Robert F Kennedy Lays Out the Whole Start of the Ukrainian War. How Long Before He Becomes the 3rd Kennedy....?

[User]

2 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

All of the blood from these dead Ukrainians is on Biden's hands, and no one else's. He's the one who was sitting in the big boy chair when this went down. 

Yet again... it was Russia that invaded. This is on Putin. 

3 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

As you can see, they don't "got nothing".

That is the very definition of nothing. That is not in any formal agreement and they did sign onto a formal agreement after Baker said that. 

Do you not understand how these things work?

If you and my cousin are negotiating in your basement about how I won't run my lemonade stands within 20 feet of your driveway, not one inch closer than 20 feet, but then you sign a final contract with me that includes no such language... you don't get to cry about how my lemonade stand is right next to your driveway. 

No contract arbitration or judge in the world is going to give two shits what my cousin and you talked about when it was never part of the final deal with me. 

 

51 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Answer this question honestly: if Canada tried to sign on to a military alliance with China, Russia, NoKo and Iran, what do you think the US would do?

Answering ^that^ correctly doesn't require a whole lot of historical knowledge, you just need to have an IQ over 40 to get that one right. What would the US do, dummy? 

North Korea has already been helping Russia... Iran too. Last I checked, we were not invading either of them because of it. 

 

[User]

2 hours ago, Nationalist said:

I have never justified the Russian invasion. 

I do have the intellect and honesty to know there are 2 sides to every war.

LOL, so you are not justifying the invasion... but you are justifying the invasion. 

 

[WestCanMan]

1 minute ago, User said:

North Korea has already been helping Russia... Iran too. Last I checked, we were not invading either of them because of it. 

OMG that's stupid.

Can you explain how that has ANYTHING to do with the question I asked you? 

[robosmith]

12 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

• U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s famous “not one inch eastward” assurance about NATO expansion in his meeting with Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev on February 9, 1990, was part of a cascade of assurances about Soviet security given by Western leaders to Gorbachev and other Soviet officials throughout the process of German unification in 1990 and on into 1991, according to declassified U.S., Soviet, German, British and French documents posted today by the National Security Archive at George Washington University (http://nsarchive.gwu.edu).

1. As you can see, they don't "got nothing".
2. The US doesn't have any assurances on paper from China, NoKo, Iran and Russia about them not signing off on military alliances with Canada and Mexico. That being said, if Canada and Mexico attempt to enter into a military alliance  with those countries, what do you think the US will do? If the US attacks under those circumstances, do you think that's an example of "the US going on an empire-building spree"? Would you say that the US attacked for that specific reason?

I know US propaganda when I see it. You do too. 

All of the blood from these dead Ukrainians is on Biden's hands, and no one else's. He's the one who was sitting in the big boy chair when this went down. 

 

YOU just DESTROY what little credibility you have when you blame Joe Biden for PUTIN'S INVASION.

It's like you KNOW NOTHING about the Budapest Memorandum. LMAO

 

Memorandum on security assurances

United Nations Treaty Collection

https://treaties.un.org › Pages › showDetails

 

 

 

 

Budapest, 05/12/1994. EIF information. 5 December 1994 by signature. Authentic texts. Ukrainian. Russian. English. Attachments. ICJ information. Depositary ...

 

Budapest Memorandum at 25: Between Past and Future

Harvard Kennedy School

https://www.hks.harvard.edu › publications › budapest-...

 

 

 

 

On December 5, 1994, leaders of the United States, the United Kingdom, and the Russian Federation met in Budapest, Hungary, to pledge security assurances to ...

 

Budapest Memorandum

Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Budapest_Memorandum

 

 

 

 

The Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances comprises three substantially identical political agreements signed at the OSCE conference in Budapest, ...

 

Content

 

History

 

The Budapest Memoranda

 

Sequels

 

Ukraine's Territorial Integrity and the Budapest Memorandum

Wilson Center

https://www.wilsoncenter.org › files › publication

 

 

PDF

 

by M Budjeryn · Cited by 60 — In 1991, Ukraine inherited the world's third largest nuclear arsenal as a result of the collapse of the. Soviet Union.2 By mid-1996, all nuclear munitions.

Edited September 8 by robosmith

[Dougie93]

12 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

• U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s famous “not one inch eastward” assurance about NATO expansion in his meeting with Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev on February 9, 1990, was part of a cascade of assurances about Soviet security given by Western leaders to Gorbachev and other Soviet officials throughout the process of German unification in 1990 and on into 1991, according to declassified U.S., Soviet, German, British and French documents posted today by the National Security Archive at George Washington University (http://nsarchive.gwu.edu).

1. As you can see, they don't "got nothing".
2. The US doesn't have any assurances on paper from China, NoKo, Iran and Russia about them not signing off on military alliances with Canada and Mexico. That being said, if Canada and Mexico attempt to enter into a military alliance  with those countries, what do you think the US will do? If the US attacks under those circumstances, do you think that's an example of "the US going on an empire-building spree"? Would you say that the US attacked for that specific reason?

I know US propaganda when I see it. You do too. 

All of the blood from these dead Ukrainians is on Biden's hands, and no one else's. He's the one who was sitting in the big boy chair when this went down.

so basically,  the Evil Empire got deceived into quitting without us having to fight a war against them ?

never critique a win

but furthermore, whatever was said to the Soviets, this is not that country anymore

Mikhail Gorbachev was never the President of the Russian Federation

 

[WestCanMan]

4 minutes ago, robosmith said:

YOU just DESTROY what little credibility you have when you blame Joe Biden for PUTIN'S INVASION.

It's like you KNOW NOTHING about the Budapest Memorandum. LMAO

I don't normally reply to your posts because you're one of the dumbest people on the internet, and basically everything that you say is a lie, but because you brought up the Budapest Memorandum, I'll just point you to a spot in your own wiki link that just went over your stupid little head:

• "except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations."

Entering into a military alliance that's hostile towards Russia would have been good enough reason to void the Budapest Memorandum all by itself, but there's also the issue of Ukraine's Nazi battalion ethnically cleansing the Donbas region. 

[WestCanMan]

6 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

so basically,  the Evil Empire got deceived into quitting without us having to fight a war against them ?

never critique a win

but furthermore, whatever was said to the Soviets, this is not that country anymore

Mikhail Gorbachev was never the President of the Russian Federation

 

You can call it a win when Germany was allowed to reunite under the NATO banner. 100%

You can also call it a win that the US forced Russia to go to war against America's proxy. 100%

You can call it a win that the American military industrial complex is getting hundreds of billions of dollars to supply Ukraine with shiny new toys. 100%

You can call it a win that the Americans are using SE Ukraine as a proving grounds to drive up the price & demand for their weapons systems. 100%

BUT, the deaths in Ukraine are still the result of Biden and Zelenski policies, and no one else's. 

America is profiting heavily from these Ukrainian deaths.

Russia has at least gained some real estate, if nothing else.

Ukrainian lives are being used like toilet paper by the Biden regime. 

[DUI_Offender]

On 9/7/2024 at 5:33 PM, WestCanMan said:

1992: Gorbachev offers to leave E Germany, reunifying the country, in exchange for a promise that NATO never moves east of there. James Baker accepts on behalf of the US and commits to "Not one inch past Germany"

In 1992, there was no such thing as "East Germany," The country had already reunified. Gorbachev was not in power, and had retired. Boris Yeltsin was the leader of Russia. 

The rest of the claim is completely unsubstantiated. 

On 9/7/2024 at 5:33 PM, WestCanMan said:

2014: America orchestrates the overthrow of the Ukrainian gov't. 

This is ridiculous, and untrue.

On 9/7/2024 at 5:33 PM, WestCanMan said:

2014: American-appointed gov't in Ukraine bans Russian language in Eastern Ukraine and starts committing genocide against Russian-speaking Ukrainians there. This was when the Ukrainian Nazi battalion - the Azovs - first becomes famous for committing their war crimes.

Once again, the Ukrainians chose who they wanted to lead their nation in elections. America did not appoint anyone.

On 9/7/2024 at 5:33 PM, WestCanMan said:

2019: American appointee Zelenski, a comedian and actor with no political experience, runs on a peace platform - promising to sign the Minsk accords along with Russia, Britain France and Germany - earning him 70% of the popular vote, and then transforms into ZelNazi: "No peace for you!" 

You spelled Zelenskyy wrong. 

On 9/7/2024 at 5:33 PM, WestCanMan said:

2019: Donbas/Luhansk region (SE Ukraine, between Russia and Crimea) votes 90% in favour of joining Russia but Putin wants Ukraine to remain a functioning country, and pushes for the Minsk accords to be signed instead.

This is such BS, that I cannot ever take any of your posts seriously.

On 9/7/2024 at 5:33 PM, WestCanMan said:

2022: Ukraine actually signed the peace agreement with Russia, Russian troops start withdrawing, and the Biden administration sent Tony Blair to Ukraine and tells them to rip up the peace agreement. Negotiators from Turkey and Ukraine have confirmed that there was a SIGNED peace agreement. 

You ahve been saying that Boris Johnson told Ukraine to "rip up" a non-existent peace agreement between Russia and Ukraine. Now you change the name to Tony Blair, who was not even PM at the time. 

Sometimes I wonder if you and your wing-man CdnFox are even from Canada. You both have spent the last couple of years parroting Russia misinformation.

Edited September 8 by DUI_Offender

[Dougie93]

2 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

BUT, the deaths in Ukraine are still the result of Biden and Zelenski policies, and no one else's.

so long as you are blaming the Democrat Party Plantation Aristocracy, I have no quarrel

they are indeed the treasonous scum of the earth

but getting back to the 1980's and the fall of the Warsaw Pact

the Republicans never promised the Soviets anything

if Gorbachev was want to cut some sort of deal, sign a treaty, he had his chance at Reykjavik in 1986

[robosmith]

15 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I don't normally reply to your posts because you're one of the dumbest people on the internet, and basically everything that you say is a lie, but because you brought up the Budapest Memorandum, I'll just point you to a spot in your own wiki link that just went over your stupid little head:

• "except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations."

Entering into a military alliance that's hostile towards Russia would have been good enough reason to void the Budapest Memorandum all by itself, but there's also the issue of Ukraine's Nazi battalion ethnically cleansing the Donbas region. 

So you say, with NO EVIDENCE. Donbas is INTERNAL to the Ukraine and anything that happens there IS NOT a threat to RUSSIA. Your IQ is LESS than 40.

Meanwhile, the Budapest Memorandum OBLIGATES the US to come to Ukraine's DEFENSE when Russia attacked.

You really are STUPID.

11 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

You can call it a win when Germany was allowed to reunite under the NATO banner. 100%

You can also call it a win that the US forced Russia to go to war against America's proxy. 100%

You can call it a win that the American military industrial complex is getting hundreds of billions of dollars to supply Ukraine with shiny new toys. 100%

You can call it a win that the Americans are using SE Ukraine as a proving grounds to drive up the price & demand for their weapons systems. 100%

BUT, the deaths in Ukraine are still the result of Biden and Zelenski policies, and no one else's. 

America is profiting heavily from these Ukrainian deaths.

Russia has at least gained some real estate, if nothing else.

Ukrainian lives are being used like toilet paper by the Biden regime. 

^Putin's PUPPET. 🤮

How much is Vlad paying you for spouting HIS BULLSHIT?

[WestCanMan]

9 minutes ago, DUI_Offender said:

In 1992, there was no such thing as "East Germany," The country had already reunified. Gorbachev was not in power, and had retired. Boris Yeltsin was the leader of Russia. 

TBH, I should have known better than to write 1992 there, because I knew the wall came down in 1990, mostly because of me. I was just getting out of the navy in June of that year, and I had plans to fly to Europe with one of my best friends but he re-signed and that was the end of that. 

[WestCanMan]

5 minutes ago, robosmith said:

So you say, with NO EVIDENCE.

RFK just said it, and my friends from Poland and Bulgaria say the same thing.

Almost everyone from that region has friends and relatives in all those neighbouring countries. 

Quote

Donbas is INTERNAL to the Ukraine and anything that happens there IS NOT a threat to RUSSIA.

1) That's kinda true, and 2) by your reasoning the US has gotten involved in a dozen wars since 1946 that they were not allowed to get involved in. Are the Americans war crimes 20 times over? 

Quote

Your IQ is LESS than 40.

If so, it could be 4x higher than yours.

Quote

Meanwhile, the Budapest Memorandum OBLIGATES the US to come to Ukraine's DEFENSE when Russia attacked.

Look up voided in a dictionary, dumbass.

Quote

You really are STUPID.

Everything you say stands as incontrovertible evidence of the opposite. 

[robosmith]

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

RFK just said it, and my friends from Poland and Bulgaria say the same thing.

^No quote; it didn't happen.

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Almost everyone from that region has friends and relatives in all those neighbouring countries. 

And are all FOS.

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

1) That's kinda true, and 2) by your reasoning the US has gotten involved in a dozen wars since 1946 that they were not allowed to get involved in. Are the Americans war crimes 20 times over? 

UN resolutions authorized most of them.

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

If so, it could be 4x higher than yours.

Not possible. My test scores say 140.

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Look up voided in a dictionary, dumbass.

Quote the relevance here, dumbass.

5 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Everything you say stands as incontrovertible evidence of the opposite. 

Only in your fantasies.

[User]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

OMG that's stupid.

Can you explain how that has ANYTHING to do with the question I asked you? 

What answer were you fishing for?

[Nationalist]

15 hours ago, robosmith said:

Russia gave Ukraine a security guarantee IN WRITING (unlike your alleged verbal commitment) along with the US, in the Budapest Memorandum. Russia reneged and WE are KEEPING OUR COMMITMENT by coming to Ukraine's defense AS PROMISED.

Your ALLEGED verbal promises aren't worth the paper they WERE NOT written on.

RFK JNR's WORM must have EATEN YOU BRAIN. LMAO

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/09/08/us/politics/trump-and-harris-times-siena-poll.html

😃

[Nationalist]

14 hours ago, User said:

LOL, so you are not justifying the invasion... but you are justifying the invasion. 

 

No. I follow the facts.

[WestCanMan]

13 hours ago, User said:

What answer were you fishing for?

Can you explain how there's a similarity between NoKo helping Russian, and Canada joining a Warsaw Pact type group? 

Can you explain how there's a similarity between Iran helping Russian, and Canada joining a Warsaw Pact type group? 

I just don't see it, sorry.

Think about what our border with the US would look like in ten years if, for some strange reason, the US let us join a military alliance with China, Russia, NoKo and Iran...

Think about how close the tanks and fighter jets from those countries would be to Washington DC, NY, Chi, Det, Boston, etc....

Are you getting any brain activity up there yet?

The US would never let us do the thing that Russia is not letting Ukraine do. Get it? 

Are you honestly so f'ing stupid that you think Canada would have been allowed to just leave NATO and join the Warsaw Pact in 1985? You think that the Americans would just say "Awwwww, shucks. Now there are gonna be a bunch of tanks and stuff right on our norther border"? 

[User]

25 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

No. I follow the facts.

Clearly not... as you ignore facts that are not convenient to the narrative you want to push. 

[WestCanMan]

10 minutes ago, User said:

Clearly not... as you ignore facts that are not convenient to the narrative you want to push. 

You're literally ignoring the fact that if Russia didn't invade Ukraine then they'd eventually have NATO tanks all up in their grille, and Belarus would be surrounded. You have the geopolitical knowledge and awareness of a 3 yr old. 

[User]

13 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

You're literally ignoring the fact that if Russia didn't invade Ukraine then they'd eventually have NATO tanks all up in their grille, and Belarus would be surrounded. You have the geopolitical knowledge and awareness of a 3 yr old. 

NATO has had Tanks all up in their grille since at least 2004... 

My geopolitical knowledge and awareness are just fine. You need to work harder on yours. 

NATO is a defensive alliance created to oppose the Soviet Union's aggression. NATO having tanks all up in Russia's grille is no more a threat to Russia than the United States having tanks all up in Canada or Mexico, except for the fact that Russia is the aggressor state and only has to worry about NATO because of that. 

 

[User]

33 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

The US would never let us do the thing that Russia is not letting Ukraine do. Get it? 

Are you honestly so f'ing stupid that you think Canada would have been allowed to just leave NATO and join the Warsaw Pact in 1985? You think that the Americans would just say "Awwwww, shucks. Now there are gonna be a bunch of tanks and stuff right on our norther border"? 

So, this was the answer you were fishing for, that somehow you think the US would invade Canada if for some crazy reason they formed an alliance with Russia. 

Sure dude... sure. 

You have the mentality of a 8 year old playing risk. 

[Deluge]

On 9/7/2024 at 4:33 PM, WestCanMan said:

1992: Gorbachev offers to leave E Germany, reunifying the country, in exchange for a promise that NATO never moves east of there. James Baker accepts on behalf of the US and commits to "Not one inch past Germany"

2014: America orchestrates the overthrow of the Ukrainian gov't. A month earlier, Vitoria Nuland was recorded appointing members of the new Ukrainian gov't

2014: American-appointed gov't in Ukraine bans Russian language in Eastern Ukraine and starts committing genocide against Russian-speaking Ukrainians there. This was when the Ukrainian Nazi battalion - the Azovs - first becomes famous for committing their war crimes.

2019: American appointee Zelenski, a comedian and actor with no political experience, runs on a peace platform - promising to sign the Minsk accords along with Russia, Britain France and Germany - earning him 70% of the popular vote, and then transforms into ZelNazi: "No peace for you!" 

2019: Donbas/Luhansk region (SE Ukraine, between Russia and Crimea) votes 90% in favour of joining Russia but Putin wants Ukraine to remain a functioning country, and pushes for the Minsk accords to be signed instead.

2022: Ukraine actually signed the peace agreement with Russia, Russian troops start withdrawing, and the Biden administration sent Tony Blair to Ukraine and tells them to rip up the peace agreement. Negotiators from Turkey and Ukraine have confirmed that there was a SIGNED peace agreement. 

 

@robosmith @Rebound @ExFlyer @lefarddolthorde.... 

I'm pretty sure that a RF Kennedy knows more about this than a bunch of low-IQ dipshits who get ALL their 'info' from CNN. 

Hussein Obama is probably the biggest pile of shit in all of the democrat shithole. Slightly smarter, but so much more devious. 

[Nationalist]

45 minutes ago, User said:

Clearly not... as you ignore facts that are not convenient to the narrative you want to push. 

Oh? Which facts might those be?

[User]

3 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Oh? Which facts might those be?

This is the part where you pretend like we have never had this discussion before... 

The facts that the actual agreement Russia signed included no such language from the negotiation talks where Baker himself said he was over his skis. 

But yeah, sure, you want us to believe that the US/NATO is somehow committed to terms they never formally agreed to with Russia. 

Those facts. 

[robosmith]

2 hours ago, Nationalist said:

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/09/08/us/politics/trump-and-harris-times-siena-poll.html

😃

^Appeal to popularity FALLACY, dumbass.

1 hour ago, Nationalist said:

No. I follow the facts.

You follow FOS LIES which is LIES, not "facts."