Female Boxer Refuses to Fight Trans Opponent in Canadian Championship Match

[Michael Hardner]

9 hours ago, Army Guy said:

1. Who is this "NOBODY" you talk about, i see plenty of posters wanting to discuss it in more detail..  

2. If we are to only discuss topics that only personally involve us, i think the entire forum could be reduced to one page...maybe Greg could change the format...for you that is...

 

1. I'm talking about the topic of the public sphere, apart from hot issues like Jessica Yaniv or trans shop teachers...

2. Well, I get what you're saying... And for sure you will never see a newspaper without, say, an astrology column.. but I have seen people on here, for example, complaining that people care too much about Hollywood Gossip. 

That might be a parallel problem.  Do you ever think that there's an important issue not getting enough attention?  How might that be looked at?  Maybe if we ask why things are covered, we can get ourselves to consider those issues that don't get enough play.

[blackbird]

18 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

No, you can do whatever you like.  But when I pointed out the impact was negligible, that's what I was referring to: people actually impacted not those discussing it like us BC we like to chatter and get upset.

Actually all these LGBT and Trans issues are having a major impact on the public school system and young people.  They are now grooming kids to accept all this nonsense by teaching them it is normal, while falsely claiming it is to reduce or eliminate bullying.  That is just a cover.  Surely they can teach and oppose bullying without needing that kind of an excuse.  Bullying is simply wrong.  Don't need a reason to forbid it.   If bullies won't stop bullying after some discipline, kick them out of the school system and force them to study at home by using the home education system.

They can teach kids in school that everyone has to be treated respectfully and without hurtful speech or comments.  That should be taught in schools anyway.  But there is no need to teach kids LGBT is normal.  That subject should be taboo or off limits for schools.  Simply take that subject out of the school system and stick to the three RRRs. 

So yes it is having an impact on society as a whole.  We know you want to play it down but that's just an excuse because you have no real argument to support the trans agenda.  You support it all but have no rational reason.

Edited November 19, 2023 by blackbird

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Actually all these LGBT and Trans issues are having a major impact on the public school system and young people.  They are now grooming kids to accept all this nonsense by teaching them it is normal, while falsely claiming it is to reduce or eliminate bullying.  That is just a cover.  Surely they can teach and oppose bullying without needing that kind of an excuse.  Bullying is simply wrong.  Don't need a reason to forbid it.   If bullies won't stop bullying after some discipline, kick them out of the school system and force them to study at home by using the home education system.

So yes it is having an impact on society as a whole.  We know you want to play it down but that's just an excuse because you have no real argument to oppose the trans agenda.  You support it all but have no rational reason.

The issue is not a zero sum game.  I support trans rights, and fully support the idea that children are taught about the world around them as it actually is, not as religious people would like it to be.

At the same time, when trans rights clash with women's rights, I tend to support the latter. 

There is no "one size fits all".  Especially not a religious one.

And anyway, the issue wasn't around trans rights per se, but rather, how much time and energy do certain aspects of the issue deserve when it comes to discussing them.  I think.

[Michael Hardner]

8 minutes ago, blackbird said:

 

They can teach kids in school that everyone has to be treated respectfully and without hurtful speech or comments.  That should be taught in schools anyway.  But there is no need to teach kids LGBT is normal.  

So.. tell the kids to not bully the gay ones, who must accept that they're seen as abnormal.

Your proposal wouldn't go anywhere, I assure you.  And in fact, your way of looking at things is being adopted more and more by identity politicians, to ostracize and ban people who are religious.

Tolerance works both ways, and unfortunately do does intolerance.

[OftenWrong]

32 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

And anyway, the issue wasn't around trans rights per se, but rather, how much time and energy do certain aspects of the issue deserve when it comes to discussing them.  I think.

I hide within my cloak,

a little poison

it is very deadly,

but very little.

very, very, little. 

 

How much would you allow yourself to drink?

[Guest]

30 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

I hide within my cloak,

a little poison

it is very deadly,

but very little.

very, very, little. 

 

How much would you allow yourself to drink?

Harry Potter?

See, I'm not completely uneducated...

[OftenWrong]

8 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Harry Potter?

See, I'm not completely uneducated...

Nietzsche really.

Still, you were close!  

Ok, let's say there was a really big bowl of soup, and there was a fly in it. How much fly is acceptable to you? I can add more soup to it if you like. No? I see. You cannot digest that soup, no matter how little fly is in it. The very idea of fly parts in your meal is simply unpalatable. It is an irritant at any level.

That is why we can't stop talking about this issue.

[blackbird]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

So.. tell the kids to not bully the gay ones, who must accept that they're seen as abnormal.

I never said it needs to be said they are abnormal.  That is you saying that because you know it's a fact.

I say the whole subject should not be talked about at all in schools.  It should be a taboo subject for obvious reasons.  

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

And in fact, your way of looking at things is being adopted more and more by identity politicians, to ostracize and ban people who are religious.

You are saying nothing new.   It is not strictly a religious matter.  It is a health, mental, and societal social issue.  It is destroying much of society.  LGBT is not normal no matter how much people beat their drums or march in the streets.

It is causing great harm to many individuals involved in it because it is not a normal life style.  It is harmful.

People who are religious have often been discriminated against all through history because it does not conform with mainstream society or what is popular.  Nobody who believes the Bible and is a faithful Christian expects to be patted on the back or respected by mainstream society.  That is just the reality of living in a wicked world.

[blackbird]

4 hours ago, bcsapper said:

The issue is not a zero sum game.  I support trans rights, and fully support the idea that children are taught about the world around them as it actually is, not as religious people would like it to be.

What are "trans rights"?   What gives anyone the right to teach LGBT / trans  is normal to school children?

This is not just a religious issue as you paint it.   This is a societal, medical, mental, health issue that has deep consequences for society.  It is teaching kids that there is no such thing as a traditional or normal family made up of a male father and female mother.  That is taboo now in the new progressive, liberal world.  And parents don't have a right in many places to know what is happening to their kids in schools and have a say in it.

[I am Groot]

6 hours ago, bcsapper said:

And anyway, the issue wasn't around trans rights per se, but rather, how much time and energy do certain aspects of the issue deserve when it comes to discussing them.  I think.

Incorrect. The issue is about women's safety and women's rights. One individual has done his best to either end it or turn it to something else, with little success.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, blackbird said:

What are "trans rights"?   What gives anyone the right to teach LGBT / trans  is normal to school children?

This is not just a religious issue as you paint it.   This is a societal, medical, mental, health issue that has deep consequences for society.  It is teaching kids that there is no such thing as a traditional or normal family made up of a male father and female mother.  That is taboo now in the new progressive, liberal world.  And parents don't have a right in many places to know what is happening to their kids in schools and have a say in it.

I suppose they have the right because it is normal.  To everyone except a religious nutjob or an out and out bigot, that is.  Trans rights are the same as all the other rights in the Canadian Human Rights Act.  Like it or not. 

It's not teaching kids that there is no such thing as a traditional or normal family made up of a male father and female mother, it's teaching kids that there are things besides traditional or normal families made up of male fathers and female mothers.  Which there are, regardless of your doctrine.

I would, of course, join you on the barricades if those teaching LGBT / trans  issues as normal to school children tried to teach them that was anything wrong with the more traditional family structure.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, I am Groot said:

Incorrect. The issue is about women's safety and women's rights. One individual has done his best to either end it or turn it to something else, with little success.

You're right.  I got involved in the conversation around "the public sphere" and deserving thereof, and forgot what the OP was actually about.  Sorry about that, all.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Nietzsche really.

Still, you were close!  

Ok, let's say there was a really big bowl of soup, and there was a fly in it. How much fly is acceptable to you? I can add more soup to it if you like. No? I see. You cannot digest that soup, no matter how little fly is in it. The very idea of fly parts in your meal is simply unpalatable. It is an irritant at any level.

That is why we can't stop talking about this issue.

Can I have a spoon?

I'm on the talking side.

[Aristides]

8 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

Nietzsche really.

Still, you were close!  

Ok, let's say there was a really big bowl of soup, and there was a fly in it. How much fly is acceptable to you? I can add more soup to it if you like. No? I see. You cannot digest that soup, no matter how little fly is in it. The very idea of fly parts in your meal is simply unpalatable. It is an irritant at any level.

That is why we can't stop talking about this issue.

How much fly in your soup is acceptable to you is of no consequence to anyone but you unless you are trying to force them to eat your soup.

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

I suppose they have the right because it is normal.  To everyone except a religious nutjob or an out and out bigot, that is.  Trans rights are the same as all the other rights in the Canadian Human Rights Act.  Like it or not.

Normal???  Can you give any evidence to support that?  Fifty years ago, if you made such a statement to anybody, they would think you were out of your mind.  What has been believed as normal for thousands of years is that a person is what they are born as biologically.  It is only in the last number of years that some people like you think a person can change their sex or sexual gender.  So how can anybody claim or believe it is "normal"?  In fact, give us the proof that a person can really biologically and scientifically change their gender.

You have to have some proof or evidence to say it is normal.  Since you have none, I assume you are just making it up for the sake of argument.  You love to argue and make outrageous statements if you think it goes against my religious beliefs.  I really think that is the only reason you are making such statements. 

Since you claim that I am a religious nutjob for believing the Bible, I would have to say that makes you the bigot.  You obviously don't believe in freedom of religion.

You also misuse the word bigot.  I never advocated that anyone just be discriminated against for being LGBT / trans.  I said I simply disagreed with it being promoted in schools to kids and I disagree that a person can actually change their gender.  That is not being a bigot.  It is simply disagreeing about certain claims.  Other than the two points I have stated, I think they should be treated respectfully in schools and not discriminated against in society as for example in jobs and housing.  The only bigot is someone who calls religious people nutjobs.  That shows extreme bias and unreasonableness.

Edited November 20, 2023 by blackbird

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Normal???  Can you give any evidence to support that?  Fifty years ago, if you made such a statement to anybody, they would think you were out of your mind.  What has been believed as normal for thousands of years is that a person is what they are born as biologically.  It is only in the last number of years that some people like you think a person can change their sex or sexual gender.  So how can anybody claim or believe it is "normal"?  In fact, give us the proof that a person can really biologically and scientifically change their gender.

You have to have some proof or evidence to say it is normal.  Since you have none, I assume you are just making it up for the sake of argument.  You love to argue and make outrageous statements if you think it goes against my religious beliefs.  I really think that is the only reason you are making such statements. 

Since you claim that I am a religious nutjob for believing the Bible, I would have to say that makes you the bigot.  You obviously don't believe in freedom of religion.

I believe in freedom of religion.  You can believe whatever you want.  You can believe in Santa Claus if you want.  You might as well.

I don't need proof that it is normal.  Gay people exist.  Trans people exist.  You exist.  As far as I'm concerned, all of you are normal, except you believe in fairy tales.  Again, I don't care if you believe in fairy tales, except where you want to control those who don't.

Let me ask you this:  If someone expresses their gender in a way that doesn't suit you, are you going to tell them they cannot?

[blackbird]

7 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Let me ask you this:  If someone expresses their gender in a way that doesn't suit you, are you going to tell them they cannot?

Of course not.   I already explained why I disagree with it.  I simply don't think it is possible to change.

But I am not going to hassle anyone over it.  I disagree with people covering themselves with tatoos.  I think it is self harm, but I am not going to say anything about it.  There was somebody in McDonalds the other day shouting and ranting.  I don't agree with that but I am not going to say anything.  I don't go around trying to police the world.  But I am entitled to disagree with some things just as you are.   This forum is the place where people make their disagreements known and express their opinions or beliefs.  But most of us probably don't go around saying the same things to people we meet or know.   It just wouldn't work out.

Edited November 20, 2023 by blackbird

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Of course not.   I already explained why I disagree with it.  I simply don't think it is possible to change.

But I am not going to hassle anyone over it.  I disagree with people covering themselves with tatoos.  I think it is self harm, but I am not going to say anything about it.  There was somebody in McDonalds the other day shouting and ranting.  I don't agree with that but I am not going to say anything.  I don't go around trying to police the world.  But I am entitled to disagree with some things just as you are.   This forum is the place where people make their disagreements known and express their opinions or beliefs.  But most of us probably don't go around saying the same things to people we meet or know.   It just wouldn't work out.

Quite right.  Live and let live is my motto too.

[blackbird]

13 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Let me ask you this:  If someone expresses their gender in a way that doesn't suit you, are you going to tell them they cannot?

Also, many people who do abnormal things are doing it because they have mental problems.  I think that is what is driving many things we see happening in the world today.  I think a significant percentage of people are struggling with mental issues that affects their judgment.

[blackbird]

5 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Quite right.  Live and let live is my motto too.

Yes, because many people are suffering from mental problems, we cannot simply assume they know what they are doing.  We are usually not in a position to tell other people what they are doing is wrong.   You would be amazed how easy going I am with people.

Edited November 20, 2023 by blackbird

[Guest]

Just now, blackbird said:

Also, many people who do abnormal things are doing it because they have mental problems.  I think that is what is driving many things we see happening in the world today.  I think a significant percentage of people are struggling with mental issues that affects their judgment.

Yes, I don't disagree with you there.

Perhaps a few details, but that's all.

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, bcsapper said:

I suppose they have the right because it is normal.  To everyone except a religious nutjob or an out and out bigot, that is.  Trans rights are the same as all the other rights in the Canadian Human Rights Act.  Like it or not. 

that's pretty debatable. Unlike homosexuality, "transgender disphoria' is an illness.  So any 'rights' accrued would be from the same body of rights as a cancer patient or a disabled person or the like.  Which is SOME rights, but it's basically just the right to not be treated in a discriminatory fashion by people due to their disability and people would have to accomodate to the "point of hardship" as the law puts it, which basically means as long as it's not a lot of work or money to do so.

But it wouldn't apply to having anything taught in school

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

that's pretty debatable. Unlike homosexuality, "transgender dysphoria' is an illness.  So any 'rights' accrued would be from the same body of rights as a cancer patient or a disabled person or the like.  Which is SOME rights, but it's basically just the right to not be treated in a discriminatory fashion by people due to their disability and people would have to accomodate to the "point of hardship" as the law puts it, which basically means as long as it's not a lot of work or money to do so.

But it wouldn't apply to having anything taught in school

Well, up until some years ago homosexuality was considered a disease.  In fact, according to Tom Robinson, introducing "sing if you're glad to be gay":

“This song is dedicated to the World Health Organization, it’s a medical song and it concerns a disease whose classification according to the International Classification of Diseases is 302.0”

And transgender dysphoria is not an illness that characterizes the transgender condition.  It is an illness that indicates that being transgender is causing stress or distress, which might be because of an innate refusal to accept the condition, or because of a lack of acceptance from others.

I support teaching about it in school, at a level where other sexual or humanities subjects are taught.

[CdnFox]

25 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Well, up until some years ago homosexuality was considered a disease.  In fact, according to Tom Robinson, introducing "sing if you're glad to be gay":

“This song is dedicated to the World Health Organization, it’s a medical song and it concerns a disease whose classification according to the International Classification of Diseases is 302.0”

And transgender dysphoria is not an illness that characterizes the transgender condition.  It is an illness that indicates that being transgender is causing stress or distress, which might be because of an innate refusal to accept the condition, or because of a lack of acceptance from others.

I support teaching about it in school, at a level where other sexual or humanities subjects are taught.

Give me a break. First off - if your source of medical knowledge is folk singers then i think we're identified your problem

And it was considered a mental disorder for a very brief period of time, beginning in 1952.  And that's what happens when you try to mix politics and medicine.

And sorry but gender disphoria is in fact a direct relation to being transgender.  It DOES characterize the transgender condition - it's just a question of how serious or severe it is.  As one famous doctor put it - "of course it's an illness, it has a pathology. How can you have a pathology if there's no illnesss".

Transgender people in general are much more likely to have suicidal thoughts, experience a number of mental health issues related directly to their condition and do so to a level of dysfunction.

gays can have healthy happy lives without anyone else doing anything. They basically just need people to stay out of their way - i don't need to announce my 'pronouns' or sexuality to make gay people feel valid. They don't need to demand to be allowed in the women's washrooms or on womens' sports teams, they don't demand to wear fake breasts the size of water barrels to teach children, etc etc.

whole different thing.

Gays function just fine being gay. Trans people struggle, period.
 

For political reasons we've changed how we refer to them and we're supposed to pretend this isn't a mental health problem.  Just like how for political reasons we were supposed to pretend being gay was.

 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Give me a break. First off - if your source of medical knowledge is folk singers then i think we're identified your problem

And it was considered a mental disorder for a very brief period of time, beginning in 1952.  And that's what happens when you try to mix politics and medicine.

And sorry but gender disphoria is in fact a direct relation to being transgender.  It DOES characterize the transgender condition - it's just a question of how serious or severe it is.  As one famous doctor put it - "of course it's an illness, it has a pathology. How can you have a pathology if there's no illnesss".

Transgender people in general are much more likely to have suicidal thoughts, experience a number of mental health issues related directly to their condition and do so to a level of dysfunction.

gays can have healthy happy lives without anyone else doing anything. They basically just need people to stay out of their way - i don't need to announce my 'pronouns' or sexuality to make gay people feel valid. They don't need to demand to be allowed in the women's washrooms or on womens' sports teams, they don't demand to wear fake breasts the size of water barrels to teach children, etc etc.

whole different thing.

Gays function just fine being gay. Trans people struggle, period.
 

For political reasons we've changed how we refer to them and we're supposed to pretend this isn't a mental health problem.  Just like how for political reasons we were supposed to pretend being gay was.

 

I know it's only a matter of time before I'm a lying sack of crap so I try to get a little creative.  It wasn't wrong.

Nor was I wrong about transgender dysphoria.  You are.  In fact, you pretty much say so in the rest of your post.