US soldier throws puppy from cliff

[buffycat]

This is just sick. You all know what they say about people who enjoy being cruel (understatement) to animals:

LINK

I guess making kids chase trucks for water, and of course not letting them get any, or raping of 14 year old girls then slaying them and their innocent families just isn't enough for some folks.

What will happen when this sick twisted f***gets back to the US? Does anyone think he will suddenly become a nice person? A 'Brave and honourable' soldier - to be praised for defending democracy???

sick sick sick sick.

Throw him of a f***** cliff.

Edited March 4, 2008 by buffycat

[Shakeyhands]

I'll agree thats pretty bad, but I don't see any insignia on that uniform.

[buffycat]

I'll agree thats pretty bad, but I don't see any insignia on that uniform.

So... you are saying what??

That this is not an American soldier?

Well... it seems he is based out of Hawaii:

Puppy abuse video investigated by Hawaii Marine base

Edited March 4, 2008 by buffycat

[kuzadd]

what an a**hole!

sick way to get some jollies, maybe he can come back and mutilate some kittens for fun too.

Or maybe he can be like that soldier, back from 2 tours in Iraq, drinking and drugs, who beat and raped a 3 month old baby.

gotta get that frustration out somehow eh?

puppies, kitten, Iraqi kids, rape and torture.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080220/ap_on_re_us/infant_raped

JACKSON, Mich. - A former Army paratrooper who served two tours of duty in Iraq has been ordered tried on charges of raping and critically injuring a 3-month-old girl.

Kirk Coleman is charged with first-degree criminal sexual conduct and first-degree child abuse, charges that carry up to life in prison.

Authorities say the then-27-year-old Coleman attacked the baby Sept. 14 in Jackson County's Blackman Township, about 65 miles west of Detroit.

The girl sustained brain damage and 17 broken bones and is undergoing therapy. District Judge R. Darryl Mazur ruled Tuesday there's enough evidence to warrant a trial.

Coleman allegedly told investigators he blacked out after drinking heavily and taking painkillers and awoke to find the injured baby in her crib, The Jackson Citizen Patriot reported. WILX-TV says he remains free on $100,000 bond.

One news story indicated this was the mans own baby.

[AngusThermopyle]

All of those instances are disgusting. Deal with these people harshly and shut out the cries of "they couldn't help themselves".

[Shakeyhands]

So... you are saying what??

That this is not an American soldier?

Well... it seems he is based out of Hawaii:

Puppy abuse video investigated by Hawaii Marine base

Well yes, thats exactly what I was wondering but I see the story posted elsewhere now as well. Sick guy.

[Guest American Woman]

I have to wonder how much a factor his being a soldier is. It's not as if non-soldiers don't engage in this behavior all too often.

I take it you support the death penalty, Buffy?

[kuzadd]

I have to wonder how much a factor his being a soldier is. It's not as if non-soldiers don't engage in this behavior all too often.

I take it you support the death penalty, Buffy?

I know you asked buffy a question but if I may respond?

American woman, Generally wether a soldier or not, this most certainly unacceptable behaviour.

But for a soldier, who is alleged to be of a higher standard, or more moral, it leaves one wondering.

Especially in light of the fact he is an occupier in another people's country.

Should he not, in light of his responsibility , and what he represents (the US) be held to that higher standard?

Recently I heard Chalmers Johnson interviewed, and he noted that many world citizens experiences with Americans come not from contact with American business people, etc, but for many, their experience comes from their dealings with the American military/soldiers, through America's numerous occupations, wars, military bases,etc.,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chalmers_Johnson

Is this really the experience people should have of the US through it's military men?

Edited March 4, 2008 by kuzadd

[M.Dancer]

Especially in light of the fact he is an occupier in another people's country.

Hawaii is no longer part of the US?

...the things you can read here truley boggles the imagination......

[Guest American Woman]

I know you asked buffy a question but if I may respond?

American woman, Generally wether a soldier or not, this most certainly unacceptable behaviour.

But for a soldier, who is alleged to be of a higher standard, or more moral, it leaves one wondering.

Especially in light of the fact he is an occupier in another people's country.

Should he not, in light of his responsibility , and what he represents (the US) be held to that higher standard?

Of course it's unacceptable behavior. There's no question about that. But my point is that abuse like this occurs too often, not just by soldiers. Here's a news item from the Honolulu Advertiser, which Buffy used as a source for this thread, from a couple of weeks ago:

Babysitter throws tot off Honolulu overpass

A 23 year old man threw a toddler off an overpass into traffic, but there was no thread about that. Yet there's all sorts of indignation over this incident, which there should be, but I can't help but feel the reason this news item made it to the board is because it involves a U.S. soldier. Why else the need to list other atrocities committed by soldiers in this thread? Then there's a call for the alleged U.S. Marine's death, so my question was a serious one. I want to know if Buffy supports the death penalty.

But I'm not sure soldiers are alleged to be more moral. Certainly the leaders of some of the nations these soldiers come from claim to be more moral, but there isn't any morality test for new recruits. In fact, the standards for new recruits have been lowered as quotas have gone unfilled. I've never thought the mere fact that someone enlisted in the military made him/her more moral. Have you seriously thought that yourself?

Furthermore, the troops in Afghanistan and Iraq have been held over their tours of duty. I would find occassional behavior like this less surprising coming from someone who may be suffering from the effects of being at war than I would the average citizen. Certainly they should be held accountable, but they shouldn't be the basis for judging the troops.

From Buffy's source:

There have been numerous stories of Marines adopting pets and bringing them home from Iraq or helping to arrange life-saving medical care for Iraqi children.

Seems to me that deserves at least as much attention as the marine who abused the puppy, but there's basically nothing but silence over the good, compassionate acts the troops are responsible for-- and there have been many.

[kuzadd]

'American Woman'

But I'm not sure soldiers are alleged to be more moral. Certainly the leaders of some of the nations these soldiers come from claim to be more moral, but there isn't any morality test for new recruits. In fact, the standards for new recruits have been lowered as quotas have gone unfilled. I've never thought the mere fact that someone enlisted in the military made him/her more moral. Have you seriously thought that yourself?

In the rhetoric , and the advertising for the military the soldier is held up, always, in a positive light.

with themes of heroics , family etc.,

killing puppies, doesn't exactly promote that image?

BTW: Note I use the word alleged in my original post.

Have I seriously thought that myself?

can't say I have

[Guest American Woman]

In the rhetoric , and the advertising for the military the soldier is held up, always, in a positive light.

with themes of heroics , family etc.,

killing puppies, doesn't exactly promote that image?

BTW: Note I use the word alleged in my original post.

Have I seriously thought that myself?

can't say I have

Of course the soldier is presented in a positive light for advertising, etc. Most often the troops are engaging in postive acts. I quoted from Buffy's source about some of those acts. Canada is held up as a peace-keeping, compassionate nation, though I'm sure there's been a Canadian or two who have killed a puppy in their day. Yet we'll never see that in tourism ads for Canada.

And yes, I did note the use of the word alleged in your post, which is why I used it in my response to you. Just wondered if you actually believed enlisting in the military meant one was 'more moral.' Evidently you don't.

Basically I don't understand why the fact that in this instance the abuser was a soldier is the main focus of the thread; and I can't help but feel there's more disdain being directed at the military than there is at this act.

Edited March 4, 2008 by American Woman

[Carinthia]

The guy who threw the toddler off the overpass will surely go to jail for a good long time, if not for life. It's a given! When someone does something reprehensible to an animal, there will always be public outcry as that's all the defense that they really have. People cry out in outrage to ensure that the perps of these crimes are brought to justice, if only to bring their faces to the eyes of the public to shame them. The same argument was discussed at length during the Michael Vick dog fighting crime. When people cry out for justice for animals, they do it because they have no real faith that these crimes will be dealt with within the framework of the justice system. They sure as hell are after the media gets a hold of it.

This crime against an animal being brought to the forefront, has nothing whats so ever to do with the fact that this idiot is an Amercian soldier. Unfortunately, these cruel idiots live all over the planet.

[kuzadd]

Of course the soldier is presented in a positive light for advertising, etc. Most often the troops are engaging in postive acts. I quoted from Buffy's source about some of those acts. Canada is held up as a peace-keeping, compassionate nation, though I'm sure there's been a Canadian or two who have killed a puppy in their day. Yet we'll never see that in tourism ads for Canada.

And yes, I did note the use of the word alleged in your post, which is why I used it in my response to you. Just wondered if you actually believed enlisting in the military meant one was 'more moral.' Evidently you don't.

Basically I don't understand why the fact that in this instance the abuser was a soldier is the main focus of the thread; and I can't help but feel there's more disdain being directed at the military than there is at this act.

tourism and military are two really different , really different subjects.

I already gave my opinion as to why the fact that the abuser is in the military is the main focus of this thread.

Basically the US military represents the US to the world, and puppy killing isn't part of a good image , for the military or the country it represents.

[White Doors]

Basically I don't understand why the fact that in this instance the abuser was a soldier is the main focus of the thread; and I can't help but feel there's more disdain being directed at the military than there is at this act.

you honestly wonder or do you know and are just asking tghe question anyways?

Buffy and Kuzadd hate western soldiers, ESECIALLY if they are from the US. They also loathe Israeli soldiers.

I saw this article on the news this morning and I just knew it would be reported and picked up by these two very people. They emphasize anything that is against Israel and The USA. They have been doing this for a looong time here.

You have noticed that haven't you?

Can you go dig up ONE topic they have started that had anything positive to say about the US or Israel? I can't.

Doesn't that tell you enough about their motivations?

The have a clear agenda and will use ANY means to promote it, even if that means pretending to be outraged because a dog was abused. In reality it is outrage and hatred of anything American or Israeli.

I wonder how deep the hatred goes, but Buffy answer that question for me in the holocaust thread.

If your question was an honest one, I hope I answered it. If it was rhetorical, I hope you know that you are not the only one aware of it.

[M.Dancer]

I find it hilarious that a thread about throwing a dog over the cliff is in the Moral, Religious and Political Philosophy section.

What is there to debate here? That throwing a dog over the cliff is immoral?

[Guest American Woman]

This crime against an animal being brought to the forefront, has nothing whats so ever to do with the fact that this idiot is an Amercian soldier. Unfortunately, these cruel idiots live all over the planet.

Bringing this crime to the forefront on this forum has plenty to do with the fact that the one doing the abuse is an American soldier. I agree with you and have said as much, that these cruel people live all over the planet and come from all walks of life, but this instance was used to slam American soldiers.

As for the soldiers in question: If the video is authentic, the Marines involved could face judicial charges, a reduction in rank and pay and a court-martial. They could also be discharged. Link

However, the video hasn't been authentisized yet. It could be a hoax.

"The act itself is atrocious and just to see the disregard for life is just troubling," Hawaii Humane Society spokeswoman Kawehi Yim said.

Others said they believed the clip was staged and not real.

The Marines said while they will look into what happened. They want to determine whether the video clip is authentic.

"We need to find out who is this person, is this a legitimate video? Was it edited?" Perrine said.

[Drea]

The US does not hold their soldiers to any "high" moral standard. They want the lowest of the low, the worst beasts of humanity make the best soldiers in today's wars where the targets are civilians -- old men, women, children and now puppies.

And M.Dancer -- the soldier (and the puppy) were not IN Hawaii, they were in Iraq. You people will say anything to defend your war for oil.

S'all goooood. The puppy was obviously an "insurgent" after all. :puke:

Edited March 4, 2008 by Drea

[guyser]

Basically the US military represents the US to the world, and puppy killing isn't part of a good image , for the military or the country it represents.

And you can bet that the USMC are very unhappy about it, disgracing the uniform and all that. You can also bet he will be dealt with harshly.

From the bottom to the top, Marines are very unhappy about this.

[kuzadd]

AW:

http://www.star-telegram.com/news/story/509183.html

Marines probe puppy-throwing video

HONOLULU -- Military officials are investigating an Internet video that purports to show a Marine throwing a puppy off a rocky cliff.

Maj. Chris Perrine of the Marine Corps Base Hawaii says it appears the man is based with a unit in the islands.

Marine officials are calling the YouTube video "shocking and deplorable" and say it violates "the high standard we expect of every Marine."

The low-quality video shows two Marines joking as one holds up what appears to be a motionless black and white puppy, which he then hurls into a rocky gully.

A yelping sound is heard as it flies through the air.

there's that high standards/morals spin I was referring to.(in bold)

The marines, appear to be concerned with image.

Edited March 4, 2008 by kuzadd

[Guest American Woman]

tourism and military are two really different , really different subjects.

I already gave my opinion as to why the fact that the abuser is in the military is the main focus of this thread.

Basically the US military represents the US to the world, and puppy killing isn't part of a good image , for the military or the country it represents.

Ok. Let me reword my response. The Canadian military presents itself as peacemakers, in a positive light, to the world. I'm sure you'll agree that there have been instances where Canadian soldiers have acted out of line (I could search for specifics, but we both know it's true, right?); yet you don't see that presented in your military ads, etc.

And while you gave your opinion as to why the fact that the abuser is in the military is the main focus of this thread, you admitted even you don't believe those who enlist are more moral than civilians. I'm guessing Buffy doesn't either. Or is it your opinion that Buffy does think U.S. troops are more moral?

[Guest American Woman]

AW:

http://www.star-telegram.com/news/story/509183.htmlMarine officials are calling the YouTube video "shocking and deplorable" and say it violates "the high standard we expect of every Marine."

Marines probe puppy-throwing video

there's that high standards/morals spin I was referring to.(in bold)

The marines, appear to be concerned with image.

That's not a "spin." That's a fact. But just because high standards are expected doesn't mean the troops, ie: those who enlist in the military, are more moral than civilians. I'm no more shocked that a soldier would engage in abusive behavior than I am that 'Joe citizen' does. Of course the Marines are going to be upset, just as anyone would be; just as a football team would be if their star player engaged in such behavior; just as a school district would be if one of their teachers behaved in such a way, etc. Of course they expect more. Seems to me that would go without saying.

[Drea]

No longer is the thread about the poor puppy -- it's now evolved into whether or not the military is "moral".

Who gives a shit? A man committed a very cruel act and you people can only think of "your" image. Newsflash! "Your" image is already shot to hell and even if you could bring back that dead puppy it would not make a lick of difference.

This soldier = America at it's worst.

[AngusThermopyle]

and I can't help but feel there's more disdain being directed at the military than there is at this act.

Well you wont find such disdain coming from me. Mine is solely reserved for the animal who did this.

Standards have been lowered in the US, true, not here in Canada though. In fact DND has announced no problem meeting its recruitment numbers. When I still served they would send us to seminars and on courses dealing with morals and ethical behaviour. Not sure if they still do this but I know they used to. That being the case then yes, military people should be held to a higher standard of behaviour, they should know better.

Its simple really. Do you want an organized armed group of men running around without the guidance of some sort of ethical compass? The short answer would be hell no!

[guyser]

This soldier = America at it's worst.

Hey, I thought you said this thread is not all about the puppy, but yet, here you are ...not talking about the puppy but America. Strange that.

Anyhow, No thats just your projection. Convenient and all.

When he is sentenced, and severely at that, we will all await your verdict.

Oh by the way, it will read ..." This verdict=America at it's best"

Just cut and paste.