OK?

[Drea]

How very typical -- "we might be bad, but someone else is worse!". Are you on a race to the bottom?

I hope there is a follow-up story... probably the soldier will go on Prozac when he gets home and there will be no prosecution whatsoever.

After all -- he is a stressed* out soldier and needs to take his frustrations out on something doesn't he?

*Never mind that he sure doesn't look stressed in the video, looks like he's just having some good ol boy fun.

Edited March 5, 2008 by Drea

[bush_cheney2004]

This Marine needs a break...maybe some R & R clubbing cute baby seals in Canada!

[DogOnPorch]

How very typical -- "we might be bad, but someone else is worse!". Are you on a race to the bottom?

I hope there is a follow-up story... probably the soldier will go on Prozac when he gets home and there will be no prosecution whatsoever.

After all -- he is a stressed* out soldier and needs to take his frustrations out on something doesn't he?

*Never mind that he sure doesn't look stressed in the video, looks like he's just having some good ol boy fun.

Are you aware of the fur industry in China? Seriously...it's right out of Silent Hill. So-called fake fur isn't so fake it seems.

But to seek to paint all USMC members as puppy killing sadists would be somewhat inaccurate...right? I mean...all Muslims aren't terrorists...etc. Or are they??

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines: Marines and the enemy. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion.

---Gen. William Thornson

[Melanie_]

I didn't watch the video - I don't need to see some sicko be cruel to a helpless animal. I hope the Marines send a strong message that this type of behaviour can't be tolerated.

[Drea]

Are you on a race to the bottom?

Someone does something horrific so it's OK to do something a tad less horrific? Because someone is doing something worse, makes it OK?

And I wasn't painting the entire military as cruel. Just this one asshole. And I highly doubt if any punishment will occur. Like I said, the soldier will probably get a prescription and go home and excuses for his behaviour will abound.

There is no excuse, no reason at all for doing this except to be cruel. "Latorie" does not deserve to wear the uniform imo.

[bush_cheney2004]

Meanwhile, back in Iraq, this pooch flew to the USA in First Class! I think he was the puppy's father.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...8021403263.html

Edited March 5, 2008 by bush_cheney2004

[Brain Candy]

Apparently the puppy was allready dead, or was a doll, even PETA is cautious about making a statement on it, but im sure this guy will get alot of angry morons protesting for the next little while, what a great distraction. Meanwhile, the world keeps turning.

Edited March 5, 2008 by Brain Candy

[White Doors]

No longer is the thread about the poor puppy -- it's now evolved into whether or not the military is "moral".

Who gives a shit? A man committed a very cruel act and you people can only think of "your" image. Newsflash! "Your" image is already shot to hell and even if you could bring back that dead puppy it would not make a lick of difference.

This soldier = America at it's worst.

Which has you frothing at the mouth and licking your lips.

And you pretend to actually care about the dog.

lol how predictable.

[Drea]

You are correct.

I just absolutely love to rub America's nose in its own shit.

And people like you who would defend the soldier and make excuses for his behaviour just make it so easy. *shrug*

You are winning the race to the bottom -- congratulations.

[AngusThermopyle]

Man! Did this ever get high jacked! If the video is real then this guy is nothing more than a sadistic peace of crap. For those who try to deflect the topic or excuse him, there is no excuse, simple as that. If I had been deployed with him and he did that he'd have more to worry about than an investigation. The boys would have kicked the living sh*t out of him.

Just because one is military does not mean a person is a heartless bastard. There is a code of conduct for military members and this individuals behaviour does not conform to that code. All irrelevant and childish mention of baby seals aside, this is about the unacceptable behaviour of a military member, not industries in other countries.

As for killing people but not puppies. Well in all honesty I haven't seen any dogs totting AK's and beheading people with dull knives. Bit of a disconnect from reality going on today, eh!

[eyeball]

Meanwhile, back in Iraq, this pooch flew to the USA in First Class! I think he was the puppy's father.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...8021403263.html

I wonder how many orphaned humans have been evacuated from Iraq or Afghanistan? It seems to me that would be an honourable thing to do.

[bush_cheney2004]

Man! Did this ever get high jacked! If the video is real then this guy is nothing more than a sadistic peace of crap. For those who try to deflect the topic or excuse him, there is no excuse, simple as that. If I had been deployed with him and he did that he'd have more to worry about than an investigation. The boys would have kicked the living sh*t out of him.

And if you got caught assaulting a soldier, you would be brought up on charges as well. Hell, I had a Commanding Officer who liked to use seagulls for M-14 target practice.

Just because one is military does not mean a person is a heartless bastard. There is a code of conduct for military members and this individuals behaviour does not conform to that code. All irrelevant and childish mention of baby seals aside, this is about the unacceptable behaviour of a military member, not industries in other countries.

The American code (UCMJ) does not apply to puppies, dead or alive. Doesn't apply to clubbing baby seals either.

As for killing people but not puppies. Well in all honesty I haven't seen any dogs totting AK's and beheading people with dull knives. Bit of a disconnect from reality going on today, eh!

Get a grip....go visit a slaughterhouse, "humane" society, or cockfight. Save some tears for all three.

[M.Dancer]

Hell, I had a Commanding Officer who liked to use seagulls for M-14 target practice.

When I was in the army cadets, one summer we were on the range at Val Cartier firing the FN-C1 when this rabbit ran across the range near the butts....

all of a sudden hitting a large target at 200 yeards didn't seem all that interesting anymore....at least half of us on the range saw this grey bunny ....and then all you would have seen was a rising cloud of dust as a half dozen kids emptied their remaining rounds in thier magazines....

Should anyone have been brought up on charges?

Well, the ones that missed, certainly....

[bush_cheney2004]

...Should anyone have been brought up on charges?

Well, the ones that missed, certainly....

Agreed...even Luke Skywalker needed target practice on live game!

Personal feelings aside (if that is possible), this thread vividly illustrates the disconnect some people have, with arbitrary judgements about which lives/organisms can be snuffed out on a whim, up to and including fetuses.

Oh no...NOT P-U-P-P-I-E-S! O-M-I-G-O-D !!!!!!

Many years ago, people use to drown kittens in a sack because it was too expensive to "euthanize" them "properly".

[M.Dancer]

Oh no...NOT P-U-P-P-I-E-S! O-M-I-G-O-D !!!!!!

Two balck men can pummel themselves silly and everyone cheers but let a black man gamble on dog fighting....

[Guest American Woman]

I tend to agree that the suffering of the dog was indeed secondary to the prime motive for posting this. I suppose we all can be guilty of this at times on a political forum. Just when buffy or kuzadd do it is has the subtlty of an anvil being dropped from the top of a building. A tad predictable...but there we go. As I reminded kuzadd a while back...when looking for witches under beds, try not to make it look like you're on some sort of a hunt.

When I read that this marine is "sick sick sick sick," a "sick twisted f***" and we should "Throw him of a f***** cliff," along with a list of other terrible deeds done by other military personal which have absolutely nothing to do with this soldier or this (alleged) deed, the suffering of the dog definitely seems to be secondary to bashing the U.S. military.

And yet a see comments like these from Buffy in other threads:

This in regards to a Muslim celebration/tradition gone bad-- Leave it to some here to make this tragedy into a bash all Muslims thread. News lows are struck here daily eh? What totally poor taste. link

...and this in regards to a Muslim father, who had been at odds with his daughter over the hijab, who choked her to death-- I have avoided this thread for a few reasons (mostly due to the overwhelming bigotted responses by certain members who chose to focus on the Muslim thing [...]

Some folk simply snap. IMO this is what happened here. I would wager this guy feels pretty awful right now link

Why anyone would have the need to turn this into a 'bash the U.S. military/bash the U.S.' issue is difficult to understand, especially in light of the comments quoted above regarding others; comment which would be appropriate regarding this thread.

Edited March 5, 2008 by American Woman

[eyeball]

Why anyone would have the need to turn this into a 'bash the U.S. military/bash the U.S.' issue is difficult to understand, especially in light of the comments quoted above regarding others; comment which would be appropriate regarding this thread.

It may be difficult to understand but its really not that surprising. I think its a reflection of just how impotent and powerless most people feel in terms of seeing the US military and its commander in chief get such a free pass on other more important things like rendition, torture, phoney intell and misguided invasions etc etc.

I'd rather see things like the secret meetings the commanders have behind closed doors posted to places like You-tube, then people's outrage would be more focused on where it really belongs.

[Drea]

Agreed...even Luke Skywalker needed target practice on live game!

Personal feelings aside (if that is possible), this thread vividly illustrates the disconnect some people have, with arbitrary judgements about which lives/organisms can be snuffed out on a whim, up to and including fetuses.

Oh no...NOT P-U-P-P-I-E-S! O-M-I-G-O-D !!!!!!

Many years ago, people use to drown kittens in a sack because it was too expensive to "euthanize" them "properly".

Do you not see a difference between shooting a hare and tossing a puppy off a cliff...?

Hint: one is deliberately cruel.

Tossing a defenseless creature off a cliff and shrugging while it yelps as it goes through the air. You are one sick "puppy".

BTW, I would be just as disgusted if the guy had tossed a salamander or rat. It's the deliberate cruelty at issue, not the fact that he killed it, but HOW he killed it.

How do you feel about those kids who microwaved the kitty? Do you condone it? Were they just having some "harmless fun"?

:puke:

[M.Dancer]

BTW, I would be just as disgusted if the guy had tossed a salamander or rat.

Rats are to be killed on sight. And personally I don't care if it squeals.....better to warn its friends to stay away....

[guyser]

And if you got caught assaulting a soldier, you would be brought up on charges as well. Hell, I had a Commanding Officer who liked to use seagulls for M-14 target practice.

The American code (UCMJ) does not apply to puppies, dead or alive. Doesn't apply to clubbing baby seals either.

Sadly, you should have put your CO up on charges.

As for UCMJ, no it does not apply to puppies. It certainly would apply to idiots who do harm to them. And , frankly you know this.

Your CO , and this Marine who threw the puppy could be charged under Subchapter 933, article 133 , Conduct unbecoming , or S 934 Article 134 , the "dont be stupid" section (abuse of animals)