paxamericana Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 (edited) 2 hours ago, John Stone said: The problem remains that this is a war of choice - with global implications. It was sprung on the American public. No this is the anti Trumper narrative. Attacking Iran was 40+ years in the making since 1979. Now is a good time since America’s energy independence. And it’s not just Iran, America is ridding the world of many other Chinese Proxy, from Nepal to Cuba. No wars are decided overnight, it takes years of preparation, training and war planning to work up. Edited April 5 by paxamericana 1 Quote
John Stone Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 48 minutes ago, paxamericana said: No this is the anti Trumper narrative. Attacking Iran was 40+ years in the making since 1979. Now is a good time since America’s energy independence. And it’s not just Iran, America is ridding the world of many other Chinese Proxy, from Nepal to Cuba. No wars are decided overnight, it takes years of preparation, training and war planning to work up. Ok - lets agree that it was a war of choice. The proof of the cooking will be in the eating........... You have to admit that the 'war' has global consequences - a coalition of action would have been prudent at the very least. Examine past conflicts - the degree of organization, the international buildup, the cooperation? Oh, and we're not talking NATO - we're talking broad, international cooperation. They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions ................ is Iran an example. They possess the power of mass disruption ...... in the form of Hormuz. Quote
robosmith Posted April 5 Author Report Posted April 5 6 hours ago, paxamericana said: It’s a good time to mop the floor. Cuba, Venezuela and now Iran. Trump is doing something the greatest generation didn’t do, finish the job. General Patton was right, should have destroyed the Soviets. We wouldn’t be here cleaning the left over mess the axis of evil Russia and China created. You want a peace dividend? Don’t leave unfinished business. ONLY ^lDIOTS advocate war as the first resort. Or are "forced" into it by a strategic "opportunity." 🤮 1 Quote
Goober National Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 Great story. Another feather in the cap of Donald Trump. I can't wait for the movie to come out. Quote
robosmith Posted April 5 Author Report Posted April 5 5 hours ago, John Stone said: If my strategy was asymmetrical I would luv latest manpad - programmable - infrared targeting. Depending on range and maneuverability there is no defense for ground attack a/c/ pop up, shoot, disappear. Rotary wing (any) go home to mommy! High flying platforms are immune - but not to AA STIR - that is where the wild weasel is employed - to use fire control, air superiority is de rigueur. This is where INTEL is so important - the U.S believed they had absolute air superiority. Just because Trump CLAIMED IT, doesn't mean it's true. Trump LIES ALL THE TIME. Quote
robosmith Posted April 5 Author Report Posted April 5 4 hours ago, paxamericana said: That only exist for a span of time. It’s never an indefinite period. As soon as the enemy resupply, the danger zone returns. That said, for the type of munition that can endanger high flyer, it requires a long logistic tail, rail, ship or truck to get to where it needs to go. The question becomes, where are the supply routes and can they get enough of it to matter. Quantity is a quality in of itself. A few jets downed isn’t going to stop America. But it has PROVED Trump to be a LIAR. 3 hours ago, paxamericana said: It comes with the territory. See you don’t get a president willing to go against popular sentiment and take risks without the personality trait it comes with. Greatest presidential president ever! ONLY ^FOOLS declare premature "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED," see GWB. 1 Quote
John Stone Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 3 minutes ago, robosmith said: Just because Trump CLAIMED IT, doesn't mean it's true. Trump LIES ALL THE TIME. Only when his lips are moving. Quote
robosmith Posted April 5 Author Report Posted April 5 1 hour ago, paxamericana said: No this is the anti Trumper narrative. Attacking Iran was 40+ years in the making since 1979. Now is a good time since America’s energy independence. And it’s not just Iran, America is ridding the world of many other Chinese Proxy, from Nepal to Cuba. No wars are decided overnight, it takes years of preparation, training and war planning to work up. And that's something at which Trump ALWAYS FAILS. That's how his CASINOS were bankrupted. 5 minutes ago, John Stone said: Only when his lips are moving. AKA, all the time. 1 Quote
Legato Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 3 minutes ago, robosmith said: And that's something at which Trump ALWAYS FAILS. That's how his CASINOS were bankrupted. Yup it took a lot of firepower to defeat all those one arm bandits. Quote
BeaverFever Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 1 hour ago, paxamericana said: Attacking Iran was 40+ years in the making since 1979. Yet somehow despite Trump forgot to mention it in his election campaign whil claiming to be a peace president who would put an end to America’s foreign wars. And then he somehow forgot to get congressional approval even when spending a billion dollars a day on it. Quote
West Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 6 hours ago, John Stone said: Congrats on the rescue - well done to U.S. SAR / military. Worst part is listening to Trump .....? Would someone please tell that bombastic, ignorant fool that there is no "I' in TEAM? The rescue team were able to penetrate into Iran deeply fairly easily. If that doesnt signal air superiority and a depleted air defense of Iran what does? 31 minutes ago, BeaverFever said: Yet somehow despite Trump forgot to mention it in his election campaign whil claiming to be a peace president who would put an end to America’s foreign wars. And then he somehow forgot to get congressional approval even when spending a billion dollars a day on it. Trump's campaign was peace thru strength. Keeping others in line while quickly taking out leadership of another country. Islamists don't fear death and believe theyll recieve a hundred goats as martyrs so you aren't exactly dealing with rational people. Quote
User Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 1 hour ago, robosmith said: Just because Trump CLAIMED IT, doesn't mean it's true. Trump LIES ALL THE TIME. You lie all the time. If you care so much about lying, stop it. 1 Quote
User Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 1 hour ago, BeaverFever said: Yet somehow despite Trump forgot to mention it in his election campaign whil claiming to be a peace president who would put an end to America’s foreign wars. And then he somehow forgot to get congressional approval even when spending a billion dollars a day on it. You don’t need the campaign, he was President once before and said this: https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-iran/ Also, he doesn’t need Congress to do what he is doing. 1 Quote
CdnFox Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 8 hours ago, John Stone said: ha ha ......... nice try! Sorry don't do other's homework. Don't do your own either apparently Anyway I looked into the matter and it turns out you're wrong. There, homework done So in other words you lie And you just hope everyone else will believe it. Well you got busted 5 hours ago, John Stone said: Man portable AA is an infantry weapon................. incredible defense against ground attack. But they don't have any, you've already admitted to lying about that Quote "That which doesn't kill me... Had better start running."
John Stone Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 57 minutes ago, CdnFox said: Don't do your own either apparently Anyway I looked into the matter and it turns out you're wrong. There, homework done So in other words you lie And you just hope everyone else will believe it. Well you got busted But they don't have any, you've already admitted to lying about that lol - always entertaining ........ actually i prefer u this way, u don't have to fake it. Quote
BeaverFever Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 1 hour ago, User said: You don’t need the campaign, he was President once before and said this: https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-iran/ Also, he doesn’t need Congress to do what he is doing. That’s a ridiculous assertion on so many levels. He did not campaign on war with Iran in 2024, full stop. 1) No intelligent person could say with straight face that voters in 2024 voted for war with Iran because Trump made ONE SPEECH in 2020. Like you’re saying the promise for an “epic” war was “implied” or something and didn’t need to be mentioned directly To paraphrase the old Seinfeld skit “you can’t ‘yadda yadda’ the most important part!” NOT TO MENTION that was during a totally different election that he LOST 2) Nowhere in that old speech did he pledge to go to war with Iran anyway, it was just standard political tough talk. 3) If Trump was already President once and did NOT invade iran during his first term, and made no promises to do so, common sense tells you voters did not elect him to attack Iran Whether or not he needs congressional approval is debatable. Its a highly politicized grey area. Republicans certainly claim democrat presidents need congressional approval for any money they want to spend or foreign military action they want to undertake but that’s a well known hypocrisy. Whenever there is a republican president republicans claim the constitution states the president has king-like authority and whenever there is a democrat president they claim the constitution states the office of the president is limited to a symbolic figurehead role. Republicans wipe their memories and reset their brains accordingly whenever there’s a change in POTUS, it’s a time-honoured tradition. Quote
User Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 3 minutes ago, BeaverFever said: That’s a ridiculous assertion on so many levels. He did not campaign on war with Iran in 2024, full stop. Why would he have? The decision to go to war was not made during the campaign. Duh. The point I asserted was that Trump has made his position clear before; this did not come out of left field. What a stupid argument you are making like usual. Just make up some convoluted thing to argue against. Quote
CdnFox Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 2 hours ago, John Stone said: lol - always entertaining ........ actually i prefer u this way, u don't have to fake it. LOL so you admit i was right and you're so embarrassed that you had to come up with this banality rather than be a man about it Honestly debating with you is like playing the tutorial level on a video game. I win a lot but it's pretty boring Better luck next time kiddo Quote "That which doesn't kill me... Had better start running."
gatomontes99 Posted April 5 Report Posted April 5 5 hours ago, John Stone said: Ok - lets agree that it was a war of choice. What was the choice? Bomb them or get a nuke to the face? Quote Don't you think that if I were wrong that I would know it?
bush_cheney2004 Posted April 6 Report Posted April 6 (edited) 2 hours ago, User said: The point I asserted was that Trump has made his position clear before; this did not come out of left field. 100% true....on record way back in 1980 (Jimmy Carter era): Edited April 6 by bush_cheney2004 1 Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
John Stone Posted April 6 Report Posted April 6 11 hours ago, gatomontes99 said: What was the choice? Bomb them or get a nuke to the face? From who, Iran?? On the Continental U.S.? It was a war of choice............. now it is a war of necessity? The priority now isn't recovering the nuclear fuel - it's opening the strait. Nuke in the face is still a possibility! Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted April 6 Report Posted April 6 23 minutes ago, John Stone said: From who, Iran?? On the Continental U.S.? Also Israel and other allied nations. Proxy terrorism, attacks on shipping, yada, yada, yada. Quote It was a war of choice............. now it is a war of necessity? The priority now isn't recovering the nuclear fuel - it's opening the strait. Nuke in the face is still a possibility! Another war for U.S and Israeli interests...nukes or not...actually were overdue for one given history. Just call it an "intervention" like previous "wars". Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
John Stone Posted April 6 Report Posted April 6 12 hours ago, CdnFox said: LOL so you admit i was right and you're so embarrassed that you had to come up with this banality rather than be a man about it Honestly debating with you is like playing the tutorial level on a video game. I win a lot but it's pretty boring Better luck next time kiddo meh! Quote
John Stone Posted April 6 Report Posted April 6 (edited) 7 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Also Israel and other allied nations. Proxy terrorism, attacks on shipping, yada, yada, yada. Another war for U.S and Israeli interests...nukes or not...actually were overdue for one given history. Just call it an "intervention" like previous "wars". ............. how strange the 'other' nations weren't informed beforehand of this largesse. ah, recovering the fuel isn't the priority ........ this text is right out of the horse'.............. er, donkey's mouth.......deranged! Edited April 6 by John Stone Quote
John Stone Posted April 6 Report Posted April 6 9 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Another war for U.S and Israeli interests...nukes or not...actually were overdue for one given history. Just call it an "intervention" like previous "wars". u do realize that in Trump's defense, u abase urself. Quote
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