What is Critical Immigration Theory?

[gatomontes99]

11 hours ago, Five of swords said:

Obama deported more people than trump

That isn't true. Obama changed the rules for reporting so that turn backs counted as deportation.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/obama-deported-more-people/

[CdnFox]

4 hours ago, Five of swords said:

Germany had no control over what happened. Of course they were going to be attacked because their political model was so successful

Well- the DID kind of have control over whether or not they invaded poland which they knew would start a major war.  Sooooo  ....

And i think it was the attack on a treaty country after being warned not to do that any more that kind of started the war rather than any envy over their economic model. 

Oh well.  So much for being 'smarter than people give you credit for'. 

[CouchPotato]

1 minute ago, Hodad said:

It's the rejection of the world of orthodox information in favor of "secret truths" that only the special few embrace. And embracing these secrets makes one special. (Though not in a way that's appealing to the rest of us.)

I am sure that is part of the appeal, but I don't know if this is always the case. I am not a mind reader. There are tons of conspiracy theorists out there. They have been around as long as I can remember. I would say well over 90% of them are harmless.

[Five of swords]

7 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Well- the DID kind of have control over whether or not they invaded poland which they knew would start a major war.  Sooooo  ....

And i think it was the attack on a treaty country after being warned not to do that any more that kind of started the war rather than any envy over their economic model. 

Oh well.  So much for being 'smarter than people give you credit for'. 

If they cared about the germans in danzig then no, they had no choice

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, Five of swords said:

If they cared about the germans in danzig then no, they had no choice

of course they had a choice. There's always another way period. 

Hitler had talked about the need to go to war for lebensraum since the day he got into power. Not that it was an original idea to the nazis, it had been around since ww1 and before. 

The documented plan was to occupy all those lands and throw out the sub humans to provide expansion space and resources for the german nation. 

It had zero to do with germans in danzig. There is a stack of documentation as high as a hitler salute that proves that written in their own words. 

[Five of swords]

13 minutes ago, Hodad said:

It's the rejection of the world of orthodox information in favor of "secret truths" that only the special few embrace. And embracing these secrets makes one special. (Though not in a way that's appealing to the rest of us.) 

Some people simply get off on that feeling. Trutherism, birtherism, Q-Anon. It's a progressiin. Not everyone will slide down the slope, but if one is likely to go the full distance, these are the warning whistles. 

Like the best missionaries, our recent arrival is intelligent and well spoken enough to conduct the dialectic, eager to help receptive minds find their way to "the truth" one point at a time. If one has fallen for those other isms, they will be easy marks. 

 

And Trump has already tried to overthrow our democracy once. It would be foolish to think he's above trying again. Rather, he's more prepared. This election is going to be a shitshow. For 4 years the Trumpublicans have been actively placing election deniers in as many positions as possible, with the expectation that they are likely to refuse to certify results with a Trump loss. It's going to get very messy. 

You, on thr other hand, are clever enough to know that the state never lies about anything

[CouchPotato]

37 minutes ago, Hodad said:

It's the rejection of the world of orthodox information in favor of "secret truths" that only the special few embrace. And embracing these secrets makes one special. (Though not in a way that's appealing to the rest of us.) 

I enjoy reading conspiracy theories. Some of them are very entertaining and far out. But I don't think they all are. People have very good reasons for being suspicious of orthodox information. Truth is often stranger than fiction. It's a pretty crazy world. History is pretty crazy. And the last century or so has been really crazy. The Nazis themselves are a good example of this. The Soviet Union.

If someone in the 50s told you that the CIA was dosing unwitting people with LSD, you might call them a whackjob. If someone told you that they were funding a psychiatrist in Canada to experiment with LSD on mental patients that probably would have sounded insane.

Edited August 7 by CouchPotato

[Five of swords]

48 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

of course they had a choice. There's always another way period. 

Hitler had talked about the need to go to war for lebensraum since the day he got into power. Not that it was an original idea to the nazis, it had been around since ww1 and before. 

The documented plan was to occupy all those lands and throw out the sub humans to provide expansion space and resources for the german nation. 

It had zero to do with germans in danzig. There is a stack of documentation as high as a hitler salute that proves that written in their own words. 

It had everything to do with germans in danzig. You are just repeating fake history. Hitler was desperate for a peaceful solution with poland, and it annoyed his own generals.

[CdnFox]

13 minutes ago, Five of swords said:

It had everything to do with germans in danzig.

Zero, zip, nada and there's tonnes of documents to prove discussing their  plans and why they're doing it.  We know the truth from their own words and pens. 

Quote

You are just repeating fake history. 

Hitlers own words are fake history? The mountains of documents on Generalplan Ost was all written by germans who wanted to fake history BEFORE it happened? To make themselves look worse?!?!

Kid.  This is documented so well we can practically tell what they thought day to day.  

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, CouchPotato said:

If someone in the 50s told you that the CIA was dosing unwitting people with LSD, you might call them a whackjob. If someone told you that they were funding a psychiatrist in Canada to experiment with LSD on mental patients that probably would have sounded insane.

What if someone had told you the CIA would knock off a duly elected government and install an autocratic tyranny instead? The things you mentioned seem pretty mundane compared to that.

[CouchPotato]

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

What if someone had told you the CIA would knock off a duly elected government and install an autocratic tyranny instead? The things you mentioned seem pretty mundane compared to that.

Fair enough then, so you aren't really in disagreement with me here.

There are tons more examples as well.

Edited August 7 by CouchPotato

[eyeball]

5 minutes ago, CouchPotato said:

Fair enough then, so you aren't really in disagreement with me here.

Not about how relatively harmless confused thinking is in such a deliberately misinformed and disinformed world as today's. At least the people of Babel tried to cooperate.

[CouchPotato]

11 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Not about how relatively harmless confused thinking is in such a deliberately misinformed and disinformed world as today's. At least the people of Babel tried to cooperate.

Oh, I definitely see the potential for harm. I just don't think most people are harmful, and I don't think mistrusting "orthodox information" is harmful in and of itself. I think many people observe that sources of "orthodox information" are often the purveyors of misinformation and disinformation. That doesn't mean it's wise to just blindly accept an elaborate conspiracy theory, but people have their reasons for being mistrustful.

I think many of the people (not yourself) that lament "misinformation" and "disinformation" just don't like competition.

Edited August 7 by CouchPotato

[Michael Hardner]

7 hours ago, CouchPotato said:

Oh, I definitely see the potential for harm. I just don't think most people are harmful, and I don't think mistrusting "orthodox information" is harmful in and of itself. I think many people observe that sources of "orthodox information" are often the purveyors of misinformation and disinformation. That doesn't mean it's wise to just blindly accept an elaborate conspiracy theory, but people have their reasons for being mistrustful.

I think many of the people (not yourself) that lament "misinformation" and "disinformation" just don't like competition.

It's tricky for sure.

When you consider that the NY Times and Washington Post exposed such things as Watergate and The Pentagon Papers but yet are seen by some a s purveyors of neoliberal orthodoxy.

There's no perfection.  The CBC and Globe will have their biases baked in, just as others.

https://www.pollara.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/Trust-in-Media-July-2024-final.pdf

 

That poll gives the breakdown as net trust score.

 

[Five of swords]

9 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Zero, zip, nada and there's tonnes of documents to prove discussing their  plans and why they're doing it.  We know the truth from their own words and pens. 

Hitlers own words are fake history? The mountains of documents on Generalplan Ost was all written by germans who wanted to fake history BEFORE it happened? To make themselves look worse?!?!

Kid.  This is documented so well we can practically tell what they thought day to day.  

You are, as always, severely retarded. Ukraine is not poland.

[Five of swords]

9 hours ago, eyeball said:

Not about how relatively harmless confused thinking is in such a deliberately misinformed and disinformed world as today's. At least the people of Babel tried to cooperate.

Babel wasn't a real place

[Deluge]

17 hours ago, eyeball said:

Hyper-nationalism - with a paranoid hyper right wing bent to it these days.

It only seems like hyper-nationalism; but that's only because you degenerates are trying to erase the borders and it's pissing off the good people of this country. 

Edited August 7 by Deluge

[Deluge]

16 hours ago, robosmith said:

Thanks for proving you started another waste of time thread and you don't know WTF you're talking about, AGAIN. 

roboliar's appeal is to always let the perverts tell you what you are seeing with your own eyes. 

[Five of swords]

12 hours ago, gatomontes99 said:

That isn't true. Obama changed the rules for reporting so that turn backs counted as deportation.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/obama-deported-more-people/

Snopes is a ridiculous source that frequently just lies in order to maintain mainstream narrative...but it has a funny way of lying that doesn't contradict the truth. The fine line between 'turning people back' and 'deporting' is doing a lot of work here, lol. The only time Trump bothered to do anything at all about immigration was in the covid response. And that wasn't him, of course. The covid response was constructed by the people who really rule the country. The president is irrelevant.

Edited August 7 by Five of swords

[Deluge]

18 minutes ago, Five of swords said:

Snopes is a ridiculous source that frequently just lies in order to maintain mainstream narrative...but it has a funny way of lying that doesn't contradict the truth. The fine line between 'turning people back' and 'deporting' is doing a lot of work here, lol. The only time Trump bothered to do anything at all about immigration was in the covid response. And that wasn't him, of course. The covid response was constructed by the people who really rule the country. The president is irrelevant.

People can change, and I expect Trump to be a whole lot more aggressive against illegal immigration. What the hair sniffer and his empty headed czar have done is inexcusable. 

[Deluge]

14 hours ago, Hodad said:

Having a Nazi sympathizer and Holocaust denier on the board is a sort of novelty, like having a genuine flat-Earther, but also a harbinger of sorts. A Ghost of Christmas Yet to Come. Take heed, conspiracy theorists, this is your future if you build for yourselves an alternate reality of heterodoxy and false history. Your election denials and climate denials and FBI conspiracies and other nonsense that turns you away from the reality where the rest of us live.

Your fever dreams are no match for reality. 

Election rigging, January 6 bullshit, open borders, lawfare, climate hysteria.... can't you scumbags ever do some actual good in this world? 

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Five of swords said:

Babel wasn't a real place

I know it wasn't. Neither are half the places many people's heads are today.

The point I'm making is that in the story of Babel there's no indication people were divided - their society cooperatively worked towards a common goal.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Deluge said:

It only seems like hyper-nationalism; but that's only because you degenerates are trying to erase the borders and it's pissing off the good people of this country. 

Excuse me but I've made it clear that I too would like to curb immigration because of the strain it puts on our already overextended ecosystems.

I realize my environmentalist reasons are even more degenerate than the racist reasons attributed to me but that's only because you people are retarded.  I'm quite certain if the environment were the only concern here you'd be busily tearing the borders down as fast as possible so as to unleash the economy and grow baby grow.

Edited August 7 by eyeball

[Deluge]

2 minutes ago, eyeball said:

1. Excuse me but I've made it clear that I too would like to curb immigration because of the strain it puts on our already overextended ecosystems.

2. I realize my environmentalist reasons are even more degenerate than the racist reasons attributed to me but that's only because you people are retarded.  I'm quite certain if the environment were the only concern here you'd be busily tearing the borders down as fast as possible so as to unleash the economy and grow baby grow.

1. Sorry, pal. The "Let's cap it off at 3,000 per day" isn't going to cut it. We're not interested in that bullshit. The goal is ZERO, not 3,000. 

2. There's no such thing as retardation over here. The retardation is all left, all of the time. In fact it's woketardation to be precise. Every single f*cking thing you woketards touch turns to dog shit. The country has resources, but that doesn't stop you b*tches from kicking & screaming at the air; you're like that neighbor that pisses everyone off with all the noise and weirdos hanging around your house. 

[Five of swords]

26 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I know it wasn't. Neither are half the places many people's heads are today.

The point I'm making is that in the story of Babel there's no indication people were divided - their society cooperatively worked towards a common goal.

Well it would be more appropriate to mention, say, the British empire. Or Rome in its heyday. Stuff like that. Functional civilizations. What destroyed both of then seems to be the same thing, also. Which is also what ruined the mythical city of babel.