CdnFox Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 18 minutes ago, eyeball said: Well there you go. You obviously lost the wars and now you think woke is worse we pretty much won the wars, I distinctly remember something about Germany surrendering at some point You're at the point where you've gotten so frustrated by the fact you're wrong that you're blathering like a lunatic. I'm pretty sure you know we beat the nazis. And the commies for that matter more often than not. LOL seriously - whatever drugs you're on today you should let them wear off before posting. You're making NO sense. And woke is about the same i suppose. Its all the same authortarian hate-based thinking. Honestly i don't see much difference between the mentality of the work or the nazis or the commies, just different flavours of the same sickness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 (edited) 3 hours ago, User said: Of course the Pride flag is controversial. You might see it as a symbol as safety and support, but it is obviously more than that. It is a symbol representing the entire movement in many regards, including support for not just students, but the ideology. It is a political promotion in a classroom. The classroom can be inviting and welcoming without such symbols. Would you be OK with the Christian flag in the classroom? How about the Pro-Life Flag? The "Christian flag" is exclusive. It asserts dominance over other faiths and non-faiths. Not inclusive. The "pro-life flag" (whatever that is) is similarly exclusive. It says THIS instead of THAT. The pride flag is not a zero-sum game. The only message it connotes is that of LGBTQ friendliness, and literal pride and acceptance. It does not connote superiority or dominance. There is nobody on the downside of that message. The "entire movement" and "ideology" are tolerance, acceptance and equality. If the idea of tolerance, acceptance and equality hurt one's feelings, they have much bigger problems than a colorful flag. Quote Yes, as I already said in my response, that book is in classrooms: "As for the book... the political left in America has been pushing that smut into the K-12 classrooms and demanding it stay when folks on the right discovered it among many other LGBTQ smut books the left has been putting in their schools. " No, it is not merely a part of sexual education. They put the book in the school library for students to read. What grade is it appropriate for children to read about strap on dildo sucking and other gay sex fetishes? One of these books the left is putting in schools is a guide on how to use anal butt plugs and the gay hook up site. Because we need anyone in K-12 to learn about that? No. That is smut doesn't belong in any K-12 school. You made an offhand and unsubstantiated claim. I have no idea what "in classrooms" means, and I suspect it's deliberately vague. But from an educational perspective, the conversation about "if and when" students should be exposed to such material it should be well informed and in good faith. You dismiss it as "smut" when it may well serve an important educational function. It's not prurience, right? It's not pornography. So you should be asking what students might learn. And are those lessons important in light of the vast amount of unhealthy sexual content they see every day. Nobody wants to acknowledge that their teens are having sex, but they are. Do you want them to see healthy sexual relationships modeled, or to think that porn is a real-life roadmap? Is there any merit in counterprogramming against porn? Edited April 29 by Hodad 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 in most cases, online forum posters use the words, "Nazi" or "commie" to describe anyone that disagrees with them. Most use those two words interchangeably along with fascist. Been doing the forum game since 2008 and have since became numb to the use of those words. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 5 minutes ago, Hodad said: The "Christian flag" is exclusive. It asserts dominance over other faiths and non-faiths. Not inclusive. The "pro-life flag" (whatever that is) is similarly exclusive. It says THIS instead of THAT. The pride flag is not a zero-sum game. The only message it connotes is that of LGBTQ friendliness, and literal pride and acceptance. It does not connote superiority or dominance. There is nobody on the downside of that message. The "entire movement" and "ideology" are tolerance, acceptance and equality. If the idea of tolerance, acceptance and equality hurt one's feelings, they have much bigger problems than a colorful flag. You made an offhand and unsubstantiated claim. I have no idea what "in classrooms" means, and I suspect it's deliberately vague. But from an educational perspective, the conversation about "if and when" students should be exposed to such material it should be well informed and in good faith. You dismiss it as "smut" when it may well serve an important educational function. It's not prurience, right? It's not pornography. So you should be asking what students might learn. And are those lessons important in light of the vast amount of unhealthy sexual content they see every day. Nobody wants to acknowledge that their teens are having sex, but they are. Do you want them to see healthy sexual relationships modeled, or to think that porn is a real-life roadmap? Is there an merit in counterprogramming against porn? The Christian flag is no more exclusive than the Pride flag is. To your argument, it would symbolize support and safety for Christian students... Again, the Pro Life flag would be a symbol of support and safety... Watch, I can assert the same thing! The Christian and Pro-Life flag is not a zero-sum game. The only message it connotes is that of friendliness, and acceptance. It does not connote superiority or dominance. You do not tolerate and accept Christains? People who are Pro-Life?! You don't want equality for Christians?! I am not sure where you live, if it is Canada or something, but this has been a pretty contentious issue here in the States for the past year and has been all over the news. I did not think I had to prove it to you when it was fairly self-evident and easy to find. Even then... this is still a discussion on the merits of such, and the requisite knowledge is not required to form your own thoughts on such having a place there or not... as you are now proving to beat around the bush to justify it and down play it. We are not talking about sex education. We are talking about putting this material in the library for students to browse and have access to. Yes, it certainly is little more than smut and pornographic in nature. Its a graphic novel depicting one boy giving another boy a blow job on his strap on dildo. It is not the schools job to try to expose kids to even more sexual content because you think they may be exposed to some outside of school. If you wish to expose your kids to LGBTQ porn/smut, more power to you. The issue here is what all kids are being exposed to. No, not all teens are having sex. Those numbers are declining and less than half do. At least by the last CDC numbers I looked at. Healthy sexual relationships happen in marriage in committed relationships. You are now pushing your warped values on what constitutes a healthy sexual relationship here. Sexual education should be limited to the concepts of the basics of what is safe, rape (yes and no), birth control, and the consequences that result from it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goddess Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 I'm feeling more and more that the "woke" movement has done nothing but unleash a lot of dark triad/cluster B personalities loose on everybody else. They use outlandish identities to terrorize the others. And turn anti-social rage and violence into an armor of untouchability and make lists of people to attack. Crybullies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 25 minutes ago, Goddess said: I'm feeling more and more that the "woke" movement has done nothing but unleash a lot of dark triad/cluster B personalities loose on everybody else. They use outlandish identities to terrorize the others. And turn anti-social rage and violence into an armor of untouchability and make lists of people to attack. Crybullies. There's terrorism on both sides for sure. There are also reasonable people on both sides. But there's no advantage to anybody in promoting politics at this point. Until people start saying stop the divisiveness we won't be able to talk about an actual solution 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 10 minutes ago, User said: The Christian flag is no more exclusive than the Pride flag is. To your argument, it would symbolize support and safety for Christian students... Again, the Pro Life flag would be a symbol of support and safety... Watch, I can assert the same thing! The Christian and Pro-Life flag is not a zero-sum game. The only message it connotes is that of friendliness, and acceptance. It does not connote superiority or dominance. You do not tolerate and accept Christains? People who are Pro-Life?! You don't want equality for Christians?! I am not sure where you live, if it is Canada or something, but this has been a pretty contentious issue here in the States for the past year and has been all over the news. I did not think I had to prove it to you when it was fairly self-evident and easy to find. Even then... this is still a discussion on the merits of such, and the requisite knowledge is not required to form your own thoughts on such having a place there or not... as you are now proving to beat around the bush to justify it and down play it. We are not talking about sex education. We are talking about putting this material in the library for students to browse and have access to. Yes, it certainly is little more than smut and pornographic in nature. Its a graphic novel depicting one boy giving another boy a blow job on his strap on dildo. It is not the schools job to try to expose kids to even more sexual content because you think they may be exposed to some outside of school. If you wish to expose your kids to LGBTQ porn/smut, more power to you. The issue here is what all kids are being exposed to. No, not all teens are having sex. Those numbers are declining and less than half do. At least by the last CDC numbers I looked at. Healthy sexual relationships happen in marriage in committed relationships. You are now pushing your warped values on what constitutes a healthy sexual relationship here. Sexual education should be limited to the concepts of the basics of what is safe, rape (yes and no), birth control, and the consequences that result from it. Nonsense. Religions jockey for dominance, not mutuality and tolerance. Central to those faiths is the idea that everyone else is wrong--and often damned to hell because of it. Hence why that dehumanizing tactic has been used for thousands of years to justify sectarian violence. Similarly the "pro life" flag is not a symbol of tolerance, safety or support. It says a LOT about the people who would fly it and their intention to strip women and girls of a fundamental right to choose. Both of those flags stand for the triumph of ideas in which someone else is the loser. They are exclusive. The pride flag is fundamentally different, in that no one loses. It is inclusive. And noooope, teens are definitely having more sex than you think--and the minority who aren't are still coping with the same challenges. They are literally bombarded with unhealthy sexual content. So, again, why shouldn't they have access to content that models healthy, sex-positive relationships? Are you having those conversations with your children? Do you sit down and tell Junior that you don't spit in mommy's mouth or step on her face when you are intimate? (Or maybe you do, no judgment between consenting adults.) But most parents aren't having that explicit conversation. So where are kids supposed to get the information to offset the dark fantasy world of porn? Shouldn't healthy sex be modeled as well? Consider that the world has changed and the information kids need might not be the information you had growing up. Or to look at it the other way, do you think a consensual cartoon blowjob is too titillating for these kids? Is it going to corrupt them, when Extreme Asian Backdoor Gangbangs vol 3 is just a Google search away. How do you think such a book is harmful? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goddess Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 7 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: There's terrorism on both sides for sure. There are also reasonable people on both sides. But there's no advantage to anybody in promoting politics at this point. Until people start saying stop the divisiveness we won't be able to talk about an actual solution Maybe someone, somewhere in all of this, was really & truly seeking justice and tolerance once, but I feel like we've lost the plot along the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 34 minutes ago, Hodad said: Nonsense. Religions jockey for dominance, not mutuality and tolerance. Central to those faiths is the idea that everyone else is wrong--and often damned to hell because of it. Hence why that dehumanizing tactic has been used for thousands of years to justify sectarian violence. Similarly the "pro life" flag is not a symbol of tolerance, safety or support. It says a LOT about the people who would fly it and their intention to strip women and girls of a fundamental right to choose. Both of those flags stand for the triumph of ideas in which someone else is the loser. They are exclusive. The pride flag is fundamentally different, in that no one loses. It is inclusive. And noooope, teens are definitely having more sex than you think--and the minority who aren't are still coping with the same challenges. They are literally bombarded with unhealthy sexual content. So, again, why shouldn't they have access to content that models healthy, sex-positive relationships? Are you having those conversations with your children? Do you sit down and tell Junior that you don't spit in mommy's mouth or step on her face when you are intimate? (Or maybe you do, no judgment between consenting adults.) But most parents aren't having that explicit conversation. So where are kids supposed to get the information to offset the dark fantasy world of porn? Shouldn't healthy sex be modeled as well? Consider that the world has changed and the information kids need might not be the information you had growing up. Or to look at it the other way, do you think a consensual cartoon blowjob is too titillating for these kids? Is it going to corrupt them, when Extreme Asian Backdoor Gangbangs vol 3 is just a Google search away. How do you think such a book is harmful? I am not interested in your bigoted views on religion. They no more pronounce everyone else as wrong than does the LGBTQ mafia anyone that doesn't 100% tote their beliefs, like a man being a woman just because he feels that way. The point though, is that for all the reasons you don't like the Christian flag, this is exactly why classrooms should be free from shoving political viewpoints on them, like the Pride flag. The only difference here is that you don't seem to care how others feel about it, but want us all to respect your bigoted feelings about how bad the Christian flag would be. You are also reading a lot into that Pro-Life flag. Here is what it means: "While simple, the design of the Pro-Life Flag is highly symbolic of the pro-life message. It stresses “Love them both.” Do you not love them both?! https://www.prolifeflag.com/the-flag So, your answer to their being bombarded to unhealthy sexual content is to bombard them with more. I don't think so. I do not agree that you can have healthy sexual relationships outside of marriage, especially for children, and especially not with strap on dildos... You completely ignored my comment on YOU are wanting to push YOUR sexual values onto these kids, which is exactly what I oppose and why it should be basic factual information. Values are subjective and clearly ours do not align. You also glossed right over this one: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted April 29 Report Share Posted April 29 12 minutes ago, User said: I am not interested in your bigoted views on religion. They no more pronounce everyone else as wrong than does the LGBTQ mafia anyone that doesn't 100% tote their beliefs, like a man being a woman just because he feels that way. The point though, is that for all the reasons you don't like the Christian flag, this is exactly why classrooms should be free from shoving political viewpoints on them, like the Pride flag. The only difference here is that you don't seem to care how others feel about it, but want us all to respect your bigoted feelings about how bad the Christian flag would be. You are also reading a lot into that Pro-Life flag. Here is what it means: "While simple, the design of the Pro-Life Flag is highly symbolic of the pro-life message. It stresses “Love them both.” Do you not love them both?! https://www.prolifeflag.com/the-flag So, your answer to their being bombarded to unhealthy sexual content is to bombard them with more. I don't think so. I do not agree that you can have healthy sexual relationships outside of marriage, especially for children, and especially not with strap on dildos... You completely ignored my comment on YOU are wanting to push YOUR sexual values onto these kids, which is exactly what I oppose and why it should be basic factual information. Values are subjective and clearly ours do not align. You also glossed right over this one: ^^ Sexual intercourse is a much smaller subset of sexual activity. And schools don't have any responsibility to teach puritanical values--no more than they have to teach creationism. You're welcome to do that at home, but schools have a responsibility to give kids the factual information they need to thrive and succeed in the world. You're welcome to debate what that information might be, and how it should be presented, but to discount it out of hand is pretty silly. You may have met a lot of people who wished you understood the basics of a proper blowjob.❤️ And your argument about the flags has now devolved into the absurd notion that a pride flag is intolerant of the intolerant. Bravo. Reductio ad absurdum, we have arrived! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 Been watching the NBA playoffs and if you do not watch pre-game or half time ....nothing woke happening here. as the free market goes.. if they are willing to pay and the NBA along with TNT is willing to broadcast it .. then who is tell them that they should not be allowed to do so. Well... anyways hoping that the Denver Nuggets win tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 4 hours ago, Hodad said: ^^ Sexual intercourse is a much smaller subset of sexual activity. And schools don't have any responsibility to teach puritanical values--no more than they have to teach creationism. You're welcome to do that at home, but schools have a responsibility to give kids the factual information they need to thrive and succeed in the world. You're welcome to debate what that information might be, and how it should be presented, but to discount it out of hand is pretty silly. You may have met a lot of people who wished you understood the basics of a proper blowjob.❤️ And your argument about the flags has now devolved into the absurd notion that a pride flag is intolerant of the intolerant. Bravo. Reductio ad absurdum, we have arrived! I never said "sexual intercourse" or "sexual activity." The comment was just sex. That is what the CDC chart was on. I never said anything about "puritanical values," but you are catching on to my point, which is that yes, we should stick to the facts, not YOUR twisted values, or that we send kids to school to learn about how to give blow jobs. Like I said, the Pride flag is meant to brow beat others into 100% acceptance and you are here pushing it. No wonder why you support it. You want to push your political views onto others in the classroom and label them as "intolerant" if they don't go along with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 (edited) 1 hour ago, User said: 1 hour ago, User said: I never said "sexual intercourse" or "sexual activity." The comment was just sex. That is what the CDC chart was on. I never said anything about "puritanical values," but you are catching on to my point, which is that yes, we should stick to the facts, not YOUR twisted values, or that we send kids to school to learn about how to give blow jobs. Like I said, the Pride flag is meant to brow beat others into 100% acceptance and you are here pushing it. No wonder why you support it. You want to push your political views onto others in the classroom and label them as "intolerant" if they don't go along with you. Okay, so it sounds like you're dead set that kids should not have real sex education. Just let them figure it out with Prof. Ron Jeremy. That's fine if that's how you feel, but I hope you can see that it's reasonable for other people or jurisdictions to take a more practical approach. And no, the pride flag doesn't "browbeat" anyone. It's a message of self-worth and tolerance. That shouldn't be offensive to anyone. There is no undertone about straight people going to hell or being less-than. Again, if you're offended by messages of self worth and tolerance, a colorful flag is the least of your problems. I'm trying to empathetically imagine being outraged at people for being comfortable with their own sexuality and I just can't imagine how that works. By what mechanism? Do you feel so entitled to impose your views and values upon others that it's offensive to you when someone is proud of who they are. Is that like an incursion on your privilege?ockquote widgetblockquote widget Edited April 30 by Hodad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 1 hour ago, Hodad said: Okay, so it sounds like you're dead set that kids should not have real sex education. Just let them figure it out with Prof. Ron Jeremy. That's fine if that's how you feel, but I hope you can see that it's reasonable for other people or jurisdictions to take a more practical approach. And no, the pride flag doesn't "browbeat" anyone. It's a message of self-worth and tolerance. That shouldn't be offensive to anyone. There is no undertone about straight people going to hell or being less-than. Again, if you're offended by messages of self worth and tolerance, a colorful flag is the least of your problems. I'm trying to empathetically imagine being outraged at people for being comfortable with their own sexuality and I just can't imagine how that works. By what mechanism? Do you feel so entitled to impose your views and values upon others that it's offensive to you when someone is proud of who they are. Is that like an incursion on your privilege?ockquote widgetblockquote widget Well, sounds like you are not going to be honest now. Not that you have not been circling the drain in this area, but this is just outright blatantly dishonest. Like, in this discussion I have already said I support sex education explicitly and even outlined the basics of what it should focus on. So, sitting here saying that it sounds like I am dead set that kids should not have sex education is just a lie. I don't think you are used to arguing with someone who can focus on the merits of what you say and pick them apart. The more I do, the more you veer to this kind of dishonesty and frankly, asinine rhetoric... Ron Jeremy? really? You are not being serious. Where did I say anything about being outraged at people comfortable with their own sexuality? Seriously... just a lame straw man argument now. Let me point out again, it is you who wants to impose your views on people here... impose your brand of sexual morality on them, impose your political symbolism on them. Not just people, but kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodad Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 6 hours ago, User said: Well, sounds like you are not going to be honest now. Not that you have not been circling the drain in this area, but this is just outright blatantly dishonest. Like, in this discussion I have already said I support sex education explicitly and even outlined the basics of what it should focus on. So, sitting here saying that it sounds like I am dead set that kids should not have sex education is just a lie. I don't think you are used to arguing with someone who can focus on the merits of what you say and pick them apart. The more I do, the more you veer to this kind of dishonesty and frankly, asinine rhetoric... Ron Jeremy? really? You are not being serious. Where did I say anything about being outraged at people comfortable with their own sexuality? Seriously... just a lame straw man argument now. Let me point out again, it is you who wants to impose your views on people here... impose your brand of sexual morality on them, impose your political symbolism on them. Not just people, but kids. I said "real sex education." You know, something relevant to the real world they inhabit today. You think the ol' nuts and bolts (so to speak) is sufficient to help today's youth successfully navigate through a vast sea of more explicit, more engaging--but generally unhealthy--information. I, on the other hand, think that's woefully naive, and that you're setting kids up for a lot of pain, failure and long-term harm. As the world changes kids will naturally face different challenges. Education should adapt to meet them. My reference to Ron Jeremy is just colorful rhetoric for an inescapable point: kids are learning about sexuality and sexual relationships from online pornography. If you don't give them an alternative, that's the only message that becomes the sole and authoritative source of truth. Trying to countreprogram with a pamphlet from the 50s is like fighting a forest fire with a squirt gun. And you want to talk about asinine rhetoric? You literally said that the pride flag was intended to "browbeat" people, lol. If that's not absurd, I don't know what is. It has a very narrow message, pride in one's self and tolerance. Again, if those ideas offend you, if you're outraged by a symbol of those ideas, then you have much bigger problems than a colorful flag. It does no harm to anyone. It does not claim supremacy. It does not make anyone "less-than." It is a simple affirmation for a long-marginalized and abused group. And yet it bothers you and you feel it's an act of aggression? Sorry, your privilege is showing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 Interpretation of a symbol can only be subjective because it doesn't explicitly say anything. As such, a Swastika is a harmless design, perhaps, before the 20th century. But it now signifies something unacceptable. For us to agree that subjectivity exists and that there are 'edge' cases, and 'non-edge' cases... And that means there will necessarily be politics for some symbols. The politics around "Pride" symbols appears to be recent, and I would say that points to a change in our mode of politics more than anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted April 30 Author Report Share Posted April 30 16 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: There's terrorism on both sides for sure. There are also reasonable people on both sides. But there's no advantage to anybody in promoting politics at this point. Until people start saying stop the divisiveness we won't be able to talk about an actual solution Well Mike, you find a way to get us back to the 80's and we'll all more or less be good to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 51 minutes ago, Hodad said: I said "real sex education." You know, something relevant to the real world they inhabit today. You think the ol' nuts and bolts (so to speak) is sufficient to help today's youth successfully navigate through a vast sea of more explicit, more engaging--but generally unhealthy--information. I, on the other hand, think that's woefully naive, and that you're setting kids up for a lot of pain, failure and long-term harm. As the world changes kids will naturally face different challenges. Education should adapt to meet them. My reference to Ron Jeremy is just colorful rhetoric for an inescapable point: kids are learning about sexuality and sexual relationships from online pornography. If you don't give them an alternative, that's the only message that becomes the sole and authoritative source of truth. Trying to countreprogram with a pamphlet from the 50s is like fighting a forest fire with a squirt gun. And you want to talk about asinine rhetoric? You literally said that the pride flag was intended to "browbeat" people, lol. If that's not absurd, I don't know what is. It has a very narrow message, pride in one's self and tolerance. Again, if those ideas offend you, if you're outraged by a symbol of those ideas, then you have much bigger problems than a colorful flag. It does no harm to anyone. It does not claim supremacy. It does not make anyone "less-than." It is a simple affirmation for a long-marginalized and abused group. And yet it bothers you and you feel it's an act of aggression? Sorry, your privilege is showing. No, you did not just say real. You mocked me by saying I would leave them to a porn star as if I did not support anything at all. What you did was dishonest. *Some kids fall prey to online porn. Do you support legislation pushed by Republicans in various right leaning states to regulate online porn more to require age verification to help prevent kids from accessing it? Any other measures? Your position here is that they are going to see this in porn... so we should teach them how to do it in the classroom too? No, that is in fact asinine. You are not giving them an alternative, you are simply endorsing it and pushing your own warped values onto them. You can have blow job training sessions with your own kid, maybe even teach them about how to shit on people and how to properly fit their bondage or use a sex swing. Don't want to miss out on any of the sexual fetishes out there! Leave your sick twisted depravity out of the classroom. And yes, you are here trying to brow-beat with the Pride flag, you are the one proving that is exactly your intent with your intolerant of the intolerant rhetoric and notions that having an honest, scientific, and factual position about men being men and women being women... Hey, the Pro-Life flag and Christian flags do no harm to anyone either. Round and round we go... maybe we should keep your political crap out of the classroom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 3 minutes ago, Deluge said: Well Mike, you find a way to get us back to the 80's and we'll all more or less be good to go. Well... let's ask why this wasn't an issue in the 80s, 90s, 2000s, 2010s... or ... when / why did it become an issue ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 28 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Interpretation of a symbol can only be subjective because it doesn't explicitly say anything. As such, a Swastika is a harmless design, perhaps, before the 20th century. But it now signifies something unacceptable. For us to agree that subjectivity exists and that there are 'edge' cases, and 'non-edge' cases... And that means there will necessarily be politics for some symbols. The politics around "Pride" symbols appears to be recent, and I would say that points to a change in our mode of politics more than anything. The pushing of all things PRIDE into the classroom is recent... BECAUSE it is a political message meant to push that view (all of what the PRIDE flag encompasses) onto children. There is a reason why you see this in more left wing places and liberal run/controled schools. It is entirely political. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted April 30 Author Report Share Posted April 30 (edited) 17 hours ago, Hodad said: 1. The "Christian flag" is exclusive. It asserts dominance over other faiths and non-faiths. Not inclusive. 2. The "pro-life flag" (whatever that is) is similarly exclusive. It says THIS instead of THAT. 3. The pride flag is not a zero-sum game. The only message it connotes is that of LGBTQ friendliness, and literal pride and acceptance. It does not connote superiority or dominance. 4. There is nobody on the downside of that message. The "entire movement" and "ideology" are tolerance, acceptance and equality. If the idea of tolerance, acceptance and equality hurt one's feelings, they have much bigger problems than a colorful flag. 1. The "Christian Flag" is an invitation. It's your choice to take it or leave it. It represents the predominant religion of this country, which makes sense since the US is a Christian nation. You want to have equal or greater prominence? Move to another country. 2. The "Pro-life" flag defends life. If you fetus slaughtering a$$holes want to say that's exclusive then there's nothing we can do to help you. 3. Wrong. The Pride Flag represents invasiveness that reaches Orwellian levels. It's more than just "acceptance" for these wokejobs, they want 100% compliance. 4. Wrong. It's Compliance, obedience, or punishment. You shills really need to stop defending these degenerates - their only purpose is to spread their filth everywhere. Edited April 30 by Deluge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted April 30 Author Report Share Posted April 30 12 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Well... let's ask why this wasn't an issue in the 80s, 90s, 2000s, 2010s... or ... when / why did it become an issue ? Moral decay. Now, I'm not saying that there wasn't moral decay in the 80's, but there was less of it than there is now, which made life tolerable. So you find a way to get us back to that decade and we'll all be happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 2 minutes ago, User said: The pushing of all things PRIDE into the classroom is recent... BECAUSE it is a political message meant to push that view (all of what the PRIDE flag encompasses) onto children. There is a reason why you see this in more left wing places and liberal run/controled schools. It is entirely political. Can you cite that ? I think the controversy is recent, but the flags have been present for awhile now. I can find a reference to a university flying them over 20 years ago. "Political message" - loud buzzer sound - your subjective opinion "push that view" - ditto "left wing places" - attempt to divide.... here's a dictum outlining Pride flag protocol in an Alberta school board https://www.epsb.ca/ourdistrict/policy/g/gndb-ar/ I'm honestly wondering where the recent controversy came from. A few minutes on Google tells me it may have been caught up in a controversy around BLM flags in the classroom... I can't find anything prior to 2021 as it being objectionable, at least as a movement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 1 minute ago, Deluge said: Moral decay. So you find a way to get us back to that decade and we'll all be happy. "Moral decay" = subjective opinion If your points require someone to share your opinions, then it's difficult to have a political discussion. Like convincing someone who doesn't like watermelon that it's good. Values can't transfer across a web forum. But, I get the pining for nostalgia. Back in the 70s, with Nixon, the US pretty much burst with nostalgia to the point where Movies, Music and TV shows from the 1950s (!) came back. I understand that ancient Rome was also susceptible to longings for the past, near the end. Believe me, I am old and would love to go back to the 1960s... my favourite. That said, time only goes one way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted April 30 Report Share Posted April 30 5 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Can you cite that ? I think the controversy is recent, but the flags have been present for awhile now. I can find a reference to a university flying them over 20 years ago. "Political message" - loud buzzer sound - your subjective opinion "push that view" - ditto "left wing places" - attempt to divide.... here's a dictum outlining Pride flag protocol in an Alberta school board https://www.epsb.ca/ourdistrict/policy/g/gndb-ar/ I'm honestly wondering where the recent controversy came from. A few minutes on Google tells me it may have been caught up in a controversy around BLM flags in the classroom... I can't find anything prior to 2021 as it being objectionable, at least as a movement. The entire argument is going to be subjective here regarding ones stance on putting the PRIDE flag into a classroom or not... that is my point. Leave the politics out of the classroom. Stop pushing your agenda onto kids. I have little interest in writing a research paper here on all schools in the country and how many introduced pride flags, when they did so... I will leave it at my anecdotal experience in answering the question as to why this is more recent... because it is more recent that the LGBTQ stuff has been going crazy. You go back 10 years ago and we did not spend over half the year celebrating days, weeks, months out of the year for Transgender awareness day, Gay Pride Month, my dogs cousins brothers owner coming out of the closet day.... to include we must have teachers in the classroom dressed in rainbows like they came off the street with PRIDE flags all over their classrooms. That was not a norm 10 years ago like it is today. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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